British Indian Ocean Territory: Negotiations
Lord Naseby Excerpts(2 months, 1 week ago)
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Baroness Chapman of Darlington (Lab)
I have been disappointed, as I said in my earlier remarks. We would not have played political games with the sovereignty of our overseas territories, but we have been able to offer the reassurances that were needed. We have been in close contact with the Governments in both Gibraltar and the Falklands, and I think they understand what is really going on here. I hope we have been able to offer the assurances that the noble Baroness refers to.
Lord Naseby (Con)
My Lords, in relation to the lease, will His Majesty’s Government bear in mind that Gan, in the Maldives, is a vital defence dimension, as is Hambantota, in Sri Lanka? Those are both owned, in a sense, by the Chinese, and it is a very dangerous situation if the lease can be broken at any point.
Baroness Chapman of Darlington (Lab)
One of the reasons that it took so long to get this deal over the line was because of concerns such as that, and wanting to make sure that the 99 years are fixed and firm, and it is never up for question in the way that the noble Lord describes. He is quite right to raise those concerns.
Global Combat Air Programme International Government Organisation (Immunities and Privileges) Order 2024
Lord Naseby Excerpts(4 months, 3 weeks ago)
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Lord Naseby (Con)
My Lords, as the House knows, I had the privilege of being an RAF jet pilot. This programme is absolutely fundamental to air power, which, ultimately, in the modern world, is almost more important—some would say more important—than feet on the ground.
I will not repeat what my colleagues have said but will just say, “Well done”. It has been only two sitting days since we discussed defence issues. I took part in that really good debate, when it was made clear across the House that this particular project is fundamental to the future defence of our nation. I thank the noble Baroness on the Front Bench—and welcome her to that role—for moving with speed. I had the privilege of being a Deputy Speaker down the other end, so am willing to help with the proceedings on this important project.
I have worked with the Japanese in the past and believe that they are very efficient. That is a blessing in itself and I would not extend this programme beyond the three parties involved. I wish the Government all possible speed. We know that our friend, the noble Lord, Lord Robertson, is very much behind this as well.
Baroness Smith of Newnham (LD)
My Lords, I have an advantage—or disadvantage—on these Benches because, as often with debates on defence, there is nobody behind me on the Back Benches to say anything different from what I may be or had been planning to say.
As other noble Lords have, I welcome the noble Baroness, Lady Chapman, to her place. I am speaking as the defence spokesperson for the Liberal Democrats, even though this SI is being brought forward via the FCDO, precisely because we felt that this is a critical defence issue. Obviously, the interplay of defence and foreign policy is vital.
I listened to much of the debate in the other place about the GCAP arrangements. I think that GCAP has the huge advantage that we can probably all pronounce it, as opposed to GIGO and its alternative pronunciations. I will focus on GCAP.
I had the huge benefit of listening to the passion right across the other place for this commitment to the trilateral relationship with Japan and Italy. Much of the discussion here has been about the relationship with Japan, which is clearly very important to the Japanese. Over the last couple of years, the Japanese embassy has been regularly coming to Liberal Democrat conferences. Before other embassies remembered that we existed, the Japanese ambassador and his colleagues were coming to talk to us. The bilateral relationship with Japan and the relationship on this specifically are hugely important. Last week, the noble Lord, Lord Coaker, was keen to reiterate the commitment of His Majesty’s Government to GCAP, which was very reassuring to your Lordships’ House.
Today, we are obviously supposed to be focusing on the statutory instrument. I have a couple of very specific questions I want to raise. I note that there is no impact assessment, and the reason given for that is that no impact, or no significant impact, is foreseen on the private, voluntary or public sectors in the UK. I wonder why not. What would count as significant? Surely one of the benefits of the Tempest programme is precisely that it is intended to have a significant impact on our defence capability. Presumably, this is simply the language of a statutory instrument.
In particular, it was noted that there would not be a significant impact on small businesses or micro-businesses. I raised this in the humble Address debate last week, with the noble Lord, Lord Coaker. The question was about the role of small and medium-sized enterprises. Clearly, if this is about defence investment and defence research and development, there is a potentially significant role for small, medium and even micro-businesses in the United Kingdom. What do His Majesty’s Government think are the possibilities for those small businesses and micro-businesses?
I declare an interest—not, unlike other noble Lords, an Anglo-Japanese interest—as I am a trustee of the Armed Forces Parliamentary Trust, which organises the Armed Forces Parliamentary Scheme. It is essentially funded by the defence industries and, given that some of the primes were mentioned by the Minister, I thought I should reflect that as a declaration of interest, although I do not benefit personally.
In addition to wanting a better understanding of the impact on our defence industrial base, I also want to ask a few questions related to those from the noble Lord, Lord Liddle, on the Labour Back Benches. This is not because I disagree in any way with the proposals here, but in order to get a little more information. Whether somebody was trying to tease the United Kingdom Government in drafting this convention, I am not sure. If we ever wanted to rejoin the European Union, we would be doing so under Article 49. It would appear that, if any country is looking to sign up to this convention, it is under Article 49. There are some provisions under Article 48 and 49 looking at the possibility of expansion. What is His Majesty’s Government’s thinking about the possibility of expansion? The wording seems to be slightly vague at the moment. It is down to the steering committee of the GIGO to decide whether other countries can discuss possible membership. If a third-party country decided it wished to join, would that have to come to the United Kingdom Parliament to be ratified, or is it down to the steering committee, which would not appear to be right? A greater understanding about that would be welcome.
Similarly, under Article 50, about defence exports, what are the mechanisms likely to be if one of the current parties has an arms export ban to a certain country? How is that going to work in terms of dealing with the GCAP?
Finally, there does not appear to be any provision for regular reporting, other than back to the MoD and the FCDO. Will there be a way for Parliament to be updated on these arrangements? These are very much by way of probing questions and not in any way speaking against the statutory instrument and the convention, which are most welcome.
Low and Middle-income Countries: Debt Restructuring
Lord Naseby Excerpts(9 months, 1 week ago)
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Lord Cameron of Chipping Norton (Con)
It is very important that we provide alternatives to finance so that Commonwealth and other countries have a choice. I am very proud of the work I did to set up the Caribbean infrastructure fund, for instance, and we are looking again at whether we can refresh and renew that. We are also trying to get the multilateral development banks to expand their balance sheets and lend more to poorer countries. These are ways in which we can offer countries alternatives to Chinese finance in the way that he suggests.
Lord Naseby (Con)
My Lords, should we not look at the recent example of Sri Lanka, which decided that it had to seek the help of the IMF? The IMF responded speedily, but the problem was the private creditors and the time that took. Is there not a case for perhaps the IMF to produce some dimension whereby there is a structure that all private creditors can use, or be advised to use, so that a speedy decision is made for the benefit of the poor people who are suffering?
Lord Cameron of Chipping Norton (Con)
If bonds are the form of lending, there are collective action clauses that can prevent private sector hold-outs. With loans, you have these majority voting provisions so that a group of private investors cannot hold up the resolution of those debts. That is the right way forward. On Sri Lanka, we welcome the official creditor group deal that was reached on 29 November 2023; the bondholder committee is currently in negotiations with the Government of Sri Lanka. We do not comment on ongoing restructuring programmes, but we hope that a deal will be arranged soon.
Foreign Affairs
Lord Naseby Excerpts(9 months, 2 weeks ago)
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Lord Naseby (Con)
My Lords, I start my contribution by saying a huge thank you to my two colleagues on the Front Bench and their families. The amount of travel they have undertaken, and the commitment they have shown, is an example to all of us, and in particular to some other countries around the world.
Just under a year ago, I brought a big debate to this very Chamber, the title of which was
“Climate change in developing countries”.
That arose from a UN report, the final part of which said that the cash flows to help developing countries cut their emissions must be raised by six times their current levels. I gave a number of examples.
One example I gave was the Falklands and the situation there. I know my noble friend the Foreign Secretary has been there recently. In fact, I read in the Independent that he stated that
“if they can responsibly extract hydrocarbons”—
which is a project called Sea Lion—
“that can be part of that zero because of course we’re still going to need oil and gas in the short term while we transition. I think that’s an important point to make. It’s net zero, not zero”.
So there is this new project, and I hope my noble friend will influence his colleagues in Cabinet to give some moral and sort of financial backing, as final lender if necessary, for that imaginative project.
Secondly, there is the Caribbean, which views with great care and worry the annual hurricane season. I declare an interest: I have family in the Cayman Islands. It is pretty devastating when it hits. My understanding is that we now provide and pay for some special resources to Antigua and Barbuda, Jamaica, and Saint Lucia through a gentleman or woman called the climate adviser. But my question to my noble friend is: why is that not extended to the Cayman Islands, the Turks and Caicos, and Bermuda, which equally suffer from these difficult hurricanes?
I will move on to a country I know probably better than any other. I served there in 1963 for the Reckitt & Colman Group, and I started the all-party parliamentary group. Of course, I refer to Sri Lanka, a country that has faced incredible problems. On the climate side, the tsunami hit Sri Lanka and the Maldives really hard. I remember my wife and I watching it on Boxing Day and, a few days later, we were out there trying to help them deal with that problem. Over 1,000 people were killed on one railway because of the tsunami. Huge numbers were killed.
The country has been through massive difficulties, some of them of their own making and some of them not—but it does not matter: it is an important part of the Commonwealth. I thank our Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Office for the way it has stood by it, questioning it very hard at times. But, underneath, the Sri Lankans know that they are part of the same family.
Two things are happening now. There is the talk—and, more than talk, work being done—on a truth and reconciliation commission. In my judgment, that is to be greatly welcomed. I reflect on the late Sir Desmond de Silva, a great lawyer, as evidence that the quality of lawyer in Sri Lanka is second to none. As it is set up, it will of course be across the ethnic groups—it has to be. There are people there who are thoroughly objective.
There is still one challenge: that country lives by good tourism. It is recovering now, but one element that is missing is those who are 75 and over. They are, on the whole, British citizens. It is the FCDO comments on that country that currently cause me concern because they refer to the fact that protests are going on when they are not. They say that there is a fuel shortage, but there is not and has not been for 18 months. They also say that there are other difficulties of a terrorist nature, which we have not had for five years. So can my noble friend look at that guidance? It helps that particular age group because, at least from surveys that have been done, 80% of it looks at that guidance. Perhaps I could bring a couple of people from the newly set-up Experience Travel Group, which is private sector, to perhaps talk to a junior Minister about amending that.
Developing World: Debt Reduction
Lord Naseby Excerpts(10 months, 1 week ago)
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Lord Cameron of Chipping Norton (Con)
I think that the noble Lord refers to what was agreed at the G8 in Northern Ireland in 2013, where a whole series of steps forward were made to make sure that companies were not doing what is known as base erosion and profit shifting and not paying their taxes in countries where they should. To be fair to the former Prime Minister, who is now the Foreign Secretary, we did make some progress, and I think the OECD would say that it has made a lot of progress, but I will certainly check up on the noble Lord’s point.
Lord Naseby (Con)
On the question of Sri Lanka, will my noble friend recognise the way in which Her Majesty’s Government, to whom I give particular thanks, through the IMF, were very firm to the Government of Sri Lanka about what they should do? The Sri Lankan Government responded, which means that the people of Sri Lanka can now move forward. I believe that that is as good a case history as we will find in recent times.
Lord Cameron of Chipping Norton (Con)
My noble friend is absolutely right that Sri Lanka is in debt distress; it has been working through a programme with the IMF. We wish the new Government in Sri Lanka well as they go through this and try to make sure that they can build a brighter future for that country.
Latin America
Lord Naseby Excerpts(1 year ago)
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Lord Naseby (Con)
My Lords, the House is truly indebted to my noble friend. There is nobody that I am aware of, in either House, who has the depth of knowledge that she has—and not just the knowledge but the knowledge put to good use. My noble friend the Minister knows that I have a very long association with South Asia going back about 70 years, but I am a relative newcomer to this region of the world. It started because the revered late Speaker in the other place, Betty Boothroyd, asked me in the summer of 1992 to lead a delegation on behalf of Parliament to go to Stanley and pay our respects to the losses we suffered, but the joy that the Falklands remained in our friendship and part of our Commonwealth.
I went, and that began to open my eyes, quite frankly. It is an incredible part of the world. A year later, my wife and I went on a vacation to Antarctica, visiting the research stations there and looking at the sheer beauty of that part of the world, but also the extent of the ice shelf and the then not really understood challenges associated with that. For myself, unfortunately I lost my seat in 1997, the marginal seat of Northampton, having been its first-ever Conservative Member. I said to my beloved, “We are both interested in wine; why don’t you go and find somewhere in the world, in the new world, where wine is important in the country?” She came back and said, “Right: I have found a small travel agent who will take three couples, and we are all going to Chile”. So, we went to Chile. Obviously, I went and saw the ambassador beforehand, and said we were going. Remarkably, when we went through passport control, the first words said to me in Chile were, “You are enormously welcome in my country”. You do not often get that at passport control elsewhere in the world.
Out of that, I led another delegation a couple of years later and I discussed with the then Chilean Ambassador that I was already a member of the Ordre Des Coteaux De Champagne and the Commanderie de Bordeaux a Londres. I said, “How would you feel if I tried to start a Chilean wine group?” I did not know that he was a master of wine when I asked him that, and the answer was very positive. I started the Cofradía del vino Chileno and we celebrated last evening, at the Caledonian club, with 54 people, the majority of whom are Chileans who are over here. But there is a good core of British people there and we thoroughly enjoyed one of Chile’s leading houses, Montes, and there were about half a dozen others.
When I first went to Chile, there were really no leading houses as such. One of the great jobs done by the Chileans, in our country, was to recognise that the original wines that came here were pretty bog standard—they were ordinary table wines. Today some of the finest wines we taste, particularly on a blind-tasting basis, come from Chile. That is how I lost my heart to Chile.
As it happens, 2023 is the 200th anniversary of the appointment of Great Britain’s first consul-general to Chile, in1823, which is auspicious in itself. I am so pleased that our Foreign Secretary made such a challenging speech in Chile, trying to say to the world that the countries of South America need to be more greatly involved in what is happening in the world. It was an outstanding and timely speech, and it was a huge help. There is another, practical side, which will help a bit. There was a 9% increase in bilateral trade between the UK and Chile in 2022. We now have a UK-Chile modernisation roadmap and have also agreed a memorandum of understanding on the development of the financial sector. Both those should boost international bilateral trade.
Chile itself has shown initiative by joining the Comprehensive and Progressive Agreement for Trans-Pacific Partnership, otherwise known as CPTPP. Thanks to my noble friend and his team on the Front Bench we were the first European country to join the organisation. That is real initiative, so well done. What will that do? It will reduce red tape for trade between Chile and the UK, simplify the import-export process, reduce tariffs on imported goods and could—and should—lead to cheaper prices for some consumer products we get here in Britain, such as fruit juices.
There are opportunities there, and I think they are very exciting. In addition, I understand we have pledged £2 million to support academic exchanges and capacity-building projects in the lithium industry, which is pretty important to the future of the electric vehicle industry. Also, I am very pleased that we are building a scholarship programme for outstanding students. On the educational front, in which I am involved, it could extend a little further into the younger age groups.
In October 2023, a few weeks ago, the UK and Chile signed a renewed partnership agreement on Antarctica. We must just reflect on where the Falklands are in relation to there.
I just make one plea. We have no ambassador from Chile here at the moment. I urge my noble friend the Minister to say to the Chileans that we want to work with them, and we believe in what they are trying to do: could they please send us another ambassador, because the ambassador provides the leadership? It is okay at the moment, but I would hope that early in the new year we will see a new ambassador. The last one was female; the one before was male. I do not mind who they are: I just want them to come over here and join this very exciting country and the development it does. How good it was to go to Richmond upon Thames, a few months ago, to see the monument to Bernardo O’Higgins, who gave them independence, and resided in Richmond upon Thames.
Climate Change in Developing Countries
Lord Naseby Excerpts(1 year, 8 months ago)
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Lord Naseby
To ask His Majesty’s Government what plans they have to introduce new economic policies to address the challenges of climate change in developing countries, particularly those that are members of the Commonwealth.
Lord Naseby (Con)
My Lords, earlier this month the United Nations launched its latest global warming report, claiming that there needs to be a cut of 80% in CO2 emissions by 2040 in order to limit warming to 1.5 degrees centigrade. If it should go beyond 1.5 degrees centigrade, the impact of heatwaves, drought and sea level rises will become significantly more extreme. That report, compiled by 93 of the world’s top climate scientists, was approved by UN members at talks at Interlaken in Switzerland. It says that cash flows to help developing countries cut their emissions must be raised by six times over current levels.
In the next few moments, I will talk about mini case histories of countries that I have visited and know in a bit of depth. As it happens, on Saturday 18 March, I went to my old college, St Catharine’s, and listened to Professor Willis talking about Antarctica. Not too many people live there: indeed, none are recognised as living in Antarctica. Professor Willis is a glaciologist. He and his colleagues measure the effects of changing glaciers and ice sheets. They believe it is exceptionally important that the planet moves to net zero as soon as possible and tries to keep the planet’s global average temperature rises below 1.5 degrees to avert devastating impacts on human and economic life and climate change. They have done some measuring of glaciers and global sea level: the sea level is rising at an accelerating rate. Between 1901 and 1971 it rose 1.3 millimetres a year, but between 2006 and 2018 it rose 3.7 millimetres a year—nearly three times as much.
These scientists try to predict the future of the planet and their view is that there is a particular case that they believe is possible within the confines of what I have already mentioned, whereby, by going to net zero by 2050, we will just about survive. These scientists are quite adamant, though, that it is exceptionally important for countries to move to net zero by 2050, otherwise the effects will be totally devastating for the life of all of us on this planet.
That is Antarctica. Secondly, I will say a few words about the Falklands. I had the privilege of representing Parliament 10 years after we recovered the Falklands. They have gone on and done a good bit of work, and all praise to them. They have had a plan, since 2018 through to the current year, which they call the comprehensive environment strategy. Every time a decision is taken in the Falklands, they look at the environmental impact. That is not a bad place to start. They recognise, though, that this may mean that some of the traditional, practical side of life may have to change there, but they are a small country—just 3,000 people—and they need help from us.
My third case history is Samoa, right in the middle of the Pacific, which, again, I had the privilege to visit. It comprises nine small islands in the middle of nowhere. Its Prime Minister stated recently that while we are all impacted, the degree of the impact in Samoa’s circumstances is enormous. In Samoa, there are already communities who have moved from one low-lying atoll to another to ensure that they can live safely. They know full well that, unless something happens, rising storms will remove Samoa from the world.
I will say a few words about the Cayman Islands. I declare an interest: my youngest son works there. They know what hurricanes are like. I have seen the results of hurricanes, on the ground in the Cayman Islands. The results were horrific. Every year, they worry particularly in the hurricane season, around September. I wonder why His Majesty’s Government are providing some special resources to Antigua, Barbuda, Jamaica and Saint Lucia, providing a person called a climate advisor, whereas the Cayman Islands, with 66,000 people, the Turks and Caicos Islands, with 3,900, and Bermuda, with 62,000, at the moment get nothing.
Finally, I will look at some bigger countries. I will start with the Maldives—I have had the privilege of chairing the all-party group on that country, although I am not currently the chairman—and Sri Lanka, which has a population of about 21.6 million, about one-third of the UK. I have been involved with Sri Lanka since 1975, when I started the all-party group. The Sri Lankans know what disaster is. A few days after the Boxing Day tsunami in 2004, my wife and I went out there to try to help. One thousand people were killed in a single train; thousands were killed just by two waves that came in at a huge height, and demolished the south and the south east, roughly speaking, so the Sri Lankans know what disaster means.
I am very proud to read what the current Prime Minister of Sri Lanka said when he was at COP 27. He made it quite clear that his is a country that admits it is in financial difficulties. It was hit hard by Covid and, sadly, has experienced war, and it is now seeking the help of the IMF. Nevertheless, it is trying hard to do something in relation to what I have just been talking about. He claims that Sri Lanka has commenced the process of reducing carbon emissions. It has initiated marine spatial planning and established a climate office, which in itself is a good thing to do. It is leading the Commonwealth blue charter action group on mangrove eco-systems, and overcoming the obstacle of communication, in that it thinks it would be valuable if there was an international climate change university. He has offered to set it up in Sri Lanka and work with an ancillary university in the Maldives, so there is co-ordination.
However, the Sri Lankan Prime Minister also pointed out recently:
“It’s ironic that the $100bn pledged annually has not been available in the coffers to finance climate challenges”.
Understandably, the Sri Lankans would like some action on that front. In their view and mine, the developing countries are worst affected by the rise in emissions from the industrialised world, and they really need to be compensated for that degree of loss.
I conclude with a brief summary. The time has come for us to sit down together, stop the talking and take some practical action. I should like to see the Commonwealth, assisted by His Majesty’s Foreign Office, to create a task force with the varied skills to give advice, help and motivation for the plans for the small dependencies and countries such as those I referred to. They need a clear policy framework to know what is possible and what can be financed. I know there is a joint fund, split between the FCDO, the Department for Business and Trade and the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs, but, frankly, it is too cumbersome and is not targeted precisely enough. My right honourable friend in the other place said that finance is key to deliver the trillions of dollars needed for climate change, but I do not think we have that structure at the moment.
We have not listened carefully enough to the likes of Professor Willis, who was the man I listened to the other Saturday. It is so important to the world to move to net zero by 2050, and doing so will limit global warming and sea levels rising to more manageable levels. If we do not, it will be the biggest crisis ever faced by humanity.
Sri Lanka: Truth Commission
Lord Naseby Excerpts(2 years ago)
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Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)
My Lords, I agree with my noble friend. The Commonwealth Secretariat and the Secretary-General have engaged directly with the Sri Lankan Government, and we are looking to key partners. I mentioned the important role that India has played in supporting Sri Lanka at this time, as a near neighbour, both with energy issues and in providing credit lines to allow it to navigate its way through the economic challenges it faces.
Lord Naseby (Con)
Is my noble friend aware that I shall personally support and work for a truth and reconciliation commission, established in Sri Lanka, rather similar to those in South Africa and Colombia? However, are there not two key initiatives that His Majesty’s Government need to do to help? The first is to persuade the United Nations to remove the 20-year restriction on the source of the evidence in the Darusman report of 2011, which stated that up to 40,000 people were killed. Secondly, the UK Government themselves should surely now release to any commission the unredacted dispatches from the UK’s respected and experienced military attaché, Colonel Gash, who was on the battlefield every day from 1 January to 18 May 2009, proving beyond doubt in his dispatches that there was no genocide.
Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)
My Lords, I cannot agree with all aspects of my noble friend’s questions because it is very clear that the whole point of standing up a truth and reconciliation commission in 2015 was that there was a real recognition, even by the Sri Lankan Government of that time, of the importance of bringing communities together to ensure that atrocities could be fully investigated and, more importantly, perpetrators could be held to account. That is why we have pursued the issue at the UN Human Rights Council, which is the right approach. Of course, in time, there is a need for domestic mechanisms, but the sad truth is that, since 2015, despite successive changes of Government, we have seen little progress with the truth and justice commission in Sri Lanka.
International Development Strategy: Volunteering
Lord Naseby Excerpts(2 years, 5 months ago)
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Lord Goldsmith of Richmond Park (Con)
The right reverend Prelate makes an extremely good point. It is hard to know which Ministers will be responding to the invitation when it comes to the Foreign Office, but I assure him that, in the unlikely circumstance that I am the Minister opening the envelope, I will certainly take him up on his invitation. I look forward to being given good counsel by people who, as he rightly says, do extraordinary work in some of the most difficult parts of the world.
Lord Naseby (Con)
Is my noble friend aware that there are 330,000 young people in the Duke of Edinburgh’s Award scheme and rising? Is he also aware that there are well over 130,000 boys and girls in the Sea Cadets and Combined Cadet Force? Does he not understand that among young people there are thousands who want to go out on VSO work? The noble Lord from the Labour Front Bench is right: we need to move forward; we have been waiting too long.
Lord Goldsmith of Richmond Park (Con)
My noble friend makes a very good point and I am not going to argue with him. The value of the Duke of Edinburgh’s Award and the Sea Cadets and Combined Cadet Force is absolutely unquestioned—they are magnificent organisations. As I said before, I do not agree with the noble Lord on the Front Bench opposite. This is an area that we absolutely need to continue to provide support for, and I understand the call from this House for greater clarity. I hope we will be able to provide that clarity soon.
Food Insecurity: England
Lord Naseby Excerpts(2 years, 6 months ago)
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Lord Goldsmith of Richmond Park (Con)
The noble Lord makes an important point. The department that I am representing is working closely with the Home Office to ensure we have the labour we need to pick and collect the food that is produced in this country.
Lord Naseby (Con)
Is my noble friend aware that the families and men and women who go shopping in the UK are well able to make a judgment on their own part and welcome promotions that reduce the price of the produce they want to buy?