Leaving the EU: Driving Licences

Debate between Jim Shannon and Thérèse Coffey

Wednesday 31st January 2024 Westminster Hall

[Dr Coffey]

I completely agree with my hon. Friend. I am sure his organisations have talked about the lack of people who are able to readily come forward, and the costs they are enduring. I know that has happened in my constituency. Investment was made in people but, understandably, after they pass a test and get this extra licence—because they did not take their driving test before 1997—they will quite often get a job, and while they might still be committed to community transport, that commitment will perhaps not be on the same scale.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I thank the right hon. Lady for bringing this forward. One of the interventions earlier on referred to grandfather rights. Does she not agree that the punitive response of the EU will lead to problems that exist only on paper and in imagination? Does she also agree that someone who was qualified to drive in Europe on the basis of their driving test five years ago still goes through the same vigorous testing as now, and they should be entitled to drive, just as they were? She deserves to be congratulated on bringing this forward. She is absolutely right, and the more I think of the EU, the more I thank the Lord we are out of it.

[Dr Coffey]

I believe this is a real opportunity to adopt some sensible approaches and that that would be welcome across the House. I am conscious that the Government signed up to the Vienna convention in 2018. There are a number of things in there, and we had already adopted these regulations pretty much under EU regulations. However, we have the opportunity to make changes, and this is just like in the Vienna convention; we put in reservations against elements of that. We have put a reservation in to say that people do not have to wait for the pedestrian crossing to tell them to go; they can cross the road if there is no traffic coming. We have used our common sense for regulations affecting people in this country while still having a safe environment.

It is important to hear from the Minister how other, European and non-European countries go about this, in particular for D1 and C1. I come back to the real need to make it more straightforward for people to get D1 licences, because those sorts of services are closing down or are starting to have to be commercial. That is not what we need for our communities. I understand the challenge of the cost of living and the fact that volunteers’ time is precious. More and more people do want to volunteer. At the moment, we still have a threshold; quite a lot of people coming forward have had those licences before. But it is about the next generation. It is about that that community link, particularly with younger children. People have had to take tougher and tougher tests over the years—far tougher than the ones I took. I do not see why we should expect them to pay £2,000 or £3,000 more and go through all sorts of activities to do something that is frankly quite straightforward.

I turn now to C1 and the commercial and economic impact. I went on about this within Government for several years. When we left the European Union, I had the opportunity to look at regulations that either hindered or helped or were things that we might want to tweak. I saw this as a standout opportunity, as a result of my constituency experience of the community of Suffolk Coastal. That was also driven by my experience as Secretary of State for Work and Pensions at the time. Recently, as Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs, I saw this as an opportunity for economic growth and to alleviate the impact on rural areas.

I have to say that my right hon. Friend the Member for Welwyn Hatfield (Grant Shapps) did listen. He put out a call for evidence, which I was pleased about. I think it reflects that the Department more broadly does not want to make any changes here, which disappoints me. That can be determined to some extent in some of the response, or the summary responses and aspects of the response, that the Government gave at the time.

But I have not given up, because I think this is the right thing to do. I think it is the right thing for our economic growth, and so do the majority of people who responded to the call for evidence. There were business people saying that this would be good. It would be much more efficient to run a single trip in a 4.6-tonne van than to be restricted to multiple trips, as it would require fewer journeys to transport the goods. It would mean fewer vehicles on the roads and fewer trips. This is good news.

I should have explained what C1 does: it covers, not the heavy goods vehicles that we all know, but vehicles between 3.5 to 7.5 tonnes. That is an important threshold—and by the way, this also applies to a number of commercial activities. To go back to D1, a lot of the community minibuses were rightly equipped to take people with disabilities and wheelchairs. Some minibuses are just under 3.5 tonnes, but as soon as the equipment and the person in the wheelchair goes on to the minibus, it goes over that limit. As a consequence, activities can be suspended or services withdrawn.

I turn to the responses. A significant number were very pro and wanted a change without any conditions whatsoever. That was the biggest result, at 43% I think, while there were those who thought we could have an opportunity, but with some changes to conditions—at the moment, the licence would apply only from the age of 18, but once people turn 70, it has to be reviewed. I agree with that, which is why I want to see reform, but in combination, that is 73% of the people who responded to the call for evidence who wanted the change and felt that it could be made safely or that it might need no adjustments at all. I am open to discussion with the Minister about possible reforms—perhaps two or three years since driving, or perhaps a slightly older starting age than 18—but the important thing is to make this as straightforward as possible, rather it being about the cost that goes in.

I should also say to the House that this issue actually stops people driving ambulances, and has done for the last couple of years. Although people were already undergoing advanced training and blue light training, because they were waiting to get a C1 assessment, they could not drive an ambulance. That has led to a driver shortage.

We all know what happened in the HGV driver crisis, as it was called at the time. I do not criticise HGV drivers for that at all—I have cousins who are HGV drivers, and they diligently help to power the economy of the country. However, with the explosion of much more localised delivery, which reflects patterns of consumption in the market, the local delivery element can become attractive to people. Instead of being away from home for several days at a time, travelling and staying overnight in the cab, they can have a much more localised job.

Taking this opportunity would open up the market, enabling many more drivers to take advantage of these opportunities and allowing businesses to grow their business, reflecting the availability of labour. By making this simple change, we would significantly increase the availability of drivers to help to drive the economy, which is absolutely vital.

I know that tests have become a lot tougher since I took mine, and I am conscious that there will be organisations that worry about this. I am not looking to try to make things less safe; I am trying to reflect the fact that our driving standards have got higher over time, yet key elements are holding up, at significant cost. The impact of that on the economy, on economic opportunity and on our communities really needs to be considered.

There may be some other things that we need to look into, such MIDAS—the minibus driver awareness scheme. I am not suggesting, by the way, a full repeal of the regulations needed for C1E. I know that my right hon. Friend the Member for Welwyn Hatfield was quite keen on making things more straightforward for trailers when he was Transport Secretary, but we are also talking about people driving camper vans or with a horse-box. There are all these different sorts of activities where, thanks to an EU regulation that we now have the opportunity to remove, we have just loaded on cost. There would be fewer vans on the road, making fewer trips—it all makes sense, and would actually be a sensible way to improve safety.

I am conscious that the Chamber is filling up with Members who expect the next debate to start in two minutes. Because of the Divisions, this debate can now finish later, and I hope that this much wider audience will hear why this simple change could make a massive impact in their local communities. I will conclude, though, because I am conscious that the household support fund is very important—I was involved in establishing it, and I should have put my name down for that debate, too.

Having worked with this Minister for many years when we were together in the Department for Work and Pensions, I know that he is assiduous and cares about his constituents in Hexham. I also know that he is innovative. Together we worked on many things that might not have come to complete fruition while we were together in the DWP, but we know they were the right things to do. They are now part of the Government’s plan to unlock economic opportunity, and we will continue to be interested in and motivated by them.

The Government set out a plan for drivers, which I think was a really good plan. We need a few extra additions to the plan for drivers, and I hope that the Minister will work with me on that. I should give him notice that on 21 February it is my intention to introduce a ten-minute rule Bill, and to work with him in advance of that, to try to ensure that we find a good process that helps our rural communities and helps the economy, while maintaining of course the safe roads that we all enjoy.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Jim Shannon and Thérèse Coffey

Thursday 19th October 2023 Commons Chamber

[Dr Coffey]

My hon. Friend has great credibility in this field, given his professional experience as a vet. I understand that many owners of XL Bully dogs are passionate about their animals—their pets. That is why we are working at pace, but taking our time to get right the definitions and the transition period that we anticipate. It is important that all dog owners work to make sure that their dogs behave and have appropriate training. That is why we established a taskforce that includes dog welfare charities. We expect it to respond to us by the end of the year, and we will potentially take forward some of its recommendations.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

As someone who has had a pet dog all my life and still does, I am conscious that some of those who own American XL Bully dogs think that their dogs are integral and safe, but many in the general public see them as a danger and have fear. Is the Secretary of State’s intention, as this process goes forward in Westminster, to engage with the Northern Ireland Assembly and the police, in particular, to ensure that the law and the recommendations that come out of this place can be shared with them?

[Dr Coffey]

The hon. Gentleman is right to recognise owners’ concerns where they believe that they have very good dogs. That is to some extent accommodated already in the legislation that has evolved since 1991. On working with other nations, the law—the primary legislation—will apply in both England and Wales by default, but we are working with the Scottish Government and the Northern Ireland Administration on potential moves to make this a UK-wide approach.

Combined Sewer Overflows

Debate between Jim Shannon and Thérèse Coffey

Wednesday 13th September 2023 Commons Chamber

[Dr Coffey]

The hon. Lady is incorrect. We absolutely respect the law—we introduced the Environment Act. We can disagree with initial assertions, but we will continue to ensure that we provide the information the OEP has requested.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I thank the Secretary of State for the renewed determination to bring about improvement—it is clear that we need it. When we voted on this issue in the House, we were given assurances that these incidents would not take place. It is clear that, while officials may not agree with this investigation, there is still a real cause for concern. How does the Secretary of State intend to alleviate those concerns and, more importantly, ensure that sewage releases are regulated and safe? I make this suggestion very respectfully: stopping the dividends to the chief executives and directors would be a method to encourage improvements by the water companies, who seem reluctant to make them.

[Dr Coffey]

I am conscious that the hon. Gentleman is a Member for a Northern Ireland constituency. The OEP’s remit extends to Northern Ireland, although not to the Welsh Labour Government or the Scottish SNP Government. Investigations can be undertaken—that is what we legislate for in this House—and unlimited penalties can be applied. That is true in England. We will continue to make sure that we do what we can not only to reduce these challenges, but to fix the long-term issues. We know that in London, for example, the Thames tideway tunnel has taken a decade—that is the scale of the issue. The fact that we know about the scale of the issue right now is due to the Conservative Government having taken action, while the Labour Government looked the other way.

Environmental Protection

Debate between Jim Shannon and Thérèse Coffey

Tuesday 18th July 2023 Commons Chamber

[Dr Coffey]

We are straying somewhat from the purpose of the statutory instruments that we are dealing with today, but I have that same situation whereby Anglian Water covers sewerage and Essex & Suffolk Water covers the supply of water. One critical element in the price review process that we have is that Ofwat goes through a mechanism of working through with water companies what they are allowed to invest in and, as a consequence, what the bill changes could be. We have a situation where bills go up with inflation—that has been part of the mechanism so far, and there is a price review process under way, but I have listened carefully to what my right hon. Friend said.

It has always been the case that Ofwat is there to ensure that the investment that is required in our waterways and our sewerage is made, to ensure that we get best value for money. It is important to note that these SIs cover what happens when we see water companies and other operators, having had that ability to invest, breach their permits. We want to make sure that the penalties are uncapped in order to act as an effective deterrent, as I have mentioned.

Hon. Members have asked how some of those penalties will be applied. I expect that, as now, the Environment Agency will use the guidelines for environmental offences, which are published by the independent Sentencing Council, to determine the level of all variable monetary penalties. Thinking particularly of some of the very small businesses covered by the environmental permitting regime, that will also include a number of safeguards to make sure that penalties are proportionate.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

On the subject of penalties, one thing probably annoys most of us—it certainly annoys many of my constituents—is that whatever happens, the chief executive seems to get a massive dividend. When it comes to damages and penalties, is it possible that those dividends could be retrieved and used for the betterment of customers?

[Dr Coffey]

The water industry in Northern Ireland is not covered by the UK Government. It is a separate system, so with the greatest respect I think the hon. Gentleman will need to follow that up with the Northern Ireland Executive when they are reformed, which I hope will be soon. However, I will also ask the permanent secretary to write to him in that regard.

The regulations apply only to England. We invited the Welsh Government to join us in making the regulations, but they felt unable to act at the pace at which we have acted. That is not to say there are not sewage spillages or other environmental breaches in Wales—there are: we know that on average there were 38 spillages from Welsh storm overflows last year, compared with 23 in England.

The new regulations sit alongside the freedom that we have given Ofwat to link water company dividends to environmental performance. As I have referred to, the fines and penalties will be reinvested in local water improvement schemes through our new water restoration fund, while the water company will pay the polluter penalty and will have to fix the problems at no cost to the bill payer.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Jim Shannon and Thérèse Coffey

Thursday 25th May 2023 Commons Chamber

[Dr Coffey]

As I just said, I expect an announcement on the progress of the Bill very soon, but I stress that animal welfare has been a priority for the Government since 2010. We have made improvements for farm animals, pets and wild animals. In 2021, we published an action plan on animal welfare, and since then we have delivered four manifesto commitments and passed the Animal Welfare (Sentience) Act 2022 and the Animal Welfare (Sentencing) Act 2021. We have provided greater protection for elephants by bringing the Ivory Act 2018 into force, and we are extending that. We have also made micro- chipping compulsory. We have supported many measures in our manifesto through the House and hopefully more will complete their passage through the other place within the next couple of months.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I welcome the Secretary of State’s response. I endorse the request made by the hon. Member for Torbay (Kevin Foster), because puppy smuggling is an important issue in Northern Ireland. We have to work together to tackle the smuggling of puppies from the Republic of Ireland into Northern Ireland and across on to the mainland. Has the right hon. Lady had an opportunity to speak to the authorities in Northern Ireland, the Police Service of Northern Ireland in particular, to stop this terrible activity that goes on across all of the United Kingdom?

[Dr Coffey]

I had the great pleasure of attending the Balmoral show recently, although I admit we were more focused on farming and food, rather than aspects of animal welfare. The police can act on a number of activities where they suspect crime is being committed, and we intend to strengthen the offences to help the police.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Jim Shannon and Thérèse Coffey

Thursday 30th March 2023 Commons Chamber

[Dr Coffey]

I assure my hon. Friend that I see my role as Secretary of State as ensuring that we have productive trade agreements, which include exports as well as potential imports. It is important, and it has been a key part of our negotiations, that we not only protect our sanitary and phytosanitary and animal welfare standards but ensure that any impact on the domestic market is sufficient that British farmers continue to grow, and rear, their brilliant British food and livestock.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I know the Government and the Minister, in particular, take a deep interest in fisheries issues, specifically about spurdog fishing; I asked the Minister a question about that some time ago. Will the Minister confirm that the total allowable catch for spurdog will be announced? That will create a significant boost for all local fisheries, especially those in Northern Ireland.

UK Food Shortages

Debate between Jim Shannon and Thérèse Coffey

Thursday 23rd February 2023 Commons Chamber

[Dr Coffey]

As I said to the NFU yesterday, farmers are here to feed the country. That is why we support them and will continue to support them in a number of different ways. We are going through a transition away from a financial support system of direct payments, the basic payment, where more than half the money was going to just 10% of farmers because it was based on how much land people had. That is part of the journey we are on, but there are still significant amounts of basic payments going in. That is why we still want, as our manifesto set out and as I said to the NFU yesterday, to at least maintain the amount of domestic food production, if not increase it. We will continue to try to support that, to ensure that our farmers are there for generations to come.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I thank the Secretary of State for her answers and for trying to be constructive in those answers, as always. Having heard examples of shoppers turned away from shops for trying to purchase vegetables for their family of seven—I was told that story just yesterday—it is clear that steps must be taken to secure our produce. Can she outline the steps being taken to ensure that paperwork for importation is a smooth system, allowing new suppliers to be found and easily facilitated at this time of shortage and need?

[Dr Coffey]

I am conscious that, as the hon. Gentleman will be aware, we are still working on issues involving the Northern Ireland protocol in terms of exchanges between parts of the UK. It is important to recognise that suppliers are proactively working with supermarkets—that is what we have been told. We have been told there is an issue for potentially up to four weeks, and I am keen that the sector gets on with alternative sourcing options. Meanwhile, we will continue to encourage and boost food production. That has always been set out in our food strategy and our manifesto commitment, and I am determined we will try to deliver it.

Environmental Improvement Plan 2023

Debate between Jim Shannon and Thérèse Coffey

Wednesday 1st February 2023 Commons Chamber

[Dr Coffey]

My hon. Friend is absolutely right to say how important this issue is. It is not just about the coast. Traditionally, bathing water statistics have focused on coastal areas, because that is where the majority of people go to enjoy that leisure, so that is vital. More broadly, the quality of water matters dramatically. I think of our chalk streams, which are so precious.

Let me tell the House a little anecdote about an occasion when I went to see the River Itchen. The landowner in front of me, having spotted a bottle of dog shampoo, started to cry and said, “This person may not have realised that they have just ruined the chemical status of this river for about the next 25 years.” That will not have been done deliberately, so we need to ensure that everyone is more aware. I understand why my hon. Friend is campaigning for his local river to be brought into the bathing water statistics, and I am sure that his case will be considered very carefully indeed.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

While I note that the plan applies to England specifically, the protection of 30% of land and sea, including through marine protected areas, must apply equally to the Irish sea. What discussions have taken place with officials from the Department of Agriculture, Environment and Rural Affairs in Northern Ireland to ensure that Northern Ireland Water does not drop the ball, and that that protection is fully extended?

[Dr Coffey]

The hon. Gentleman has made a strong point. In preparation for the CBD COP15 in Montreal, we brought back together the four nations of the United Kingdom that we are proud to represent. We have the Joint Nature Conservation Committee, which is a body that covers the UK. Last year, wearing a different hat, I visited the Giant’s Causeway, which is, of course, extraordinary.

We want to ensure that there is more access to Northern Ireland in this regard, and I know that that has been an important part of the discussions that have taken place. However, we will also continue to work closely with officials—although we all want the Executive to be re-formed so that we can really make progress in Northern Ireland, which is a fantastic part of the United Kingdom.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Jim Shannon and Thérèse Coffey

Thursday 12th January 2023 Commons Chamber

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

2. Whether she has made an assessment of the potential implications for her policies of the recommendations of UK100’s clean air net zero report.

[The Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Dr Thérèse Coffey)]

Happy new year, Mr Speaker.

I am pleased that air quality is improving across our country. I have not made an assessment of that report, but I expect all local authorities to make full use of the many powers available to improve air quality and meet their statutory obligations. That includes an expectation that local authorities will contribute to delivering the new target on reducing population exposure to PM2.5.

[Jim Shannon]

I thank the Secretary of State for her answer. She will be aware that UK100’s report, “Yes We CANZ: Local leaders delivering Clean Air and Net Zero”, highlights the importance of bringing together clean air and net zero challenges. Many sources of greenhouse gases are also sources of air pollution. Can she comment on the report’s recommendations? Will she agree to meet me and some of the cross-party local authority members of UK100 to discuss how the Government can support the further integration of the clean air and net zero agendas?

--- Later in debate ---

[Dr Coffey]

I am conscious of the impact fireworks can have on animals. I will share my hon. Friend’s concerns with my noble Friend Lord Benyon, who covers this area, and I expect Lord Benyon will meet with him.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

The Minister will be aware of the Northern Ireland protocol and the difficulties that vets in Northern Ireland are experiencing in accessing medicines. It is important that assistance is given on both availability and cost. Vets are reorientating their supply chains with great difficulty. Can I seek the Minister’s help for Northern Ireland vets in respect of medicines access, so that we have the same access to treatment as the rest of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland?

[Dr Coffey]

The hon. Gentleman will be aware of the status of what is happening with the Northern Ireland protocol. My noble Friend Lord Benyon leads on borders and veterinarians, so I will bring the hon. Gentleman’s question to his attention. It is important that we continue to ensure a peaceful solution to what is happening in Northern Ireland and a restoration of the Northern Ireland Executive and Assembly as quickly as possible.

Convention on Biodiversity COP15: Outcomes

Debate between Jim Shannon and Thérèse Coffey

Monday 19th December 2022 Commons Chamber

[Dr Coffey]

Through the Environment Act 2021, some targets on improving the environment are already in primary legislation. We have just confirmed pretty much the environmental targets that we consulted on earlier in the year. I believe the statutory instruments are being laid today, and I think one is being laid tomorrow, so that Parliament can vote on those legally binding targets. Meanwhile, we continue to make other improvements, including through the clean air strategy, the biosecurity plan, existing plans for increasing biodiversity, and landscape recoveries.

We are already doing a lot of work. Indeed, we are changing our funding away from the basic payment system and what the European Union did—making payments to improve the environment based on the amount of land somebody owned—to paying for services, so that we can do more spatial targeting in a more intelligent way by improving water quality and reducing pollution. We will take that forward in aspects of the environmental improvement plan, which will be published next month, as well as in the changes that we will make through the environmental land management scheme.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

First, may I welcome the Secretary of State’s statement, which is really encouraging news? I think we are all excited by what she said. As somebody who has been involved in prior biodiversity drives and has planted some 350,000 trees on my land, I know that other landowners will get involved if the incentive is there. I am inspired by the aims, but will the Secretary of State outline how she believes that the UK as a whole can achieve them, how the devolved nations will play into them, and how we in the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland can all win?

[Dr Coffey]

I thank the hon. Gentleman. I know that the people of Northern Ireland are also keen to see enhanced nature. I recall my trip earlier this year when I went to the Giant’s Causeway for the first time ever and saw beauty in nature but also the force of nature and a desire to continue to improve it. As for how we work together, it will be up to individual devolved Administrations, but I know that Northern Ireland Ministers and the Executive have been very supportive of our approaches so far.

Covid-19: DWP Update

Debate between Jim Shannon and Thérèse Coffey

Monday 4th May 2020 Commons Chamber

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP) [V]]

Thank you, Mr Speaker; it is always a pleasure to ask a question. I thank the Secretary of State for her energy and commitment and her responses to the questions so far. I also thank the DWP staff across the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, and in particular those in Strangford, who have done a whole lot to help people.

The Secretary of State referred to self-employed directors. Hospitality, retail, fishing, construction and bus companies invest their profit back into their companies, as well as self-employed directors. Many of these are family businesses creating many jobs in the high street. Exactly what can be done to help the self-employed directors in shops in Newtownards, Comber, Ballynahinch, Saintfield and villages across the constituency of Strangford?

[Dr Coffey]

It is good to see my hon. Friend doing well over in Northern Ireland. I want to stress again that the scheme established by the Treasury will cover about 95% of people who receive the majority of their income from self-employment. I have tried to share with the House some of the approach taken in order to support people who pay themselves only, in effect, by dividends. As I pointed out earlier, a small percentage of people get the majority of their income in that way, on which, in effect, they pay only 7.5% tax. I am conscious that it cannot be decided whether dividends are solely for substitute pay or whether they are a return on investment, but I encourage those people to consider other forms of support that may be available at this time.

Degraded Chalk Stream Environments

Debate between Jim Shannon and Thérèse Coffey

Monday 22nd July 2019 Commons Chamber

[Dr Coffey]

I entirely agree, and I hope that that will happen. I think that the term of the current chair of Ofwat, who is a doughty defender of the consumer, is due for a short extension until 2020. I also genuinely believe that any future holder of the great office of Secretary of State—if that person is not our excellent right hon. Friend the Member for Surrey Heath (Michael Gove), who has done so much for the environment and, indeed, so much in challenging water companies—will take that point into account.

[Jim Shannon]

No one has mentioned one issue so far tonight, but it is important for it to be on the record in Hansard. I refer to the issue of water leakages. If there is a demand for more water—which clearly there is—water companies need to address the issue. Will the Minister make that a priority, so that water is not wasted as it clearly is being wasted now, and we can use that precious resource much better?

[Dr Coffey]

The hon. Gentleman is absolutely right. For several years there has been an economic calculation about the cost of repairing the causes of leakages rather than doing something else to keep water flowing. I will not say that the price of repairs is irrelevant, but it is not the only factor under consideration. Water users struggle. My right hon. Friend the Member for Chesham and Amersham (Dame Cheryl Gillan) spoke extensively about the water consumption of residents, and the need for us to consume less. If the water companies are allowed not to take the issue quite as seriously as they have been, why should the end user make a difference? I think that the situation is changing, but we need to recognise that the economics do not always add up.

As the hon. Gentleman will know, this matter is devolved. Our 25-year environment plan for England, which concerns reserved matters, sets out our commitment to protect our water environment and how we will do that, to ensure that there is enough water for the environment as well as for homes and businesses.

Our abstraction reform plan, launched in 2017, explains how we will ensure that abstractors can access the water that they need, and that there is enough water in our rivers, and groundwater, to maintain habitats and water quality. That includes reducing the damaging abstraction of water from rivers and groundwater, so that by 2021 the proportion of water bodies with enough water to support environmental standards will increase from 82% to 90% for surface water bodies, and from 72% to 77% for groundwater bodies. Earlier this year we published our abstraction reform progress report to Parliament, which shows that the Environment Agency is on track to meet those targets.

The Environment Agency has already reviewed thousands of abstraction licences, and has changed many of the most damaging. Seventy-one abstraction licences on 15 chalk streams across England have now been changed. Those changes will return 16 million cubic metres of water per year to the chalk streams, and will remove the risk of another 8 million cubic metres per year being taken. This is equivalent to the average annual domestic water use of approximately 200,000 people, the approximate population of Oxford.

Developing a stronger catchment focus is a key aspect of abstraction reform. The Environment Agency is now testing innovative solutions to protect the environment and improve access to water in priority catchments. The Cam and Ely Ouse and the East Suffolk priority catchments both contain rivers that are fed by chalk groundwater. In these priority catchments, there are now stakeholder groups, which are made up of a wide variety of abstractors with an Environment Agency co-ordinator, who are working together to develop and trial new solutions to address sustainability issues. I look forward to the Environment Agency launching more of these water resource catchments later this year.

The River Bulbourne in Hertfordshire is impacted by the Canal and River Trust operations, including groundwater abstractions. The Environment Agency is presently negotiating delivery of recommended solutions with the trust. Affinity Water has also completed an investigation for the River Bulbourne and as a result will implement river restoration projects in the catchment by 2025, subject to its business plan being approved by Ofwat, and I see no reason for Ofwat to reject it. The Environment Agency’s chalk stream partnership “Bringing Back the Bulbourne” has been an award-winning success story.

Turning to the River Kennet in the constituency of my right hon. Friend the Member for Newbury (Richard Benyon), the Environment Agency, working with Thames Water, has changed abstraction licences that impact the Kennet, Wye and Hughenden stream. This includes reducing Thames Water’s licence at Axford to restrict groundwater abstraction when flows are low, revoking its Ogbourne licence, and investing in a £30 million pipeline that prevents up to 10 million litres of groundwater from being abstracted when river levels are low.

Turning to parts of north London and an issue not directly in the constituency of the hon. Member for Dagenham and Rainham but close to the heart of Feargal Sharkey, the River Lee below Ware weir lock splits between the old River Lee and the Lee navigation. The loop was the original course of the River Lee and is the site of two fisheries clubs. Flows in the loop are influenced by the volumes abstracted upstream from the Lee by Thames Water and by navigation activities. The Environment Agency seeks to manage flows on the Lee between Thames Water, the Canal and River Trust and the Amwell Magna loop. Thames Water operates under a voluntary flow trigger to reduce its abstraction volumes. This assists with downstream flows but its abstraction is still a significant volume of the available flow. Thames Water has invested in habitat enhancement improvements in the loop, working with the fisheries and the Environment Agency.

Several contributors to the debate talked about the impact of dry weather on chalk streams. Some of our chalk streams are showing flow impacts that could be attributed to the prolonged dry weather we have experienced over the last couple of years. Impacts are visible in chalk streams in Cambridgeshire, Bedfordshire, Hertfordshire, north London, Lincolnshire and Northampton, but I have to admit that the national picture is variable.

The impacts we are seeing in chalk streams include changes to fish movement, a decline in the numbers of invertebrates and an increase in algae. The Environment Agency’s current actions include leading and co-ordinating the National Drought Group, which brings together a wide range of stakeholders responsible for water and for those who need the water. This partnership includes water companies, the Government and non-governmental organisations, including the National Farmers Union, environmental groups and business groups. The Environment Agency also collates and monitors evidence of impacts of dry weather on chalk streams and actions undertaken to protect the streams.

If required, the Environment Agency will implement abstraction restrictions to protect the environment. For example, as we have heard, the Environment Agency is likely to implement restrictions in a number of places, including the River Stour catchment in Essex, which is a chalk stream. That will affect 16 abstraction licences, and there will be a reduction of 25% to their weekly abstraction limit. The Environment Agency is discussing these matters with individual abstraction licence holders in other parts of the country, particularly Hertfordshire, Berkshire and Herefordshire.

My right hon. Friend the Member for Chesham and Amersham referred to the designation of sites. The Government have designated 11 high priority chalk rivers as sites of special scientific interest to protect them from the pressures they are under and to begin work to restore them. Each of those 11 designated chalk rivers that has been assessed to be in an unfavourable condition has a river restoration plan. For the record, those rivers are the Kennet, the Nar, the Test, the Frome, the Hull headwaters, the Lambourn, the Itchen, the Wensum, the Bere streams, the Moors rivers system and the Avon system. By implementing these action plans, we have enhanced more than 40 miles of priority chalk river habitat through 60 projects since 2011.

Chalk rivers are protected from harmful effluent discharges by a rigorous permitting process. When an operator seeks to discharge effluent, they must first get a licence from the Environment Agency. In consultation with Natural England, civil society and the public, the agency will then grant the permit to discharge into a priority chalk stream only if the environmental risk is low. I am conscious of the example that was used earlier, and I will draw it to the attention of the Environment Agency so that it can investigate further the concerns about discharges.

Natural England has been delivering catchment-sensitive farming, offering a combination of grants and advice to help to reduce pollution from farms within priority catchments, including chalk streams, across the country. There is clear evidence that this advice has led to improvements in water quality and a reduction in serious water pollution incidents, and ecological communities have responded positively to the reductions in sediment pressure. However, it is important to stress that all water companies also have a significant role to play in protecting the environment. A large proportion of companies look after the chalk aquifer, which is the major aquifer of southern and eastern England. These companies include Thames, Affinity, Southern and Anglian. Apparently, South East is also included, as is Yorkshire, for some reason. This just goes to show how far the power of Yorkshire stretches, as my hon. Friend the Member for Thirsk and Malton will know.

There are good examples of partnership work in action. The Environment Agency’s work with Affinity Water to reduce abstractions at 11 pumping stations across seven chalk streams means that 70 million litres of water a day will be kept in the environment by 2025, and they have reduced abstraction from the River Mimram and the River Beane by over 40%. In the north London and Hertfordshire area alone, the Environment Agency is working to improve more than 150 miles of chalk streams by 2025. The agency also hopes to remove or bypass 50 weirs or other structures to improve fish passage and habitats in the north London area.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Jim Shannon and Thérèse Coffey

Thursday 9th May 2019 Commons Chamber

[Dr Coffey]

I will certainly look at that again. I understand that village halls are usually run by separate entities, so I am not sure why there is a barrier to grant applications in the villages that the hon. Gentleman has mentioned.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

Hundreds of farmers are being treated for mental health issues. What plans have been made to ensure that village halls have a signpost to mental health help for rural communities?

[Dr Coffey]

Village halls are used for a variety of purposes, including the provision of health services, which are also available in the voluntary sector. I commend the hon. Gentleman’s suggestion on how we can continue to use village halls to support farmers locally.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Jim Shannon and Thérèse Coffey

Thursday 17th January 2019 Commons Chamber

[Dr Coffey]

It is important that evidence is gathered to try to tackle the issue. I know that farmers are taking preventive action to try to stop people entering their areas illegally. It matters that we also work together on other issues of rural crime, such as hare coursing, and other significant routes used by serious and organised crime to try to exploit the countryside.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

Does the Minister intend to liaise with the Ministry of Justice on increasing the ability of the judiciary to make examples of those who flout the law? The fines are less than the financial advantage of waste disposal, which does not add up.

[Dr Coffey]

As I have said, we have set out our intentions in our resources and waste strategy. Fining is one approach and different types of sentences is another. That is the kind of work we are doing with the MOJ and, of course, the Home Office.

Anti-Corruption Strategy: Illegal Wildlife Trade

Debate between Jim Shannon and Thérèse Coffey

Wednesday 28th February 2018 Westminster Hall

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Dr Thérèse Coffey)]

Thank you, Mrs Moon; it is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship. I congratulate the hon. Member for Ealing Central and Acton (Dr Huq) on securing this important debate on the anti-corruption strategy and the illegal wildlife trade. I welcome the debate, which is timely because we are preparing for the illegal wildlife trade conference in London in October, as the hon. Member for Stroud (Dr Drew) pointed out.

The UK Government’s anti-corruption strategy was published in December. It provides an ambitious framework for tackling corruption to 2022 and includes significant international and domestic commitments. The strategy describes the illegal wildlife trade as the fourth most lucrative trans-boundary crime, with an estimated value of up to £17 billion a year. We recognise that it damages economic growth and undermines state institutions and the rule of law. It relies on and exacerbates corruption, cultivating discontent and undermining security. Seizures of illegally traded species have been recorded in 120 countries and include approximately 7,000 species.

I am very conscious that the illegal wildlife trade threatens some of the world’s most iconic species, such as elephants and rhinos, with extinction, but it is not just those majestic animals that are threatened; birds, flora and invertebrates are also among the thousands of species at risk from illegal trade. For example, tropical hardwoods are illegally felled and shipped around the world, with impacts on forest fauna, water quality, medicines and building materials for local people.

CITES—the convention on international trade in endangered species of wild fauna and flora—protects more than 35,000 species. The UK is fully committed to its obligations under CITES to act against unsustainable trade that threatens the survival of species in the wild. We are pressing ahead with activities inspired by the aims of CITES to ensure the sustainability of legal trade in wild flora and fauna and to protect species ranging from lions and goshawks to cacti, coral and rare orchids.

The UK chairs the CITES working group on proposals to combat illegal killing and trafficking of rhinos. We take an active role in the implementation and development of CITES controls and are actively involved in working groups on species ranging from great apes to sharks. Our aim is to ensure that the international trade in specimens of wild animals and plants does not threaten their survival.

International trade in hunting trophies is controlled under CITES. Although there are examples of negative effects from big game hunting caused by poor or inappropriate management, scientific evidence shows that in certain limited and rigorously controlled cases, trophy and big game hunting can be an effective conservation tool, supporting local livelihoods and attracting revenue for other conservation activities. That was confirmed in the report that was prepared for the Government by Oxford University. That said, we will continue to look very carefully at big game imports, to ensure that they do not impact on the sustainability of endangered species in the country of origin.

The UK anti-corruption strategy recognises that countering the illegal wildlife trade requires concerted multilateral action to raise awareness, eradicate markets, strengthen legal frameworks, strengthen law enforcement and—critically—promote alternative livelihoods. While I in no way excuse such activity, if somebody can earn in one night what it would otherwise take them five years to earn, one might understand why people commit these crimes. However, there is no excuse for doing so. We are working with global partners, including the G20 and UN, to achieve the aims that I have outlined.

Progress is being made. UN resolutions, co-sponsored by the UK, recognise the links between IWT and corruption. In 2015, the UN General Assembly called upon member states for the first time

“to prohibit, prevent and counter any form of corruption that facilitates illicit trafficking in wildlife and wildlife products.”

Last year the UK worked successfully with Germany’s G20 presidency to agree high-level principles on combating corruption related to the illegal trade in wildlife and wildlife products.

The UK has shown global leadership in tackling IWT, and I thank right hon. Members and hon. Members for their generous comments about that. We hosted the first, groundbreaking London conference in 2014, which secured ambitious agreements from more than 40 Governments to take urgent, co-ordinated action and was hailed as a turning point in global efforts to tackle these damaging activities. We also played a leading role in the subsequent conferences in Botswana and Vietnam.

Previous conferences have achieved an international consensus against IWT, but we recognise that there is more to do. The levels of poaching of many species remain unsustainably high and, as has already been pointed out, organised criminal networks continue to benefit from the proceeds of IWT. That is why urgent, united action by the international community remains vital.

Our work on IWT fits within the four strategic pillars that were agreed at the first conference in London in 2014: eradicating the market for illegal wildlife products; ensuring effective legal frameworks and deterrents; strengthening law enforcement; and providing sustainable livelihoods and economic development. These four pillars are well established and are used globally to focus on IWT.

To help to reaffirm political commitment, we are bringing global leaders back to London this October for another conference. I understand that the invitations have gone out and we want to welcome people from around the world, so that we can come together to focus on tangible outcomes for delivery. In particular, we intend to focus on law enforcement and tackling the corruption that facilitates IWT. The conference will recognise IWT as a serious organised crime that affects people as well as animals, and it will harness the power of the private sector, non-government organisations, academia and technology to strengthen global action.

To support our global leadership on tackling IWT, the UK Government are investing £26 million in practical action around the world to reduce demand, strengthen enforcement, ensure effective legal frameworks and develop sustainable livelihoods for affected communities. We are providing funding to Interpol to expand its work on tracking and intercepting illegal shipments of ivory, rhino horn and other illegal wildlife products.

Also, the four-year Waylay II project starts this year. It will improve awareness and understanding of advanced investigative techniques in Kenya, Uganda, Singapore, Vietnam and China. We have funded the British military to provide tracker training for park rangers in African states. We have also worked with China to deliver joint training to African border forces, and we have committed up to £4 million to the International Consortium on Combating Wildlife Crime—Interpol is one of the five organisations involved in the ICCWC—to help to strengthen criminal justice systems and co-ordinate support at regional, national and international levels to combat wildlife and forest crime. We have already paid £1.6 million of that money this month.

[Jim Shannon]

The Minister has touched on this, but I asked in my contribution what help was being given towards training and equipping the rangers. Can she confirm that she has been able to help with that?

[Dr Coffey]

I have already pointed out that we have funded the British military to provide tracker training. I attended a project in South Africa, where we have worked with an organisation involving the Tusk Trust to increase anti-poacher training and the techniques to do that. More than one Member has asked about this, but we are investigating, as the 25-year environment plan said, the feasibility of a more established poaching taskforce. Just last week, I was in France speaking to my opposite number and we will explore options together. This work does not need to solely involve the UK Government or the British military; there should be a collective effort to extend it.

The Crown Prosecution Service has worked with officials in key states such as Kenya and Tanzania to share its expertise and to help to strengthen the enforcement activities in those countries. Part of the UK Government’s funding is the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs’ IWT Challenge Fund. It funds 47 projects around the world and has a value of just over £14 million.

Those projects include training of rangers, border force agents and prosecutors; campaigns to reduce the demand for products in key markets; supporting legislative reform; and helping communities to manage their wildlife and benefit from it, for example through tourism. It also funds projects aimed at tackling corruption, by engaging with Governments, enforcement agencies and the private sector. There is also mapping of one area, as the hon. Member for Ealing Central and Acton referred to. The next round of the IWT Challenge Fund is expected to open for applications later this year. I am sure that we will welcome any new projects, and I hope to announce the successful applicants to round four of the fund later this spring.

We are also strengthening action against IWT at home. We have consulted on proposals to introduce a total ban on UK sales of ivory, with narrowly defined and carefully targeted exemptions. It was welcome that we received more than 70,000 responses, with overwhelming support for a ban. A response to the consultation will be published shortly.

I know that hon. Members often ask, “What is ‘shortly’? When will it happen?” We want to ensure that any ban we propose will be effective and will not be open to legal challenge. That is why we need to go through, very carefully, every representation that has been made to us. If we did not do that, we would be subject to legal challenge, which could derail the legislation that is already being drafted on some of the big items, where there is no dispute about what we want to take forward. I can assure the Chamber that officials and lawyers are already actively working on this issue.

In the short time I have left, I will again mention the London conference. It will have three main themes—

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Jim Shannon and Thérèse Coffey

Thursday 26th October 2017 Commons Chamber

[Dr Coffey]

I recognise what my hon. Friend says. It is key that we continue to do more to work with farmers at a local level to ensure that their farms have better barriers against such access. Nevertheless, this is about targeting, getting intelligence, ensuring that we follow up people who are dumping, and using the full force of the law to deter such behaviour.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

The Minister has outlined the importance of the issue and the role of the local councils. Will she indicate what incentives local councils can make available to homeowners to encourage them to use waste recycling centres, rather than harming agricultural land and farmers?

[Dr Coffey]

This matter is devolved in Northern Ireland. We are issuing new guidance with the Department for Communities and Local Government to try to clarify what councils should and should not be charging when people want to use the recycling centre. I know that councils want to do the right thing. Some £800 million is spent every year on tackling litter and fly-tipping, which is why we want to work with councils and the Environment Agency to make improvements.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Jim Shannon and Thérèse Coffey

Thursday 19th January 2017 Commons Chamber

[Dr Coffey]

I commend Southend-on-Sea Borough Council for its tree planting scheme, and I personally acknowledge my hon. Friend’s recent bereavement with the loss of his mother, Maud. I certainly agree with his tribute because trees can provide a longstanding reminder of the departed and offer bereaved loved ones a special place to visit that is living and growing. I know that from personal experience of the trees planted in Wrexham cemetery.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

Having planted some 3,500 trees on my farm back home, I am aware of the incentives given by the Department of Agriculture and Rural Development. Will the Minister indicate what long-term incentives there are for farmers to plant trees, and for the participation of community groups and schools in that process?

[Dr Coffey]

As I have outlined, the countryside stewardship scheme acts as an incentive for tree planting. I am glad that the hon. Gentleman is leading by example but, as he understands, the encouragement in Northern Ireland is led by his Government there.

Air Quality

Debate between Jim Shannon and Thérèse Coffey

Thursday 3rd November 2016 Commons Chamber

[Dr Coffey]

I have outlined the fact that the Treasury has already provided incentives to make some changes and that we are looking at the strategic road network. We have to do this on the basis of the best available evidence. We are updating our modelling, and I hope that we will be able to help Enfield Council in due course.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

Does the Minister accept not only that steps need to be taken, but that a knee-jerk reaction is not needed? We need action that does not adversely affect industry and our economy, but that encourages a reduction in pollution.

[Dr Coffey]

The hon. Gentleman makes a fair point, but we do have to have a sense of urgency on this issue, and I am absolutely committed to prioritising it. It is a top priority for me and the Secretary of State. I will echo what the Prime Minister said:

“We have taken action, but there is more to do and we will do it.”—[Official Report, 2 November 2016; Vol. 616, c. 887.]

Business of the House

Debate between Jim Shannon and Thérèse Coffey

Thursday 26th May 2016 Commons Chamber

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

In Pakistan, another Ahmadi Muslim was murdered in a target killing in Karachi on Monday night. To date, 30 Ahmadis have been murdered there on grounds of faith—but not a single attacker has been brought to justice. In Indonesia on Sunday, an Ahmadi mosque was attacked and destroyed in central Java. Will the Deputy Leader of the House agree to a statement on what the Government are doing to tackle intolerance and extremism against Ahmadis and to call on countries to make adequate provision for that?

[Dr Coffey]

I am not aware of the details of that particular situation. The best I can do is to ensure that the appropriate Minister replies directly to the hon. Gentleman.

Parliamentary Assembly of the Council of Europe

Debate between Jim Shannon and Thérèse Coffey

Tuesday 3rd November 2015 Commons Chamber

[Dr Coffey]

I take those duties very seriously. I am sure that the wise words that have been expressed today will be listened to. Nevertheless, the convention on appointments that has been followed on multiple occasions has been followed in this case. There is nothing to suggest that there is anything disorderly about it. My understanding is that you, Mr Speaker, will present the names on behalf of Parliament to the Parliamentary Assembly.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I thank the hon. Member for Christchurch (Mr Chope) for bringing this matter to the House and allowing us all to make a contribution.

I agree that the groups should not only be made up of parliamentary representatives but be picked by the House. I share the concern expressed by the hon. Member for Ochil and South Perthshire (Ms Ahmed-Sheikh) about the Scottish National party’s exclusion from the Joint Committee on Human Rights. I would like my party to be involved in that Committee, too. Will the Deputy Leader of the House tell us what steps are being taken to ensure that the House itself will decide who the representatives will be, and that Members will make that decision rather than just one person?

[Dr Coffey]

I cannot give the hon. Gentleman any assurances about changes in procedure, because there have been no such changes in the past five years. He should be aware, however, that the right hon. Member for Lagan Valley (Mr Donaldson) has been appointed as a member of the Parliamentary Assembly. There are 27 Members of Parliament on the list, 10 of whom come from the 2015 intake. This is just about changing with the new set of MPs coming into the House.

NHS Funding (Ageing)

Debate between Jim Shannon and Thérèse Coffey

Tuesday 25th March 2014 Westminster Hall

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

It is a pleasure to make a contribution to the debate. I congratulate the hon. Member for Suffolk Coastal (Dr Coffey) on bringing the matter before the House for consideration and giving us all the opportunity to contribute.

We are long past the days when people who die at the age of 68 would be considered to have had a good innings. Now, we would shake our head and describe them as in their prime. The rising age of our population has meant an increase in the pension age, with further increases to come. That is something my parliamentary aide has questioned, saying that she will have to work until she is 72. She wonders who will hire her to write speeches and come to the House then. At the age of 35 or thereabouts, she is already thinking of the future.

One of the figures in the press last week, which hon. Members have referred to, was that we in the United Kingdom now have the greatest number of people living to the age of 100 since records began. Approximately 600 people have lived to 105, which is another indication of the statistical trends. Although that is perhaps great for families who use the free grandparent babysitting service offered nationwide—that is what grandparents do—and which has ensured that families get to enjoy time together, with stories and wisdom passing easily down the generations, it has also put a lot more pressure on our NHS. The NHS is not equipped to handle that pressure without major investment or a redirection and reprioritising of funding.

The sheer beauty of my constituency and the area’s strong links to Belfast and other cities make it one of the most desirable places for older people to retire to—indeed, Strangford and the neighbouring constituency of North Down are the top two retirement locations in Northern Ireland. The hon. Member for Suffolk Coastal said that people want to retire to her constituency because it too is beautiful, and quieter and more serene than many places. As they do in my constituency, people might look forward to seeing the sea in the morning and taking walks, because these are the attractions of such locations. More people retiring to such places, however, certainly puts pressure on our local NHS.

If the Government took account of this debate and increased the funding given to the NHS, offering additional ring-fenced funding to the devolved Assemblies, the level of care would be much greater. I look forward to the Minister’s response, as I always do, because he understands the issues and I respect his comments. It is fantastic to read about the available drugs, treatments and therapies, but the fact is that the NHS cannot afford to provide them fully. Any additional funding would benefit not simply the ageing population, but the entire community. There are pressures on the NHS, given the prioritising of funding to the sections where it is needed most, but I am sure I am not the only person in the Chamber to have read the media speculation about the NHS and the ageing population. Statistics from the Institute for Fiscal Studies indicate that spending per patient will have fallen by 9% within four years even if health service funding is ring-fenced and protected.

I have already alluded to the reasons: 2 million more over-65s on the UK mainland, which is a 20% rise, will place far greater demands on the NHS. To give the Northern Ireland perspective, new figures released by the Northern Ireland Statistics and Research Agency show that the number of people aged 65 and over is projected to increase by a quarter, to 344,000, by 2022. That indicates the pressures on the NHS in Northern Ireland, where health is a devolved matter.

[Dr Coffey]

Has the hon. Gentleman seen the figures circulated by the Royal College of Physicians, which show that two thirds of people attending A and E and admitted to hospital are aged over 65? We all recognise that we need to do more to prevent people going into hospital when they might not need to, and certainly to expedite their leaving. Does he recognise that, right here, right now, we still need to allow CCGs to have appropriate funding to address that need?

[Jim Shannon]

I agree with that. If more preventive action is taken at an early stage in surgeries, that will have dividends further down the line. The hon. Lady is quite right and I wholeheartedly agree with her.

Rail (East Anglia)

Debate between Jim Shannon and Thérèse Coffey

Tuesday 3rd July 2012 Westminster Hall

[Dr Thérèse Coffey (Suffolk Coastal) (Con)]

Mr Hollobone, it is a great pleasure to serve under your chairmanship. I am delighted that many colleagues from our counties are here today. I extend a warm welcome to the hon. Member for Nottingham South (Lilian Greenwood), who will be alone on her side of the Chamber because East Anglia has not a single Labour Member of Parliament. However, she will be pleased to know that Labour councillors have worked through their district and other councils, local enterprise partnerships, rail passenger groups and MPs to put together a vision, so she should not feel completely alone. I was delighted to be able to send both her and the Minister a copy of the prospectus before today’s debate.

Investing in East Anglia’s rail will benefit local residents and the national economy. Connecting our economic hubs, moving freight on to rail and improving our branch line services, alongside smarter ticketing, new and refurbished trains and better stations, will make a huge difference to people in Suffolk, Norfolk, Essex and Cambridgeshire. That is why we are all united with the people I mentioned earlier to try to deliver a document, “Once in a generation—A rail prospectus for East Anglia”, which was launched yesterday. I am delighted that many MPs were able to put their name to our proposals.

I know that some colleagues are planning to speak and some are planning to intervene. I will indicate the appropriate point, if that is okay, because I will be referring to some colleagues who are not able to be here today. That will be clearly signalled, and I hope that the signalling is better than that which we experience on the great eastern main line.

In putting the matter into context, if I paint a negative picture, I am afraid that it is, sadly, a true one—poor reliability, cramped commuters, old stock, unsmart ticketing and a poor deal for East Anglian rail passengers, who, with the premium in the last franchise, are net contributors to rail services in the rest of the country. However, I am delighted that we have come together to say that we can have a better service. It is possible and feasible, and there is a genuine commitment to try to ensure that the infrastructure for East Anglia is among the best, so that we can harness the economic benefits and a better quality of life for people.

I have just dashed from a meeting of my Select Committee, in which we were interrogating Broadband Delivery UK and the Under-Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport, my hon. Friend the Member for Wantage (Mr Vaizey), who has responsibility for broadband. Broadband is another key asset, but better broadband for our counties will not replace the need for people to travel to work and for investors to come out to our communities.

I have mentioned the prospectus already, and I am not planning to regurgitate every single priority in the document. I will try to give an overview and focus on Suffolk.

Some colleagues are not able to attend today—some are ministerial colleagues who approached me to say that unfortunately they have meetings and cannot attend. They include my hon. Friend the Member for Norwich North (Miss Smith), whom I think should be given great credit for trying to pull together, on a long journey—even longer than from my local station at Darsham—the different interests into one compelling vision for our counties and for growth. She has led the way, and she should be thanked for trying to ensure that her constituents will get a better service out of the vision.

Unfortunately, my right hon. Friend the Member for South East Cambridgeshire (Mr Paice) is also unable to be here today. He wanted me to stress the importance of the Ely North junction. I am sure the Minister will hear the words “Ely North” many times in today’s debate, as it is a key interchange, not only for residents in Ely and north Cambridgeshire, but for unlocking our freight corridor and services to Cambridge and the other hubs of Norwich and Ipswich. It is also important to an east-west link so that, instead of going via London, commuters can go from Oxford to Cambridge to Norwich, linking three great universities of knowledge and investment.

My right hon. Friend the Member for Chelmsford (Mr Burns) cannot be here, sadly, because he is trying to run the national health service, but he has been pressing for greater capacity, a new station in his constituency and the track improvements that are required on the great eastern main line to make a difference for passengers.

My hon. Friends the Members for Great Yarmouth (Brandon Lewis) and for Waveney (Peter Aldous) wanted to remind us that we need green transport, enabling green growth in the green enterprise zone shared between Norfolk and Suffolk. The hon. Member for Cambridge (Dr Huppert) wanted to remind us about increasing connectivity in the key east-west interchange. My hon. Friend the Member for Ipswich (Ben Gummer), who is in a Select Committee meeting, has been pivotal in trying to improve investment into Ipswich and surrounding constituencies, including mine and that of my hon. Friend the Member for Central Suffolk and North Ipswich (Dr Poulter), who is present. My hon. Friends the Members for South Suffolk (Mr Yeo) and for Harwich and North Essex (Mr Jenkin), who are also in Select Committee meetings, continued to stress, quite rightly, the importance of Manningtree as a commuter station and key attributes such as the investment in the station, but also the important need for accessible platforms.

I will happily welcome interventions from colleagues now.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

The hon. Lady is probably thinking, “What is a Northern Ireland Member going to say about East Anglia rail?”, but I would like her to take on board my point. A great number of Army camps are stationed in Norfolk, and service personnel use trains to get from base to camp—one of them reported to me last week that it took an hour and a half extra to get from A to Z. Does the hon. Lady feel that the usage of trains by Army personnel puts a greater onus on rail improvement in the area?

[Dr Coffey]

The hon. Gentleman makes an important point. I have not considered military travel, although there is an Army regiment in my constituency. However, we should ensure, through our county councils and as Members, that the document—which, although it is a prospectus, is not exhaustive—includes such considerations. I note that the constituency of the hon. Member for Colchester (Sir Bob Russell), who is present, has a significant Army presence, which is quite close to the railway station, but I am sure that other colleagues whose constituencies have RAF bases, including Marham in the constituency of my hon. Friend the Member for South West Norfolk (Elizabeth Truss) and Wattisham in the constituency of my hon. Friend the Member for Bury St Edmunds (Mr Ruffley), will want to follow that issue up.

Other Members present are from different counties, so they will talk about specific lines or issues there in more detail. For investors, including in tourism, the issue is capacity to get out of London to our different economic hubs. We should ensure that it is as easy as possible to get on the train to come to some of our beautiful beaches and our cultural highlights in different parts of our counties. Commuting into London is also an issue. There is no doubt, particularly in Essex, that people are fed up of terrible trains, having to stand for a long time and being crammed in. It is not fair on them. There is a two-way process: one thing that we need to do is boost off-peak services through tourism initiatives. LEPs and our county and district councils are keen to ensure more frequent and reliable services.

There is no question but that Cambridge with its research centre and development of capital, Norwich with the knowledge base in its university, especially in life sciences, and Ipswich and surrounding areas and their software development industry, provide a big opportunity for expanding connections between the counties. The risk is that the Government get it that the east of England is already a net contributor to the national economy and, therefore, do not think it needs investment, but we can generate a lot more investment as a consequence of such improvements.

Energy Prices

Debate between Jim Shannon and Thérèse Coffey

Wednesday 19th October 2011 Commons Chamber

[Dr Thérèse Coffey (Suffolk Coastal) (Con)]

It is always a pleasure to speak in these debates. The usual faces are here—the people who regularly show up when we discuss fuel poverty in Westminster Hall—and it is a pleasure to be debating with them.

I was intrigued by the shadow Secretary of State’s reference to meerkats. I always think of them as cute, cuddly animals that cover the ground quickly, which may be an appropriate description of the Secretary of State. My dog’s favourite toy is a meerkat, as was seen at last week’s Westminster dog of the year show. The right hon. Member for Don Valley (Caroline Flint) later asked what we are going to do about the situation. Given the fantastic adverts—dare I say it?—we are going to stand up for the consumer; anybody who watches “Meerkat Manor” will know that meerkats stand up and look around. I am not going to be overly critical of what the previous Government did, although it is a bit of a cheek to ask what this Government are doing given that no nuclear power stations had started being built under them.

We need to be constructive because this issue is very important for our constituents. That is the key point that we need to unite behind, and I am pleased that there will not be a Division on the motion.

I want to tackle something that came up in my exchanges with the hon. Member for Ynys Môn (Albert Owen), who is no longer in his place. I know that he is an absolutely fantastic champion on behalf of those in fuel poverty—especially for off-gas-grid households. I am not suggesting that the energy companies should be encouraged to make excessive profits; I think we should be critical friends to them, but we do have to be friends to them because this country needs £100 billion to be spent on energy infrastructure over the next 10 years, and it is absolutely right that that will come partly from the profits that those companies will make. I understand that, in effect, consumers are the people who make the profits for the companies, but, like anything else, if it comes in tax, it still comes from consumers—from our constituents. Let us not kid ourselves that we do not ultimately have to pay, together, for the infrastructure that our country desperately needs.

I welcome the contributions that were made by my hon. Friend the Member for Hexham (Guy Opperman), who also is no longer in his place. He, too, has been a doughty champion for off-gas-grid households. Earlier today, the hon. Member for North West Durham (Pat Glass) and I were at a briefing about the Office of Fair Trading report that I have here. It is quite a weighty document, but it is double-sided, so the OFT was trying to be friendly to the environment. Members should read the report because, although the press notice did not make it sound very exciting, when one digs into it, one finds quite a lot that will prove very useful.

The hon. Member for North West Durham had an exchange with my hon. Friend the Member for Hexham about another issue that has been raised today—the OFT and how people were quoted one price and then expected to pay another. I am pleased to report that Carmarthenshire county council has successfully prosecuted a supplier for that practice. If we believe that that is happening in our areas, we must make sure that our county councils or city councils take full advantage of that ruling and ensure that they go after the suppliers that behave inappropriately towards our constituents at their most difficult time of need.

Let me mention some of the other contributions that have been made, including that of the right hon. Member for Wentworth and Dearne (John Healey) and the interventions from my hon. Friends the Members for Truro and Falmouth (Sarah Newton) and for Halesowen and Rowley Regis (James Morris). It is important that we make sure that our constituents are fully aware of the opportunities to seek advice on these matters. I thought that the criticism made of the Prime Minister and the Secretary of State was a bit of a shame because I feel that there has been a genuine attempt to say to people, “There is information out there and there is an opportunity to switch, and we are going to try to make it easier to do so.” They will encourage people to do that. People do not need to pay a standing charge if they wish to receive gas from companies. If one is a low user, it makes sense not to want to pay that.

I was at a dinner last night with the hon. Member for Ellesmere Port and Neston (Andrew Miller) and we were talking about energy challenges for the next 30 years. People from the royal academies were saying that it was ridiculous that the pricing and tariff systems seem to incentivise greater use rather than less.

To return to being a critical friend of the energy companies, there is one practice that I know that my hon. Friend the Member for Battersea (Jane Ellison) would have intervened on me to make a point about if she were here, so I shall do it for her. I am talking about the practice whereby people pay so much a month by standing order or direct debit. I happen to know about this because I end up dealing with this situation for my mother—this might embarrass her. I work out that she somehow seems to be £400 in credit even though there is no way she is ever going to consume that much, but the company keeps taking the same sum each month if not increasing it. So I have to make the phone call once or twice a year and a big cheque comes back.

I experienced similar behaviour when I spoke on the phone with a very pleasant customer service adviser who was trying to persuade me that, for no particular reason, I would double the amount of gas that I would use in the next year. However, I was able to convince her that if she did not leave my standing order as it was, I would change supplier. We all know that that argument encourages companies to listen a bit more. I put out a call today to energy companies to be friendly to their consumers and to work on these issues. I say to them, “Do not use your consumers’ direct debits or standing orders as cheap ways of borrowing, but help people to make sure that they are paying what they need to.” I am not saying that people should be given false prices so that they end up with a huge bill at the end of the year. Energy companies need to make sure that the scheme works as it should, so that MPs do not have to keep writing to the companies to ensure that such practices are not tolerated.

[Jim Shannon]

In my constituency, and I suspect in many constituencies across the whole United Kingdom, elderly people come to me and ask, “Should it be oil? Should it be electric? Should it be coal?” Does the hon. Lady share my concern that there should be no penalty for those who want to transfer from one energy source to another? If after a year, or perhaps 18 months or two years, they want to transfer back, there should also not be a penalty from the energy company.

[Dr Coffey]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for that intervention. The reason I am hesitating is that I probably need to think about it a bit more. There is undoubtedly a significant capital cost for switching between fuel sources. If one has a coal boiler and switches to a gas or oil boiler, there is a significant capital cost to that. I am not clear what is being done at present, but energy modelling should make it possible to model the prices and understand the impact.

[Jim Shannon]

I thank the hon. Lady for her generosity in allowing me to intervene again. An example would be gas from different companies—we have two gas companies in Northern Ireland, and there are different electricity companies. The change should not be so costly. Sometimes unnecessary penalties are included.