Social Homes for Rent

Baroness Thomas of Winchester Excerpts

Thursday 26th May 2022 Lords Chamber

[The Lord Speaker (Lord McFall of Alcluith)]

My Lords, the noble Baroness, Lady Thomas of Winchester, will now make a virtual contribution.

[Baroness Thomas of Winchester (LD) [V]]

My Lords, what action are the Government taking to address the need for more accessible housing, and when can we expect a response to the consultation on raising accessible housing standards?

[Lord Greenhalgh (Con)]

As the noble Baroness indicates, we have just carried out a consultation on raising accessible housing standards, and I shall write to her to give more details on that point.

Supported Housing: Funding

Baroness Thomas of Winchester Excerpts

Tuesday 14th September 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Greenhalgh (Con)]

My Lords, we are aware of the issues in Birmingham. That is one of the reasons why we carried out those pilots, which will inform future policy in this area. It is important that we deal with the small examples where standards are simply unacceptable.

[Baroness Thomas of Winchester (LD) [V]]

My Lords, as well as supported housing for disabled people, more wheelchair-accessible housing is greatly needed. What action will the Government take to ensure that it is provided?

[Lord Greenhalgh (Con)]

My Lords, we are investing a considerable amount—up to 10% is the target—of the £11.5 billion affordable housing scheme in the supply of supported housing. Specifically, the Government have invested more than £4 billion through the disabled facilities grant, which has funded adaptations in almost 450,000 homes.

Non-Domestic Rating (Public Lavatories) Bill

Baroness Thomas of Winchester Excerpts

Report stage & Lords Hansard
Wednesday 17th March 2021 Lords Chamber

I hope the noble Lord, who seemed to be taken with our arguments earlier this week, will take this opportunity and seize the moment to think more radically and widely about what the country needs and how it might be provided. Of course we want this Bill to go through, and we certainly do not want to impede it, but we need to think more creatively about what can be provided.

[Baroness Thomas of Winchester (LD) [V]]

My Lords, Amendment 3 seeks to exploit the opportunity—as the noble Baroness, Lady Andrews, said—that the Bill gives the Government to find out whether we have enough public lavatories throughout England, particularly for the growing number of disabled and elderly people, and whether this Bill, after a year, will have had the impact we all hope it will have.

I too am grateful to the Minister for arranging a meeting with the British Toilet Association. However, I am afraid, as I think the Minister realised, we learned that things were even worse than we thought, with a great many public lavatories closed, whether through fear of spreading the disease or because cleaning could not be undertaken. I myself have not been out and about for months, as I am in the “extremely vulnerable” category, but my friends tell me there is such a shortage of open public lavatories that there is evidence of people using front gardens to relieve themselves.

In Committee, I asked the Minister whether he would update the House on the Changing Places facilities. Muscular Dystrophy UK, which is co-chair of the Changing Places consortium, has been working with the Government to help identify how best to direct the funding. Could the Minister give us more detail on how this is going? Brilliant though Changing Places is, the country also needs a greater number of more modest disabled loos. We should take this opportunity, as a matter of urgency, to find out just how many open public lavatories we have for everyone.

Non-Domestic Rating (Public Lavatories) Bill

Baroness Thomas of Winchester Excerpts

Wednesday 24th February 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Lucas (Con) [V]]

My Lords, the noble Baroness, Lady Greengross, asked me to speak to Amendment 13 in her name. We very much share the sentiments just expressed by the noble Lord, Lord Kennedy. We all support this Bill and want to see it succeed. We want it as a foundation on which a renaissance in publicly available toilet facilities can proceed down the next decade or so. To know that we are succeeding or to know where any problems or challenges lie, we need good data. We therefore hope that the Government will accept an obligation to publish that information so that we can cheer them for their successes and encourage them to do better where that appears to be needed. It took around 50 years to persuade Victorian authorities to install public lavatories, let alone to agree funding and rates for them. With luck, because of this legislation, we will see increased provision at a much quicker rate. This amendment would let us keep track of progress and would be an essential expression of Parliament’s support for this measure.

[Baroness Thomas of Winchester (LD) [V]]

My Lords, I so agree with what the noble Lord, Lord Lucas, just said. I support Amendment 11, but am speaking to Amendment 14, which follows Amendment 11 in this group, calling on the Government to undertake a review of the impact of the Act on the provision of accessible lavatories within a year of its passing.

There are three reasons why we need to know whether the change in rating for stand-alone public loos is resulting in more accessible facilities. First, the population is getting older, so there will be more disabled and elderly people about in the future than there are now, which means that the need for accessible toilets will grow. Secondly, sadly, there will not be so many food outlets on the high street which have accessible toilets for use by the general public, because of multiple closures in the wake of the pandemic. Thirdly, thousands of disabled people, like me, have spent the last year shielding, which means that they will not have been out and about. Many will now be more fearful than ever about going out without knowing where they can spend a penny in an accessible toilet. The Minister may say that any review should be done by local authorities, but we will not have a national picture unless the Government take ownership of it. Perhaps the British Toilet Association could help with up-to-date information.

I asked the Minister, at a meeting to which he kindly agreed, whether he could tell us how the £30 million rollout of Changing Places was going. These wonderful facilities are absolutely vital to about 250,000 disabled people. They are needed in town centres, arts venues, hospitals and wherever there are large gatherings of people. We have heard a bit about them this afternoon. Perhaps the Minister will undertake to give us more specific information at the next stage of the Bill.

[Baroness Andrews (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, it is a great pleasure to follow the noble Baroness, Lady Thomas of Winchester, and to support what she said. I am speaking in support of Amendment 11 and particularly to Amendment 13. I am conscious that the noble Baroness, Lady Greengross, is not able to be in her place today, because we all know what a superb advocate she is for all these matters. I am happy to support these amendments, because they are significant.

Amendment 13 makes clear what everybody who supports the Bill already knows: that we want to ensure that it works; that it is seen to be working; and that the evidence is collected and available for us to see. There is a matter of principle here: that public policy changes should be seen to be effective, especially when public money is involved; that when local funds are dedicated to a particular purpose, they are used for that purpose; and that there is transparency and agency in local and national government.

There is also a practical issue here. As the noble Lord, Lord Greaves, said, we have waited a long time for practical and universal initiatives to be taken to stop the closure of public lavatories and to place them in their proper context, which is within a robust and vigilant policy for local health and safety, rather than in some afterthought where no one is really interested in what happens to them.

As I said on Second Reading, the Bill is very welcome, but it would be a major disappointment if the funding that is going to be generated is not used for that purpose. We have to know the impact of the Bill, that it works and that it has achieved its purpose, and we need the evidence to be published. As other noble Lords have said, it is all the more crucial that we know this, because the measures will be introduced at a time when local authorities have never been more strapped, and it has never been more difficult to decide on priorities. We need to know that this small change will take its place in the range of priorities.

Local government needs financial and political investment to repair the damage and help to rebuild communities. I think that the Bill is part of that and part of the fabric of our whole public health and preventive health system, for the personal reasons that many noble Lords have raised today, and as part of a series of principles. I support these amendments and look forward to the Minister’s response. I cannot see any possible reason for rejecting them and I hope I am right in that respect.

Non-Domestic Rating (Lists) (No. 2) Bill

Baroness Thomas of Winchester Excerpts

2nd reading & 2nd reading (Hansard) & 2nd reading (Hansard): House of Lords
Monday 18th January 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Thomas of Winchester (LD) [V]]

My Lords, I warmly welcome, for the second time, this Bill to scrap business rates on public lavatories. I hope this will mean that closed loos will reopen and that local authorities will now be encouraged to provide more such facilities, including well-maintained disabled loos with hand-washing facilities. It is imperative that more disabled loos are available for our ageing population because so many people with medical conditions cannot risk leaving home without knowing that there is a suitable loo for them to use.

I commend the excellent facilities provided by Changing Places, which the Minister mentioned in his speech: they have space, hoists and a changing table, and are vital for families with disabled children. I am glad that Changing Places is going from strength to strength, with a clear map of where their facilities are installed.

However, there is a problem with the centrally held database of where there are public loos in the United Kingdom. The Government gave up on collecting this information 20 years ago, and the British Toilet Association would like to help them restart this invaluable database. It also says that local authorities would like clear guidance on cleaning and hygiene measures in these Covid times.

Nowhere in the British Isles should be far from accessible public lavatories, and this situation should be monitored. Is that asking too much?

Planning: Accessible Homes

Baroness Thomas of Winchester Excerpts

Wednesday 4th November 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Greenhalgh (Con)]

My Lords, I thank my noble friend for pointing out a report which is just over a year old. With the Covid-19 pandemic, we are seeing a massive impact on our town centres and we need good policy to ensure that we have more inclusive and smarter options for urban design. Of course, we will look carefully at that report.

[Baroness Thomas of Winchester (LD) [V]]

My Lords, following on from the question from the noble Lord, Lord Best, does the Minister agree that changing the regulations for homes to be built to accessible and adaptable standards should not mean that fewer homes will be built, as the additional costs per typical dwelling are very small?

[Lord Greenhalgh (Con)]

My Lords, I made clear in response to the noble Lord, Lord Best, that we can raise standards while continuing the drive for the numbers of homes, of all types and tenures, that this country so badly needs. However, we have to wait to have time to respond to the ongoing consultation.

Planning

Baroness Thomas of Winchester Excerpts

Wednesday 16th September 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Greenhalgh (Con)]

My Lords, I am aware of the campaign for retrofitting, and it often has a place instead of demolition and rebuild. I will look at the campaign and make sure that is fed into our policy as it evolves.

[Baroness Thomas of Winchester (LD) [V]]

My Lords, further to the right reverend Prelate’s question about accessible housing, does the Minister agree that category 2 housing should be the mandatory baseline for all new housing, as is the policy in London?

[Lord Greenhalgh (Con)]

My Lords, I will have to write to the noble Baroness about that suggestion.

Planning Rules

Baroness Thomas of Winchester Excerpts

Tuesday 28th July 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Greenhalgh]

My Lords, the planning system can be improved. We are seeking to do that through the measures that we have outlined as a Government, and will continue to do so with more planning reforms to be announced.

[Baroness Thomas of Winchester (LD) [V]]

My Lords, can the Minister guarantee that changes to the planning rules will not mean fewer accessible homes for disabled people, such as 50 year-old Daniel, who has to live in a care home for elderly people due to the lack of accessible homes?

[Lord Greenhalgh]

My Lords, I point out that the National Planning Policy Framework is clear that local planning authorities are expected to identify all types of housing, including the housing outlined by the noble Baroness.

Business and Planning Bill

Baroness Thomas of Winchester Excerpts

Committee stage & Committee: 1st sitting (Hansard) & Committee: 1st sitting (Hansard): House of Lords
Monday 13th July 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Blencathra (Con) [V]]

My Lords, I will speak to Amendment 21 in my name, but begin by referring to the recommendations of the Delegated Powers Committee, which I have the honour of chairing. It was critical of these conditions, which are legally enforceable but not subject to parliamentary scrutiny. The committee’s report last week said:

“In the absence of cogent reasons for not requiring mandatory conditions to be imposed through regulations, we recommend that the power to impose legally enforceable conditions in Clause 5(6) should be exercisable through regulations and that the negative procedure would afford an adequate level of parliamentary scrutiny.”


However, today I am requesting simply that we apply it to the national condition relating to space on pavements for disabled people, because the guidance is absolute nonsense which would not survive proper parliamentary scrutiny.

This is nothing to do with my noble friend the Deputy Leader, or the Minister, who did not invent this guidance published by the Government on 22 June. Paragraph 4.2 refers to

“the recommended minimum footway widths and distances required for access by mobility impaired and visually impaired people as set out in Section 3.1 of Inclusive Mobility”.

Paragraph 2.2 on page 5 of Inclusive Mobility says that:

“Someone who does not use a walking aid can manage to walk along a passageway less than 700mm wide, but just using a walking stick requires greater width than this; a minimum of 750mm. A person who uses two sticks or crutches, or a walking frame, needs a minimum of 900mm, a blind person using a long cane or with an assistance dog needs 1100mm. A visually impaired person who is being guided needs a width of 1200mm. A wheelchair user and an ambulant person side-by-side need 1500mm width.”


So, if I read this correctly—and I apologise to the Minister if I have got it wrong—rather than one simple instruction to café owners to keep a space of 1,500 millimetres, there are six different widths by which they might be guided.

Some noble Lords are old enough to remember two ancient television programmes. I can imagine a Benny Hill sketch—or something like that wonderful “Fawlty Towers” episode in which John Cleese keeps moving his diners from table to table—whereby a café owner sets out his tables at 700 millimetres and sees someone with a walking stick coming and moves them out to 750 millimetres, then I come along in my chair with my wife beside me, and he moves them out to 1,500 millimetres, and closes them back to 1,100 millimetres when my noble friend Lord Holmes comes along with Lottie, his guide dog, or the noble Lord, Lord Low, comes along with his white stick.

These guidelines are unworkable. We must have one simple rule: a minimum of 1,500 millimetres in all cases. That would also go some way towards aiding social distancing.

[Baroness Thomas of Winchester (LD) [V]]

My Lords, I am bowled over by the research done by the noble Lord, Lord Blencathra.

I am pleased to support the amendment moved by the noble Lord, Lord Holmes of Richmond, and the other amendments in this group. People who do not have mobility problems or sight impairment might wonder why there are so many amendments about accessibility. The answer is simple. So many of us who use wheelchairs or, in my case, mobility scooters, or have a sight impairment, have all had experience of obstructed pavements, which make journeys extremely hazardous.

As my noble friend Lady Pinnock said from these Benches, we support what the Government are doing in the Bill, but there is detail which must be addressed, and I hope that I am pushing at an open door. I too note the national guidance for local authorities over pavement space, but guidance is unenforceable by its very nature, so how much notice of it will be taken by an enthusiastic café owner trying to maximise table space, for example? We need something much more explicit in the Bill, and I urge the Minister to table a suitable amendment on Report if he is not going to accept any of the existing amendments.

Covid-19: Planning System

Baroness Thomas of Winchester Excerpts

Monday 8th June 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Greenhalgh]

I am afraid that I cannot give the noble Lord a precise timetable, but we are well aware that many of the emergency measures that we need to reboot the economy, including making the requisite planning changes, need to occur before the Summer Recess.

[Baroness Thomas of Winchester (LD) [V]]

My Lords, what assurance can the Minister give that homes constructed under permitted development rights will be required to meet all the policy standards, including accessibility, set out in local planning policy?

[Lord Greenhalgh]

Certainly there is no diminution in the standards required for accessibility in these temporary and pragmatic changes as a result of the Covid-19 pandemic.