Collective Ministerial Responsibility

Gregory Campbell Excerpts

Wednesday 13th February 2013 Westminster Hall

[Mr Chope]

My hon. Friend makes a good point that demonstrates the inconsistency, and the feeling of unfairness, or even injustice, that it generates among parliamentary colleagues. That is why I hope for clarification on to what extent, if at all, the Government have altered the concept of collective ministerial responsibility. It seems to many, including from a number of comments made by Liberal Democrats, that notwithstanding what is said in the coalition agreement and the guidance for Ministers, there has been a change in the approach to collective ministerial responsibility.

One of the problems is that the Deputy Prime Minister cannot differentiate between collective ministerial responsibility and collective responsibility. He sees everything in terms of coalition, and thinks that Back-Bench Members of either the Conservative party or the Liberal Democrats have responsibility equal to that of members of the coalition Government, which is palpably wrong.

At oral questions yesterday, I asked the Deputy Prime Minister whether he would

“make it a priority to introduce transparency into collective ministerial responsibility, which seems to be being set aside without any proper accountability to the public or the House”.

He replied:

“As the hon. Gentleman and I have discussed before, collective responsibility prevails where there is a collective agreement and a collective decision on which collective responsibility is based. It is not easy, and certainly not possible to enforce collective responsibility in the absence of a collective decision taken first.”—[Official Report, 12 February 2013; Vol. 558, c. 697.]

I think A-level English language students will in due course be asked to interpret that. By muddling up collective ministerial responsibility and collective party political responsibility, the Deputy Prime Minister demonstrates a lack of understanding of the significance and importance of the concept of collective ministerial responsibility; its importance is that it gives certainty to people outside who want to know about Government policy.

The Liberal Democrats have a history of speaking with forked tongue. They often enunciate a different policy for different groups of potential electors, or electors in different parts of the country, because they think no one will check on the inconsistencies between policies. It seems as though their attitude towards speaking with forked tongue is tainting the whole Government.

I worry that a lack of intellectual rigour is being brought to the issue. That goes to the heart of the governance of our country. It is not just an academic topic to be discussed in essays; it bears on how the Government operate, the predictability with which they operate and, most importantly, the information available to people who rely on Government decisions. As I said at the outset, the situation today is that nobody knows the Government’s view on press regulation, because all that we had in response to the urgent question were statements in the House from party spokesmen. The issue will develop further in future, which is why we need proper accountability.

In a debate on 29 January, I asked my right hon. Friend the Leader of the House to tell us who had set aside collective responsibility and, if it was the Prime Minister, why. He said:

“My hon. Friend will be aware that the Prime Minister has responsibility for the ministerial code. Indeed, when ministerial collective responsibility is explicitly set aside, it is the Prime Minister who makes that decision”—

the Prime Minister alone, not the Deputy Prime Minister. The Leader of the House continued:

“He is clearly doing it, as the House will understand, in the context of coalition government.” —[Official Report, 29 January 2013; Vol. 557, c. 807-8.]

When I asked the Prime Minister about that, all I got was a reference back to what the Leader of the House had said, even though according to the Leader of the House, the Prime Minister is solely responsible, and therefore accountable for the policy.

[Mr Gregory Campbell (East Londonderry) (DUP)]

I congratulate the hon. Gentleman on securing this debate. Cannot the entirety of what he is saying be summed up in one sentence? I speak with some experience from Northern Ireland. When political parties and philosophies in a coalition are diametrically opposed, inevitably we will end up with the problem that he is trying to rationalise.

[Mr Chope]

I submit that we should not necessarily end up with that problem. We know that one of the disadvantages of coalition government is that it leads to indecision, lowest common denominator decision-making and so on, but lowest common denominator decision-making does at least have a lowest common denominator. What we seem to have is a Government who take two parallel decisions at the same time and pick and mix.

That is evidenced further by the answer given yesterday to complaints about the change in the Government’s approach to inheritance tax. The answer, given by the Secretary of State for Health, was that there is an important difference between promises made by the Conservatives while in opposition and pledges made after the coalition agreement:

“That commitment on inheritance tax was a Conservative manifesto commitment. It’s not in the coalition agreement, so there is an important difference”.

It is not in the coalition agreement, but it is not specifically ruled out of the agreement either. Now the coalition and the agreement are being used as excuses for basically ripping up any policy that the Government do not like and replacing it with another. That is creating a lot of confusion among people outside, who are wondering where that leaves manifestos. We vote for parties on the basis of manifestos. If at the next general election a lot of people vote for the Conservative party on the basis that they will get an in/out referendum, and we then find that we do not have an overall majority and enter into some sort of coalition agreement, the manifesto pledge on which we got so many millions of votes will be torn up.

Oral Answers to Questions

Gregory Campbell Excerpts

Wednesday 6th February 2013 Commons Chamber

[Mr Maude]

Public sector pensions, after the reforms are fully in place, will remain among the very best available. That is right and we are strongly in support of it, but the cost was out of control. It is now back under control.

[Mr Gregory Campbell (East Londonderry) (DUP)]

What discussions are the Government having with trade unions representing civil servants to ensure the smoothest possible transition?

[Mr Maude]

We have regular discussions at official and ministerial level with the civil service unions, which, for the most part, have adopted a constructive approach and want the change to be introduced as smoothly as possible. Those discussions continue.

Patrick Finucane Report

Gregory Campbell Excerpts

Wednesday 12th December 2012 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

Let me first respond to the hon. Gentleman’s point about Hillsborough. There was a public inquiry and an inquest, but they were, in effect, faulty. It took an act by Government, with the Bishop of Liverpool, to lay open all the information. The families have thus been able to see the truth and, hopefully, they will be able to get that new inquest. I would argue that in this case that is what has happened: there was this full police investigation, but instead of having a public inquiry we have opened up and given all the information that is necessary.

On Douglas Hogg, I ask the hon. Gentleman to read the report carefully. It finds that Douglas Hogg was briefed in a way that he should not have been briefed, that that compromised him and that therefore what he said was unfortunate. But the report does not find that he in any way encouraged the action that took place or in any way knew about it. I would encourage the hon. Gentleman to read the report very carefully in that regard.

[Mr Gregory Campbell (East Londonderry) (DUP)]

There has of course been widespread condemnation of the murder of Pat Finucane and of all the others in Northern Ireland. The Prime Minister alluded to trying to get at the truth of this issue. Does he accept that after a series of inquiries, reviews and reports that have cost tens of millions of pounds, if not hundreds of millions, into a small number of totally and utterly regrettable and unacceptable incidents, the problem that we have in this House is the credibility gap, because others out there caused the violence in the first instance and have never apologised, have never reviewed and have never reported? They have never said sorry for the activities that they carried out, which ensured that others responded to their activities. Will the Prime Minister indicate that they should open up and say sorry for what they have done—for 30 years of murder?

[The Prime Minister]

Everyone has to face up to what they did and what they got wrong. It is up to those people responsible for violence, for terror, for murder to do that; they should apologise for what they did. But let me repeat: we should not put ourselves in this House, in government and in a state that believes in the rule of law, democracy and human rights, on a level with those organisations. We expect higher standards and when we get it wrong, we need to explain and completely open up in the way that we have done today.

Oral Answers to Questions

Gregory Campbell Excerpts

Wednesday 7th November 2012 Commons Chamber

[Miss Smith]

I can confirm that the spend on procurement with SMEs has gone up. I say again that it was this Government who bothered to count that spend, unlike those now on the Opposition Benches, and I think that that is something we should be proud of.

[Mr Gregory Campbell (East Londonderry) (DUP)]

The Government have repeatedly indicated that they want to reduce the bureaucracy and red tape that can prevent SMEs getting contracts. Will the Minister outline what further steps will be taken over the next two and a half years to complete that task?

Oral Answers to Questions

Gregory Campbell Excerpts

Wednesday 5th September 2012 Commons Chamber

[Miss Smith]

The Department of Health is reducing the number of quangos, not increasing them.

[Mr Gregory Campbell (East Londonderry) (DUP)]

On behalf of my party, may I congratulate the hon. Lady on being appointed to her new position?

Every Government and every Parliament have promised to do what her Government have promised to do on non-departmental public bodies. Will she abide by the judgment of the people in two years’ time, close to the end of this Parliament, in respect of how many of these NDPBs have fallen by the wayside?

[Miss Smith]

The hon. Gentleman raises a vital point. More than half the quangos in government will be reformed. There will be no return to the old ways of working. He is right, too, that we need to be accountable in this process, which is why we are instituting triennial reviews and other measures in order to ensure we keep on this path.

Oral Answers to Questions

Gregory Campbell Excerpts

Wednesday 13th June 2012 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hurd]

That is a frustration felt in many constituencies. My hon. Friend will be aware that changes are under way. There are two major thrusts of change: many fewer people will require checks; and those who do will find it much easier to carry those checks around the system—the portability for which people have been asking for some time. Those changes will largely be in place by next spring, and I am sure that they will be as welcome in Sherwood as they will in Ruislip.

[Mr Gregory Campbell (East Londonderry) (DUP)]

This issue has come up repeatedly. Does the Minister accept that in the coming years the red tape challenge will be judged on the numbers of people who are involved in volunteering and the verdict of those who want to volunteer?

[Mr Hurd]

All I know is that it is incumbent on Government to get out of the way as much as they can. Many areas of regulation are too intrusive and take up too much time and money that could be better used. I think that there is cross-party support for wanting to encourage more people to get involved, and if the Government can get out of the way, then we should.

Oral Answers to Questions

Gregory Campbell Excerpts

Wednesday 21st March 2012 Commons Chamber

[Mr Letwin]

Absolutely not. The hon. Lady should look carefully at what we have done in respect of funding of advice services, to which the Parliamentary Secretary, my hon. Friend the Member for Ruislip, Northwood and Pinner (Mr Hurd), referred a moment or two ago. In 2010-11, the funding stood at rather less than £200 million, but in 2011-12 it went up and it has almost maintained the 2011-12 levels—still above those of 2010-11—for 2012-13. The Government are investing in the voluntary and community sector, not disinvesting in it.

[Mr Gregory Campbell (East Londonderry) (DUP)]

Some examples of bureaucracy are being faced by many in the community and voluntary sectors. What are the Government doing to try to ensure that those sectors face no undue levels of bureaucracy in delivering their services?

[Mr Letwin]

The hon. Gentleman is absolutely right—there are major bureaucratic obstacles and regulatory hurdles. My noble Friend Lord Hodgson has been looking specifically at those, and my team and I have been looking at them as part of the red tape challenge. We are going through every single regulation that affects the voluntary sector, the community sector and social enterprises to see what we can do to ameliorate or remove those obstacles, because we are determined to build the big society.

Trade Union Funding

Gregory Campbell Excerpts

Wednesday 29th February 2012 Westminster Hall

[Jim Sheridan (Paisley and Renfrewshire North) (Lab)]

Thank you, Mr Owen, for calling me to speak.

It is normal practice to congratulate the hon. Member who secures a debate in Westminster Hall. On this occasion I shall resist that temptation, because there is no doubt whatsoever that this is a politically driven debate, with the dark hand of the TaxPayers Alliance behind it—an organisation about which little is known, including how it is funded, so we know where it is coming from. It is also rather interesting that the Conservative MPs in Westminster Hall today are all from the new intake of the party’s MPs, which gives us an idea of where the new Conservative party is going.

I must say that I have not had one single constituent complain to me about trade union funding—not one—in the 10 years that I have been in Parliament. In terms of employment rights, we already have the most business-friendly employment rights in the whole of Europe. That is undisputed, and if people do not believe me let me quote Richard Lambert, the director general of the CBI in 2009, who said in a foreword:

“In today’s difficult economic climate, it is more important than ever that all resources available to the workplace are well deployed. Union reps constitute a major resource: there are approximately 200,000 workers who act as lay union representatives. We believe that modern representatives have a lot to give their fellow employees and to the organisations that employ them.”

[Mr Gregory Campbell (East Londonderry) (DUP)]

Does the hon. Gentleman agree that, however he would analyse or describe the business-friendliness of the current Government, being business-friendly does not necessarily mean the opposite of being in favour of workers’ rights?

[Jim Sheridan]

The hon. Gentleman is absolutely right and I am glad that he made that intervention.

There are some members of the Conservative party who live in the real world, none more so than the Minister for Further Education, Skills and Lifelong Learning, the hon. Member for South Holland and The Deepings (Mr Hayes), who said:

“I want to pay tribute to union learning reps, who have made so much difference to so many lives, and to such effect. Trade unions can play an invaluable and immeasurable role in improving skills in the workplace.”

That suggests that there are some Conservatives—apart from those in Westminster Hall today—who live in the real world.

For my sins, I have been a member of the Transport and General Workers Union and I am still a proud member of the Unite union. I am also proud to be the chair of the Unite parliamentary group, which meets regularly and takes up issues with whatever Government are in power. Before anyone asks about my funding, there is absolute transparency about my funding, including my funding from the trade union movement; it is all recorded in the books and is there for everyone to see.

In the short time that is left for me to speak today, I will focus on one of the major issues that trade unions are involved with, which is health and safety in the workplace. For my sins, I am also chair of the all-party group on health and safety, which deals with occupational health. We have just released a report that highlights the dangers from asbestos to children, teachers and other people who work in schools. There is not one single business in this country that would raise the issue of people dying of asbestos-related diseases, especially children who go to school and who are in danger of being contaminated by asbestos and suffering from such diseases. As a former shipyard worker, I have seen people die of mesothelioma, which is the most horrible death that anyone could ever see, yet employers are still churning out asbestos to the third world because it has been banned in this country. That is what trade unions are about; that is what their job is about. It is to ensure that people go to work safely and come home safely. It is unfortunate that the hon. Member for Beckenham (Bob Stewart) is no longer in the Chamber, because he is a former member of the armed forces and it is a little known fact that more people are killed in the workplace in the UK than British service personnel are killed in armed conflict.

I am conscious of the time, Mr Owen, and all I want to say in conclusion is that I have worked for many good companies, none more so than Thales, which is a very successful and progressive business. It sees every benefit in having trade unions in the workplace. In fact, it goes out of its way to ensure that people have the opportunity to join a trade union. The rhetoric from Conservative MPs today is different from what is happening in the real world and it is really disappointing to see that the Conservative party, which has some decent people in it, has been dragged down by the young Turks.

Oral Answers to Questions

Gregory Campbell Excerpts

Wednesday 25th January 2012 Commons Chamber

[Mr Speaker]

Order. There are far too many very noisy private conversations taking place in the Chamber. I want to hear Mr Gregory Campbell.

[Mr Gregory Campbell (East Londonderry) (DUP)]

Does the Secretary of State accept that part of the problem in dealing with the past and trying to get the parties around the table is that one party was party to the major problem of the past—the Provisional IRA. It will not own up to the part it played in creating the past—rather, it tries to deem everyone equal, innocent and guilty alike.

[Mr Paterson]

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for his question and he touches on the problem of arriving at uniform consensus. We were elected on a platform of no more costly and open-ended inquiries, because we do not like the asymmetry of applying an extraordinary intensity of effort and expense to a very small number of cases. That is why I am trying to find a broader approach, working with all local parties.

Parliamentary Lobbying

Gregory Campbell Excerpts

Wednesday 2nd November 2011 Westminster Hall

[Paul Flynn]

My comrade Robert—as I call him—and I serve together on the Public Administration Committee, and we have many common causes. I would not suggest that there was anything untoward in what he does, and I am sure that he does not receive an income from the Government of that country. However, other MPs do, directly or indirectly, from some regimes. Money is being paid—it is all there. It is a question about the way in which we are going.

I want to pay tribute to Tamasin Cave of SpinWatch and the other organisations that have persisted in their support for the Select Committee’s recommendations about what all Governments are doing. We must ask ourselves: are the Government serious about the matter? Are we making any progress in rebuilding our reputations? Are we quelling what the Prime Minister called the public’s “worst fears and suspicions”? We have to be concerned about those fears and suspicions. The perception of how this place behaves is crucial.

[Mr Gregory Campbell (East Londonderry) (DUP)]

I congratulate the hon. Gentleman on securing the debate. He has outlined the need for people to know about Members being approached and lobbied. Would it not be helpful if all Members did what some Members already do—I have done this in my constituency—which is to make it clear to the public and our constituents when we are lobbied and when we have refused to be a victim of a lobbying group, so that other lobbyists get the message that there is no point in lobbying MP X because he or she has made it abundantly clear in the local press that he or she will not be lobbied, receive favours or be fêted? That would help address the issue of perception that the hon. Gentleman is talking about.

[Paul Flynn]

I agree entirely with the hon. Gentleman. That is precisely what we should do. We must take a puritanical line with ourselves to ensure that the public believe us. When the public read about what is going on and see the drip, drip of stories about links between MPs and others, they will assume that we are all in the business of being influenced by outside sources.