Uncollected Financial Penalties

Lord Ponsonby of Shulbrede Excerpts

Tuesday 13th May 2025 Lords Chamber

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Ministry of Justice (Lord Ponsonby of Shulbrede) (Lab)]

My Lords, it is essential that financial penalties are collected and enforced. His Majesty’s Courts & Tribunals Service uses robust methods to do so, including taking money from an offender’s benefits or salary and seizing and selling goods. Offenders can be sent to prison for non-payment to the court. In 2023-24, HMCTS collected over £671 million in financial penalties. The Government are investing in the replacement of outdated IT systems and are also planning legislative changes which will reform the confiscation order regime.

[Baroness Levitt (Lab)]

My Lords, I thank my noble friend the Minister for his Answer, but in March 2024 there were £4.4 billion-worth of unpaid criminal court fines, compensation orders, victim surcharges, et cetera. Does the Minister agree that steps should be taken urgently to deal with this unacceptable situation, which is grossly unfair on those who pay up and feeds scepticism in the judiciary and society at large about the effectiveness of non-custodial sentences?

[Lord Ponsonby of Shulbrede (Lab)]

I thank my noble friend for that supplementary question. Of the £4.4 billion that she referred to, £2.7 billion is from confiscation orders. Of the £2.7 billion, £1.2 billion is purely interest—interest is paid at 8% on the confiscation order amount. There are legislative changes in the Crime and Policing Bill, which is currently in the other place, but I think it is worth pointing out to my noble friend that, in existing legislation, there are only very limited circumstances where a Crown Court can judicially cancel an order, and it contains no powers to administratively cancel a confiscation order. That means that the confiscation order amount accrues over the years, including the interest. With respect to financial penalties, by which I mean fines, the picture is very different. Over a five-year period, 80% of all fines are collected, and that figure has remained flat over the last few years. While I accept that the overall number is increasing, that gives an unfair picture of the current situation, and the Government are addressing the reasons why that is an unfair reflection of the position.

[Lord Hogan-Howe (CB)]

My Lords, it has always been a challenge to collect fines, because they are often imposed on people who cannot pay them. One of the areas in which progress can be made is criminal assets. This is usually around organised crime, which is motivated by profit. What I think the enforcement agencies have not invested in—and I invite the Minister to inquire—is having forensic accountants, who are people who can trace assets in often complex financial arrangements. At one stage, the NCA had one, as did Police Scotland. Can the Minister find out, or tell us, how many forensic accountants there are? People may not know, but the police can keep half of the cash they seize and 15% of other assets that are confiscated—not for themselves—

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[Lord Ponsonby of Shulbrede (Lab)]

I thank the noble Lord for that question. It is worth saying that, if somebody fails to pay a fine and they are imprisoned for that failure to pay, then the fine is written off. However, if somebody fails to pay a confiscation order and they are sent to prison, the compensation order amount is not written off. They are different. The other point worth making goes to the point that he made about the work of forensic accountants. A lot of the assets which confiscation orders are applied to are hidden assets, so there is an estimate—an informed guess, if I can put it like that—of the amount when making that confiscation order. Nevertheless, I take the point that he makes in his question. If I can add anything on the number of forensic accountants available to give advice to the court, I will write to him.

[Lord Bellingham (Con)]

My Lords, is the Minister aware that embassies across London owe a total of nearly £150 million in unpaid fines and charges? Obviously, under the Vienna convention, embassies are exempt from taxes but not from these fines and charges. What will the Government do about it?

[Lord Ponsonby of Shulbrede (Lab)]

What the Government will do is write to the noble Lord. After much time in this House, I know that this issue comes up very regularly. If there was a simple answer to that question, I am sure it would have been found. Nevertheless, it is a real issue. It undermines confidence in the parking fines system, and it undermines confidence within the wider community if certain groups are not paying their fines. It is a serious issue, and I understand that. If there is more I can say, I will write to the noble Lord.

[Lord Marks of Henley-on-Thames (LD)]

My Lords, as the noble Lord, Lord Hogan-Howe, said, many financial penalties go uncollected. Does the noble Lord agree that we are, in respect of such offenders, imposing far too many financial penalties? Should we not be making more use of community service and the probation services in those cases where there is no hope of collecting payment?

[Lord Ponsonby of Shulbrede (Lab)]

It is an interesting question—one which I used to grapple with regularly when I sat as a magistrate in Westminster. The noble Lord is asking that the sentencer increase the sentence from a fine to a community order, increasing the sentence for certain people who are unable to pay their fines. It may be that this is taken into account when sentencers make that judgement, but it is an inflationary—if I could use that word—solution to a problem. Nevertheless, of course, when sentencers impose fines, they have to take into account the means of those whom they sentence.

[The Earl of Effingham (Con)]

My Lords, there is £5 billion-worth of bitcoin cryptocurrency in government accounts seized from organised crime relating to Jian Wen. Please allow me to repeat that: £5 billion that is in the Government's bank account. I ask a similar question to the one that the noble Lord, Lord Lamont of Lerwick, posed to the Chancellor of the Exchequer four months ago: what are the Government’s plans for this windfall?

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[Lord Ponsonby of Shulbrede (Lab)]

I do not know the answer to that question. If the £5 billion is in the Government’s accounts, I do not know how free they are to use that money. If there is anything more I can add to that answer, I will write to the noble Lord.

[Lord Faulkner of Worcester (Lab)]

My Lords, when my noble friend writes to the noble Lord opposite about unpaid parking fines by embassies in London, would he also write to me and include in my letter the details of unpaid congestion charges by embassies in London? That is an amount that has escalated almost out of sight. As the noble Lord opposite has said, this is not a tax; it is a payment for services provided in London.

[Lord Ponsonby of Shulbrede (Lab)]

Yes, if I am able to find those figures, I will indeed write to my noble friend.

[Lord Sikka (Lab)]

My Lords, since 2018 only seven unexplained wealth orders were issued, and not a single penny of wealth has been recovered since 2019. This seems to undermine the Government’s offensive against unexplained wealth’s illicit financial flows. Can the Minister explain whether anything has changed since the Criminal Finances Act was introduced in 2017?

[Lord Ponsonby of Shulbrede (Lab)]

I thank my noble friend for that question. The figures he quoted reflect how difficult it is to track down the money when criminals are hiding it. It takes hugely intensive work, and it is something I have personally received presentations on. The issue is one of resourcing to a certain extent, but there is no lack of will to pursue criminals who have unexplained wealth. They need to be tracked down and charged as appropriate.