Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Clive Efford

Thursday 12th July 2012 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

I am not sure that my hon. Friend has got that one absolutely right. The Wright Committee recommendations make it absolutely clear that the Government have an entitlement to get their business through. My hon. Friend’s suggestion is that the Government’s business should be subjected to a regime that might put at risk the likelihood of the Government getting their Bills through. It was always envisaged that the House would set up a Backbench Business Committee, which we have done, but it was always recognised that the Government should be entitled to get their business through.

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

I will certainly be trying to speak in Monday’s health debate, but I am dismayed that the Leader of the House has not given any notice that the Secretary of State for Health intends to come to the House, because he has issued a written statement today about appointing an administrator for my local healthcare trust. He has met the Conservative Members of Bromley and one of the Conservative Members of Bexley who are affected by the decision all together, but he did not meet the Labour Member who covers a Bexley seat, nor the Labour Members in the borough of Greenwich. That is clear and blatant politicising of the decision. I hope that the Leader of the House will take that back and make it clear that not only is the House unhappy with the Health Secretary’s behaviour, but that it is not appropriate for him to avoid coming to that Dispatch Box having put out blatant misinformation from his Department about the performance of that trust.

[Sir George Young]

The Secretary of State has put the House in the picture by making a written ministerial statement, which is a perfectly appropriate means of communicating Government initiatives. There is a health debate on Monday, where the hon. Gentleman may be able to raise this. I think the issue of meeting Members of Parliament was raised at Prime Minister’s questions yesterday, and I will do as my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister said and make further inquiries to see whether meetings can now take place that have not taken place so far.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Clive Efford

Thursday 1st March 2012 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

My hon. Friend raises an important issue, particularly given the background that he has touched on. I cannot promise a debate in the near future in Government time, but it strikes me as an appropriate subject for a debate on the Adjournment or in Westminster Hall. I am sure that a large number of Members on both sides of the House would like to take part in such a debate.

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

Having said that they would not do so, the Government adopted the previous Labour Government’s 18-week waiting time target for treatment in hospital once somebody has been referred by a GP. The number of people breaching that 18-week period has gone up by 43%. We are now told that people are being bounced off lists and left waiting once they have breached the 18-week point to hide the huge spike in the number of people who have breached it. May we have a debate to expose the Government’s appalling record on that target?

[Sir George Young]

I must gently disagree with the hon. Gentleman. The backlog of over-18-week waiters is going down and the figures for December were the best on record. In the broader context, the average waiting times for in-patients and out-patients before they start treatment are lower than at the time of the last election, and the number of patients waiting for more than a year is half what it was in May 2010.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Clive Efford

Thursday 15th December 2011 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

Regardless of whether the problem is solved, I hope my hon. Friend will continue to fight a large number of elections in Banbury. He will know that one of the first actions we took was to establish the Dilnot commission, which reported in July. There is a commitment to publish a White Paper in the spring, which will outline the Government’s response to the important issues. There have been a number of debates on this important subject, but I would welcome a further one. We inherited a situation in which there were lots of White Papers but no action was taken during 13 years.

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

Can we have a statement from the Leader of the House—or whoever he delegates it to—on how we can hold the Government to account over participation in school sport? We put questions to the Secretary of State at DCMS Question Time this morning, but he refused to answer any about how we are going to monitor participation at school age. The Secretary of State has put £11 million into school games: it was announced by him and it is on his Department’s website, so it is not unreasonable to expect answers to DCMS questions about it. Will the Leader of the House make a statement on who is going to be accountable for answering questions on this subject in future?

[Sir George Young]

That sounds a little like unfinished business from the question and answer session that we have just had. I caught the end of DCMS questions and I thought that my right hon. and hon. Friends were answering questions with their usual competence and accuracy. I will, however, draw the hon. Gentleman’s comments to the attention of my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State to see whether there is anything he wishes to add to what he said a few moments ago.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Clive Efford

Thursday 8th September 2011 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

It is an offence to provide false information to electoral returning officers, and if that happens I hope they would pursue it. As my hon. Friend will know, we are introducing individual electoral registration, which will reduce the opportunity for fraud because people will have to provide some evidence of identity before they are added to the register. I hope that that will reduce the sort of practices to which he refers.

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

Further to the answer that the Leader of the House gave to my right hon. Friend the Member for Warley (Mr Spellar), we know that the moving of the elections of police commissioners to November is going to cost an enormous sum of money. May we have a statement on how the Government reached the decision to make this amendment to the proposal in the Police Reform and Social Responsibility Bill? We are told that that was done to appease Liberal Democrat councillors. If that is how the Government are making decisions and wasting public money, is it not a matter that should be discussed on the Floor of the House?

[Sir George Young]

Of course it is. That is why the Government have tabled an amendment to the Bill that will be debated on Monday.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Clive Efford

Thursday 14th July 2011 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

I am grateful to my hon. Friend. The whole House will want to send its sympathy to the friends and relatives of those who lost their lives in these terrorist atrocities. The Foreign Office consular team is already in Mumbai providing consular support to any British nationals who may have been caught up in these events. We are working very closely with the Indian authorities, and we are committed to working with the Indian Government and our allies to combat the threat from terrorism in all its forms.

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

We have only two sitting days left, and it is important that this House is reported to on the progress of the Leveson inquiry in terms of securing evidence. In response to my right hon. Friend the Member for Kirkcaldy and Cowdenbeath (Mr Brown) on Monday, News International said that if he would give it the details of his complaint, it would investigate it. For us, that is not good enough. It is the police who should carry out that investigation, or the inquiry. All the information should be made available and secured now. We need a statement before the recess in order to understand what progress is being made on securing that evidence.

[Sir George Young]

The Prime Minister dealt with this in his statement yesterday. It is a criminal offence to destroy documents when a criminal investigation is under way.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Clive Efford

Monday 4th July 2011 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

If the right hon. Gentleman looks at Hansard for last Thursday, he will see the timeline outlined by the Minister for Policing and Criminal Justice. Ministers were told on 24 June.

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

I have Hansard for last Thursday, and the Minister made it quite clear that the original decision was on 5 April and that a judicial review gave oral confirmation of that decision on 19 May. Can the Leader of the House say whether he was alerted, after 19 May, to the possibility of the need to legislate on the Floor of the House to reverse that decision?

[Sir George Young]

This is rehearsing to some extent the arguments that were dealt with on Thursday. As my right hon. Friend the Minister said on Thursday, we had to wait for the written judgment to follow the oral one.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Clive Efford

Thursday 12th May 2011 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

The reason that I pause is that I am not sure whether responsibility for salmon is a devolved matter—[Interruption.] It is devolved; I see a nod from the Opposition Benches. Sadly, therefore, I cannot organise a debate on salmon in Scotland, but my hon. Friend has drawn attention to a more generic point about resources flowing from Westminster to the north. Perhaps there will be an opportunity to debate that when the Scotland Bill returns.

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

May we have a debate on the coalition agreement? I think that the country has a right to know exactly what state that document is now in. The Health and Social Care Bill is now at a pausing, listening and reflecting stage, the Police Reform and Social Responsibility Bill was severely reformed by the Lords last night and, on Tuesday, we had the debacle of the statement on off-quota higher education places. If the coalition document were brought to the Floor of the House, both Government parties could table amendments to it and we could debate in public exactly what is happening to the agreement and understand it in greater detail.

[Sir George Young]

On the various issues, we had a debate on the national health service on Monday, and I indicated a few moments ago that we would be seeking to reverse the decision of the House of Lords on the Police Reform and Social Responsibility Bill. The coalition is in good shape; we are getting on with strong, decisive, united government, which is what this country needs.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Clive Efford

Thursday 5th May 2011 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

The Government would welcome with open arms any opportunity to debate the successes. My hon. Friend reminds the House that 1.1 million people have been taken right out of tax and that a number of other measures have been introduced—for example, to safeguard the interests of those who have retired with a triple lock on pensions, and the other measures announced in the Budget. We had an opportunity in the two days that we spent on the Finance (No. 3) Bill to talk about some of those issues, but if we can arrange it, I would welcome any opportunity to continue with that agenda. I remind the House that we are still paying £120 million a day in interest on the debt that we inherited from the outgoing Government.

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

Will we have a statement following the outcome of today’s referendum? Even before the polls have closed, the Deputy Prime Minister is under attack for breaking yet another pledge. He said that he would not get involved in the yes campaign, but when he saw it ahead in the polls he became involved, and it suffered from dead Clegg bounce—and now it looks as if it will not succeed today. So can we have a statement—and can it be made by the Deputy Prime Minister, because we really want to take in earnest whatever is said from the Dispatch Box?

[Sir George Young]

The best answer I can give the hon. Gentleman is that the Government have no plans to make a statement on the outcome of today’s elections.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Clive Efford

Thursday 10th March 2011 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

A convention has developed in the House that before troops are committed, the House should have an opportunity to debate the matter. We propose to observe that convention except when there is an emergency and such action would not be appropriate. As with the Iraq war and other events, we propose to give the House the opportunity to debate the matter before troops are committed.

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

May we have a debate as part of the consultation on the Government’s Green Paper on special educational needs and disabilities? There is widespread concern that the cuts imposed by the coalition on local authorities will reduce the money available to parents to control budgets. If there is no money in the budgets, there is no control for parents and that will be nothing but a con trick on them. We need to have a debate in the House so we can represent our constituents’ views.

[Sir George Young]

I welcome yesterday’s publication of the consultation document. The consultation will take place over four months. I emphasise that it is not a cost-cutting exercise; it is about having a much better regime for children who need support in schools and about giving parents more of a say. Crucially, it is about bringing together health, education and care in one package and, we hope, having a more user-friendly, streamlined approach than we have at the moment. I would welcome a debate on the SEN statement. That might be an appropriate issue for the Backbench Business Committee to consider or for debate in Westminster Hall. Yesterday’s announcement was warmly welcomed by those who take an interest in this issue and recognise the need for reform.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Clive Efford

Thursday 13th January 2011 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

We made a commitment that the previous Government refused to make, namely to introduce a House business committee within three years of this Parliament. I want to evaluate the work of the Backbench Business Committee at the end of its first year and then to take forward the discussions on how we might roll that into a House business committee that would embrace both the Backbench Business Committee and the Government business managers.

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

May we have a statement from the Secretary of State for Transport on readiness for future spells of severe cold weather, snow and ice? We had the report from David Quarmby, published on 21 December, on the response to the previous spell of cold weather. My constituents suffered chaos on Network South East during the recent period of bad weather, and it is right that this House should hear a statement on what the Government are doing to ensure that we do not have that chaos again in future.

[Sir George Young]

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman. He will know that the Secretary of State made a statement just before we rose for the Christmas recess. The country is, I think, in a much more resilient position this winter than in the past couple of years, but we are not complacent. The Secretary of State, in a written statement on 21 December, informed the House of the publication of the report to which the hon. Gentleman just referred. The Secretary of State undertook, on behalf of his Department, to do further work on how well highways authorities and transport operators in England coped with the cold weather between 24 November and 9 December. I cannot promise a statement, but I know that the Secretary of State will want to keep the House informed.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Clive Efford

Thursday 16th December 2010 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

Like my hon. Friend, I welcome the commencement of oil production in Ghana. I hope very much that the revenue will be used for the benefit of all the citizens of that country, and will be managed with a view to Ghana’s future prosperity.

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

I am sure that the right hon. Gentleman would not wish to disfranchise students in the Oldham East and Saddleworth by-election. Will he join me in encouraging the relevant Secretary of State to make a statement to the House today, so that, before the Christmas holidays, students are made aware that they can register for postal votes in that by-election?

[Sir George Young]

If the hon. Gentleman was worried about the timing of the by-election, he could have registered his objection an hour ago when he had an opportunity to do so. He did not, and we heard earlier that Labour Members wanted to “bring it on”. No one has been disfranchised.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Clive Efford

Thursday 2nd December 2010 Commons Chamber

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

In the light of some of the exposures on WikiLeaks, may we have a debate on the 22 days when the coalition was formed? May I make the helpful suggestion to the right hon. Gentleman that perhaps we should set aside the Standing Orders of the House and have Mervyn King lead the debate on behalf of the Government? In that way, we could at least hold to account someone who played a major role in forming the coalition Government.

[Sir George Young]

The hon. Gentleman said that that would be a helpful suggestion, but I am not sure that I agree with him.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Clive Efford

Thursday 25th November 2010 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

That question is slightly beyond my pay grade, but my hon. Friend has made a strong case for a debate on rural broadband. I too represent a rural constituency, and I know that it is vital for those who live in rural areas to be able to compete on the same terms as those in towns and cities. I think that the issue is a strong candidate for a debate, but perhaps not in Government time.

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

May I ask the right hon. Gentleman to reconsider his answers to my right hon. Friend the Member for Leeds Central (Hilary Benn), the shadow Leader of the House, and my hon. Friend the. Member for Aberdeen North (Mr Doran) on the subject of debates set up by the Backbench Business Committee? The Committee’s Standing Orders make no reference to the Committee’s having responsibility for those debates. A dangerous precedent is being set, because those on the Opposition Front Bench who are responsible for holding the Government to account cannot do so. The Government have avoided arranging the debates in Government time and Opposition Front Benchers cannot make representations to the Backbench Business Committee. The Government are thus dodging the issue. May we have those debates in Government time?

[Sir George Young]

Labour Members must make it absolutely clear at some point whether or not they agree with the Wright Committee’s recommendations. They supported them throughout the last Parliament, although towards the end of that Parliament they did not implement them by setting up the Backbench Business Committee.

If the hon. Gentleman reads the Wright Committee’s report, he will see that it makes a distinction between Government business and House business, and makes it clear that the debates to which he has referred are House business. It is up to the Backbench Business Committee, which has been allotted 35 days, to find time for those debates—if it wants to hold them—in competition with other bids. We cannot allow a position in which the Government, having allotted 35 days to the Backbench Business Committee, are then held responsible for all the subjects included in the transfer.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Clive Efford

Thursday 4th November 2010 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

The hon. Gentleman raises a serious issue. The coalition Government intend to introduce, during this Session, a draft Bill to address that matter.

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

The Leader of the House is held in high regard on both sides of the House and by all parties. As someone who holds the rights of the House in high esteem, does he share my eagerness to see information that has been given to the House corrected by the Secretary of State for Health? In Tuesday’s Health questions, the Secretary of State said that spending on the national health service will increase in real terms even if the social care budget given to local authorities is removed, but the Library and the Nuffield Trust have both stated that that is incorrect. Can the Leader of the House arrange for the Secretary of State to return to the House to correct that misinformation?

[Sir George Young]

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for the kind words that prefaced his question. I shall raise with the Secretary of State for Health the point that the hon. Gentleman has made, implying that information was incorrectly given to the House, and I am sure that my right hon. Friend will take appropriate action when he has read this morning’s Hansard.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Clive Efford

Thursday 21st October 2010 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

My hon. Friend introduced a ten-minute rule Bill on Tuesday proposing the abolition of the Whips Office. I am not sure that it was an intelligent career move. The notion of confirmatory hearings for Cabinet Ministers is a novel constitutional innovation, because responsibility currently rests with the Prime Minister. Whether he would want to share it with my hon. Friend and others is a matter for him, so on this particular issue my hon. Friend will just have to hold his breath.

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

The Leader of the House must understand that the comprehensive spending review is unprecedented. It will make 500,000 public sector workers unemployed, cut investment in housing by half and make families pay more towards cutting the deficit than the bankers who created the problem in the first place and who still pay themselves excessive bonuses. We need extra time to scrutinise all that, and Opposition Back Benchers need to be able to hold the Government to account for what they are doing right across the public sector as a result of the comprehensive spending review. Comparing the situation with what the previous Government did will not wash. We need more time to discuss the CSR, in Government time.

[Sir George Young]

The hon. Gentleman should read what the Wright Committee report said about debates on spending reviews. It made it absolutely clear that they were a matter for the House.

I simply do not agree with what the hon. Gentleman says about who will pay for the CSR. For the first time, we have produced and published distributional analyses of the impact of the spending review. They show clearly that those with the highest incomes will shoulder the greatest burden, and rightly so. It is not the case that families with children will pay more than twice the amount that banks are being asked to contribute. The child tax credit provision introduced yesterday will protect the least well-off families. I do not accept the hon. Gentleman’s premise, but he will have an opportunity to debate the matter in the time that we have made available to debate the CSR, which strictly speaking we need not have. My right hon. and hon. Friends will rebut all his propositions.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Clive Efford

Thursday 22nd July 2010 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

I am grateful to my hon. Friend for making that point. I will contact the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions to see whether my hon. Friend and the House can be given the relevant information before we rise on Tuesday.

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

The duty of the Leader of the House is to protect the interests of the House. When we have asked questions of Ministers at the Dispatch Box we have been labouring under the misapprehension that they have actually been speaking on behalf of the Government. Yesterday, we heard the statement from the Deputy Prime Minister which, it was later said, was a personal statement or a statement of Liberal Democrat policy. Will the Leader of the House make a statement about how we are to determine who is answering questions on behalf of whom on the Government Benches? While doing that, will he consider the suggestion that there should be a dress code for the Liberal Democrats? They should wear blue down one side and yellow down the other, so that when they turn the yellow side towards the Dispatch Box we know who is talking and when they turn their blue side towards it we know that they are speaking for the Tory Government. What we need to know is what—

[Mr Speaker]

Order. The hon. Gentleman has made his point very forcefully.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Clive Efford

Thursday 8th July 2010 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

On the narrow issue of privilege, that is a matter for Mr Speaker. My hon. Friend will know the procedure that needs to be gone through if anyone asserted there had been a breach of privilege, but may I also say the following to my hon. Friend? Earlier this week for the first time we had a seriously late-night sitting against the background of the new constraints imposed on the House by IPSA. I am aware that a large number of hon. Members were seriously inconvenienced by what happened, and that is something that I and others propose to pursue in a dialogue with IPSA.

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

May we have a debate in Government time on capital allocations following the Building Schools for the Future announcements, and possibly for two days, given how many hon. Members would wish to raise issues relating to their local schools? The list that was published yesterday still contains numerous errors in the Greenwich schools listed. A “Broadoak” school is listed as “Unaffected”—that is hardly surprising, given that it does not exist. The “University Technical College” is linked with Eltham Hill school, but Eltham Hill school is also listed separately. The Business Academy Bexley, which opened six years ago, the St Paul’s academy, which opened in January, and Charlton special school, which opened in September 2008, are also all on this list. What criteria were used to produce this list? It is arbitrary. What account has been taken of the capital needs that will have to be met, such as essential repairs and improvements to electrics? If we do not have a debate, how can we get to the detail of what has produced this list?

[Sir George Young]

I will of course raise with the Secretary of State for Education the hon. Gentleman’s specific points about the accuracy of the list, but that contrasts with the need for the list. That need was set out in some detail on Monday, and Labour Members have not explained in any way where they would have found the resources necessary if they had wanted to go ahead with the BSF programme.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Clive Efford

Thursday 10th June 2010 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

That, if I may say so, is a distortion of what I said. I said that the coalition Government have made a proposal, which is in the coalition agreement. That proposal cannot reach the statute book unless it goes through both Houses. Before it can do that, it is clear that there needs to be a serious debate about the pros and cons. I have taken on board requests for a debate before we make progress, and I will try to respond to them.

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

I listened with interest to the Leader of the House when he responded to my right hon. Friend the Member for Doncaster Central (Ms Winterton) about Short money and the proposals made by the hon. Member for Bermondsey and Old Southwark (Simon Hughes), the new deputy leader of the Liberal party. However, may we have a debate about the seating arrangements in the Chamber, as some of us remain concerned that although the Liberal party is a signatory to the coalition document, its Members want the right to set out statements against certain policies, for example on nuclear power, and to make a principled abstention? As a precursor to that debate, may I suggest that we build a fence down the middle of the Chamber so that when the Liberals are sitting on it, we can at least see that they are doing so?

[Sir George Young]

I am delighted with the new seating arrangements and so are my hon. Friends. May I amplify what I said earlier about Short money? It is for the Clerk of the House, as accounting officer, to ensure that Short money payments are made in accordance with resolutions of the House. As for the voting record, the hon. Gentleman will find that Members of the last Parliament who sat on the Government side of the House very occasionally voted against the Government.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Clive Efford

Thursday 27th May 2010 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

I am grateful to my hon. Friend for taking such an interest in the speeches I have made in the past. It is certainly the Government’s intention not to guillotine Bills automatically in the way that the previous Government did, and to allow adequate opportunity for debate.

On Parliament square, we need to strike the right balance between, on the one hand, the right to protest and, on the other, the conservation of a very important site, right in the middle of the capital, next to Westminster abbey and the Houses of Parliament. In my view, the balance at the moment is not right. The House will know that the Mayor of London is seeking to enforce the byelaw under the Greater London Authority Act 1999, under which it is an offence to erect tents or other paraphernalia without permission of the Mayor, so I hope we can come up with the right balance. People should protest there but they do not have to live there all the time and create what is becoming a shanty town, which does not do credit to the environment in which Parliament square is located.

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

May we have a debate to define “affordable” or “social” housing? In answer to my hon. Friend the Member for Lewisham East (Heidi Alexander), the right hon. Gentleman referred to a commitment to build social housing, but he was asked specifically about council house building, so can we have some answers from the Government on whether they will renege on the commitment to build council housing?

[Sir George Young]

Those in housing need do not mind whether it is the council or a registered social landlord who provides their home. What they want is a home, and it is a fact that, for a given amount of money, one can build more homes if the money goes through registered social landlords than if it goes to the local authority. So, I would not go along with the hon. Gentleman in endorsing the idea that such housing has to be council housing. What is needed is affordable, social housing, whoever provides it.