West Midlands Combined Authority (Transfer of Police and Crime Commissioner Functions) Order 2024

Lord Grocott Excerpts

Wednesday 13th March 2024 Lords Chamber

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Home Office (Lord Sharpe of Epsom) (Con)]

My Lords, if approved by both Houses, this order will transfer police and crime commissioner—PCC—functions from the West Midlands PCC to the Mayor of the West Midlands. The first mayor to exercise PCC functions in the West Midlands would do so following the next mayoral election, which is scheduled for Thursday 2 May 2024. This maintains the direct democratic accountability for policing and crime in the West Midlands, as the mayor will be elected by the people of the West Midlands on the basis that they are to exercise the functions of the PCC for that area.

The incumbent PCC for the West Midlands will continue to exercise the functions until the end of his elected term of office. The person elected as mayor, from the point of taking office on Tuesday 7 May following the mayoral election, will act as the single, directly elected individual responsible for holding the chief constable and police force to account. The mayor will be accountable to the people of the West Midlands for this responsibility. Their functions would include issuing a police and crime plan; setting the police budget, including the PCC council tax precept requirements; appointing and, if necessary, suspending or dismissing the chief constable; addressing complaints about policing services; providing and commissioning services for victims and vulnerable people; and working in partnership to ensure that the local criminal justice system is efficient and effective.

Part 1 of the Government’s review into the role of PCCs cemented government’s view that bringing public safety functions together under the leadership of a combined authority mayor has the potential to offer wider levers and a more joined-up approach to preventing crime. The Government’s levelling up White Paper, published on 2 February 2022, sets out our aspiration to have combined authority mayors take on the PCC role where feasible. By working in partnership across a range of agencies at local and national level, mayors can ensure that there is a more holistic, unified approach to public safety.

As is required by Section 113 of the Local Democracy, Economic Development and Construction Act 2009, the Home Secretary launched a public consultation on the proposed West Midlands police and crime commissioner functions transfer on 20 December 2023, which ran for six weeks to 31 January. Over 7,000 responses were received to this consultation, and the Home Secretary considered the views gathered when deciding whether to lay this order enabling the transfer of PCC functions to the Mayor of the West Midlands.

It is the Government’s view that incorporating PCC functions into the role of the Mayor of the West Midlands, who is elected to deliver across a range of other functions, will bolster their mandate to bring greater joined-up access across the responsibilities they are accountable for and will help to facilitate a whole-system approach to crime reduction.

[Lord Grocott (Lab)]

While the Minister is on the consultation, could he conclude it by telling us the number of consultees and the responses that they gave, and can he give us some numerical attachment to that so that we get some idea of how the consultation went?

[Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)]

I can and will do so shortly.

Incorporating the PCC functions into the role of the Mayor of the West Midlands preserves the democratic accountability that underpins the PCC model and at the same time reduces the risk of competing democratic mandates within the West Midlands Combined Authority area, providing greater clarity for the electorate on who is responsible for public service functions in their area.

The exercise of PCC functions by the Mayor of the West Midlands is a significant step to realising our ambition for more combined authority mayors to take on PCC functions, as is already the case in Greater Manchester and West Yorkshire. It will mean that people in the West Midlands will be served by a mayor who will have a range of functions and levers comparable to those of the mayors of Greater Manchester, West Yorkshire and London, and they will be able to hold their mayor to account for this enhanced range of responsibilities.

The Government have also laid a similar order which, if approved by both Houses, would see PCC functions exercised by the Mayor of South Yorkshire, following the rescheduled mayoral election in May.

I turn briefly to the amendment tabled by the noble Lord, Lord Bach. The noble Lord states that the transfer of functions is taking place without the consent of the other relevant local authorities. When PCC functions are transferred to be exercised by an existing combined authority mayor, Section 107F of the Local Democracy, Economic Development and Construction Act 2009 requires the consent of that mayor to enable the making of the order. The Mayor of the West Midlands provided his formal consent to the Home Secretary on 7 February. The consent of any other local leader is not required by statute. This reflects the fact that it is the mayor themselves and not the combined authority or the leaders of the constituent authorities who will exercise the PCC functions, as it is a central tenet of the PCC model that only the individual elected to exercise the PCC functions may do so, whether that individual is a PCC or a mayor.

The noble Lord also states that the functions are being transferred without the consent of the people of the West Midlands through a vote, but the incumbent Mayor of the West Midlands was elected to office by the people of the West Midlands in May 2021. Arguably, this means that the mayor has a clear democratic mandate in the region, and, as indicated, he has consented to this order. Should the House pass this order, it will then be directly in the control of the people of the West Midlands to elect the individual they wish to see exercise the functions of the PCC at the May election. The Government are doing nothing to take that ability away from the electorate with this order; we are simply transferring the exercise of policing governance functions from one directly elected role to another.

Finally, the noble Lord has highlighted the Secondary Legislation Scrutiny Committee’s report on this order, and specifically its finding that an initial decision was made by the Home Secretary to transfer the functions before a public consultation had been conducted. It is true that the Home Secretary communicated an initial decision to the mayor and the PCC for the West Midlands on 6 December. The Permanent Secretary’s response to the committee’s letter has addressed this concern, but for the benefit of the noble Lord and the House, I will also address it.

At the time of the Home Secretary’s decision, the requirement of Section 113 of the 2009 Act to conduct a public consultation was not known to him. It had not been the Government’s intention for the levelling-up Act to place a new statutory test and a consultation requirement on the power to transfer PCC functions to combined authority mayors. However, as soon as the Home Secretary was made aware of this requirement, he launched the six-week public consultation on the proposed transfer and agreed to retake his decision only after he had given due regard to the responses to the public consultation and he was satisfied that the statutory requirements of Section 113 had been met. The decision to make this order was taken on 6 February and supersedes the decision that was communicated on 6 December.

If noble Lords will bear with me a second, I will try to find the relevant statistics, as asked for by the noble Lord, Lord Grocott. I know I have them in my winding-up notes—I will find them in a second.

It is unfortunate that the initial decision was made without knowledge of the statutory requirements, but the appropriate steps were taken to ensure that the decision to make this order was not made until the requirements had been met. I am satisfied that the Home Secretary acted well within the legislation as soon as he became aware of this initial oversight. I call on Members of your Lordships’ House to reject the amendment tabled by the noble Lord. I hope that what I have said provides some reassurance and clarity.

I thank the House for its indulgence; I have found the numbers, with thanks to the noble Lord, Lord Gascoigne. The public consultation ran from 20 December 2023 to 31 January 2024. The Government’s response to the consultation was published when this order was laid before Parliament. The total number of responses received was 7,103—a good deal more than those received by other consultations relating to devolution proposals. Of those responses, 46% agreed with the proposal, 50% disagreed and 4% said that they did not know. I beg to move.

Amendment to the Motion

Safety of Rwanda (Asylum and Immigration) Bill

Lord Grocott Excerpts

2nd reading
Monday 29th January 2024 Lords Chamber

[Lord German (LD)]

My Lords, I direct the House’s attention to my interests as laid out in the register.

The treatment of asylum seekers and refugees, which this Bill is seeking to affect, is completely contrary to how we should act as a country with a reputation for protecting individuals’ rights and freedoms, where the rule of law is upheld. I do not need to repeat the key points of last week’s debate on the Rwanda treaty, but the decision of this House is significant in respect of the Bill. This House resolved that it could not ratify the treaty that the Government are using to declare that Rwanda is safe. The House determined that the safeguards and protections outlined in the treaty must be fully implemented. Moreover, the House agreed that future assurances of changes in the processing of asylum seekers in Rwanda were not sufficient: the changes needed to be fully operational and effective.

Significantly, the treaty is the instrument by which the Government declare that they can state in this Bill that Rwanda is safe. Clause 1(2)(b) is clear:

“this Act gives effect to the judgement of Parliament that the Republic of Rwanda is a safe country”.

However, this House of Parliament has not determined that this is the case. The treaty is the platform on which the Bill sits. If this platform is not in place, the Bill sinks. The legs have come off the table, or, to put it another way, the Bill’s foundations have been removed. It was the settled will of this House last week that the treaty cannot yet be ratified. How, therefore, can this House consent to a Bill that relies on that treaty having the approval of this House?

This is critical, because the decision of the Supreme Court was based on its analysis of the facts. The contrary case put forward by the Government in the Bill has not been supported by this House. The Bill before us requires Parliament—which of course includes this House—to agree that, in our judgment, as a House, Rwanda is safe. This House, in this respect, needs to be consistent with itself, and with the decision it took last week.

The Bill places the UK at risk of breaching our commitments under international law. We as a country have signed up to comply with the obligations of international treaties and conventions. Having done that, we need to demonstrate that, as a country, we can be relied upon to uphold international treaties, and that we promote a rules-based international order—because if we do not then we cannot expect others to comply, and are in no position to call out other countries when they fail to comply with international law.

The West is often accused of double standards, and under this legislation this accusation will only increase. Our global leadership and our ability to have a serious voice on the world stage will be severely damaged. We will no longer be a country whose voice is respected and listened to. We simply cannot rely on our historical traditions when our current actions are going in the opposite direction. Global responsibility-sharing is the foundation of the 1951 refugee convention; it relies on us all doing our part. The Government say that this plan is a “partnership” and “burden-sharing”, but, frankly, it is offloading—offloading the most vulnerable people on our planet and offloading our responsibilities under international agreements we are signed up to.

If the Bill is enacted, we will be legislating contrary to our international legal obligations. Our domestic law would be out of step with these obligations. Some might say that is acceptable but I do not believe that is the case; I think this House will stand up for the object and the purpose of these international instruments to which we are signed up. Our courts would have their hands tied by this legislation. There is a strong possibility, particularly without pre-existing safeguards being proved operational and effective in Rwanda, that this would lead to refoulement and breaches of Article 2 and Article 3 rights. That is why it is critical for the steps set out in the treaty to be seen to be working before the Bill can have any effect.

The Bill introduces the option for Ministers to refuse to comply with a Rule 39 injunction from the European Court of Human Rights. Ignoring an injunction would be a clear breach of international law, as the president of the court declared last week, and this view is strengthened by the Rule 39 reforms which the court itself has introduced.

Domestically, the Bill undermines the rule of law and, further, ousts the jurisdiction of our courts. The rule of law is a central tenet of our society, expressed by AV Dicey, well-known to all lawyers, who wrote,

“we speak of the ‘rule of law’ as a characteristic of our country, not only that with us no man is above the law, but that here, every man, whatever be his rank or condition, is subject to the ordinary law of the realm and amenable to the jurisdiction of the ordinary tribunals”.

My noble friend Lord Thomas of Gresford will elaborate on this in his contribution.

The Bill seeks to exclude a group of people from accessing the legal protections we grant to everyone else in our society. It is critical in a democratic society that the law is applied equally and that human rights apply to everyone, not just some in our society. The Government’s Bill prevents the right to access redress, which is afforded to the rest of us.

Further, the Bill is an abuse of Parliament’s role in reversing the Supreme Court’s factual assessment of risk of harm in Rwanda. If the Government believe they have new evidence to show that Rwanda is safe, surely the correct procedure to follow is to let the courts decide it and consider the evidence and come to a judgment. That is the proper way to go. If Rwanda was indeed safe, there would be no need to have the option to ignore interim injunctions from the ECHR or disapply elements of the Human Rights Act. This Bill represents an overreach of Parliament, and it is critical that we retain the balance in our democracy achieved by the separation of powers.

Despite all this, the Bill will not actually achieve its stated aim, and it certainly does not represent good value to the taxpayer—£368 million at the last count, added to which at least £169,000 for each person removed to Rwanda. These are staggering, eyewatering costs, which could pay for 100 million free school meals or nearly 6 million more GP appointments.

Far from being a deterrent, the Bill will promote smuggling—a point which my noble friend Lady Northover will develop in her remarks. It does not address real solutions to prevent people using criminal gangs to take dangerous journeys to the UK. The focus on deterrence is misplaced. Two-thirds of all those who have crossed the channel since the Illegal Migration Act was passed came from six high-grant countries. The push factor for these people is far stronger than any deterrent the UK may dream up. We need safe alternatives to dangerous journeys, and this must be part of the strategy to reduce dangerous crossings. Swift, efficient, accurate and just determination of asylum claims and humane removal of those who do not qualify will be a deterrent in itself to people without a protection claim.

We also need constructive engagement with European neighbours on co-operation on asylum. Addressing the root causes of displacement and onward movement is critical, and a strong international aid and development budget is key to that. Instead, we are presented with a political totem of the Tory right—a device to satisfy its internal party politics and a Bill from which there is no going back. If Rwanda is found to be unsafe then this Bill will act as a block to putting matters right. This legislation was not in the Government’s manifesto; the Addison/Salisbury convention does not apply. I maintain that this is one of the rare occasions—which have been used by both Conservative and Labour parties in this House, and which was foreseen by a report of the Constitution Committee—when this House should vote against a Bill at Second Reading. It is within our powers as described in the Companion.

[Lord Grocott (Lab)]

I am grateful to the noble Lord, Lord German, for giving way. Does he agree that the function of this House, the second Chamber, is as a revising Chamber? It is not a vetoing Chamber; it is a revising Chamber. Can he explain to me the Liberal Democrat’s novel constitutional thinking that, by throwing out this Bill on Second Reading, we should prevent the revising Chamber revising?

[Lord German (LD)]

The noble Lord is wrong. I think in 2011 he voted against the Health and Social Care Bill at Second Reading, as had happened before, in earlier versions, by Members of the Conservative Party. If our laws and the rules of this House say we can do it then we can do it, and it has been done by both sides here.

I maintain that this Chamber should listen to the real power in what people will be saying this afternoon about the nature of this Bill. It asks us to believe that black is white—that facts are not facts. It breaches conventions and treaties to which we are signed up. It damages our credibility on the world stage and the agreements that we have with other countries. It seeks to damage our relationships with things that we have already signed up to, including the European convention on trafficking, the CTA with the European Union, the United Nations, the ECHR and many more. It damages the separation of powers in this country, which is a fundamental tenet of our democracy. It offends against the rule of law. Fundamentally, it treats some of the most vulnerable people in the world—people who are facing persecution and torture and fleeing for their lives—as undesirables. For us on these Benches, that is unconscionable. I beg to move.

Iranian Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps

Lord Grocott Excerpts

Tuesday 23rd May 2023 Lords Chamber

[Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)]

I do not accept that characterisation. As I said, the discussions of course continue, and as soon as there is something more to say I am sure that we will be back to say it.

[Lord Grocott (Lab)]

The exchanges we have heard are predictable and understandable, but is it not important that, in all of these kinds of discussions, we recognise the wider context in which violence takes place in the Middle East, as it does relentlessly and remorselessly? The wider context is the complete absence of any significant development in the peace process between the Israelis and the Palestinians. Until such time as that is at least moving and there is some prospect of a two-state solution—whatever the rights and wrongs of it—this kind of violence will continue.

[Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)]

I am sure that the noble Lord is right, and I am more than happy to condemn all violence in the Middle East, wherever it comes from.

Vagrancy Act 1824

Lord Grocott Excerpts

Wednesday 17th May 2023 Lords Chamber

[Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)]

My Lords, as noble Lords know and as I have tried to explain, we are hard at work on coming up with a suitable replacement, which is not a like-for-like replacement of the Vagrancy Act in its current form. But it is right that the police, local authorities and so on have the tools that they need to respond effectively to begging and rough sleeping. That work is ongoing.

[Lord Grocott (Lab)]

My Lords, the Minister said two or three times that one of the factors is as soon as parliamentary time becomes available. We are already in an inordinately long Session, with no date yet announced for when it will end and when the King’s Speech will be. So is it not a pretty lame excuse to say that it is just a matter of finding parliamentary time? What we really need to see is the Government getting their act together.

[Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)]

I shall pass on the noble Lord’s comments.

Police Uplift Programme

Lord Grocott Excerpts

Tuesday 2nd May 2023 Lords Chamber

[Lord Grocott (Lab)]

My Lords, I find it pretty astonishing that the Government should call for national rejoicing that they have finally got the level of policing up to the level of 13 years ago, under the last Labour Government. An apology for all the cuts that were made in the early years of this Government would be in order. As for comments in the Statement such as criminals now “must be cursing their luck” because the figures have gone up, the inevitable response is that immediately after 2010, criminals must have been rejoicing at the savage cuts made to policing—to dangerous levels—in many cities in this country.

The Minister still has not answered a couple of specific questions that were put to him. First, we are told that these 20,000 new recruits have been recruited since 2019. How many people have left the police service during that precise period, and is that allowed for in describing the number of police officers available today? Secondly, this mass recruitment is obviously to be welcomed, but can he tell us how many of these new recruits actually leave the police service before they have completed their probationary period? It is no use having the police officers unless they give a substantial period of service after they have been trained.

[Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)]

My Lords, in fact there are more policemen than under the last Labour Government: 3,542 more, to be precise. The fact is that demand for policing has changed since 2010, which is why in 2019 the Government made this commitment to increase the number of police officers by 20,000, to help the police respond. I am afraid that I cannot say how many of this new intake will complete their probationary period, as, obviously, some will still be in their probationary period. I will endeavour to find out the statistics and come back to the noble Lord. On the number who left, I have already gone into the statistics in some detail on the number who were recruited, as well as the attrition statistics.

Police and Crime Commissioners: Accountability Arrangements

Lord Grocott Excerpts

Wednesday 25th January 2023 Lords Chamber

[Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)]

My Lords, I would have thought that councillors are also elected once every four years as a rule, so I am not sure what the difference is there. The fact is that police authorities were anonymous, notwithstanding the noble Baroness’s evident fame on the police authority where she was. I would also say that, through part 2 of the review, we are undertaking a fundamental assessment of the whole panel system, and there is a considerable degree of transparency that has been introduced into the way the police and crime commissioners communicate with their constituents.

[Lord Grocott (Lab)]

I make it eight questions that the Minister has fielded so far today, all of them pretty hostile to what he has had to say, including a number from his own side. These include those of two Members, the noble Lords, Lord Bach and Lord Lexden, who have persistently raised the issue that I will not repeat, which seems to have general support from the House. Can I give him some friendly advice? Unless he sorts out some of these questions from the noble Lords, Lord Lexden and Lord Bach, he is going to go on and on having to suffer this pain on a relentless basis.

[Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)]

I reassure the noble Lord that I actually enjoy it enormously, but I am going to have to go back to my earlier comment that it would be inappropriate to comment further while the proceedings are ongoing. The noble Lord knows that I will continue to say that until the proceedings are no longer ongoing.

Police and Crime Commissioners and Panels

Lord Grocott Excerpts

Monday 31st October 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)]

Actually, that is a helpful question, because the electorate do of course have ultimate responsibility for the election of the PCCs. I am pleased to say that the electorate seem to be becoming more enthusiastic about the elections: turnout has increased every year. Obviously that is not determined by a single factor, but it is going up.

[Lord Grocott (Lab)]

My Lords, the Minister’s definition of “enthusiasm” is certainly different from some that I could suggest. One of the main purposes of the whole system of police and crime commissioners was to get closer engagement between the public and policing. With three rounds of police and crime commissioners elections having taken place, the turnout has varied between poor and abysmal. Clearly, they are not fulfilling one of the key reasons for their having been established, so what is the point of them?

[Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)]

I have answered the question about the point. I have the turnout figures: in 2012, it was 15.1%; in 2016, it was 27.4%; and in 2021, it was 33.9%. We cheerfully accept that those are not the greatest numbers—certainly not relative to national elections—but, in a local context, they are not bad.

National Identity Cards

Lord Grocott Excerpts

Tuesday 14th March 2017 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

The noble Lord is absolutely right: they are important questions. We are considering a range of options for our future immigration system. It would be absolutely wrong of me to set out further positions at this stage.

[Lord Grocott (Lab)]

My Lords—

[Noble Lords]

Order!

Brexit: Role of Parliament

Lord Grocott Excerpts

Monday 18th July 2016 Lords Chamber

[Lord Keen of Elie]

The Government have established the Department for Exiting the European Union to form a view as to the basis on which we do exit the European Union.

[Lord Grocott (Lab)]

Like many others in this House, I had the pleasure of sitting through the whole Committee stage of the European Union Referendum Bill. As far as I can discover from Hansard, at no stage was it suggested that it was just an advisory referendum that was being established, much less that Governments subsequently would not need to take account of the decision made by the British people. Does the Minister agree with me that, with such authority having been given by Parliament to the British people and the British people having declared clearly their view on the specific question being asked, for either House, but, I must say, more specifically this House, of which I am very fond, to decide that it would in any substantial way—of course, one can look at the detail—thwart the decision of the British people would be a very unsatisfactory road down which to travel?

[Lord Keen of Elie]

It is not a road that this Government intend to go down.

Road Traffic Act 1988 (Alcohol Limits) (Amendment) Bill [HL]

Lord Grocott Excerpts

Friday 22nd April 2016 Lords Chamber

[Lord Brooke of Alverthorpe]

I am grateful for that intervention but I cannot give a precise figure. However, if the noble Lord will be patient, I will come to tell him not only how the number of jobs in the hospitality industry will be secured but will, I hope, be increased.

The simple fact is that the drinks and hospitality industry will have to change its attitude, as it had to do with the smoking ban—when people talked about all the jobs that would disappear and said that it would be the end of the world when smoking in public places was stopped. The industry should not be plying drivers with alcohol but encouraging patrons instead to have a non-drinking driver. It should look to improve—this is where I come to the answer to the noble Lord’s question—its competitiveness to attract more customers than it is at present. It is not this legislation that is the biggest threat to the industry. The biggest threat is cheap booze that is sold in supermarkets and off-licences, which leads to people drinking more at home rather than going out. The industry’s competitiveness is, in the main, weak at the moment because it has to sell alcohol in hotels and pubs at quite high charges compared with supermarkets and off-licences. If, as the Prime Minister wanted, the Government were prepared to undertake and embrace higher minimum unit pricing to have a level playing field for competitiveness, the industry could look forward to getting more people back into pubs and clubs. They would not buy so much in off-licences and supermarkets because drink would no longer be so cheap there.

[Lord Grocott (Lab)]

Does my noble friend not have a slight unease at any social policy that is being determined by price, which absolutely inevitably is of no consequence whatever to people who are better-off but substantially affects the less well-off?

[Lord Brooke of Alverthorpe]

I am grateful to my noble friend for that intervention. I do have that concern, but equally I have a very big concern about the cost to the National Health Service and the whole country. That cost bears down on the shoulders of all sections of the community.