National Security Council Leak

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Lord Reid of Cardowan

Thursday 2nd May 2019 Lords Chamber

[Lord Young of Cookham]

I can also say that I know Gavin Williamson well, having served in Parliament with him for five years and having been Chief Whip in that time. This is a difficult time for Gavin Williamson, his wife and his children, and I hope the media will give them the time and space they need to come to terms with what has happened. On the further steps my noble friend suggested, as I say, the Cabinet Secretary has judged it not necessary to refer the matter to the police, and the Cabinet Secretary will of course read the comments of my noble friend.

[Lord Reid of Cardowan (Lab)]

My Lords, how is this matter to be definitively resolved? The Government say the former Defence Secretary is guilty as charged. He is the third Defence Secretary to retire under a cloud, and he completely denies that he is guilty as charged. This is not just a question of the National Security Council; the Secretary of State for Defence is in receipt and a custodian of the most sensitive and secretive areas of British foreign policy and defence, even outside the National Security Council, so it has to be resolved one way or another. I do not know whether there is any guilt attached to the former Defence Secretary, but it is in the interests of this country to clarify this by a deeper investigation. If that means a criminal investigation, so be it.

[Lord Young of Cookham]

The noble Lord uses phrases such as “guilty as charged”. The Secretary of State for Defence was dismissed because he was in breach of the Ministerial Code, which says:

“Ministers only remain in office for so long as they retain the confidence of the Prime Minister. She is the ultimate judge of the standards of behaviour expected of a Minister and the appropriate consequences of a breach of those standards”.


That is why the Secretary of State for Defence lost his job.

Duchy of Cornwall Bill [HL]

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Lord Reid of Cardowan

2nd reading (Hansard): House of Lords
Friday 26th October 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Young of Cookham]

I have the figures for only the past three years in my brief. I think that the noble Lord’s queries went further back than that, so I will write to him. I would just say that the Labour Party voted for the Sovereign Grant Act.

[Lord Reid of Cardowan (Lab)]

I want to make one comment prior to the Minister’s response to my noble friend. There may be good reasons—I can see them in principle and in practice—for insisting on more transparency surrounding the costs at Buckingham Palace, for instance, but the expectation that it will hold costs stable or reduce them is not one of them. Witness the increase in the cost of refurbishing this Parliament and the cost of the Scottish Parliament building, which was overseen by not one but two Parliaments. The cost rose from the estimate of £40 million to more than £400 million. There may be good reasons for the transparencies regarding Buckingham Palace, but the expectation that oversight by this or any other committee will reduce the price is not one of them.

[Lord Young of Cookham]

The noble Lord said that he wanted to make a comment rather than ask a question and he did exactly that.

I conclude by expressing reservations about the Bill. The Duchy of Cornwall plays an important role in providing funds to support the public and private lives of six members of the Royal Family. The Government are keen to ensure that the Duchy can continue to perform that function. Noble Lords have made informed contributions to the debate and given pause for thought. However, the Government believe that now is not the time to attempt this reform. I repeat the valid point made by my noble friend Lord Wakeham: if we make progress, it should be on a consensual basis. Considering other pressures on the legislative timetable, the Government have reservations about the prospects for the Bill in future.

Elections: Personation

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Lord Reid of Cardowan

Tuesday 4th September 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Young of Cookham]

I remember that election well: my majority was 808. My noble friend raises the important issue of students. There were many allegations that some students at the last election voted twice. This issue was raised by Ministers with the appropriate body within the National Police Council, which is pursuing it. There is, I think, a small number of issues outstanding. In many cases, where a student voted twice, on one occasion it would have been as a proxy for another student.

[Lord Reid of Cardowan (Lab)]

My Lords, is this not one of the many challenges, with associated costs, that would be very simply addressed by ID cards? That is the solution. Why did the coalition Government allow themselves to be led by the nose by the Liberal Democrats and abolish the ID cards that had already been introduced?

[Lord Young of Cookham]

I think that the commitment to abolish ID cards was in my party’s manifesto in 2010, as well as in that of the Liberal Democrats. The House will know that the Government are not minded to introduce ID cards. We are making good progress in reducing electoral ballot fraud through voter ID and I think that that is a more proportionate solution than the one proposed by the noble Lord.

Immigration Statistics

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Lord Reid of Cardowan

Monday 12th March 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Young of Cookham]

It is not the case that the Government’s policy has deterred international students from coming to this country. According to the latest figures, study-related visas were up by 8% in 2017 to more than 220,000. The Government have made it absolutely clear that there is no cap on the number of genuine international students coming to this country—they are welcome. We are the second most popular destination after the United States for such students and roughly 40% of our overseas students now come from China, in a competitive market.

[Lord Reid of Cardowan (Lab)]

Does the Minister recognise that for more than 25 years immigration statistics have been neither authoritative nor accurate either in their generality or in their specifics? When will the Government finally recognise that only an accurate system of counting people in and out will give us such authoritative and accurate statistics, and the only way to do that is through biometric ID cards and visas?

[Lord Young of Cookham]

The point made by the noble Lord was also made by the Home Affairs Select Committee in another place. One of the recommendations echoes what he just said:

“We also recommend that the Home Office examine how all entries and exits from major ports in the UK, including for non-visa travellers, can be recorded and that all entry and exit information is then used to aid the analysis of migration flow and to better inform policy decisions”.


The Government will respond to that recommendation before Easter and I am sure that they will take on board the support expressed for that policy by the noble Lord and indeed by others.