Privilege

Adrian Sanders Excerpts

Tuesday 22nd May 2012 Commons Chamber

[Mr Adrian Sanders (Torbay) (LD)]

I, too, congratulate the hon. Member for Maldon (Mr Whittingdale) on his chairmanship of the Culture, Media and Sport Committee during not just this inquiry but previous ones, including those for which I was a member of the Committee. I also thank members of the Committee past and present, and I thank the members of staff who have supported it for their patience and counsel. It has not necessarily been easy for them.

I will be brief, because much that needed to be said has already been said. I hope that the Standards and Privileges Committee will take into consideration one of the difficulties that the Culture, Media and Sport Committee had, which was that the circumstances were changing week by week as new evidence became available. That may also become a challenge for the Committee chaired by the right hon. Member for Rother Valley (Mr Barron). Ongoing inquiries and investigations may influence its decision making.

The most important issue, as has been mentioned, is the ability of Select Committees to seek out facts and uncover the truth. If there is no penalty for misleading a Committee, it affects our entire Select Committee system. I suspect that that concern lay behind the unanimity of the Culture, Media and Sport Committee on the relevant part of the report. Our experience has highlighted the need for Parliament to consider its powers and the procedures that we follow.

I end with a note of concern, although I fully support the motion. It is that the Standards and Privileges Committee meets in secret, which could be a difficulty. Those who, in our view, have misled the Culture, Media and Sport Committee could seek to challenge anything that the Standards and Privileges Committee does if it meets in secret.

Question put and agreed to.

Resolved,

That this House notes the conclusions set out in chapter 8 of the Eleventh Report from the Culture, Media and Sport Committee, Session 2010-12, on News International and Phone-hacking, HC 903-I and orders that the matter be referred to the Committee on Standards and Privileges.

Privilege

Adrian Sanders Excerpts

Thursday 9th September 2010 Commons Chamber

[Paul Farrelly (Newcastle-under-Lyme) (Lab)]

The issue, which I hope the House will refer to the Standards and Privileges Committee, is about not just crimes committed several years ago but about cover-ups that, to all appearances, are still going on today. I was a member of the Select Committee on Culture, Media and Sport that looked into the affair previously. I drafted many of the conclusions of its report. We tried to penetrate the veil of secrecy over the affair, but we generally met with a wall of silence, with evasion and with collective amnesia. In trying to complete a much larger report before the election, we also had limited practical powers of compulsion. That issue relates to the modernisation of the House, which, if the resolution is passed today, I hope that the Standards and Privileges Committee will also consider. The powers of Select Committees need to be strengthened, and we need look no further than the United States Congress for good examples of how to do that.

Before the House votes, I want to deal with a couple of matters in the report, as well as two matters that keep being repeated, including in the past few days, on which the House might appreciate some clarity. First, regarding the police, the former Assistant Commissioner Andy Hayman has repeatedly told the news that as far as the Met was concerned, it left no stone unturned and interviewed everyone who was relevant at the time. I am afraid that that is simply not true. The police interviewed only Mr Mulcaire and Mr Goodman, despite evidence in their hands that implicated others in the activity, which has clearly affected the confidence with which MPs can go about their business. Mr Mulcaire and Mr Goodman also maintained their right to silence, before entering a guilty plea, so no cross-examination was made. Our report was highly critical of the extent of the police investigation. Frankly, had Mr Hayman been in charge of the Watergate inquiry, President Nixon would have safely served a full term. His line is one that his successor, Assistant Commissioner John Yates, is finding it increasingly difficult to maintain, as new people emerge out of the woodwork, day in, day out, in the press.

Our report was very critical of the evasive display by Mr Yates in giving evidence for the police, and I hope that if the motion is passed, the Standards and Privileges Committee will not allow the police to get away with such evasiveness. As the hon. Member for Bermondsey and Old Southwark (Simon Hughes) has pointed out, nor is the Crown Prosecution Service blameless in the affair. When we asked it to justify how the investigation and prosecution had been carried out previously, it repeated verbatim, to a great extent, the police statements, which were highly misleading.

Secondly, I want to address the claim that our Committee—this has been repeated in the news in the past few days, often for libel balance—found no evidence that the then editor of the News of the World, Andy Coulson, knew about the hacking. That has been taken to mean that we effectively cleared Mr Coulson of knowing what his staff and Mr Mulcaire were up to. Nothing could be further from the truth—this is not a political point but a matter of fact. Frankly, we were incredulous that such a hands-on editor would not have had the slightest inkling about what his staff and private investigators employed by the paper were up to. That activity has clearly interfered with the activities of Members of Parliament. Faced with Mr Coulson’s denial, however, we simply could go no further. As my hon. Friend the Member for West Bromwich East (Mr Watson) has said, others simply declined to be interviewed. To the list that he has had, I would add Mr Neville Thurlbeck, the chief reporter of the News of the World, who offered only to give evidence in private, which we considered unsatisfactory. Would compulsion have been productive? No, because it would have delayed the publication of a report. That is also an issue for the Standards and Privileges Committee to consider. Another reporter who was implicated was on a round-the-world trip at the time.

[Mr Adrian Sanders (Torbay) (LD)]

Some of the issues that the hon. Gentleman raises rather reinforce the view that there might be a justification not just for a Standards and Privileges Committee inquiry but a full judicial inquiry, especially to consider the police’s non-use of powers, which is in itself an abuse of power.

[Mr Deputy Speaker]

Order. We are not debating a judicial inquiry.