Heritage Public Houses Bill
Debate between Adam Jogee and Anna Dixon
Adam Jogee
Certainly not heritage. My hon. Friend is right. The Old Brown Jug did not just play host to my uncle Colin and the Climax Blues Band. It has played host to many a small gig, many a local band and many a young person almost as soulful and tuneful as my hon. Friend, and I feel sure that it will continue to play host to others in the future.
Anna Dixon
One of the pubs in my constituency, the Woolpack in Esholt, was the pub used for the filming of “Emmerdale”, if there are any fans of that show here. Although the building itself may not have huge heritage value, the pub has huge cultural heritage value, which ties in with what my hon. Friend the Member for Hackney South and Shoreditch (Dame Meg Hillier) said. Does he agree that we need to capture that wider cultural heritage value, such as that which the Woolpack in Esholt has for TV fans?
Adam Jogee
I am not sure what it says about me that the minute my hon. Friend said “the Woolpack”, I knew that she was talking about “Emmerdale”, although I suppose in my constituency, the Rovers Return from “Coronation Street” is a bit closer to home. She is right.
As she points out, pubs have played a role in so much of our culture, identity, heritage and history. It is important that we are comprehensive in our assessment and support.
To go back to my—thankfully—ultimately successful selection campaign to be Labour’s candidate in Newcastle-under-Lyme, it was, in many ways, the Jug wot won it. Also on Bridge Street, the Bridge Street Ale House, run by “Grum” Newbury, has an ace Irish music night on a Monday evening, a great quiz on a Tuesday, and good vibes all through the week. I am grateful to “Grum” for all he does to keep our town in the minds of local people looking for a good time, for being a destination that people want to visit, and for holding my feet to the fire on what feels like every day.
The Museum on George Street is a small and mighty tribute to the history of our community, and it is on the road to our southern border with our neighbours in the city of Stoke-on-Trent. Lastly, the Old Bulls Head, just up from my office, is the oldest pub in Newcastle town centre and dates from the 14th century. Only the Old Bulls Head is a listing building, and sadly none of the pubs that I have mentioned, and recommended to the House in the strongest terms, appear to be included on the list of assets of community value. That puts such key parts of our heritage at risk of owners moving on, the selling of local landmarks to developers or other businesses, and the sources of real community spirit being lost for ever. We cannot take risks or let that happen by default.
We must fill in the gaps to keep pubs from being sold off and demolished. Like many in my community, and I suspect like colleagues in their own communities and pubs, I would be devastated to see any of our public houses, and their hard-working staff, forced out of business. I am sure colleagues across the House would agree with that. Pubs old and new are places to learn, to enjoy, to understand, to share, to laugh, to celebrate, to console, to make memories and sometimes, I suspect, also to make mistakes.
Over recess, we were campaigning hard in the Newcastle town by-election, and I am delighted that Labour’s candidate, now Councillor Andy Fox-Hewitt, gained the seat on an 18% swing to the Labour party. With the by-election taking place in our town centre, my team benefited from being close to many of our excellent heritage pubs and waterholes for our post-canvass catch-up and note taking on casework. On more than one occasion we were in one of our historic pubs and enjoyed every moment of it. That election day, October 8 2026, my two Labour predecessors, Baroness Golding and Paul Farrelly, were out campaigning with us and, for old time’s sake, enjoying some of our heritage pubs.
Staffordshire, from my community in the north on the Cheshire and Shropshire borders to that of the hon. Member for Kingswinford and South Staffordshire in the south, on the fringes of the west midlands combined authority, is home to great people. We have a responsibility to protect and preserve the places where people spend time with others and find a real and meaningful community spirit. Everything is relative, however, and many pubs that will appear to be historic to an 18-year-old might feel less so to someone at the other end of the age scale. With that in mind, and with thought to the principles of the Bill and the importance of heritage public houses in my community and up and down the country—including, I am sure, in Bradford—I wish to touch on a number of the other excellent pubs in Newcastle-under-Lyme.
One of the greats is Mellards Bar in our town centre. I wish to give a shout out to all the team and extend my congratulations to them. It has just been named pub, beer and ale venue of the year at the Love Newcastle-under-Lyme Awards held at St Giles church last Friday. Mrs Jogee and I were there and enjoyed it immensely. It was amazing to see an old church—I think it was built in 1873, if not earlier—hosting an awards night. We were sitting in the pews, and there were lots of jokes, as you can imagine. Some people would probably enjoy being able to have a pint while sitting in a pew on a Sunday morning, but we will see whether Reverend Josh allows that to happen. I am delighted to have the opportunity to acknowledge the hard work done by all the team at Mellards, who have got the recognition they deserve.
Adam Jogee
I am enjoying this, as I think has been said by others before. My hon. Friend makes a very important intervention, and he is right.
People can get all manner of refreshments at heritage public houses in all parts of the country. I am not sure what refreshments you would choose if you were having some of the Spelthorne watery custard, Madam Deputy Speaker, but you can certainly get a good, cold pint. You could also get a bitter lemon, which I know was ordered by the former Prime Minister, Mrs Thatcher, when she was at the Rovers Return. My hon. Friend the Member for Shipley (Anna Dixon) has gone, but we have talked about Emmerdale. I remember a clip of Baroness Thatcher at the Rovers Return in which she ordered a bitter lemon. That is just one example of the things people could drink there.
My observation of Mrs Thatcher does not go much further than that—I saw that quizzical look from my hon. Friend the Member for Morecambe and Lunesdale (Lizzi Collinge)—do not worry. There is certainly a range of things. I am surprised that the Conservative party does not want to take a moment to talk about this, because it supposedly believes in choice. The great thing about our heritage pubs is that not only are there so many up and down the country that we can choose to go to, but, when we get there, the choices are infinite.
I am not a cider fan myself, but I wish cider drinkers in Halesowen and other parts of the west midlands very well indeed.
Let me take us back to the Archer in Wolstanton, the Westbury Tavern, the Swan in Betley, the Boat and Horses, and the Sneyd Arms on Higherland—the list goes on and on, as my speech is doing this morning, unfortunately for the hon. Member for Spelthorne. At the end of the day, our pubs are about so much more than somewhere to have a pint, a cuppa, a Coke, a juice, or the many other options that my hon. Friend the Member for Halesowen (Alex Ballinger) has allowed me to reference this morning. They provide an opportunity to see familiar faces and catch up. In other words, they make us feel like we are part of something—a neighbourhood, a village—and it is so important to our collective and individual happiness and wellbeing that that is so. We will all have heard stories from our communities of people who notice that someone has not been at the bar or has not been in recently, and that person is often checked up on. Most of the time, it is for a positive reason, but some of the time it is not, and without the connection and sense of community that pubs provide, people would not be able to do that.
I would like to say a couple more things about how we can support and protect our heritage pubs. The first is by ensuring that our town centres are safe and secure places to travel, to walk and to be in. Local people in Newcastle-under-Lyme are rightly furious that in recent times, antisocial behaviour and criminality have emerged far too frequently around the sunken roundabout and particular hotspots in town. I hope that all the relevant authorities, from borough and county councils to Staffordshire police, get a grip of this situation and ensure that all measures—including those introduced by this Government—are used and used quickly. Our town is a wonderful place to live, learn and work, and we cannot allow it to be blighted by crime and antisocial behaviour, not now and not ever. I am sick and tired of women in Newcastle-under-Lyme telling me that they do not feel safe going into our town; I do not want any woman in my family, or who I represent, to feel that way. We will not successfully protect and defend our heritage pubs if people are not going to spend their money there because they do not feel safe. I hope the relevant authorities have heard me loud and clear.
My second point is about the impact of incompetent decisions taken by local authorities, and what those can mean for celebrating and maintaining the heritage pubs that our towns are home to. Take the current situation on Brook Lane. Our town has essentially come to a standstill at rush hour in recent weeks because Brook Lane has been closed for several weeks, and is scheduled to be closed for several more. I wrote to Staffordshire county council—I suspect that the hon. Member for Kingswinford and South Staffordshire, whose Bill we are debating this morning, shares many of my frustrations with that council. Even if the hon. Member for Spelthorne does not want to hear it, I know that my honourable county colleague will agree with me on this. I wrote to Staffordshire county council on 1 September, and I had to write to it again this week, because no letter has arrived in response to mine.
This is important, because Staffordshire county council has announced that it plans to introduce further road closures on surrounding roads. That is going to compound the situation, and will make it even more difficult for people to get to the Bridge Street Ale House I spoke about earlier, or to the Jug pub, not to mention all the other things that people have to do.
Anna Dixon
We had a similar problem with an accident on the historic bridge close to the historic pub in Harden. That road closure, which lasted for an extended period of time, and those roadworks had a significant impact on people’s ability to get to and from that lovely historic rural pub in my constituency. These disruptions can have a significant economic impact on our heritage pubs, and I agree with my hon. Friend that councils need to do a much better job of speeding up roadworks and getting them completed on time, as well as making sure that they think about the impact on our pubs.
Adam Jogee
My hon. Friend, with whom I almost always agree, is completely correct to point out the frustration caused to businesses and residents of communities, and the impact on the ability of pubs, shops and businesses generally to trade, survive and thrive, as a result of incompetent decisions made by incompetent people. From Shipley to Staffordshire north and south—if I can speak for the hon. Member for Kingswinford and South Staffordshire—we agree.
We cannot support our heritage pubs, nor can we add them to our list of assets, if they no longer operate because of—as my hon. Friend the Member for Shipley has pointed out—stupid decisions resulting from incompetence, or just nonsense from people who should know and do better. Our pubs are places where our communities are formed, and where we share stories of our past and our heritage from generation to generation. If we were to lose them, we would be losing a huge part of our shared history. Our historic public houses each have their own unique character and charm.