Drones: High-security Prisons

Lord Reid of Cardowan Excerpts

Wednesday 15th January 2025 Lords Chamber

[The Minister of State, Ministry of Justice (Lord Timpson) (Lab)]

The noble and learned Lord is completely right that drones pose a major and serious threat to all our prisons. I have been visiting Manchester prison for over 20 years, and I went there just before Christmas, in the light of the problems that it has. I saw for myself the issues that staff are dealing with, with 49% of the prisoners arriving in the prison being addicted to drugs. I cannot share the counter-drone tactics as that would play into the hands of sophisticated and serious organised criminals. I can assure the noble and learned Lord that we are currently getting on with a number of fixes, but the biggest fix is ensuring there is no market for drugs and weapons in the first place, and that people in prison are there to get on with their sentence, get educated and do purposeful activity, so that when they are out, they stay out.

[Lord Reid of Cardowan (Lab)]

Will the Minister confirm the magnitude of the challenge that he has inherited? Is it not the case that, during the period of the previous Government, there was an increase in drug finds of 44%? In the year until March last year, there was an increase in weapon finds of 24%. The Minister now faces a challenge because of the fact that, over the past 14 years, very little has been done to confront the challenge.

[Lord Timpson (Lab)]

The noble Lord is completely right that the prisons I am visiting now are very different from the prisons I visited 15 or 20 years ago. The buildings are often in decrepit states of repair. We have a lot of new staff who are still learning the skills of being a prison officer and we have an awful lot more to do to ensure that people, when they are in prison, spend their days purposefully, not just sitting in their cells.