Water (Special Measures) Bill [HL]

Baroness McIntosh of Pickering Excerpts

Committee stage
Wednesday 30th October 2024 Lords Chamber

Moved by

[Baroness McIntosh of Pickering]

34: Clause 2, page 5, line 12, after “incidents” insert “including natural flood prevention solutions”
Member's explanatory statement
This amendment, and another in the name of Baroness McIntosh of Pickering, would require consideration of opportunities to retain water through natural solutions to prevent sewage mixing in combined sewers with excess rainfall, causing pollution incidents.

[Baroness McIntosh of Pickering (Con)]

My Lords, I am pleased to speak to the amendments in this group in my name: Amendments 34, 38, 53 and 93. I look forward to the discussion on Amendment 51 in the name of the noble Duke, the Duke of Wellington, and Amendments 54 and 88 in the name of my noble friend Lady Browning; I am delighted to have co-signed Amendment 88, but I look forward to hearing her own words.

Amendments 34 and 38 relate to the opportunity to

“require consideration of opportunities to retain water through natural solutions to prevent sewage mixing in combined sewers with excess rainfall, causing pollution incidents”.

I am delighted to have been associated with such a project at the latter stages. I rather naughtily took full credit for the Slowing the Flow at Pickering scheme, although it was my then honourable friend John Greenway who did most of the work, but we were both involved in this successful project. It is important to notice, as I am sure the Minister will agree, that we need not overengineered projects but natural solutions to flood prevention and to prevent excess sewage going into waterways. They could be natural solutions such as soakaways, culverts or, in the case of Slowing the Flow at Pickering, creating dams, planting trees and, apparently, introducing beavers, with mixed success—and they must involve all partners.

In particular, I am keen to see partnership funding, not just from public partners, which were primarily those involved in Slowing the Flow at Pickering, but from private partners. In that regard, I pay tribute to the role that water companies play in preventing flooding upstream in a catchment area, and I applaud the work of companies such as Yorkshire Water and United Utilities, which have good track records in that regard.

My question to the Minister is: if she is not minded to approve these amendments, how do the Government expect to encourage the role of water companies, farmers and others to undertake such flood prevention measures? I urge her to consider that. In Amendment 38, I specifically refer to the preparation of a pollution incident reduction plan, noting that

“a sewerage undertaker must consult with farmers, local authorities and others to identify natural flood prevention solutions to prevent pollution incidents”

occurring. I did not speak to the previous group, but I felt sympathy with many of its amendments, particularly seeing the damage to lakes such as Lake Windermere. It is important to note that this is not always the fault of water companies.

Amendment 53 builds on the amendments to which I referred and requests a report on implementation. Assuming that we have implemented Schedule 3 to the Flood and Water Management Act 2010 as part of this Bill—I am ever optimistic—I request that we have a six-month review in which the Secretary of State or the Minister would

“lay before each House of Parliament a report on the effect of this Act on the implementation of Schedule 3 of”

the Act.

Before I turn to Amendment 93, I note that the Minister, in summing up on the first day in Committee, said her catchphrase. I will repeat it for good measure; noble Lords should be alarmed when we hear this phrase in future. She said that the department is considering with the Ministry of Housing, Communities and Local Government

“how best to implement their ambitions on sustainable drainage”—

here is the killer quote we must be mindful of—

“while also being mindful of the cumulative impact of the new regulatory burdens on the development sector”.

She concludes:

“At this stage, I do not want to pre-empt the outcome of that process”.—[Official Report, 28/10/24; col. 1009.]


I should be obliged if the Minister could give us a little more meat on cumulative impact. She will recall that, at Second Reading, I set out that this was a wonderful one-off opportunity in the Bill to plug the gap and fill the loophole—the gap in responsibilities between planners, investors and housebuilders—and to recognise the responsibility of others, such as highway authorities, which contribute to road surface water runoff entering the combined sewers and storm drains, without currently having any responsibility to prevent this form of pollution. That is very costly and we have already discussed on both days of debate on the Bill the damage that is caused. I repeat what I said on Monday: it is not within the responsibility of water companies where it is the fault of developers and highways authorities in this regard.

I turn to Amendment 93 in my name. Again, I am asking for a review of water reuse and existing regulations within 12 months of the day on which this Bill is passed, whereby the Secretary of State should publish a review of the existing regulations related to water wholesomeness and water companies’ ability to encourage water reuse. A report on the findings must be laid before Parliament. The purpose of this amendment is to the effect that, currently, water wholesomeness excludes from the responsibility of water companies the encouragement of water efficiency measures such as the use of grey water, reuse of water from a shower and other such water efficiency measures, as they are not covered by the definition of “wholesome water”. If that is the case, are the Minister and the department minded to review the definition of wholesome water. There are other amendments on clean water to which I think this also might apply. Currently, it seems bizarre that wholesome water would exclude such water efficiency measures.

The Government are aware that there are already a number of government regulations. This Government announced in September that they intended to roll out a mandatory water efficiency label in which appliances, including toilets, sinks and washing machines would be sold with information about their water usage to help customers reduce their use and save themselves money. That is very welcome. However, for such a system to be effective, surely labels must be tied to a mandatory minimum standard that could be reviewed and possibly tightened over time. If that is outwith the scope of this Bill, is this something to which the Government might return?

I understand that, under current building regulations, this matter could be revisited. Part G of the Building Regulations 2010 seeks to end the system whereby local authorities are given discretion between two water efficiency standards—the optional, albeit achievable, 110 litres per day mandate and the mandatory 125 litres per day standard. Would it not be better if Part G of those building regulations contained one standard only, possibly the lower standard of 110 litres per day, which, in the long term, could be reviewed and tightened, if that were the case? If such a labelling system were carried out and the Government were minded to do so, they could actually save £300 by introducing water efficiency into homes at the time of construction.

I hope that the Minister will look favourably on these amendments. Perhaps, if she does not like them, then, using the parliamentary draftsmen that she and her department have at her disposal, she could come up with a better alternative. But I hope she will find these amendments attractive. I beg to move.

[The Duke of Wellington (CB)]

My Lords, Amendment 51 in my name has been put in this group even though it relates to a different clause. Clause 3 deals with emergency overflows and seeks to define an emergency overflow. It also includes within Clause 3 what is in effect a let-out for the water companies, in that, where an overflow occurs as a result of an electrical power failure, that is permitted. I must admit that I find that surprising. I am grateful to the Minister, who allowed me to come and discuss this point with her and her officials a few weeks ago. However, I cannot for the life of me understand how failure to have sufficient electrical power generation capacity in a sewerage works is sufficient reason to allow an overflow to occur.

I remember that, just before or during the passage of the Environment Act, there was a major overflow by Thames Water in London, and the reason given at the time was, “Oh, sorry, there’s been a power failure”. That really does not seem good enough. Nobody running a hospital would be able to plead lack of power as a reason to close down all operations under way in the hospital at that moment. It seems to me that a sewerage works is a place where there must be sufficient emergency power generation through generators in case of a power failure.

This is a simple amendment; I hope the Government will take it seriously. It simply would delete, in effect, in new Section 141G(2)(a),

“electrical power failure at sewage disposal works”

as a reason for permitting an emergency overflow. That is my argument and I hope the Minister will take it seriously.

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Hayman of Ullock (Lab)]

My Lords, I thank all those who have taken part for their interest in the important topic of sustainable water usage and sewerage infrastructure. I shall start by speaking to Amendments 34 and 38, proposed by the noble Baroness, Lady McIntosh of Pickering, and spoken to by other noble Lords. The noble Baroness, Lady Pinnock, gave some examples around this. The Government agree that nature-based solutions, including natural flood prevention solutions, are a useful tool for tackling the root causes of sewage pollution while delivering wide ecological benefits.

Noble Lords who took part in the progress of the levelling-up Act will remember that this was debated in Committee on that Bill and that I spoke against the proposals that preferred the cheapest option because we were concerned about the amount of concrete that this could lead to rather than the best solutions for the environment.

The Government’s strategic policy statement includes Ofwat’s proposal to allow more than £2 billion of investment in nature-based solutions at its draft determinations for price review 24. This includes £1.6 billion to reduce storm overflow spills through catchments and nature-based solutions, and further funding is proposed for nature-based solutions such as reedbeds and wetlands for nutrient removal. The Government have supported water companies trialling nature-based solutions for groundwater-induced storm overflows. This is, of course, subject to the final determinations to be made in December but, if approved, will allow for greater understanding around effectiveness and suitability and enable greater uptake at future price reviews.

Nature-based solutions may feature in pollution incident reduction plans, but we believe it would be inappropriate to mandate their inclusion because they may not necessarily be effective in every circumstance. These plans are intended to ensure that water companies implement mitigations to reduce pollution incidents. Each year, the single biggest source of pollution incidents is issues such as blockages or mechanical failures within the foul sewer water system. These issues are best addressed via monitoring and maintenance measures, such as the detection of bursts, checking pumps and relining sewers. This is important work that needs to take place alongside. It is for these reasons that the Government are not supporting these amendments. However, I reassure the noble Baroness and other noble Lords that the Government remain extremely supportive of using nature-based solutions to tackle the underlying causes of pollution incidents, and I look forward to discussing this topic with her further alongside colleagues from MHCLG in the coming weeks.

I turn to Amendment 51, tabled by the noble Duke, the Duke of Wellington, about the use of back-up generators at emergency overflows. The Government agree that measures should be put in place to reduce discharges from emergency overflows caused by electrical power failures. However, water companies are already required to implement measures to reduce the likelihood of a discharge occurring due to an electrical power failure through conditions in their environmental permits. In particular, water companies must demonstrate that they have back-up systems in place, such as generators or alternative power supplies, to secure the emergency overflow permit. Ultimately, emergency overflows may still be required to operate as a last resort to protect the sewerage infrastructure and prevent upstream properties flooding.

The near real-time reporting of information required by Clause 3 will enable increased transparency around the use of emergency overflows and will better enable resource to be quickly directed to investigate and address any cause of such a discharge. I thank the noble Duke for meeting me previously to discuss his concerns and his amendment. I am not sure that he will be reassured, but those are the reasons we do not believe an amendment in this space is necessary.

Amendment 53 from the noble Baroness, Lady McIntosh of Pickering, is on the important issue of SUDS, which we also discussed on Monday, and to which my noble friend Lady Young of Old Scone and the noble Baroness, Lady Pinnock, also spoke. As I have noted and discussed with the noble Baroness, this Government are strongly committed to requiring standardised sustainable drainage systems in new developments. We are actively considering whether improvements in the delivery of SUDS, which we all wish to see—14 years is far too long to wait for the implementation of legislation—may be better achieved through mechanisms other than Schedule 3 to the Flood and Water Management Act 2010.

I say to the noble Baroness that I have never had a catchphrase before. I was rather hoping for something a little more exciting—suggestions on a postcard. I am sorry to disappoint, but I am not going to use that catchphrase now. I look forward to meeting the noble Baroness alongside my colleagues in MHCLG. There are certain things that we need to discuss to see how we can move things on in this area.

On Amendment 54, I agree with the noble Baroness, Lady Browning, about the importance of having a drainage and sewerage system that can meet current and future demand. I always appreciate her enthusiasm on these matters.

As part of the Environment Act 2021, a duty has been created for water and sewerage companies in England to produce drainage and wastewater management plans. These plans set out how a company intends to improve their drainage and wastewater systems over the next 25 years, accounting for factors including a growing population and changing environmental circumstances. Taking a strategic approach to drainage and wastewater management will help to identify and mitigate issues related to insufficient network capacity.

The Environment Agency has a role as a statutory consultee for local planning authority decisions for certain types of developments that are made under Part III of the Town and Country Planning Act 1990 to help ensure that matters of wastewater and treatment, work capacity and water resource matters are considered as part of key planning decisions.

The Government appreciate the intent behind the amendment but have concerns about how it could operate in practice. That is because it could potentially give sewerage undertakers the right to refuse connections based on their own predictions of capacity without reference to agreed standards. Furthermore, legislation already permits undertakers to refuse connections where they would be prejudicial to their sewerage systems. Where disputes arise, the matter can and should be referred to the independent regulator, which in this case is Ofwat. However, I am happy to look more closely at capacity issues, as the noble Baroness suggests.

On Amendment 88, also from the noble Baroness, Lady Browning, the Government recognise the importance of ensuring the availability of sustainable water supplies to help meet our target of delivering 1 million new homes in this Parliament while protecting the environment. Under existing powers, water companies should ensure that they have sufficient water resources available to supply new homes, in line with the water resources planning guidance. In addition, Natural England and the Environment Agency are required to assess the impact of water company plans on protected sites.

Amendment 93, in the name of the noble Baroness, Lady McIntosh of Pickering, follows on from those amendments. I agree with the noble Baroness and understand the need for increased water efficiency and water reuse. Looking at all these amendments as a whole, I have to say it is completely bonkers that in this country we use drinking water to flush our toilets. That does not happen elsewhere. For that reason, we are already reviewing the relevant regulations. We intend to publish in the new year a consultation on how we could revise those regulations, with the aim of increasing water reuse.

The reuse of water through rainwater harvesting and grey water reuse may have important benefits for the environment because it is part of reducing our reliance on water abstraction. Water reuse systems have a wide range of benefits, such as reduced demand on water infrastructure, reduced carbon emissions and flood protection.

On the noble Baroness’s particular question about the mandatory water efficiency labels that we are introducing, we are completely committed to that but we have not yet made a decision on the minimum standards.

I hope this reassures the noble Baroness that the proposed new clause will not be needed as we are already taking significant steps in this space. I once again thank noble Lords for their important contributions and suggested amendments around sustainable water usage and sewerage infrastructure.

[Baroness McIntosh of Pickering (Con)]

My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister and others who have spoken in this debate. I am a little concerned, because I understood the Minister to say that they may seek to achieve sustainable drains through other means than Schedule 3.

[Baroness Hayman of Ullock (Lab)]

To clarify, we are not suggesting that we do not do that, but we want to look at all the different options so that we can look at how we can practically move forward.

[Baroness McIntosh of Pickering (Con)]

I just say that I am extremely disappointed. I know this is not necessarily within the gift of the Minister but, as we heard from the noble Baroness, Lady Pinnock, this was meant to be the year that we implemented Schedule 3, and there are only two months left. While I welcome the fact that we are going to meet before Report, I will look to bring something like that back.

I am grateful to my noble friend Lady Browning, who, in mentioning capacity, has underlined the need to end the automatic right to connect and to establish water companies as statutory consultees in all future planning applications. If there is no capacity, I do not see how we can expect water companies to make false connections that will lead to further sewage spills in future.

--- Later in debate ---

So, Section 82 of the Environment Act 2021 extended operator self-monitoring to the very rivers themselves, giving water companies the responsibility for monitoring their own impact beyond the sewage treatment works. In my book, this is like putting Herod in charge of childcare. The water companies have shown that they cannot be trusted accurately to reflect the impact of their own activities, far less monitoring in-river water quality. I believe that the Environment Agency should now be given the resources and tasked with monitoring river quality, as was previously the case. This amendment would rectify the position created by Section 82 of the 2021 Act and ensure that the Environment Agency, the body charged with monitoring in-river quality upstream and downstream of sewerage infrastructure, does that job, and would also ensure that the data produced by such monitoring is published. This cannot be done without adequate resourcing of the Environment Agency to do the monitoring in an effective and trustworthy way, but it is essential if we are ever going to restore public trust in knowing the real state of our rivers, water bodies and beaches.

[Baroness McIntosh of Pickering (Con)]

My Lords, I have two amendments in this group. The first opposes Clause 3 standing part of the Bill, and the second is Amendment 75. I am grateful to the Minister and the Bill team for the meeting we had. The earlier amendment in the name of the noble Duke, the Duke of Wellington, and those in my name and others, possibly reflected the fact that the meaning of “emergency overflow” in Clause 3 is not quite as clear as it should be. This is simply an attempt to ask the Minister and, through her, the department, whether they are entirely convinced that the Bill is as clear as it might be in this regard.

I shall focus my remarks on Amendment 75. I am grateful that it has been included in this group, where it is most relevant. Doing so saves a separate debate on it at a later stage, where I felt it did not fit in. Subsection (2)(d), under the heading “meaning of ‘emergency overflow’”, concerns

“blockage of a sewer downstream of sewerage disposal works.”

That brought to mind the typical problem we encounter: fatbergs associated with restaurants and intense food production, which is very regrettable indeed. Are the Minister and the department minded to foresee an exemption from the provision for an emergency overflow and the conditions flowing therefrom? For example, such an issue is not within the power and authority of a sewerage undertaker or water company, which cannot be held responsible for fatbergs from cooking fat, wet wipes, et cetera. I welcome the fact that we have now banned wet wipes. That is a great development, but I do not know what the solution is to fatbergs entering downstream, causing these blockages and potentially leading to an emergency overflow. Does the Minister agree that it is very difficult to link that to the responsibility of a sewerage undertaker or water company, given that it really is not within their power to prevent it?

[Lord Cameron of Dillington (CB)]

My Lords, my Amendment 59 follows on very neatly from those put forward by the noble Baroness, Lady Young. It too is very much a probing amendment and is largely designed to expose an issue or problem, and to alert the proposed industry review to possible solutions. It arises from a worry that I have had for many years: that we do not really know what is going on in our rivers. A decade or so ago, I remember hearing about a farmer who reportedly said that the chance of his small river being inspected by the Environment Agency was roughly one in 200 years, and thus he was not worried about what he or others might be doing to that river. This may have been an exaggeration, but the point he was making has a ring of truth to it even now, some 10 years later.

Then, the problem was that the Environment Agency had been starved of funds and, in many respects, chained to its desk. The number of staff deployed on the actual rivers had dropped away to the point of insignificance. However, the agency has always monitored our rivers, and certainly does nowadays. Specifically, it monitors downstream of major sewage works and CSOs, but it does so on a random basis. I should say at this point that it is a very skilled job taking a water sample and ensuring that it is a true sample and not contaminated either by the sampler—disturbing the river bed, for instance—or by some very localised issue in or near that point of the river.

Let us say that, in your sampling programme, you aim to take a sample once a month where it matters. That does not sound very much, but if noble Lords think about the hundreds of rivers in England and the literally thousands of sewage works and other licensed discharge points, even that would be a mammoth task for a whole regiment of inspectors. As a result, there is probably only a one in 100 chance of any sample being taken in any river which would coincide with the sort of event we need to know about.

The science of river quality shows—I am sure we all know this—that rivers are constantly changing. We all know the Chinese proverb: you can step into the same river only once. When we get a wet weather downpour, not only do we get overflows from sewers and CSOs, which can be very damaging to the aquatic environment; we also get discharges from urban run-off, often containing severe chemical pollution, including the possibility of persistent chemicals, mentioned by the noble Baroness, Lady Young, in her amendment. Of course, during this same wet weather incident we also get agricultural run-off and pollution, which I know, as a farmer, is as damaging as anything else to our biodiversity, particularly when it involves excess phosphate or silage effluent.

On the subject of biodiversity, I should say at this point that the UK Centre for Ecology and Hydrology— I declare an interest, as I am about to retire as its chair—reckons that since 1970 there has been an 83% decline in our freshwater populations, which is a pretty devastating figure.

As I say, the chances are in excess of one in 100 of any random river sample being taken immediately after one of these wet weather incidents, especially when it happens to be a night-time storm or incident, so we never really know the true condition of any of our rivers; nor can we calculate the short-term or long- term ecological consequences of all those wet weather discharges—except that there has been an 83% decline in our freshwater populations. But there is a solution: continuous monitoring using telemetry. Install a monitor in a river and it can record the state of that river every hour, or even every half hour. Before noble Lords think that hundreds of monitors reporting every half hour would provide an excessive amount of information that would overwhelm the watchers, I should say that these machines can be preset to produce an alarm only when a particular parameter is broken. In other words, you are woken up in the middle of the night only when, for example, there is a shortage of oxygen in the river or an excess of E. coli.

The real point is that we can find out more about the long-term state of our rivers from continuous monitoring in, say, two weeks than we would probably find out in many years of random sampling. But—and this is a big “but”, which is why this is very much a probing amendment—although this technology is developing fast, I am afraid it is still very expensive. The price goes up according to the number of pollutants being monitored. Each pollutant needs a different way of measuring, and each sensor, for each pollutant, can cost an average of about £10,000. If you want a machine that monitors and reports on just five key pollutants, it would currently cost about £50,000, while a machine that monitors almost everything would cost around £100,000.

That is an awful lot of money, especially if you think about our desperate need for hundreds of these machines. There is no doubt that, if we were to develop and order hundreds of them, the price would fall dramatically. I put the amendment out there largely for the new independent water review commission to consider. Bearing in mind

“The water sector needs a complete reset”,—[Official Report, Commons, 23/10/24; col. 279.]


it has to ask itself what price we put on the cleanliness of our rivers and our ability to truly monitor them.

Water (Special Measures) Bill [HL]

Baroness McIntosh of Pickering Excerpts

Committee stage
Monday 28th October 2024 Lords Chamber

Moved by

[Baroness McIntosh of Pickering]

11: Clause 1, page 2, line 8, at end insert—
“(iia) meeting relevant standards issued under Schedule 3 of the Flood and Water Management Act 2010 (Sustainable Drainage),”

[Baroness McIntosh of Pickering (Con)]

My Lords, I welcome the opportunity to debate Amendments 11 and 12 in my name in this group, on flood and water management. The amendments relate to Clause 1 and, in particular, tie the environmental standards which the department has set out in the Bill to those specifically meeting relevant standards issued under Schedule 3 to the Flood and Water Management Act. So it is the same provision to come in two separate places.

I am very grateful to the Minister and members of the Bill team for meeting me prior to Committee to discuss this. I invite the noble Baroness to accept that this amendment and the provisions in Schedule 3 to the Flood and Water Management Act 2010 are Defra legislation, so I would like her department to take ownership of this. She is aware of my desire and passion that we implement the provisions of Schedule 3 to the 2010 Act as a matter of urgency. Defra itself has explained that Schedule 3 provides a framework for the approval and adoption of drainage systems, a sustainable drainage system approving body within unitary and county councils and national standards on the design, construction, operation and maintenance of sustainable drainage systems for the lifetime of the development. Schedule 3 also makes the right to connect surface water run-off to public sewers conditional on the drainage system being approved before any construction work can start. That goes to the point of ending the automatic right to connect that we discussed in a previous group.

Wales has already applied Schedule 3 and has done a report on how it has been implemented. It is not entirely perfect and there are ways in which it could be improved, but we have been yo-yoing on this under successive Governments and it now falls to her Government and her department to really run with this.

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Hayman of Ullock (Lab)]

My Lords, I thank the noble Baroness, Lady McIntosh of Pickering, for her amendments relating to Ofwat’s duties. I will take Amendments 11 and 12 together.

As I have previously noted, public trust in the water sector has been severely damaged, and the number of serious pollution incidents is increasing, yet companies are still paying out millions in bonuses. To rebuild public trust, we are creating a new framework to support accountability, including the new rules relating to remuneration and governance. As the independent economic regulator of the water industry, Ofwat will be responsible for developing these rules.

However, the Government are clear that environmental standards are a vital component of performance. As such, the Bill requires the forthcoming rules to include standards that relate to the environment. The noble Lord, Lord Blencathra, has mentioned the devastation that flooding can bring; I reassure him and other noble Lords that I completely understand why it is so important for us to tackle flooding. I live in a house that has been flooded—living in Cumbria, you are always aware of these issues.

With regard to the Flood and Water Management Act 2010 specifically, while the Act includes provisions relating to sustainable drainage, it does not prescribe or define any environmental standards capable of being applied in this context. It would therefore not be appropriate to include reference to standards in this legislation within Ofwat’s rules, as Ofwat does not have any functions or expertise in relation to the technical requirements prescribed under the Flood and Water Management Act 2010.

The noble Baroness, Lady McIntosh, suggested that Defra should take ownership of delivering this. The issue we have is that it also impacts directly on development and developers, which is why the Government are currently working with the Ministry of Housing, Communities and Local Government to assess how best to implement their ambitions on sustainable drainage, while also being mindful of the cumulative impact of the new regulatory burdens on the development sector. At this stage, I do not want to pre-empt the outcome of that process.

On this basis, the Government do not accept either of the amendments from the noble Baroness. However, I would like to say that the noble Baroness knows that I am very sympathetic to her concerns. As she said, we have discussed this previously. If she is willing, I suggest that we look to arrange a meeting between herself, myself and MHCLG, in order to discuss this further, where she can clearly explain her concerns to both departments—Defra and MHCLG—that have responsibility for moving forward on this.

[Baroness McIntosh of Pickering (Con)]

My Lords, I am most grateful to all who have spoken, and in particular for the support of the noble Baroness, Lady Pinnock, and, from a sedentary position, the noble Baroness, Lady Parminter, as well as my noble friend Lord Blencathra. He referred to the flooding. I was actually a candidate—at a very early age—for Workington in 1987. I went back and visited as a shadow Minister during the severe floods of 2007 and 2009, so I am well acquainted with the pressures faced by Carlisle, Keswick and Cockermouth. It was very sad to see that many of the residents felt that they could not afford to take out insurance in those floods.

I will add that it is not just flooding that concerns me; it is the surface water going into the combined sewers taking the sewage from the new developments that do not have mandatory SUDS that is causing the problem.

I would like to take up the Minister’s offer. It would be good to have the meeting before Report, because I would be prepared to come back with these amendments then. Alternatively, if the department wish to come forward with even better amendments that achieve the same end, that would be very welcome.

Water (Special Measures) Bill [HL]

Baroness McIntosh of Pickering Excerpts

Committee stage
Monday 28th October 2024 Lords Chamber

The Government are already being criticised for lack of progress in meeting those targets; the Office for Environmental Protection, for example, has done work to highlight that. The target of halting the decline of species and biodiversity by 2030 is incredibly close and the Government certainly will not make it if an important body such as Ofwat, which controls the framework within which our freshwater environment flourishes, or not, is not clearly tasked with doing its bit now. As has already been said, it is not just about the five-yearly price rounds; it is about the day-to-day decisions that Ofwat is making as we speak, and will make over the next five years, that certainly need to be guided by this revised duty. I hope that the Minister will give way on that amendment.

[Baroness McIntosh of Pickering (Con)]

My Lords, I congratulate the Minister on bringing forward the first Defra Bill to Committee stage; I congratulate the noble Baroness and those who supported the amendments moved.

I wish to add a note of caution and I declare my interests in the register: not least, I am an officer of the All-Party Parliamentary Water Group, and I worked for five years with the water regulator for Scotland, the Water Industry Commission for Scotland. The degree of caution I would like to urge in this regard is that I believe we are already committed in law. The Water Industry Act 1991 reflects that very carefully, as do the Environment Act and the Agriculture Act and others, not least the Flood and Water Implementation Act 2010, which is built on that.

I urge the Minister to be cautious in trying to reach a balance both in the Bill before us in Committee today and, more especially, the review to which other noble Lords have spoken, which we will go on to consider. I believe that the balance is currently right but falls heavily on the side of environmental benefits. I do not think that it is entirely clear what the costs will be.

I will issue a note of regret that I have not had the chance to go through the 87 pages of the impact assessment, which was released only on Thursday when I was due to speak in a debate on the Friday—literally, the first working day before Committee. One thing I have picked up that the impact assessment looks at is what the cost of natural capital and decarbonisation, for example, would be. I would certainly like more information on this, if possible. In relation to natural capital and decarbonisation, it says:

“This measure will help to protect the Water Environment and improve the state of the UK’s natural capital. The measure will ensure Water Companies take steps to protect the environment”.


It goes on to say:

“The measure is not expected to significantly impact greenhouse gas emissions”.


That is possibly debatable.

We will go on to discuss my main concern in greater depth in relation to amendments in my name in later groups, so I will not argue this at length now. However, I was absolutely astounded to learn this week that water companies are prevented from encouraging customers to take water efficiency measures. This addresses the point raised by the noble Baroness, Lady Young of Old Scone—a very pertinent point in this regard—about keeping customers’ bills down, which has been the concern of successive Governments as well as of the Consumer Council for Water, Citizens Advice and many MPs, as I found when I was next door, along with other noble Peers.

I am concerned that the definition of “wholesome water” is focused entirely on environmental matters and does not allow for measures to introduce water efficiencies, which I think all noble Lords would sign up to, such as recycling grey water to wash vehicles and, possibly, even dishes. I am a firm believer that clean drinking water coming into the home should be kept precisely for that purpose. It is extremely expensive to produce. We should keep drinking water for the purposes of drinking water. We should seek at every opportunity to encourage water companies to encourage their customers, in whichever area they live. In an area of hard water, for example, it is more difficult to work up a lather. Water companies are best placed to know the water quality in that area and I believe they should be allowed to address it.

The second thing that astounded me this week was that Ofwat had taken away some of the powers for water companies to introduce water efficiency schemes. It took some of those moneys away for better use—to give back as grants for water efficiency. I have no truck with Ofwat in this regard, but I would argue that water companies are better placed to know what water efficiency measures will work in each region in which they operate.

I conclude by saying that, while I listened very closely and admire the eloquence and knowledge with which the noble Baroness, Lady Willis of Summertown, moved the amendment, I think we have to err on the side of caution and make sure we are allowing the water companies the tools they need to do the job, to ensure that we preserve as far as possible drinking water for drinking water purposes, and allowing them to roll out measures to ensure that water efficiency going forward will encourage us all to use water differently. They are currently prevented from doing that by the definition as I understand it of “wholesome water”. We will go on to discuss that at a later stage, but one has to be cautious with the best intentions that are sometimes expressed in these amendments.

[Lord Cromwell (CB)]

My Lords, I also add my support for these amendments, and I agree with much of what has been said already. On the matter of water usage, I have lived in deserts and I find the idea of people power-washing their cars with pure drinking water in this country extraordinary. But that is where we are today, I guess.

Why do I support these amendments? It is simply because it is vital that this Bill is consistent with existing policy and legislation to which it naturally links. The only reservation I have, which may be something that comes out of the review, is that it brings us back to the question of whether Ofwat and the Environment Agency should be a single agency or two separate ones with a division of responsibilities.

--- Later in debate ---

Moved by

[Baroness McIntosh of Pickering]

7: Clause 1, page 1, line 17, after “standards” insert “, provided the undertaker is satisfied that the failure to meet relevant standards was due to a failing on the part of the person holding the senior role and not another person, including a developer”

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness McIntosh of Pickering (Con)]

My Lords, I will speak also to Amendment 8 in my name. These amendments are in a group looking at exemptions from the rules under Clause 1. My particular concern relates to the obligations being imposed by Clause 1, and indeed the rest of the Bill, on water companies where they may not and could not possibly be held responsible for the activities they are undertaking because the fault lies with others who are not currently within the remit of the Bill.

The purpose of these amendments is to reflect the fact that water companies should be held responsible under the terms of the Bill, in particular Clause 1, only for those activities within their specific responsibility. Clearly, for example, where there are missed connections between wastewater pipes and major developments, water companies should not be held responsible if they are obliged to fit these new connections into inadequate, antiquated pipes that simply cannot take the amount of waste coming.

The background to this very simple measure follows from the Pitt review—the noble Baroness will recall that I raised this at Second Reading—following the severe floods of 2007. I think it is worthy of note that Sir Michael Pitt is from East Yorkshire, which is more vulnerable to coastal flooding than just about any other part of the country. His 2007 review identified, for the first time, surface water flooding as well.

In connection with surface water flooding, the two most consequential amendments set out that mandatory construction of sustainable drainage systems in major developments should take place so as to contain floodwater and prevent it mixing with sewage through overflows into the combined sewers.

Further, and this is where the developers should have a responsibility and not the water companies, I ask the Minister to look favourably at ending the automatic right to connect, which has so far never happened. That one measure alone would mean that misconnections—whereby the existing infrastructure is deemed to fit the amount of wastewater coming from major new developments—would simply not happen in the future. Most of these developments are made up of four or five-bedroom homes with, dare I say, four or five times the amount of sewage coming out of them into inadequate Victorian pipes. Currently, under the planning rules, developers and local authorities deem those connections to be safe and refuse to put in appropriate infrastructure to ensure that a safe connection can be made. Were the water companies to be recognised in the planning application process as statutory consultees, on the same basis as the Environment Agency comparatively recently has been, those misconnections could be averted. The simple measure of making water companies statutory consultees, on the same basis as the Environment Agency, would help in that regard.

When she looks at these amendments in summing up, would the Minister agree to obliging developers to have sustainable drains fitted to take excess rainwater into a soakaway, pond or culvert to prevent it mixing with sewage water in combined sewers, which is currently leading to sewage overflows? It is not fair to make the water companies responsible for that. Were they to be statutory consultees, they would probably argue that the wastewater will not fit the pipes currently in place.

This has led to some very perverse sewage spills. I remember when I was in the other place there was a school in Filey that suffered £1 million-worth of damage to its swimming pool and, I think, the maths department. Existing developments had to be evacuated for six to nine months because of the public health aspect of sewage coming in. Precisely because a small development of only 30 houses was pumping out so much sewage, the rainwater when mixed with it had nowhere else to go and it went into the school and the existing developments. I am sure noble Lords could give other examples of this.

I ask the Minister to review the way in which highways currently contribute to pollution through rainwater running off the road surface, taking with it oil, brake fluid and other pollutants. When this combines with floodwater, it enters the combined sewers and then often goes into homes, causing huge damage and a public health disaster.

I hope the Minister will agree that water companies should be held responsible for those activities within their control but cannot be held responsible for circumstances which are outwith their control. These two small, tightly-drawn amendments would fit that purpose.

I conclude by asking the Minister this. If these amendments are not added to the Bill, what mechanism do the Government intend to use to ensure that water companies will be held responsible under the Bill only for activities under their direct control and not those under the control of others, such as developers and highways authorities, which are currently excluded from the remit of the Bill? I beg to move.

[Baroness Pinnock (LD)]

My Lords, I broadly agree with the amendments in the name of the noble Baroness, Lady McIntosh. She raised some important issues, about, first of all, the way that surface water drainage is treated. As the Minister will know, surface water is combined with sewage water in the same pipes in many of our towns and cities, and increasing rainfall and development is putting pressure on that combined drainage system.

The other issue to consider, which the noble Baroness raised, is the pressure put on local authority planning services to agree to housing developments where the existing infrastructure is not appropriate to support them, with developers reluctant to fork out huge sums of money to pay for the additional drainage systems needed. The answer lies in empowering local authorities’ planning services to put conditions on planning consent which specifically require developers to build the appropriate infrastructure to support the development that they wish to build.

There is a related point. I am a local councillor; in my experience, where there is an issue of surface water, the planning services require underwater attenuation tanks to be built to hold that water until it can be released to the natural drainage systems, such as streams. However, the developers are very reluctant to do that, and are seeking to get around it in other ways. Surface water drainage issues and local authorities’ inability to enforce this is something that the Minister may wish to raise with her colleagues in local government when it comes to reforms of the planning system, as it will affect the Minister’s environment responsibilities. I agree with the amendments tabled by the noble Baroness, Lady McIntosh.

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Hayman of Ullock (Lab)]

My Lords, through provisions introduced by Clause 1, Ofwat will be able to issue new rules on remuneration and governance to ensure that companies and executives are subject to robust oversight and held accountable for failure. Among other things, these rules will ensure that executives will no longer be able to take bonuses where companies fail to meet standards on environmental performance, financial resilience, customer outcomes or criminal liability.

Amendments 7 and 8, introduced by the noble Baroness, Lady McIntosh of Pickering, seek to ensure that these rules apply only in instances where the failure to meet the required standards is due to a failing by that individual and not another person. I start by reassuring the noble Baroness that, should companies meet their performance expectations, executives will rightly be rewarded. However, the changes proposed through Amendment 7, in particular, would make it more difficult for Ofwat to implement the rules on remuneration and governance in a meaningful way. This is because it would introduce an additional test to be met before the bonus ban could be applied, where a link between the specific actions of an individual senior leader and the performance failings of a company as a whole might be difficult to demonstrate.

Senior executives are also collectively responsible for the actions of the company and therefore should be held responsible for poor performance. However, having said that, Ofwat has stated, in the policy consultation it published last week, that, while it intends for the rules to apply to most performance-related pay decisions by water companies,

“there may be … exceptional circumstances where a payment should not be prohibited”.

For example, if an incident leading to a rule breach was clearly and demonstrably beyond the control of the company, this could be grounds for an exemption from the ban.

Considering the changes proposed by Amendment 8, we also consider it unlikely that individuals in senior roles will fail to meet Ofwat’s future standards of “fitness and propriety” due to a failing on the part of another person. The potential criteria proposed by Ofwat in its consultation to measure “fitness and propriety” include character, previous conduct, and knowledge. These criteria are specific to the individual, rather than the performance of the company, and do not obviously relate to acts by other persons.

I just want to mention an issue that the debate moved on to, around drainage and SUDS. We are going to be discussing SUDS further in group 8, so we shall talk about that then, but I want to assure the noble Baroness that we are engaging with officials in MHCLG, because it is really important that we have a proper discussion around planning and drainage as we move forward with development. I am very aware of the problems that surface water can cause in new development if it is not thought through properly.

The noble Lord, Lord Cromwell, drew the Committee’s notice to the commission and asked whether it would be discussed there. I will draw the Committee’s attention, for interest, to part of the scope of the commission:

“Where housing, planning, agriculture and drainage interlink with strategic planning for the water system, these are in scope. ... The commission should have regard to how the water sector regulatory system provides the certainty around the provision of water infrastructure needed to underpin development plans, housing growth and sustainable development, while strategically protecting and enhancing the environment. This should include how regulation and planning for water infrastructure and for residential and commercial development can work together more effectively to anticipate and invest to provide for future growth, to quickly resolve and prevent issues where water and wastewater capacity constraints may otherwise inhibit necessary development (such as through their impact on requirements for water and nutrient neutrality)”.


So, although it is not entirely dealing with the issue around SUDS, I think it is something we need to explore further with the housing department, for example, and with local government. There is an opportunity to look at development and water within the scope of the commission. I hope that is helpful for noble Lords to understand.

I hope I have reassured the noble Baroness that the rules will be applied to individuals in a proportionate manner, and made clear why the Government consider these amendments to be unnecessary.

[Baroness McIntosh of Pickering (Con)]

My Lords, I am grateful for the opportunity to debate in some depth these two amendments. I just clarify that the automatic right to connect is very different from SUDS and I do not think the noble Baroness addressed that point. I still have reservations, because I believe it is inappropriate in terms of Clause 2 to speak about pollution incident reduction plans when so many of the sewage discharges can self-evidently be found not to be the responsibility of water companies at all. As the noble Lord, Lord Cromwell, so eloquently and appropriately recorded, these incidents are only going to increase as we see the number of major new developments of four-bedroom and five-bedroom houses increase.

Waste: Incineration

Baroness McIntosh of Pickering Excerpts

Tuesday 22nd October 2024 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Hayman of Ullock (Lab)]

My Lords, it does say in the Companion that you should not thank a noble Member for their Question—so, on this occasion, I will not. The environmental permitting regulations prevent the incineration of separately collected paper, metal, glass or plastic waste, unless it has gone through some sort of treatment process first. Following that treatment, incineration is seen to be the best environmental outcome. We know that the recycling rate is too low, that we burn too much waste and that, for too long, recycling rates in England have plateaued. The way forward is to look at the whole big picture and our circular economy ambitions are designed to address this.

[Baroness McIntosh of Pickering (Con)]

Will the noble Baroness commit to looking not just at incinerators but at anaerobic digesters and accept that they have a powerful role to play not just in getting rid of residual waste, particularly household waste, which is a very vexatious challenge, but in heating people’s homes at a reduced rate? Will the Government keep an open mind on energy from waste, including anaerobic digestion?

[Baroness Hayman of Ullock (Lab)]

As I just mentioned, we are looking to do a review right across the piece on this, so anaerobic waste will certainly be part of that.

Rural Communities

Baroness McIntosh of Pickering Excerpts

Tuesday 15th October 2024 Lords Chamber

Asked by

[Baroness McIntosh of Pickering]

To ask His Majesty’s Government what are their priorities for rural communities over the next two years.

[Baroness McIntosh of Pickering (Con)]

My Lords, I am delighted to have this opportunity to debate such an important subject and am deeply grateful to have secured this Question for Short Debate. I declare my interests as honorary president of National Energy Action, honorary associate of the British Veterinary Association, and honorary vice-president of the Association of Drainage Authorities; I also work with the Dispensing Doctors’ Association. I look forward to all contributions this evening, but especially the maiden speech of the noble Lord, Lord Elliott.

Rural communities face many challenges and are of a different nature from urban communities, yet in policy terms they are frequently overlooked. While the 2024 Labour manifesto did not specifically mention rural communities, many of the commitments it did include may damage them. There is a desperate need to support farming and other businesses in rural areas with better broadband and mobile connectivity. A lack of public transport in rural areas means that young people are unable to access jobs, while older people find access to hospitals and healthcare challenging for the same reason. The £2 bus fare has helped, but will the Government keep this? There is inadequate public transport in rural areas, but I see no point in devolving more powers to local communities and leadership for bus and other local transport provision if there are no additional resources to meet the new responsibilities.

Planning rules and guidance go some way to protecting rural communities—for example, the ban on building on flood plains and areas prone to flooding. However, rural communities are often used for the convenience of urban communities, with energy being a good example. Too often, energy is generated at sea or on land far away from where it is to be consumed. That energy then traverses rural communities, which are blighted by pylons, without gaining any of the benefits such far-flung, sparsely populated communities long for in often cooler climes with poorly insulated houses and residents on low incomes. It transpires from a Government-sponsored study that it can be cheaper to transfer electricity underground rather than through unsightly, environmentally unfriendly overhead-line transmission. Power lines should be placed underground, or alternatively, electricity generated from renewables should serve those closest to the source of the power generated.

Turning to public services, these are often more costly to deliver in rural than urban areas. Hospitals and GP surgeries can be difficult to access. Every increase in fuel duty affects the ambulance service. There is poor broadband mobile connectivity, meaning that dispensing doctors and rural GPs are unable to issue electronic prescriptions. There are inequalities of healthcare between urban and rural areas which need to be addressed. One hopes that the follow-up to the Darzi review will tackle these.

Rural communities have a desperate need for a smaller, affordable one-bedroom or two-bedroom homes, yet the Government are planning to build 300,000 houses a year, many in areas of water stress and on flood plains and mostly with four or five bedrooms. This will not address the shortage of affordable homes in rural areas but will create problems of increased sewage and houses with five or five times the amount of sewage coming out into inadequate water pipes which, when mixing with floodwater in combined sewers, will enter the sea and rivers.

Farming lies at the heart of the rural economy, yet farmers face great uncertainty. Farmers have a role to play in creating better self-sufficiency, energy and food security, generating power through renewables on their land, and they would like to sell into the national grid. In terms of storing floodwater on farmland, as we heard last week, farmers perform a public good, which should be recognised—along with other public goods that they perform—through the environmental land management schemes. Yet there is an underspend in Defra. I have seen one figure of £138 million and one of £350 million. There is also mounting concern over the forthcoming Budget, not least on the implications of inheritance tax for farms. The Government must give certainty and clarity to farmers by spending the moneys committed to farming in full and setting an increased multiannual agriculture budget for the duration of this Parliament.

To boost food security and self-sufficiency, we must consume more home-produced food and fewer substandard food imports from third countries. It would be very helpful to have an update on the land-use framework, the National Planning Policy Framework and planning policy guidance, to reflect farming being the primary role of the countryside. While environmental benefits sit comfortably with best farm practice, the mass development of solar panels, tree planting, carbon offsetting and housebuilding on Britain’s most productive and fertile land does not make good sense. In the Budget on 30 October, will the Government commit to reviewing the agricultural property relief in a compassionate way, to ensure that it remains available to those landlords prepared to let for the longest terms—10 years or more—to give tenant farmers greater security? When farmers do well, rural communities and market towns flourish.

Racing also plays a major role in rural communities. North Yorkshire plays host to racecourses at Ripon, my former constituency Thirsk, York, Wetherby and Doncaster, jewels in the crown of 54 courses dotted around the UK. Overall, racing is the second-largest spectator sport in Britain, yet it has experienced significant economic challenges recently, from the pandemic to inflationary pressures of the cost of living crisis. I urge the Government to consider ways to encourage racing, which supports 85,000 jobs across mostly small and medium-sized businesses and is a major employer in many areas, including my own former constituencies, the Vale of York, then Thirsk and Malton, providing career opportunities for young people as well as an outlet for leisure, hospitality and tourism.

The role of vets in rural communities is crucial. The veterinary profession is an integral part of the agricultural and food sector, working collaboratively with others to protect animals, people and the environment they share. Vets working across the meat sector underpin the economy, providing value to the £9.1 billion domestic meat industry and the £2.1 billion meat export trade. The vet/farmer relationship is an integral part of any farming team at every stage, from farm to fork, and facilitating trade too. Vets have a health and welfare role to play, not least at auction marts such as that at Thirsk, as well as on the farm.

A strong working relationship across the whole farming team is vital, yet an ongoing issue facing the veterinary sector in rural areas is the veterinary workforce shortage, which I hope that the Minister and the Government will address. The number of qualified vets joining the profession decreased when we left the European Union and it is felt that the new salary threshold will exacerbate the UK veterinary workforce shortage.

I welcome the Minister to her place as the rural communities Minister and ask her to value rural communities, to use the forthcoming spending review to restore the balance in spending in rural areas and to ensure a fairer spend on public services such as health, transport, housing and energy. That will give farmers—the largest sector in the rural economy—certainty and clarity of policy going forward, and ensure that all farmers can prosper and survive, whether they are arable farmers, livestock farmers, tenant farmers, owner-occupier farmers, family farms or larger farms.

Will the Government take the opportunity to create an energy policy that works for everyone, whether living north or south, in an urban or a rural community? I know that, in replying, the Minister will say that her hands are tied by both the forthcoming Budget and the spending review. However, the opportunity must not be lost to ensure a vibrant future for farming, for racing, for market towns and for auction marts, where everybody in rural as well as urban communities can prosper throughout the length and breadth of the land.

Flood Prevention: Farmers

Baroness McIntosh of Pickering Excerpts

Thursday 10th October 2024 Lords Chamber

[Baroness McIntosh of Pickering (Con)]

I congratulate the right reverend Prelate on securing this very important debate, which is very timely given the recent wet weather. I declare my interests in the register. In particular, I am a vice-president of the Association of Drainage Authorities, which encompasses the internal drainage boards.

As the right reverend Prelate said, farmers perform a huge public role producing food and delivering wholesome products domestically, battling the elements as they do so. They can and do face unfair competition from substandard imports and the inability to bid favourably for major contracts with prisons, schools, hospitals and others. However, farms are businesses, and they need to make a profit and have a sustainable business model.

Flood water is retained on farmland, which in turn protects businesses and properties downstream from flooding, yet often this service is neither recognised nor rewarded. Farmers are responsible for keeping the riverbanks on their land free from debris and maintaining the embankments, which act as a flood defence and are often in a state of disrepair. In addition, as members of internal drainage boards in low-lying areas, farmers provide the vital service of maintenance, dredging watercourses and performing flood prevention schemes.

The Environment Agency’s resources, as we know, are spread thinly and do not stretch to cover rural areas on the same basis as urban ones. The issue of maintenance and repair of pumping stations is hugely important as, where flood banks are breached in extreme floods or pumping stations fail, devastation follows for farmland and properties alike. Where farmland floods, thereby protecting other businesses and communities, it is only right that the farmer affected should be recognised for the provision of that public good on his or her land. I am sure that many farmers take a view that, if they were properly compensated for the provision which enables them to remain with a viable business, that would be an acceptable recognition for the service to the community they are providing.

Local authorities in rural areas also have a role to play but we know that their budgets are under great pressure. This is not helped where money for flood defences and prevention is not ring-fenced. Where regular maintenance does not take place, this makes farmland yet more vulnerable to floods. I believe that farmers and organisations such as golf clubs would be open to creating reservoirs on their land but are discouraged from doing so by the prescriptive provisions of the Reservoirs Act 1975. The Flood and Water Management Act 2010 modified that Act to reduce from 25,000 to 10,000 cubic metres the capacity at which a reservoir will be regulated. This should be revisited urgently. If it was reviewed, it would help more reservoirs to be created on farmland and other land, such as golf courses.

Sufficient investment must be made to maintain and manage our river systems. I have long argued that there should be a total budget for flood defence spending—totex—as opposed to conflicting and competing revenue and capital funding spend. This came to light most graphically when there was an enormous row during the flooding on the Somerset Levels some years ago, about whether the moving of a pump on to that land constituted revenue or capital spend. The farmers did not care what it was; they wanted the pump to be on the land to pump the water off the farmland, protecting it and communities downstream. Better use must be made of current budgets by rebalancing spending allocations from the current heavily weighted capital investment choice to a much more balanced approach, favouring revenue funding and the long term, to bring all flood risk assets and rivers back up to good condition.

Farmers have suffered significant challenges in recent years—Covid, the impact of hostilities in Ukraine, higher energy costs, and heavy losses of crops given the sheer scale of floods over the last 18 months. Floods this year have impacted on both arable and livestock farmers alike. As reported in the Yorkshire Post today, what makes the situation so grave and urgent, after weeks and months of flooding and saturated land, is that the impact on food prices is already being felt. The potential consequences for food security and self-sufficiency are significant, as highlighted by the right reverend Prelate. I therefore join his call for action. I press the Minister to confirm that the Government will go ahead with the expanded offer of the farming recovery fund, and to recognise what was always understood: that the public good that farmers perform with flood storage on their farmland will be recognised and receive compensation through the ELM scheme.

Will the Minister review the Reservoirs Act 1975, as amended by the 2010 Act and others, with a view to encouraging more reservoirs to be built on farmland and other areas, such as golf clubs? At present, she must recognise that the duties on landowners of smaller reservoirs are simply too onerous, with responsibilities for inspections and failure in this carrying criminal penalties and convictions for such offences. Finally, will the Minister look at amending the flood defence grant in aid to ensure that farmers and rural communities are treated on a more equal basis with urban areas and receive better protection from future floods?

Water (Special Measures) Bill [HL]

Baroness McIntosh of Pickering Excerpts

2nd reading
Wednesday 9th October 2024 Lords Chamber

[Baroness McIntosh of Pickering (Con)]

I am delighted to follow the noble Lord. I congratulate the Government on bringing forward this Bill so early in the Session and on the ongoing work that the noble Baroness set out in the water sector. I welcome her to her place as she guides her first Bill through this House. I declare my interests as an officer of the APPG on water, as co-author of Bricks and Water reports on various aspects of flooding and water management and as having worked with WICS, the Water Industry Commission for Scotland, for some four or five years to 2015.

The Bill examines the role and powers of the water industry regulators and the responsibility of water companies. The Explanatory Memorandum sets out the legal background to the Bill and refers to a number of previous Acts that are referenced or amended by the Bill. However, there was one glaring omission, that of the Flood and Water Management Act 2010, which set out many of the standards referred to in the Bill—for example, on page 2 of the Bill, standards that relate to the environment.

There are clearly, as my noble friend Lady Browning set out, related issues between the flooding and pollution aspects of the Bill. Others—the noble Baroness, Lady Parminter, in particular—have referenced the need for natural and sustainable solutions and to involve farmers in a constructive way to prevent flooding.

The Pitt review, following the severe floods of 2007, set out a number of recommendations, many of which were included in the 2010 Act, following on from the recognition—for the first time ever—of surface water flooding. Yet two of Pitt’s most consequential amendments were never adopted: first, the mandatory construction of sustainable drainage systems in major developments so as to contain flood water and prevent it mixing with sewage through overflows into the combined sewers; and, secondly, ending the automatic right to connect, which has never happened. This simple measure in and of itself would prevent misconnections, whereby the existing infrastructure simply cannot take the volume of sewage from major new developments, often of four- or five-bedroom homes, with four or five times the amount of sewage coming out of them into inadequate Victorian pipes. The developers and local authorities therefore deem the connections to be safe and refuse to put in appropriate infrastructure to ensure that a safe connection can be made. Were water companies also to have the status of statutory consultees in the planning application process, these misconnections could also be averted.

I therefore urge the Minister to use the passage of this Bill to complete the unfinished business from the Pitt review of 2007 by ending the automatic right to connect, ensuring that developers pay for new connections and mandating developers to construct sustainable drainage systems at the time that a development is built. I shall seek to press the Minister to implement Schedule 3 to the Flood and Water Management Act 2010 without delay, to end the automatic right to connect and to insist on mandatory use of SUDS; otherwise, as the noble Baroness, Lady Parminter, so eloquently pointed out, we will just load more sewage into the watercourses, rivers and seas for the foreseeable future, which is not acceptable.

I would also like the Bill to reflect the impact that the housebuilding programme is having on the ability of water companies to perform their duties under the Bill. The Bill gives the House the opportunity to end the gap in responsibilities between planners, investors and housebuilders and to recognise the responsibility of others, such as highways authorities, which contribute to road surface water run-off entering the combined sewers and storm drains without currently having any responsibility to prevent this form of pollution. That is very costly indeed and is a gap that must be plugged—to coin a phrase.

On Clause 2 and the pollution incident reduction plans, can the Minister say how onerous she expects it will be, in terms of both time and resources, for the water companies to implement them? Will allowance be made through either the existing price review or, more likely, subsequent price reviews for this time and resource factor to be taken into account?

During the passage of the Bill, I hope that we will have the opportunity to consider the role of regulators and comparisons between Ofwat and others such as WICS—the Water Industry Commission for Scotland—particularly as regards customer engagement. I also take note of the fact that Ofwat has only comparatively recently allowed prices to be fixed as part of the quin- quennial review to take account of innovation. Actually, innovation lies at the heart of what the Government are proposing to do in this Bill and the future work that they have set out this afternoon.

Two of the areas in which I believe WICS is very strong in the statutory duties that it performs are promoting the interests of Scottish Water’s customers, including having regard to the interests of current and future customers, and ensuring that customer charges reflect the lowest reasonable overall cost for Scottish Water to deliver Scottish Ministers’ objectives for the water sector. That has in no way compromised the independence of WICS in the way that it operates.

In looking at the level of penalties, I urge the Government to make them proportionate to the offence and the scope and means by which it is actually within the power of the water companies to prevent pollution in the manner in which the Government intend them to be held to account.

Regarding the proposal from the noble Duke, the Duke of Wellington, and others, such as the noble Lord, Lord Cromwell, in support of the idea of establishing one regulator, I remember, in a previous life as a shadow Minister, under the good offices of my noble friend Lord Blencathra, looking at this matter prior to one of the elections—probably the 2005 election. We were going to have “blue water thinking” on scrapping the existing regulators and coming up with one new regulator. So that is the challenge that lies at the door of the current Minister and I wish her extremely well in that regard. We stepped back from that commitment at that time.

There is plenty more to say, and I look forward to saying it in Committee.

Environment and Climate Change Committee Report: An Extraordinary Challenge: Restoring 30 per cent of our Land and Sea by 2030

Baroness McIntosh of Pickering Excerpts

Wednesday 11th September 2024 Grand Committee

[Baroness McIntosh of Pickering (Con)]

I add my voice in welcoming this excellent report and I congratulate the noble Baroness, Lady Parminter, and her committee on it and on securing the debate today. I declare my interests: I sit on the rural interest group of the Church of England Synod, and I am a patron of Upper Teesdale Agricultural Support Services. In upper Teesdale, almost 50% of the farms are tenanted, as they are in North Yorkshire, where I was an MP. As with every area of policy—this is no exception—we need to balance the interest of preserving nature and the natural world with that of those engaged in making a living and running a business in that environment. There is always a danger, which may flow from mapping and monitoring, of setting arbitrary targets that are too prescriptive and threaten that balance, as set out in the report.

I shall take a perhaps more parochial and domestic view than that of my noble friend Lord Goldsmith, whom I congratulate on what he achieved at COP 15. I will look at SSSIs and national parks, where setting planning policies too strictly prevents farmers and businesses, such as tourism and hospitality, from operating freely. The report has an omission, in that it does not reflect on the role of farmers and businesses in this regard, and indeed that of fishermen in protecting and restoring our seas. We must allow them to ply their trade, earn a living and provide food for the country.

Marine life faces a threat from the development and operation of offshore wind farms. We took evidence on this in the previous EU Energy and Environment Sub-Committee, under the excellent chairmanship of the noble Lord, Lord Teverson. I firmly believe that more research needs to be done in this area.

Farmers play a crucial role as custodians of the countryside and are integral to rural communities. Farmers manage 70% of the UK’s land area and must be regarded as key partners in nature conservation. They have faced a plethora of changes in the new schemes in a very short timeframe and, frankly, an IT system that is not fit for purpose. Recognising their contribution to the natural world will encourage and incentivise landowners and tenants alike to increase their engagement in policy. In developing the 30 by 30 policy, we must recognise the role of farmers on the land and ensure that nature conservation, if it is to be successful, is underpinned by a prosperous, economically viable farming sector.

Farmers have faced a major reset of policy since we left the European Union, and the more that environmental programmes such as ELMS and SFI have regard to the public good and allowing farmers to do that work, the better. Farmers need clarity and certainty in that regard going forward. After seven years of specific support under the CAP, farmers need to be able to create a long-term viable business plan.

Will the Minister, who I welcome to her place today, commit to Defra spending the identified underspend of £358 million over three years? Will she ensure that that money is spent not just on nature conservation but in working with farmers to ensure that they are allowed to grow crops and produce food to boost food security, self-sufficiency and increased exports abroad?

The position of tenant farmers has been ably expressed by a number of speakers, notably my noble friend Lady Rock and the noble Earl, Lord Caithness. This issue is particularly key in upland areas and on family farms in SSSI areas; the role of national parks here must be made clearer. In many instances, tenants are simply not able to claim for environmental schemes as they do not own the land on which they farm. I understand from UTASS that some 70 farming families are stuck in agreements at this time; that the agreements are almost 20 years old; that there has been no review of payments; and that those in the schemes have no ability to enter or transfer into SFI or country stewardship schemes. That is unacceptable. I understand that Natural England has a role in this regard, but we have to query whether it has the resources and the time to commit to this matter at this crucial stage.

ELMS has not emerged as the simpler, less complex, easy-to-administer scheme that farmers and the public were promised. That has to change. We must also end this piecemeal approach to reform and have a comprehensive and holistic approach that recognises what works and when. For example, an area that is good for wading birds is simply not suitable for rewilding or tree planting. I endorse entirely what my noble friend Lady Rock has said. It is unacceptable to propose booting a tenant farmer off the land that they have farmed for a generation in north Yorkshire in order to make way for yet another solar farm. That is not the way forward.

In summing up today, will the Minister undertake to consult closely with farmers and farming organisations going forward as the Government create new policy, starting with forthcoming Bills such as the Water (Special Measures) Bill but including—even more importantly—the Budget on 30 October? We must recognise the specific challenges that farmers have faced over the past five years: the fallout from Covid; imperfect supply chains; the higher input costs of energy and fertilisers, with poorer returns and a shortage of labour; and extreme weather, together with major flooding.

I disagree with my noble friend Lord Banner, whom I welcome to his place. I chaired the Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Committee when we did a degree of work looking at how, if we were to dispense with the badger cull, we would have to accept badgers continuing, across the country, to introduce TB into herds that are currently not infected. I urge my noble friend to reconsider his views in this regard; in saying that, I hope not to be attacked by badger lovers, as I have been previously.

I would like to say a word on sites of special scientific interest. As I mentioned previously, I understand that changes to those schemes must be endorsed by Natural England. Does it have the resources? Will the Minister look at this and perhaps write to me afterwards?

Following today’s report, I ask the Minister to set out what is going to change. Will Defra be clearer about how its 30 by 30 ambition links with other policies, including the Environment Act, the protected landscape targets, the land use framework, the local nature recovery strategies, Natural England’s designation programme and national planning policies? Will she ensure that there is an SFI option for upland and moorland to ensure a sustainable future for upland and family farms? Will Defra ensure that farmers and other businesses working in the countryside are able to do their jobs, while enhancing the environment as conservationists at the same time?