Care Bill [HL]

Lord Hunt of Kings Heath Excerpts

Tuesday 4th June 2013 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Wall of New Barnet]

My Lords, I, too, support Amendment 36. I just want to pick out something that the noble Earl mentioned a little while ago in response to another question from me. He mentioned the work being done by Skills for Health and Skills for Care. Certainly in the context of this amendment—which, I agree, is a probing amendment—alongside the royal colleges and the other professional bodies, the work that Skills for Health and Skills for Care are doing is hugely important. Can the noble Earl enlighten me on what relationship Health Education England will have with those bodies? For instance, the noble Lord just referred to what the future looks like and what Skills for Health in particular is doing alongside Skills for Care. It is looking at what provisions there are for apprenticeships inside the health service, which is hugely important and allows people to develop from smaller roles to bigger roles over time. I wonder how, in the scheme of things, that relationship exists, how close it is and what influence Skills for Health and Skills for Care have, so that they are not working in opposition but are working integrally with what HEE is doing.

[Lord Hunt of Kings Heath]

My Lords, I have a few amendments in this group. It is an important group because it concerns not just the functions of Health Education England and its duties to co-operate but also, of course, the membership of LETBs, the local committees of HEE.

It is very important that HEE works with NHS bodies that have expertise in education, training and regulation, so I am very happy to support my noble friend’s Amendments 9, 18 and 34, and Amendments 15 and 36 in the name of the noble Lord, Lord Willis. I would add two organisations from which HEE must seek representations: the CQC and Monitor. I imagine the noble Earl will say that they are implicit in the generic list of bodies in Clause 89(2). However, it would be good to hear a little bit about how the noble Earl expects HEE to work with the two core regulators for the health service, the CQC and Monitor. In a sense, the CQC will, on a very regular basis, be picking up issues to do with staffing and staffing levels. Equally, Monitor will be concerned with financial issues. Of course, the two sometimes do not run easily together, so it is very important that HEE has very close contact with those two bodies.

As regards Clause 91 and LETBs, which are essentially committees of HEE charged with ensuring sufficient skilled healthcare workers in the area of the LETB, the Bill makes clear that in carrying out its main functions, the LETB must represent the interests of all persons,

“who provide health services in the area for which the LETB is appointed”.

I have already referred to my interest as chair of a foundation trust, and I very much welcome the architecture in which it is clear that, at the local level, the people in the driving seat should be the people who provide services. In the past, people running hospitals and other services have been divorced from decisions about training commissions. That is one of the reasons why I believe there has been such a problem with the ability of people coming out of universities and other education institutions to practise when they get into the field. Having the people who provide services round the table is a very important development.

Of course, it is also important that other people are involved in those discussions. In the architecture of the Bill, there are two categories of membership provisions. In Clause 91(3)(a) and (3)(b), it is clear that LETBs must include,

“persons who provide health services in the area”,

and,

“persons who have clinical expertise”.

It is consistent with the provisions in relation to Health Education England. Then in Clause 91(5), people involved in education may be appointed to a LETB—but, by implication, if they may be they do not have to be. My Amendments 40 and 42 to 46 really seek to ensure that LETBs have a broad-based membership. Surely, it should be mandatory to have the involvement of education providers and health workers who are not professionally registered. My noble friend Lady Wall made that point very well indeed.

Also, where are the representatives of patients and carers? After all, they understand the output of the workforce. Surely, they ought to have a place around the table as well when it comes to these decisions about training commissions: where they are placed, what the demands are and what the monitoring is. Again, I would replicate the argument about nurses that we had on the membership of HEE. In some sense, we could have grouped those amendments together because it is the same argument: that around the table of the LETB, you must have some senior nurses when so many of the discussions of the LETB will be about the quality of nurse training.

What about the health and well-being board? We have heard earlier debates. In fact, in the House of Commons Select Committee this morning, when witnesses were giving presentations about what has happened in emergency care, the representative of the LGA made a very strong point about the potential role of health and well-being boards, which are concerned not just with public health but with how well the whole system is integrated. I very much agree with that, so I would have thought that a LETB would be well advised to have the chairmen of relevant health and well-being boards around the table to discuss issues of staffing. I hope that the noble Earl will give me some reassurance that in establishing LETBs as provider organisations, something with which I certainly agree, there will be room for these other interests to be represented as well.

[Earl Howe]

My Lords, Amendments 9, 18 and 34 seek to require Health Education England to seek the advice of regulatory bodies and royal colleges in the exercise of its functions. Similarly, Amendment 36 seeks to amend Clause 89(3) to require Health Education England to seek advice from all the medical royal colleges. Amendment 15 seeks to amend Clause 85 to require HEE to seek representations from relevant organisations to define sufficient workforce numbers and the appropriate skills mix when carrying out its duty.

The education and training landscape is multifaceted. Many organisations have an interest in the development of health professionals, ranging from local employers in the NHS through to national organisations such as the professional regulators, including the Nursing and Midwifery Council, and professional bodies such as the medical royal colleges and those supporting other professions. To carry out its role effectively, Health Education England and the local education and training boards need to tap into all this knowledge and expertise. These bodies have crucial responsibilities in setting professional standards, shaping curricula and driving forward improvements in the quality of education and training. Health Education England simply has to work closely with them to deliver its functions.

The medical royal colleges in particular play an essential role in supporting the development of the medical profession, shaping curricula and the development of training programmes, supervising training, examining trainees to ensure the highest professional standards, promoting and supporting research, supporting audit and evaluation of clinical effectiveness, and generally providing support and advice for doctors at all stages of their careers. So I can reassure the Committee that Health Education England is already required to work with the professional regulators and medical royal colleges to obtain their advice on the exercise of its functions.

Clause 89 requires Health Education England to obtain advice on the exercise of its functions. Clause 89(2) requires HEE to seek to ensure that it receives representations from bodies which regulate healthcare workers and persons who provide, or contribute to the provision of, education and training for healthcare workers. This includes universities, professional bodies and the medical royal colleges.

The noble Lord will be pleased to hear that Health Education England is already working with the professional regulators and medical royal colleges. When he gave evidence to the Joint Committee that scrutinised the draft Bill, Professor Ian Cumming, the Chief Executive of HEE, was very clear that he saw the professional regulators and royal colleges as partners in developing the next generation of staff. Professor Peter Rubin, the chair of the GMC, gave evidence in the same session and reinforced that view, reassuring the committee that the GMC has a very good working relationship with Health Education England.

HEE is not starting from scratch in building these relationships. It is building on the good work previously done by Medical Education England and others to strengthen engagement and partnership-working with the professions. As I mentioned earlier, the HEE special health authority has established profession-specific advisory groups, involving employers and key partners including national regulatory and professional bodies. These will look at profession-specific workforce development across medicine, dentistry, nursing and midwifery, the allied health professions, pharmacy and healthcare science. They will each have a patient representative and be co-chaired by Health Education England and the professional lead in the relevant field.

In addition to having profession-specific advisory groups, Health Education England is establishing a multi-professional advisory group to bring all professions together to look at cross cutting issues. I hope that is a positive piece of information for the noble Baroness, Lady Emerton, in particular. I hope that the noble Lord, Lord Hunt, will be pleased that it is also setting up a patient forum to ensure patients and service users can engage in education and training and inform work in that area.

[Lord Hunt of Kings Heath]

I am very grateful to the noble Earl on that point. Is there a case for replicating that at local level, through the LETBs?

[Earl Howe]

Certainly, I do. I am happy to take that idea away, and if I can give him any further information during the course of our debates I will. Equally, the LETBs have strongly established connections with professional regulators and professional bodies. For example, the postgraduate medical and dental deans, who are now an integral part of the LETBs, work very closely with the GMC and medical royal colleges in the management and quality assurance of training for junior doctors. I hope that those remarks will reassure noble Lords sufficiently for them not to press the relevant amendments.

In reply to my noble friend Lord Willis, who expressed concern about the way the Explanatory Notes were framed, it is important to look at the entire context of the passage he quoted. The words “such as” appear in that passage before “the medical Royal Colleges”, so it is not meant to denote an exclusive reference to the medical royal colleges; it is very much trying to say that the professional bodies in general will be relevant here.

Amendment 35, tabled by the noble Lord, Lord Hunt, and the noble Baroness, Lady Wheeler, seeks to amend Clause 89 to require HEE to seek advice from the Care Quality Commission and Monitor. It is very important that Health Education England works closely with those two bodies. The Care Quality Commission plays an important role in assessing the quality of healthcare services, and in so doing it assesses their ability to deliver services safely and effectively. In doing so, it will consider whether healthcare providers have suitably skilled staff and in the right numbers. It will need to work closely with Health Education England to share findings and evidence to support improvements in education and training. Health Education England will also be able to share information on the effectiveness of providers in supporting clinical placements and training programmes to support the Care Quality Commission in its role.

HEE and Monitor will work closely together to ensure the financial stability of the health system. This will include working together on the reform of education and training funding and the development of education and training tariffs. To reflect the importance of these relationships, the Bill places a clear and reciprocal duty on Health Education England to co-operate with both the Care Quality Commission and Monitor. I hope noble Lords will feel reassured by that and will be able to withdraw this amendment.

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Moved by

[Lord Hunt of Kings Heath]

11: Clause 84, page 72, line 11, leave out “, with the consent of the Secretary of State,”

[Lord Hunt of Kings Heath]

My Lords, we come to a series of clauses that deal with the functions and priorities of HEE. I have a number of amendments in this group. The first is Amendment 11. Clause 84(6) states:

“HEE may, with the consent of the Secretary of State, carry out other activities relating to … education and training for health care workers”.

I am curious to know why the Secretary of State has to give his consent. Does not the mandate in Clause 87 give the Secretary of State enough oversight, without the micromanagement that this part of Clause 84 seems to imply?

Amendment 12A relates to the duty of HEE to ensure that there are sufficient numbers of persons with skills and training. What does “sufficient” mean? Does it mean an equilibrium of supply and demand, or do the Government want an oversupply? This is a matter that the Select Committee looked into, and about which a number of royal colleges are concerned. They take the view that it takes so long for doctors to come through the training grades that one wants an equilibrium rather than a situation where people who have committed themselves to 15 years’ training find that there is no work for them at the end of it. Perhaps the noble Earl might take up that matter with me in writing.

Amendment 14 asks HEE to,

“have regard to any official guidance on staffing numbers and skills mix”.

We will come back to this issue. The Minister will know that the Francis report recommended that NICE essentially should produce benchmarking measures for minimum staff numbers and the required skills mix, including for the number of nurses on wards. It is too late to have a debate on issues to do with nursing staff ratios, but it would be good to know whether the Government will take forward recommendations 22 and 23, because that work will be very relevant to HEE’s own work on the number of staff required in future.

Amendment 19 relates to Clause 86 and deals with quality improvement in education and training. All I ask from the noble Earl is a recognition that in future we will need to revisit the curricula of the universities to make sure that when doctors, nurses and other practitioners leave those universities and are ready to go into employment, they will have some practical-based training from having undertaken clinical duties. I am not convinced that the bodies that set the curriculum have got it right yet. Whenever challenged on these issues, they always claim that everything is hunky-dory and that we should not worry and yet there is a complete loss of public confidence in those training programmes. I do hope that HEE is going to be able to give a kick to those bodies that are concerned with the curricula and those education institutions to ensure that people are ready to practise when they are given their ticket to go into the health service.

On Clause 87, which concerns the objectives, priorities and outcomes of the HEE, I have another series of amendments. I want to tease out the Government’s recognition that, although in the construct of the Bill HEE will have an annual plan, it will also be required to look three years ahead. I wonder whether that is long enough. The argument that has been put to me by a number of organisations is that the time between the commissioning of a training place and that person practising in the health service can be many years. One of the questions is whether it would be better if HEE had to develop five and 10-year plans and match those with the demographic and the demand pressures on the health service. It would be helpful if the noble Earl would recognise the need for much longer term planning.

Clause 88 sets out important matters to which HEE has to have regard. In Amendment 28 I ask whether HEE will have to have regard to a need for equality of funding across England and consistency in education and training opportunities. Given the mismatch between a population and the education and training facilities available, will HEE have a duty to balance where those resources go?

On Amendment 29, will the noble Earl confirm that specialist training-place issues will be dealt with nationally? I need hardly remind him of the sensitivity of this in relation to junior doctor training. I wonder whether it is good enough to leave it to local LETBs to decide. I do think that some national provision and direction is required.

Amendment 30 concerns HEE’s relationship with other countries of the UK. There is a reference to the need for HEE to undertake duties in relation to the devolved Administrations. Surely much more is required. We are talking about a UK health service. Scotland definitely trains more people than is required for the Scottish health service. The same may be the case in Wales which has big problems in attracting junior doctors. There needs to be a UK-wide view of education and training and I hope that the HEE has both the remit and the encouragement of Ministers to work across those borders.

Amendment 32A covers the matters to which HEE must have regard. I have put down an amendment to ask HEE to give specific focus to arrangements for end-of-life care. The noble Earl has taken part in a number of debates on the Liverpool care pathway which have served to raise issues not so much about the policy behind the pathway, although I know that a review is being undertaken, but more about the way in which that has been interpreted by some organisations. It suggests that more is required in relation to the training of staff in end-of-life care. I am sure that in Part 1 we will come back to the issue of social care provision for end-of-life care but it would helpful if the noble Earl could reassure me that this one of the matters that HEE may look at. I beg to move.

[Lord Rix]

My Lords, I wish to speak to Amendment 24, which explores the benefits of placing a duty on the Secretary of State to consult on the objectives and priorities of Health Education England. In particular, I wish to explore how the Secretary of State will consult vulnerable people, including people with a learning disability, to ensure that education and training provided by this body will create a workforce that meets this group’s needs. Consulting and listening carefully chimes with the Government’s intentions through their response to the Francis inquiry, which stated:

“We will listen most carefully to those whose voices are weakest and find it hardest to speak for themselves. We will care most carefully for the most vulnerable people—the very old and the very young, people with learning disabilities and people with severe mental illness”.

This is a most welcome commitment, as currently people with a learning disability are not receiving appropriate care. On Tuesday 21 May, the Parliamentary and Health Service Ombudsman published its report into the death of Tina Papalabropoulos. Tina was 23 and had a learning disability. She died on 30 January 2009 at Basildon hospital in Essex. The ombudsman found that the hospital did not give her the treatment she needed or even meet her basic care needs. Unfortunately, this is not an isolated incident, and there is substantial evidence that poor care exists across the health service.

Early this year, the confidential inquiry into the premature deaths of people with learning disabilities in the south-west reported on its study of the deaths of 233 adults and 14 children with a learning disability. It found that 42% of the deaths were premature and that 37% would have been avoidable if good quality healthcare had been provided. On a national level, this equates to over 1,200 adults and children with a learning disability across England whose deaths should have been avoidable with good quality healthcare. This comes as no surprise to many. The Department of Health highlighted the issue back in its Valuing People and Valuing People Now strategies, and the excellent report by Sir Jonathan Michael, Healthcare for All, set out a series of recommendations for improving care for people with a learning disability. It is these people whom the Secretary of State should consult when setting objectives and priorities for this most important of public bodies. Without the input of people with a learning disability and their families, we will fail to change a system and a culture that in many cases provide substandard care for the most vulnerable in our society.

I realise that the Minister will probably reply that in order to publish the objectives and priorities for the forthcoming year of Health Education England, the Secretary of State will have consulted the parties concerned. However, as an actor who, years ago, used to drop his trousers for a living, I nowadays prefer the security of belt and braces, and I hope that the Minister will be able to offer this.

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[Earl Howe]

My Lords, I understand the point. In view of the hour, if I may, I will write to both noble Lords to flesh out the remarks that I have made. I hope that I can give them some comfort in that area.

Amendments 25 and 27, tabled by the noble Lord, Lord Hunt, focus on the importance of long-term and national approaches to workforce planning in education and training, as does Amendment 26. We have strengthened the Bill, following feedback in consultation and at pre-legislative scrutiny, in Clauses 87 and 93 to reflect the importance of HEE and the LETBs taking a long-term perspective on workforce planning and education and training. It is the Government’s expectation that all workforce planning, be it national level planning by HEE or local planning by the LETBs, should be based on a well informed, long-term workforce strategy that looks at needs over the next five years, 10 years or beyond. Any workforce strategy to be credible and deliverable has to be developed in partnership with those partners and stakeholders who have a stake in it. The very same principle applies to the development of national workforce priorities and outcomes and the Government are committed to working with everyone involved in education and training to shape the education outcomes framework and the mandate for Health Education England.

Health Education England will be expected to develop a national workforce plan, building on the local plans developed across England by local education and training boards. I hope that the noble Lord will feel reassured by those comments.

I turn now to Amendments 33 and 14, which seek to amend the Bill to require HEE to have regard to any official guidance and standards on staffing numbers and skill mix. HEE must work with commissioners and healthcare providers to ensure that workforce plans focus not only on how many staff are required but the breadth of skills required to deliver safe services. These plans need to be integrated with service and financial planning so that the needs of all patients and local communities can be met. Individual healthcare providers are best placed to determine how many staff they need to employ, the skill mix required across the various teams and how they need to deploy them to support services and so on. It is the responsibility of individual healthcare provider boards to be accountable for staffing levels and the skill mix of staff in their organisations. Where changes are planned to the size and shape of the workforce, including the skill mix, healthcare organisations must provide assurance that the safety and quality of patient care is maintained or improved. The process should include clinical involvement, leadership and sign off. I hope that these comments will be reassuring.

The noble Lord, Lord Hunt, asked me about the definition of “sufficient” and whether we were talking about equilibrium or oversupply. I will write to him on that, but in delivering that duty, HEE will seek to match supply and demand so far as that is practically possible. It will also promote the importance of a flexible workforce that can adapt to changing circumstances.

I will also, if I may, write on the issue of staffing ratios. I would just say here and now that staffing is clearly not just about crude numbers and not just about nurses. It is also about how the staff work and ensuring that the right staff are in place to meet the needs of the patients whom they are looking after. Again, it is local healthcare providers that are in the best place to decide how to configure those staff in the right way and to ensure better outcomes and value for money. It really depends on the skill mix, the clinical practice and local factors. I think we would say that it is right that nurse leaders should have the freedom to agree their own staff profiles. But I shall follow up that point.

Amendment 19 seeks to amend Clause 86(2) to add to Health Education England’s main functions the promotion of the importance of practical based training in the education of clinicians. I wholeheartedly agree that practical experience while training is essential to ensure that clinicians have the necessary skills to deliver high-quality and compassionate care and have the correct values and behaviours to practise in the NHS and public health system. It is the responsibility of the professional regulators to ensure that the right standards are in place for professional education and training. Practical experience is already a requirement of the professional regulators. Nursing students, for example, are required by the Nursing and Midwifery Council to undertake half of their training in a practice setting. The GMC also expects every medical student to gain practical experience of working with patients throughout their degree. We have placed a strong duty to secure continuous improvement in the quality of education and training on Health Education England. HEE is already working with the professional regulators, as I have already mentioned, to ensure that the Bill remains clear and simple. However, we have not specified the integral elements of the training programmes to which this duty applies. I would add, though, that the need for practical experience is one of the key priorities that the Government have set for the Health Education England Special Health Authority in the mandate. Health Education England will work with the LETBs and healthcare providers to deliver high-quality clinical and public health placements that provide students and trainees sufficient time working with patients to gain experience.

On Amendment 29, I can reassure the noble Lord that, where appropriate, Health Education England will take a national lead in the planning and management of education and training activities. The Bill already makes provision for this in Clause 94(2). The HEE Special Health Authority has already taken on responsibility at national level for crucially important arrangements to manage recruitment into foundation and specialty training programmes for junior doctors. Where there are controls on workforce numbers at national level—for example, in medicine or pharmacy—it will work with partners such as the Higher Education Funding Council for England to develop national plans that will deliver the staff needed across England.

Amendment 30 seeks to amend Clause 88 to add a requirement for Health Education England to have regard to the need,

“to co-ordinate its activities with the NHS in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland”.

Of course, it is very important that HEE works closely with the other UK nations in developing workforce plans and shaping education and training. It will be important for it to take a UK-wide perspective and, where appropriate, an EU-wide or indeed global perspective in planning for the future and reforming education and training. I refer the Committee to paragraph 17 of Schedule 5, which enables Health Education England to exercise corresponding functions on behalf of the devolved authorities. The special health authority is already working closely with its partners in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland, building on previous arrangements.

I sympathise completely with Amendment 28 and I wholeheartedly agree that there should be equality of funding for education and training across England. Moving to a tariff-based system for funding clinical education and training would enable a national approach to the funding of clinical placements and would provide a more level playing field between different providers. It will ensure that providers are reimbursed fairly for the education and training that they deliver and are incentivised to provide high-quality clinical placements to their students and trainees. For consistency of opportunities across the country, Clause 85 places a duty on HEE to ensure that sufficient numbers of health professionals are trained and available to work in the health service throughout England.

I hope that noble Lords will feel reassured by those remarks. Before I close, I will quickly respond to my noble friend Lord Willis, who expressed concern about the mandate containing little on nursing and support workers. There is a clear and strong commitment to supporting the development of the care assistant support workforce. Similarly, there are clear national priorities focusing on development of the nursing and midwifery workforce. Again, if I can elaborate on that in writing, I would be happy to do.

[Lord Hunt of Kings Heath]

My Lords, I am very grateful to the noble Earl for that comprehensive response. I am sure that we will all want to study it very carefully in Hansard. I will just make two points. One is that I hear what he says about the obvious intention of HEE to undertake long-term planning, but putting something in the Bill might help it with that. Secondly, I realise that my amendment on practical-based training is not very sophisticated but there is a kernel of truth within it that I would like to pursue on Report. But I am most grateful and beg leave to withdraw my Amendment 11.

Amendment 11 withdrawn.