Long-term Plan for Housing

Debate between Lord Berkeley and Baroness Penn

Thursday 11th January 2024 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Penn (Con)]

My Lords, my understanding is that the Government launched an EPC action plan to take forward a number of changes to EPCs. We are well on track for delivering against the majority of actions within that, but we continue to look at it. We recognise that there is potentially the need for wider reform to energy performance certificates; we are looking at that very closely and doing further work on it.

[Lord Berkeley (Lab)]

My Lords, I have the honour of serving on the Built Environment Committee in your Lordships’ House, along with one or two other colleagues here. We have been listening to evidence in the last few months from builders, planners and Ministers about why the 300,000 target has not been reached. I think the low point for me was evidence from an Environment Minister and the Housing Minister, who sat next to each other trying to explain why it was all very difficult. At the end of the evidence session, I thought, “When did they ever talk to each other? It is as if they are in completely different silos”. We have heard answers from the noble Baroness, Lady Penn, this afternoon about the importance of the environment. She mentioned affordable housing once or twice. The noble Baroness, Lady Pinnock, mentioned that it is only in the NPPF once, I think; I may have that wrong.

When I looked at the Housing Minister’s Statement on 19 December when he launched this, I was astonished to read one paragraph which used several phrases which to me indicate what is really important for this Government. One phrase was “gentle density”—I do not know what that means, but perhaps some experts can tell me—on the design of mansard roof development. Does that really go in a Statement? There was “well-designed places”—we know what that is—and then,

“‘visual clarity’ on the design requirements”.—[Official Report, Commons, 19/12/23; col. 1266.]

Also, the word “beauty” comes into it, as the noble Baroness said. These are all very good things, especially if you want a lovely new house in the countryside, miles from anywhere, but are they the priorities for affordable housing? This is the problem. We have lost sight of what is important. I live in Cornwall and the lack of affordable housing there is just terrible. If we are to say that everything has to be a “gentle density” with “visual clarity” of place, I do not think we are going to get there—until we concentrate on what is important, which is affordable housing.

[Baroness Penn (Con)]

I do not think that the delivery of more affordable housing and the delivery of more beautiful housing need to be in tension with each other. In fact, the right housing in the right place allows more support for development to go ahead, which is one of the big barriers we see to delivering more housing in local areas, and affordable housing should be beautiful housing too. Noble Lords have had a lot of debates in this House about the standards within our homes, particularly within our social housing. We should be no less ambitious for the standards that people enjoy in their housing, whether it is social housing, affordable housing or private housing. The noble Baroness, Lady Pinnock, talked about space for children to play, for example. Taking into account that kind of amenity is important for the right development to go ahead. We should recognise that we have made significant progress in recent years in building more houses. We have had some of the highest housing delivery in the past four years that we have had in the past 20 years, and we seek to continue that, but without those measures necessarily needing to be in tension. The noble Lord spoke about Ministers talking to each other in different departments. I reassure him that, particularly on these areas that cut across different interests and on something like net zero or environmental impact, we bring together the Department for Energy Security and Net Zero, my department and Defra to work together to provide solutions on these issues.

Levelling Up

Debate between Lord Berkeley and Baroness Penn

Wednesday 22nd November 2023 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Penn (Con)]

Perhaps, given the strength of feeling that the noble Lord has on this issue, I could undertake to find out more about the rationale for that decision and write to him in particular on it. More broadly, one decision that we have taken recently, which I know has not been popular across the whole House, has been to not continue with the further leg of High Speed 2, to enable us to make sure that we are investing in transport projects that will provide greater connectivity to more people faster than would happen under the plans for the next leg of HS2. That shows this Government’s commitment to levelling up.

[Lord Berkeley (Lab)]

My Lords, perhaps I could ask the Minister a bit more about the costs to the local authorities that have been successful. Of course, I welcome all that. I have been involved in watching a very large award from the first round to the Isles of Scilly for a new ferry, and I am very grateful to the Government. But the cost of doing a strategic outline business case, an outline business case and then a proper business case was so high that, in fact, the Government have very generously allocated some extra funding to enable the councils to do it. This must apply to many other small councils in receipt of these bids. If they cannot afford to prepare the documentation for the next stage, or even to get there—because they will not get the money until the final business case hurdle is done—is there any way that the Minister can simplify the process without, of course, affecting the normal procurement rules of government?

Gross Domestic Product: Wales and the UK

Debate between Lord Berkeley and Baroness Penn

Thursday 6th July 2023 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Penn (Con)]

Just to reassure the noble Lord with regard to Wales, in the first two rounds of the levelling-up fund, £330 million has been invested so far. That exceeds the commitment that 5% of those funds would be invested in Wales, but we always seek to improve our processes around those issues, and I shall happily commit to working with colleagues in the Department for Levelling Up to make sure that we build on the success that we have had so far with this fund.

[Lord Berkeley (Lab)]

My Lords, will the Minister take forward with much more vigour the idea of Celtic Sea offshore wind, which can only really be built in places such as Port Talbot, where there is deep water and lots of land? That might help redress some of the economic disasters that other noble Lords have spoken about.

[Baroness Penn (Con)]

My Lords, the UK has an excellent track record in delivering offshore wind, and I am sure that that will continue. As I have said, we are investing across Wales, and that includes two freeports in Wales—the Celtic Freeport and the Anglesey Freeport, which will both be backed by policy and planning permissions, as well as up to £26 million in funding in each area.

Corporate Profits: Inflation

Debate between Lord Berkeley and Baroness Penn

Thursday 29th June 2023 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Penn (Con)]

My Lords, the answer is twofold. We are looking closely at the data and will continue to do so, but we do not see the pattern that the noble Lord refers to so far. We will also work with the regulators in the main areas—the FCA when it comes to the banking sector and the passing on of higher interest rates to savers, as well as mortgage holders—and look at the work of the supermarkets to ensure that their profits are fair and reasonable and driven by fair competition in the sector. We will keep all of that under review. We have agreed a series of steps with the regulators to make sure that action is taken if competition is not working as it should.

[Lord Berkeley (Lab)]

My Lords, does the Minister agree with the IMF that the main cause of inflation is excessive corporate profits, and the fat cat salaries that go with them, rather than the wage claims such as those from people in the National Health Service?

[Baroness Penn (Con)]

As I have explained to noble Lords, the IMF analysis applied to the euro area.

Cross-Government Cost Cutting

Debate between Lord Berkeley and Baroness Penn

Tuesday 6th December 2022 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Penn (Con)]

I do not believe that it is within my responsibilities to carry out an audit of special advisers, but I will take the noble Lord’s point back to the department. I should probably declare an interest as a former special adviser myself; I would not be best placed to undertake such work.

[Lord Berkeley (Lab)]

My Lords, perhaps I could be helpful to the Minister and give her some advice. If she wants to save £150 billion, she could cancel HS2.

[Baroness Penn (Con)]

I always welcome helpful advice. However, I am not sure that I can take it up in this case.

Green Investment Fund

Debate between Lord Berkeley and Baroness Penn

Wednesday 2nd September 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Penn (Con)]

I am afraid I do not have a date for the noble Lord for the response to that consultation, but I can say that at Spring Budget 2020 the Government announced at least £800 million to support this sector in two industrial clusters. We aim to have the first one up and running by the mid-2020s.

[Lord Berkeley (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, will the Minister use this opportunity to commit the Government to phasing out any further support for the aviation and motor sectors by the end of this financial year unless they obtain legally binding commitments from the companies concerned that are firmly and transparently tied to achieving our zero-carbon targets? If she will not do that, can she explain why not?

[Baroness Penn (Con)]

Of course the Government want to support business and industry during this difficult time. We do not see a tension between getting our economy back on its feet now and meeting our longer-term targets on climate change action.