Political Influence: Artificial Intelligence

Debate between Lord Haskel and Lord Ashton of Hyde

Tuesday 4th September 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Haskel]

To ask Her Majesty’s Government what assessment they have made of the challenges posed by imitation speech and images generated by artificial intelligence to advance political agendas.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport (Lord Ashton of Hyde) (Con)]

My Lords, the Government recognise the problems that artificial intelligence and digitally manipulated content may pose. We are considering those issues carefully as part of cross-Whitehall efforts to tackle online manipulation and disinformation. We have seen no evidence that these or other techniques have been used to interfere successfully in the UK’s democratic processes, but we are actively engaging with international partners, industry and civil society to tackle the threat of disinformation and propaganda.

[Lord Haskel (Lab)]

The Minister’s brief will have told him that this technology of breaking up speeches into tiny fragments and then refabricating them to say something completely different is now very well developed. Would he not agree that this technology could be of benefit to our creative industries but a threat to our public discourse? Bearing in mind that in recent years the Government have been behind the curve in the management of new technology, what steps are they taking now to ensure that this technology is used for public good and not for public abuse and misinformation?

[Lord Ashton of Hyde]

I agree with the noble Lord that this has possibilities for ill as well as for good. He is absolutely right that artificial intelligence can be used to create these fake images. It creates not just the fake films and images; it also creates the problem that, when true films and images are made, the person concerned can deny them as fakes. It is a truism to say that we are always behind the curve—I do not accept that—but whether it is to do with crime, defence or political ideas and things like that, there is always a balance between new technology and the ways to tackle it. We are taking this very seriously and looking across Whitehall at what we can do to educate people and to do more research on this. There has been no evidence that it has interfered with UK democratic processes, but we are keeping a close eye on that and doing many things across government to look at it.

Brexit: Digital Single Market

Debate between Lord Haskel and Lord Ashton of Hyde

Tuesday 8th May 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ashton of Hyde]

I can absolutely dispel the noble Viscount’s gloom: the tech industry is not in the doldrums; in fact, quite the reverse. The creative industries, including tech industries, are growing at twice the rate of the economy. I hope the noble Viscount is reassured by that.

[Lord Haskel (Lab)]

My Lords, digital is an important part of the Government’s industrial strategy. So when will they initiate their industrial strategy council, whose job it is to chivvy the Government and get them to take action on this sort of thing?

[Lord Ashton of Hyde]

I am not quite sure which council the noble Lord is talking about, but as part of the industrial strategy, as he knows, we are launching sector deals, and I am pleased to say that the artificial intelligence sector deal was launched a week or two ago to great acclaim.

Artificial Intelligence

Debate between Lord Haskel and Lord Ashton of Hyde

Thursday 26th April 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ashton of Hyde]

My noble friend has the advantage of having been on the committee and probably knows more about this than I do. I do not think that one could ever say that one was satisfied that the laws were perfect in a fast-moving field such as AI and the new tech area. The Data Protection Bill, which is coming up for Report in the other place soon, is one way in which Europe and this country are bringing in data protection. In that context, I should mention the Information Commissioner, referred to by the noble Lords, Lord Stevenson and Lord Clement-Jones. We are looking carefully at what the Information Commissioner has asked for, especially in terms of powers. We are working on the legislation and trying to make it as future-proof as possible. Whether the Data Protection Act will last the 20 years that the last one did, I am not so sure.

[Lord Haskel (Lab)]

Much of the outcome of all the work, which I very much welcome, is intangible. Who is going to own this intangible property? It is all right when it is used for the public good, but what happens when it is used for private profit? Surely this is the basis of the dispute over the work of Cambridge Analytica, and has to be settled before we put a lot of money into developing all this intangible property.

[Lord Ashton of Hyde]

That is exactly why we are setting up the centre for data ethics and innovation. It will be a world-leading institution. Artificial intelligence is a force for good and potentially a force for evil. We absolutely acknowledge what the noble Lord says, but we are specifically addressing that. I was also asked about the timetable for the centre. The chair is being recruited now and we hope to have it up and running by the end of this year. It will have a statutory basis in due course, but will be up and running before then because, as the noble Lord rightly says, we have to address some of these problems. For example, the report talked about data trusts, to make sure that public and private data are available in a sustainable way and benefit SMEs as well as the enormous organisations.

Data Ethics Commission

Debate between Lord Haskel and Lord Ashton of Hyde

Monday 10th July 2017 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ashton of Hyde]

The noble Baroness is absolutely right. One issue that the commission can consider is whether, as data increases exponentially and individuals give data which can be used by data-mining companies and others, what is considered private data, even if it is anonymised, can be used for the greater good. We have to consider exactly such things. The Royal Free Hospital, for example, was in trouble under the Data Protection Act for allowing data, although anonymised, to be used by another company. We have to consider such things because a tremendous amount of benefit can be obtained for the general public from that data.

[Lord Haskel (Lab)]

My Lords, much of this data is held outside the UK. In fact, we are not sure where quite a lot of it is held. How will we be able to regulate people when we do not know where they are?

[Lord Ashton of Hyde]

The best way is to get international agreement. It was discussed—