National Lottery Reform

Baroness Clark of Kilwinning Excerpts

Thursday 22nd July 2010 Westminster Hall

[John Penrose]

I shall pick up where I left off when we vanished to do our democratic duty in the Lobby. The hon. Member for Kilmarnock and Loudoun had asked whether the Big Lottery Fund was the most efficient of the disbursing organisations. I was saying that nobody is sure which of them is the most efficient, mainly because they all illustrate their figures and report their numbers on slightly different bases. It is therefore difficult to ensure that we are comparing apples with apples when working out what their stated percentage of the funds disbursed is taken up in costs.

To reassure the hon. Lady, I have set the lottery disbursing organisations the challenge of agreeing a common set of reporting standards, so they all show their numbers in the same way, enabling us to make a direct comparison. We then need to ask whether those figures can be reduced and whether we can start to disburse the funds to good causes more efficiently and cheaply, to ensure that more money gets to the front line and reaches the people for whom it is intended.

There may be some legitimate reasons for variation: for example, at the moment the Olympic Lottery Distributor is one of the most efficient because it only has to distribute funds to one organisation, which is comparatively simple, administratively speaking—I am not saying that it is simple all round—whereas Big distributes to a very large number of smaller organisations. There may be legitimate reasons for differentials, but we need clear data, at least, telling us how to compare the distributors and that like-for-like comparisons are safe, and then we need to start looking for ways to reduce costs.

[Katy Clark (North Ayrshire and Arran) (Lab)]

Many small community organisations applying for funding are frustrated because the system is bureaucratic and they require a huge amount of advice and support. Often, mentors are allocated to such organisations to assist them through the process. Are the Government considering simplifying the procedure, particularly for small voluntary organisations seeking support?

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[Katy Clark (North Ayrshire and Arran) (Lab)]

It is a pleasure to have the opportunity to make a contribution to the debate, which is important for our communities and many community organisations. I shall echo some of the points that have already been made. It is only fair to say that there is a great deal of concern that Scotland will see a net overall reduction in funding from the lottery as a result of some of the proposed changes. Will the Minister examine that?

A number of hon. Members from Scottish constituencies are present. That is because in Scotland at the moment there is conversation and discussion about the proposals, and much of its content is that Scotland will fare badly as a result of them. That would be very sad, particularly as there has already been considerable debate in Scotland about the implications of the funding of the Olympics and the withdrawal of funding from Scotland, and many other parts of Britain, as a result of lottery funding being targeted on the Olympics.

I fear that the effect of some of the proposals may be to target funding on more built-up areas, particularly cities and centres where many large institutions are providing arts and other facilities to the community. I say that partly from my experience over the past five years of representing a very rural constituency and working with a wide range of different organisations that have been trying to obtain funding, not just from the lottery, but from other bodies, such as the Scottish Arts Council and a range of other public sector bodies.

Quite often, there is a view that arts institutions in particular should look like the kind of organisation traditionally seen in cities. Therefore, organisations such as the West Kilbride Craft Town in my constituency, and a range of other arts bodies trying to do important work in a more rural environment and in small communities, have found it difficult to get arts funding. That should be looked at, particularly in the light of some of the Government’s proposals.

It is important that rural, poorer, more deprived and working-class areas benefit from the proposals that emerge when the Government decide on the matter. Some powerful points have been made about who buys lottery tickets, and whether those people and their communities are the ones who benefit at the end of the process of lottery allocation. Those arguments may not be made often, but there are important principles that should be taken into account.

As a Member of Parliament since 2005, I have met numerous community organisations and individuals to discuss applications to the Big Lottery Fund, as has practically every constituency MP, I suspect. New Members will have a huge amount of experience of that over time. It is fair to say that my views are anecdotal and probably reflect my constituency. If I represented a different kind of constituency, I would probably make other points, depending on my experience.

I have concerns about the social policy implications of some past policies, which have encouraged institutions in our communities to move into the voluntary and community sectors rather than link with the public sector. I represent an area that was traditionally wealthy, because it was very industrialised, having gone through the industrial revolution early. As a result, we have many small communities with a proud history and impressive buildings, but without the wherewithal to maintain the infrastructure that was developed over time, so old buildings are falling into a great state of disrepair. Almost every community in my constituency has public buildings such as Saltcoats town hall, which is gorgeous but is falling to pieces and boarded up at the moment. Another example is Walker hall in Kilburnie, a town built on industries such as Knox rope, which was sold all over the empire and fuelled the construction of impressive buildings that are not being maintained.

In general, the state has taken over ownership of those buildings. However, because of the way national lottery funds operated in the past it has not been possible to get funding to regenerate them. I am not talking about long-term maintenance because that is a slightly different issue. Pressure has been put on community bodies—for example, voluntary committees that help run those halls—to move into the private and voluntary sectors, so that they can apply for funding. As a matter of public policy, it is appropriate for the national lottery and for Big to provide one-off funding to try to regenerate our communities and buildings of that nature, but that should not involve communities having to take on long-term responsibility for running those institutions, when other parts of the community, such as the council, might be willing to do so. I am concerned about the way in which the funding rules have operated to date, in that they influence the decisions that people make in communities.

I am concerned about the administrative role that local organisations have had to play—the fact that it is necessary to create a business plan when making a relatively small application for funding. People in communities without the skills to present a successful application have to professionalise themselves and put a huge amount of work into making applications. Communities that do not have to hand architects, solicitors and surveyors willing to provide their services free are at a disadvantage. More middle-class communities, where there are individuals who can assist and can present applications, will be at an advantage. No community should have to put a disproportionate amount of trouble into making an application. That is something the Government should look at when they consider the matter.

The approach has partly developed from a very cautious decision-making process because money is involved, and organisations have to account for it to the public and the Government. They want to be careful that grants can be justified and are for viable projects, but that makes it difficult for local communities to make applications.

I echo some of the points made about long-term planning and the fact that there has often been a short-term approach to funding. An early experience I had in my constituency concerned the Three Towns Healthy Living Centre, which was set up partly with the support of lottery funding, to provide preventive health services in the community. Eight such healthy living centres were set up in Scotland in deprived communities. According to those who used and had contact with them, they were very successful. However, they were not the kind of project that the NHS was ever going to take on and at the end of the funding period, they had to wind up. We have seen that again and again with the lottery. That point needs to be taken on board. Is it responsible or realistic to provide funding to set up services on a short-term basis if others—whether in the private or public sector—will not come in to fund those projects? I think it would be acceptable for the lottery to say it will fund such projects on a much longer-term basis and that those decisions should be taken in the long term, rather than the short term. It would be helpful if the Government could look at that.

There is great concern that there may be problems with some proposals, particularly at a time of significant cuts in the arts, museums, culture and, no doubt, many sporting facilities, if Government policy is implemented. Although extra funding for that part of society will be welcome, there is concern—particularly if we are to be living through difficult times—that many community organisations and small projects will lose out, if some of the proposals become reality. I ask for that to be taken on board.