National Insurance Contributions Bill

David Burrowes Excerpts

Tuesday 3rd February 2015 Commons Chamber

[Mr Gauke]

My hon. Friend makes a good point. As I said, the Government invest about £1.5 billion a year in apprenticeships. In its 2012 report, the NAO suggested that for every £1 spent in this area, we got a return of £18, and studies by the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills suggest that the return might be even greater: £28 for every £1 invested. Therefore this offers good value for money. Our policy on apprenticeships is an additional step, and I am delighted that the tax system can be used in this way. Once again, it demonstrates that the Government are on the side of those who wish to work hard, improve their skills and get on in life.

With those remarks, I hope that the House will agree with the Lords amendment.

Lords amendment 1 agreed to, with Commons financial privilege waived.

[Mr David Burrowes (Enfield, Southgate) (Con)]

On a point of order, Mr Speaker.

[Mr Speaker]

I think we shall treat of the hon. Gentleman’s point of order afterwards.

[Mr Burrowes]

rose—

[Mr Speaker]

Does it relate to current business?

[Mr Burrowes]

No, it concerns the next business.

[Mr Speaker]

In that case, we shall come later to the hon. Gentleman. I am saving him up. It would be a shame to squander him too early.

Clause 2

Consequential etc power

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Speaker]

It is always a joy to hear the Minister develop the argument, but he is exercising a self-denying ordinance. I must say that the way he has addressed matters thus far—comprehensively and courteously, in his usual manner—has been accompanied by a slight increase in the number of Members present for the next business. It is not for me to suggest that those two phenomena are causally related, but some people might think they are. I suppose if one is in a tight corner and hoping that the Minister will develop the arguments fully, one can always best depend (a) on a Treasury Minister and (b) on a lawyer, and he is both.

Lords amendments 3 to 5.

[Mr David Burrowes (Enfield, Southgate) (Con)]

On a point of order, Mr Speaker. Has any consideration been given to disapplying Standing Order No. 16(1), which allocates 90 minutes to consideration of the mitochondrial donation regulations? When similar regulations, concerning embryo research, came before the House in 2000, some 3 hours and 19 minutes were taken. Through the usual channels, the House has previously disapplied Standing Orders when dealing with issues of great significance, not least in this area. Obviously, many are concerned about the significant impact of these regulations, not least in respect of mothers at risk of passing on serious diseases to their children. This matter is of great significance to the country, because, for the first time in the world, we would be permitting human germ-line genetic modification. Given the significance of these matters, not just for those in the House but for the public, and in the interest of considering them in detail, I would have thought these matters deserved fuller debate and scrutiny, although I respect the fact that we will be turning to a general debate on rural phone and broadband connectivity afterwards. Given all that and the significant safety and legal issues, as well as ethical issues, surely we need longer than 90 minutes. Has any consideration been given to disapplying Standing Orders?

[Mr Speaker]

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman both for his point of order and for his usual courtesy in notifying me in advance of its intended content. I am very sympathetic to the hon. Gentleman, but I fear—I say this in all sincerity—that I am unable to help him. The hon. Gentleman is right that it is within the power of Ministers to propose an extension of time available for a debate to which the 90-minute limit under Standing Order No. 16 applies. Notice is required, and there is no such motion on today’s Order Paper. I am clear that that is extremely regrettable, so far as the hon. Gentleman is concerned and many other Members may feel likewise. But we are where we are. In practical terms, the possibility of proposing such an extension is in the hands of the Government business managers, and is not available to Back Benchers.

The hon. Gentleman knows my views about the importance of empowering Back Benchers, and I have never been much fussed about empowering Ministers in any Administration, as the hon. Gentleman knows. Obviously, however, the Speaker has to operate within the established procedures of the House. As far as I can see—I have taken advice on the matter—today’s business must therefore conclude after an hour and a half.

The Minister is always a most courteous Minister, and she will have taken note of what has been said. Knowing the Minister as I do, I know she is planning to be pithy in her remarks to facilitate the majority of Back Benchers. About 18 Members wish to speak in the debate. If Members help each other, it will maximise the number of contributors. I fear we will have to leave it there for now.