Great British Energy Bill

Lord Naseby Excerpts

2nd reading
Monday 18th November 2024 Lords Chamber

[Lord Naseby (Con)]

My Lords, we know that the challenges of the age can be met only by energy. We have before us the vehicle to achieve that objective: Great British Energy. Of course, a fair number of questions have been raised in the other place and this afternoon, particularly about the relationships with the other energy corporations and agencies. I will not get involved in that; I do not want to duplicate those questions. Although many of them are valid, the situation we face calls for an independent vehicle such as the one we are debating in the Bill. In historical terms, looking at the state of our railways and comparing them with those on the continent of Europe, where they are all nationalised, I think for once that we need again to look at the success Europe has had in not dissimilar circumstances.

I will raise four points to look at in more detail in Committee, partially because some of them came up many years ago when I was on the energy Select Committee in the other place. The one that did not come up then was hydrogen, on which we just heard some wise words. I have had a meeting with the boilermakers’ union, which knows exactly what was put in when almost all gas domestic heating was put in. That was done highly successfully over many years. Work has been done on hydrogen mixed with gas. The indication is that it is successful and that all that needs to change is the burner to the boilers. If that is the situation, it would save huge sums of money for the infrastructure for heating the vast majority of the homes in the United Kingdom. Yes, certain areas will need heat pumps, but no way can heat pumps ever overtake this opportunity for domestic heating at this point in time. That means we need to look at the definition of clean energy in the Bill. I will put down an amendment to that effect.

Secondly, there has been much discussion about small modular reactors, which is absolutely right. I had discussions with Rolls-Royce two and a half years ago, when it claimed it was just about ready to go forward. It is not the present Government’s fault but, if Rolls-Royce was ready then, I cannot understand why there was no decision. I asked questions of my noble friends on the Front Bench on that when we were in government, and we still do not have a decision. I say to the Minister: if I and, more importantly, Rolls-Royce are right, let us please have a decision on that.

Thirdly, I have had some talks with and briefings from the UK Sustainable Investment and Finance Association. I hope very much that the Minister has had the same. If he has not then I would be delighted to hand over the briefing I received, but I am sure he has had it. Therefore, I do not need to go into great detail, but it raised five areas that I think should all be looked at very carefully.

Fourthly, the area that nobody has raised, as far as I know—and I have been sitting here all afternoon—is the situation in small countries around the world. We have a Commonwealth and our own small-country groupings. We need to recognise that we must help them deal with their problems, which will not be similar to ours in most cases. We should be considerate and understanding. After all, the Commonwealth is a family, and we should help them in that relationship.

The Bill is a good one, as far as I can see. As I said, I will put down some amendments, but I wish the Government well. It is so important that this is successful and I will do my best to help it on its way.

Great British Energy Bill

Lord Naseby Excerpts

Committee stage
Tuesday 3rd December 2024 Lords Chamber

Moved by

[Lord Naseby]

8: Clause 3, page 2, line 13, after “encouraging” insert “investing in”

[Lord Naseby (Con)]

My Lords, in moving Amendment 8, I will also speak to Amendments 9, 12, 13, 14, 31 and 32 in my name. They are focused on Clause 3, “Objects”, and they arise from a key part of the energy world that has problems with those objects as they exist in the Bill. I will refer particularly to the hydrogen industry; all my remarks will be on that industry’s reading of the Bill as currently drafted.

I have had discussions with the leading and largest trade association, Madano, which has 120 members across the value chain for Hydrogen UK. It is concerned that the current definition of clean energy in the Great British Energy Bill lacks clarity and could unintentionally hinder the growth of the UK hydrogen sector. That is why I am seeking to amend the definition in the Bill.

The proposed amendments aim to provide an inclusive definition of clean energy that includes CCUS-enabled hydrogen. The amendments are supported by Hydrogen UK and the Carbon Capture and Storage Association to address the concerns they have about limiting sector growth and investment. The UK’s unique twin-track approach to hydrogen production that supports the use of CCUS-enabled hydrogen and electrolytic hydrogen is, in my judgment, a major strength that can help kick-start the UK hydrogen industry. Excluding critical CCUS-enabled hydrogen production technology at this early stage would harm the UK hydrogen industry.

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Naseby (Con)]

My Lords, I am grateful for the depth of the Minister’s answer. He may well be right that Amendments 8, 9, 12, 13 and 14 are unnecessary. I would like to reflect on that. I am far less convinced on Amendments 31 and 32 and I reserve the right to come back on Report if necessary. I beg leave to withdraw the amendment.

Amendment 8 withdrawn.

Great British Energy Bill

Lord Naseby Excerpts

3rd reading
Tuesday 25th February 2025 Lords Chamber

[Lord Vaux of Harrowden (CB)]

My Lords, I rise very briefly to thank the Minister for tabling this amendment, which, as he says, introduces a periodic independent review of Great British Energy’s effectiveness, as he undertook to do on Report. I am most grateful to him for the constructive discussions we have had around this as the Bill has moved through its stages. I also thank all noble Lords who have added their support to this through the process.

The amendment does not go quite as far as my amendment on Report, in two respects. First, as the Minister has just alluded to, it does not include any mention of reporting on the extent to which GBE has succeeded in encouraging private investment. However, the noble Lord was very clear on Report about the importance of the additionality principle for GBE and that he therefore expected that it will be covered by the independent review of effectiveness, and he has just repeated that in his speech just now, which gives me more than sufficient comfort on that question.

Secondly, my original amendment proposed a review every three years. While I think that it would have been better to have the initial review before 2030, which is the Government’s deadline for achieving decarbonisation —therefore, there would be time to do something about it if things were not going right—the five-year interval that the noble Lord’s amendment requires is a reasonable compromise.

I do have one question about the amendment. It was changed at the last minute to give the devolved Governments the opportunity to see the independent report 14 days prior to it being laid before Parliament. I fully understand and agree that the devolved Governments should be given the independent report, but I really do not understand why they should get it in advance of the UK Parliament. I would be grateful if the Minister would explain the reasons for that.

Frankly, however, that is not a major issue. I am very grateful to the Minister for tabling the amendment, which will be a very significant improvement to the transparency and accountability regime that Great British Energy will be subject to, and I therefore urge all noble Lords to support it.

[Lord Naseby (Con)]

My Lords, I took part at Second Reading, but, sadly, I had a short sojourn in hospital during Committee and Report. I will make three points, although I support the whole Bill in principle.

It seems to me that three key areas fall under this amendment. The first is mini-reactors. Three years ago, I was told that Rolls-Royce was ready to go. It is fundamental that the mini-reactors get going.

Secondly, I understand there is some discussion about the role of hydrogen. I have contacted two universities, Cranfield and Manchester, which are doing extensive work. Additionally, the boiler workers’ union is totally involved. Hydrogen work is absolutely fundamental to the future of our energy, particularly for domestic heating.

Finally, there is still a view that, rather than import oil and gas, we should carry on some degree of exploration in the North Sea.

[Baroness Bennett of Manor Castle (GP)]

My Lords, I welcome the government amendment and the way in which the Government have listened to your Lordships’ House on this Bill and overseen considerable improvements. One was the inclusion, finally, of community energy, something your Lordships’ House has been fighting for through two Governments and several energy Bills.

However, an important issue arises at this moment relating to community energy. While the amendment that the Government have put down will help community energy to grow in the medium to long term, the sector faces an urgent short-term problem: the uncertainty of the community energy fund’s future. The fund began in January 2024 and has been very successful and heavily oversubscribed: more than 150 community energy projects have been awarded grants. More than 100 projects are ready to go and are eligible for funding, but they will not receive it because the initial £10 million is expected to run out in May. This is the only substantive mechanism helping community energy to grow, yet it has no future beyond this year.

I make no apologies at all for representing Community Energy here. Its members have asked me to say that we have seen so many times with energy policy over the years a boom-bust cycle of funding and defunding and then funding and defunding again. There is a short-term issue here, although the Government have expressed their support for the long term. So can the Minister give me a clear statement on how the Government will deal with the uncertainty over the community energy fund’s future? Can he assure me that there will be early action to deal with the enthusiasm that the fund has not been able to meet, and clear instructions on that in the statement of strategic priorities for Great British Energy, as required by Clause 5 of the Bill?