Hereditary Peers: By-elections

Debate between Lord Hannan of Kingsclere and Lord True

Wednesday 10th November 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Hannan of Kingsclere (Con)]

My Lords, is this not really about good faith? I have not been here very long but some of your Lordships were here when a deal was done, establishing the current system pending stage two reform. At the risk of making myself Billy-no-mates again, as I was in my old job, I favour eventual democratisation but, unless we are prepared to do that, does my noble friend not agree that it is perverse to be targeting what is, despite a limited franchise, the only elected element in this Chamber?

[Lord True (Con)]

My Lords, I will not be tempted too far down that road or some people might resuscitate some of the things that I said 10 years ago about your Lordships’ House and its composition. I now stand at the Dispatch Box as a Minister. My noble friend is absolutely right that we have a system that came out of particular circumstances. It was assented to and, as the noble and learned Lord, Lord Irvine of Lairg, said at the time, will bind and honour all who gave it their assent until we have reform of your Lordships’ House, which, as I hear, a lot of people would favour.

Ministerial Code

Debate between Lord Hannan of Kingsclere and Lord True

Tuesday 9th November 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord True (Con)]

My Lords, I have explained the constitutional position. So far as the Prime Minister’s movements are concerned, I am thankfully not responsible for them, but he was on a prearranged official visit to the north-east. My right honourable friend the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster, who heads up the Cabinet Office and is responsible for this, led in the parliamentary debate. The Speaker was informed that both my right honourable friend and the leader of the Scottish nationalists would be unable to attend.

[Lord Hannan of Kingsclere (Con)]

My Lords, until a generation or so ago there was almost no statutory regulation of Ministers, Members of the other place, or Members of this Chamber. Does my noble friend the Minister see a danger that the proliferation of codes, statutes and commissions skews incentives, encouraging politicians to tick the boxes, rather than asking themselves whether their behaviour is, in the broader sense, moral or edifying? Is there not a danger that we are replacing a culture of conscience with one of compliance?

[Lord True (Con)]

My Lords, my noble friend is absolutely right to say that the background, provisions and guidance have changed and evolved over time, and they will continue to evolve.

UK Policy Implementation for Wales and Scotland

Debate between Lord Hannan of Kingsclere and Lord True

Wednesday 19th May 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord True (Con)]

My Lords, I am grateful for the noble Lord’s welcome of the Prime Minister’s initiative. On intergovernmental relations, I laid a Statement before the House—I think on 21 March—on the significant progress made in those discussions. I am confident that further progress will be made on those co-operative instruments.

[Lord Hannan of Kingsclere (Con)]

My Lords, our world-beating vaccination programme was a UK achievement. Our independence allowed us to move quickly and our size allowed us to buy big. Can my noble friend the Minister confirm that, while it is perfectly legitimate for politicians to argue for a reset—as the noble Lord, Lord Wigley, did—or democratic partition of this country, the focus must be on recovering from the worst economic trauma any of us has ever experienced?

[Lord True (Con)]

I absolutely agree with my noble friend. That is the commitment of the Prime Minister, and I have every hope that it will be the commitment of the other First Ministers and leading Ministers involved. Our nation gained enormously from the resources of the United Kingdom, including financial, Armed Forces, co-operative, technical and scientific ones. That lesson has not gone unnoticed by people in every corner of these isles.