Sudan and Eastern DRC

Debate between Jeremy Corbyn and David Lammy

Tuesday 28th January 2025 Commons Chamber

[Mr Lammy]

I am grateful to the hon. Lady for continuing to press these issues. Let me reassure her that the UK continues to pursue all diplomatic avenues to press the parties into a permanent ceasefire, to allow unrestricted humanitarian access to protect civilians and to commit to a sustained, meaningful and peaceful process. We have the most robust export licensing regime in the world. Where there are breaches of international humanitarian law, we suspend licences. She should be reassured that we take that very seriously.

[Jeremy Corbyn (Islington North) (Ind)]

I thank the Foreign Secretary for his statement and agree with his point about the way in which global media values pay no attention whatsoever to conflict or life in Africa. He has drawn attention to that today, and I thank him for it. As one who represents constituents from both the DRC and Sudan, I can say that the communities I represent are emailing and talking, and all of them are saying the same thing: why is nobody discussing what is going on in the DRC or Sudan?

I have two quick questions for the Secretary of State. First, what can he do to reduce the flow of arms into Sudan? It is motivated by the countries that want to get hold of the wealth and natural resources of Sudan, and have no concern whatsoever for the lives of the people in that country. Secondly, having been to Goma on a number of occasions in the past, as well as to other parts of the DRC, I am very well aware of the long-term conflict that has gone on over minerals, essentially, where militias are effectively financed by mineral companies to drag out coltan and other riches from the Congo at the expense of the lives of the people there. The role of the Rwandan Government in supporting M23, and now the occupation of Goma, has to be called out and challenged. Surely, the future has to be one of peace and of the democratic engagement of all the people of the DRC in their future.

[Mr Lammy]

I am grateful to the right hon. Gentleman. I know he did a lot of work with my predecessor in Tottenham on issues to do with the African continent. He has been raising these issues consistently for the past three or four decades, and we are very grateful to him for that.

I seek to reassure the right hon. Gentleman that when I say that we want to convene and come together with regional partners and those neighbouring Sudan, as well as with the international partners that take a big interest and play a big role, as the UN penholder, we are of course aware of some of the motivations; there is gold, for example, in Sudan. We urge everyone to step back and get to a ceasefire. This cannot go on forever; there has to be a ceasefire. We need that ceasefire now because of the women and children who are suffering. Like the right hon. Gentleman, I have been to Goma. We have been talking about the coltan in our mobile phones for many years. It is why there are so many external actors engaged in the DRC.

Middle East

Debate between Jeremy Corbyn and David Lammy

Thursday 16th January 2025 Commons Chamber

[Mr Lammy]

My right hon. Friend will know that, in some ways, this is a moment of peril for that political process. On the one hand, we have the potential for Saudi normalisation and two states, for the Palestinian people. On the other hand, some in Israel will never be committed to two states and talk instead of annexation. Those two are opposites, and that is why the next few months are so important. It would be folly for me to stand at this Dispatch Box and give timetables.

[Jeremy Corbyn (Islington North) (Ind)]

Obviously, we hope that the Israeli Cabinet makes a rapid decision to support this ceasefire agreement, but that is only a ceasefire agreement, and one hopes it will be rapidly followed by the release of all the hostages and prisoners, as agreed. However, there have been some major developments over the past two years, particularly on the legal front, where the International Court of Justice has recognised that acts of a genocidal nature have taken place and has called for Israeli withdrawal from the west bank and an end to the settlement policy. Will the Foreign Secretary commit the British Government to demanding that all the ICJ recommendations are carried out and that Israel has a programme of withdrawal from the west bank and an end to the settlement policy? There cannot be any peace for the Palestinian people while they remain under occupation. They have suffered so much, lost so much and lost so many, and the mental scars of the people of Gaza will now be intergenerational. They will need a lot of support to get through this and, above all, international recognition of the state of Palestine.

[Mr Lammy]

Let me begin by recognising the unique way in which the right hon. Gentleman has raised these issues in the House over a lifetime of work and his commitment to justice and accountability in this era. It is right and proper that international humanitarian law is followed and that the international courts do their work. Let me also be clear that this Government do not believe in illegal occupation and are committed to two states. I repeat again: we cannot tolerate the violence; we cannot tolerate the expansion. We recommit ourselves to continuing to work with civil society on the ground in the west bank and the occupied territories that is documenting these things. Both this Government and the previous Government have continued to support such organisations over many years. Clearly, when we get to that settlement, it will essentially come down to swaps and very serious negotiation over that land, on both sides. We recognise that, and that is why expansion is so thoroughly unacceptable.

Syria

Debate between Jeremy Corbyn and David Lammy

Monday 9th December 2024 Commons Chamber

[Mr Lammy]

I am grateful for the way in which the hon. Gentleman has outlined the dangers after a dictator falls. He will understand that it would be wrong of me to comment on operational issues, but I find the scenario that he raises highly, highly, highly unlikely.

[Jeremy Corbyn (Islington North) (Ind)]

As the people of Syria come out of the horrors of war, torture and imprisonment, and many go into asylum, can the Foreign Secretary assure us that the foreign troops in Syria at the present time—particularly the Turkish troops in the north—will leave; that they will respect the right of the Kurdish people to live safely in their own area; and that any incoming Government in Damascus will also respect the diversity of the country and all the minorities, particularly the Kurdish minority? From his discussions with the Israeli Foreign Minister, is the Foreign Secretary satisfied that Israel will withdraw immediately from the area that it has illegally occupied over the past couple of days, just north of the already illegally occupied Golan heights?

[Mr Lammy]

We are in the early days of a fluid situation, so it is not for me to give the right hon. Gentleman the assurances that he seeks, except to say that of course I continue to talk to our closest allies in the region about their security concerns and the issues facing Syria. In relation to the conversation that I had with the Israeli Foreign Minister, there is an arrangement in place—it was put in place in 1970s. It has worked and has sustained an arrangement in the Golan heights. The Israelis’ assessment was that the withdrawal of the regime over the past few days—and the potential for chaos, which has been discussed in this House and was indicated in the right hon. Gentleman’s question—has required them to protect that buffer zone. As I have said, I hope that that situation is temporary.

Middle East

Debate between Jeremy Corbyn and David Lammy

Monday 28th October 2024 Commons Chamber

[Mr Lammy]

I can confirm that we are supporting those fleeing Lebanon into Syria at this time, and we recognise the fragile position that Syria is in, let alone what is now happening in Lebanon. My hon. Friend can definitely have that reassurance.

[Jeremy Corbyn (Islington North) (Ind)]

Earlier, the hon. Member for Argyll, Bute and South Lochaber (Brendan O’Hara) quoted Joyce Msuya, the humanitarian chief of the UN, who says:

“The entire population of North Gaza is at risk of dying.”

This is on top of the 1,000 who died last week, on top of all those living in the most desperate situation in southern Gaza, and on top of the occupation of southern Lebanon, the bombing of southern Beirut, and now the dangers of a hot war between Iran and Israel. Is it not time that, instead of expressing concern about the humanitarian catastrophe in the region, we stop supplying Israel with the weapons that caused the humanitarian catastrophe in the first place, and suspend arms supplies in total to Israel in order to bring about a ceasefire and a cessation of this, frankly, murder of an innocent civilian population?

[Mr Lammy]

I know the strength of feeling that my neighbour in north London has on these issues, and his long-standing campaigning on them. I assure him that we are not just wringing our hands. The work of UK-Med in hospitals is hugely important, and I was very pleased to make further funds available to UK-Med upon coming into office. The work of the Disasters Emergency Committee in raising further funds, and the way in which the Government have match-funded that to the tune of £10 million, is hugely important. It was great to be in Jordan a few weeks ago, discussing with King Abdullah his airlifts into Jordan and the planning that he is getting from UK armed forces in organising those airlifts, and the air bridge that he has been keen to take forward.

These are actions—real things that we are doing, not just wringing of hands. When the right hon. Member describes the situation in Gaza, he largely describes much that I said in my statement. As I have said before, and will say again, we have suspended arms that could be used in contravention of international humanitarian law, where there is a clear risk according to our export licensing regime. He should be reassured that we have done that.

British Indian Ocean Territory: Negotiations

Debate between Jeremy Corbyn and David Lammy

Monday 7th October 2024 Commons Chamber

[Mr Lammy]

My hon. Friend is right. There is an important distinction between the Indian ocean overseas territories and Diego Garcia, and Gibraltar and the Falklands, which are, of course, populated. The self-determination of those people is essential to their future, which is why the remarks that have been made over the past few days are wholly unacceptable and shameful.

[Jeremy Corbyn (Islington North) (Ind)]

Will the Foreign Secretary take the opportunity to recognise that what happened to the Chagossian people in the 1960s and 1970s was abominable, abusive, illegal and disgraceful? Many of them lived in poverty for many years after in the Seychelles and Mauritius. They have long demanded their right to return to Diego Garcia and to the archipelago, which has been denied until now. It is right for the Foreign Secretary to pay tribute to those Chagossians who led that campaign for the right of return and resettlement on their home islands. An apology is due to the Chagossian people for the way they were treated.

Could I also ask the Foreign Secretary about the situation in Diego Garcia? It is unclear to me whether Chagossian people can visit, reside, stay or remain there, or whether they will be denied going there for another 140 years because of the deal done with the USA. Finally, why have the Americans been offered a 140-year lease as part of this deal? That is a very long time in recorded history of any sort, and longer than many countries have even existed. Can he explain that?

Middle East Update

Debate between Jeremy Corbyn and David Lammy

Monday 2nd September 2024 Commons Chamber

[Mr Lammy]

My hon. Friend asks a very good question, and she is absolutely right: what brings this to an end is a ceasefire. The issues boil down to the security of Israel once we get to that ceasefire. She will no doubt have read about the issues around the Philadelphi corridor, and Israel’s insistence that it should still be present in Gaza; that is a matter of discussion. There have been issues around the hostages, who must come out—that is absolutely right—and the prisoners in Israel’s prisons, the Palestinians in particular. We are reaching a decisive point, as Joe Biden has said. We can get there, and we need to get there to bring to an end this horror, which has gone on for many, many months.

[Jeremy Corbyn (Islington North) (Ind)]

The Foreign Secretary will be well aware of the decisions made by the International Court of Justice and the International Criminal Court. He will also be well aware that the world has condemned Israel for its illegal occupation of the west bank, the settlement policy and the killing of 40,000 people in Gaza. On the suspension of some arms contracts, can he explain what effect that will actually have on Israel’s ability to continue the bombardment of Gaza, or will it continue unabated? Will he also explain what role, legally or otherwise, Britain has played in overflying Gaza with surveillance aircraft, and explain the use of RAF Akrotiri as a staging post for aircraft going to Israel, which many people believe are carrying weapons to be used to bomb Gaza?

[Mr Lammy]

I know that the right hon. Gentleman is informed on many aspects of these issues. He must know that our arms exports to Israel amount to about 1% of its arms; in fact, the United States, Germany and others are much more engaged in selling arms to Israel, so when he asks about the effect, he can draw his own conclusions. I am very comfortable with the support that we give to Israel, and as he would expect, I will not comment on operational issues from this Dispatch Box.

Lebanon

Debate between Jeremy Corbyn and David Lammy

Tuesday 30th July 2024 Commons Chamber

[Mr Lammy]

My hon. Friend is right. When we look at the scale of rocket fire and missiles and the damage that they are doing, and when we think about these poor people away from their homes in northern Israel, who have been boarded up in hotels for months and months, it is important to have in clear view who is supporting these proxies and the arms and weaponry that is driving a lot of conflict in the region—including by Hamas, by the way. For all those reasons, we keep sanctions under review.

[Jeremy Corbyn (Islington North) (Ind)]

I thank the Foreign Secretary for his statement. Obviously yet more deaths is a tragedy—every mother and every father grieves for lost children, as do all relatives—but there is an issue here: unless the Government and Israel and others accept the International Court of Justice’s opinions and judgments about the illegal nature of the occupation of the west bank and Gaza, and of course the illegal nature of the occupation of the Golan heights, we are in danger of the conflict getting much worse. The UN Secretary-General has called for restraint. Will the British Government join him in doing so? Will they also join him in trying to convene some sort of regional peace initiative in order to prevent this whole thing from escalating completely out of control? Finally, do the Government reject the Israeli occupation of the Golan heights?

[Mr Lammy]

I am grateful to the right hon. Gentleman, who I know has taken up these issues over many years in this Parliament. Let me be clear: what I saw and what I continue to see in the occupied territories is unacceptable. He will know that the community who experience this violence in the Golan heights are Druze in background, and that this is occupation of the Golan heights—I do recognise that. I want to see de-escalation across the board and a solution along the lines of Oslo and 1967. A two-state solution is what we all want to get to, and we will achieve that if we have an immediate ceasefire and get back to political dialogue and conversation.