Private Members’ Bills: Money Resolutions

Debate between Lord Beamish and Andrea Leadsom

Monday 21st May 2018 Commons Chamber

[Andrea Leadsom]

I totally agree with my hon. Friend. It is vital that we always keep a close eye on value for taxpayers. As I have said, progressing with this particular private Member’s Bill would place a potential financial burden of £8 million on taxpayers. The Opposition may believe that it is perfectly fine to spend this amount of public money on a further boundary review, but, given that we have already committed to the 2018 boundary review, the Government cannot support such extra cost to the taxpayer at this point. With one review under way, plus an incomplete review from a previous Parliament, this review would be the third and would push the total cost of reviewing boundaries towards £18 million. I am sure that many constituents of the hon. Member for Manchester, Gorton would share our concern at any further unnecessary expenditure of taxpayers’ money.

The other private Members’ Bills in this Session also of course have costs attached, but they are costs associated with unique legislation, not that replicated elsewhere. As I have made clear many times, the Government will keep this private Member’s Bill under review, but it is right that we should allow the boundary commissions to report their recommendations before carefully considering how to proceed.

[Mr Kevan Jones (North Durham) (Lab)]

I am sorry, but the right hon. Lady is talking complete nonsense. Is it not a fact that the Government could lay the money resolution now? The idea that that money would be spent is absolute rubbish, and as for the idea that the Bill will somehow go ahead, would it not be a suitable back-up if the boundary commissions’ review were to fall?

[Andrea Leadsom]

I cannot really understand why the right hon. Gentleman wants to support a Bill if he thinks the money will never be spent to enact it. That would be a ludicrous situation.

Scheduling of Parliamentary Business

Debate between Lord Beamish and Andrea Leadsom

Monday 17th July 2017 Commons Chamber

[Andrea Leadsom]

Yes, I think my hon. Friend speaks for all of us in his observation.

I have outlined the many opportunities that the Opposition have had since the general election to debate in this House. In four days, the House rises for recess, but not before there are many further opportunities to put their views on the record. Today we are supposed to be debating the abuse and intimidation of candidates during the general election. Members on both sides of this House have been victims of vile abuse from anarchists and hard-left activists, but obviously Labour Members are not interested. It is now unlikely that there will be any time for that critical debate to take place today. I sincerely hope that the Leader of the Opposition, having prevented this debate, will want to condemn in the strongest language the frightening and intimidating abuse endured by many Conservative Members, as well as a number of those on his own Benches.

This Government are working towards a brighter future for our great country. We are bringing forward the European Union (Withdrawal) Bill and negotiating our exit from the European Union, fulfilling the will of the British people, and working to make a success of Brexit. We are putting in place a strong programme of social and economic legislation, introducing measures that will improve mental health provision, build the industries of tomorrow, and stamp out extremism and terrorism. These are issues that matter—

[Mr Kevan Jones]

On a point of order, Mr Speaker.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Speaker]

I note the hon. Gentleman’s point. As far as I can tell—I hope I sense correctly—the Leader of the House is very likely approaching her peroration. A lot of Members wish to speak and there is usually a rough equivalence between the length of time taken by the Opposition spokesperson and the Government spokesperson. At this stage the right hon. Lady is in order, but I imagine that she is probably nearing the conclusion of her remarks.

[Andrea Leadsom]

rose—

[Mr Jones]

Go on, get on with it!

Draft Nuclear Industries Security (Amendment) Regulations 2016

Debate between Lord Beamish and Andrea Leadsom

Tuesday 12th July 2016 General Committees

[Andrea Leadsom]

No, I am sorry, I will not give way to the hon. Gentleman again. I have answered his questions absolutely openly and transparently. What I am saying to him is that it is not a matter of realising we were in breach; it is a matter of a more recent look that has decided that, for completeness, these regulations should be updated. He is trying to suggest that there has been some sort of coming to the game late, and that is not the case. This is a case of a more recent review of the regulations suggesting that this should be carried out for completeness. That is the end. That is all I am prepared to say on the matter. I will now move on to the other questions.

[Mr Jones]

Will the hon. Lady give way on that point?

[Andrea Leadsom]

No, I am sorry. I have completely answered the question.

The hon. Member for Nottingham North asked about the safety of moving nuclear material by air. The Office for Nuclear Regulation would always need to be assured of the robustness of not just the packaging, but all safety arrangements, before any movement by air could take place. All these amendments do is change the regulation of security. The existing safety framework remains completely unchanged. Nothing is changing other than the regulation of security.

The hon. Member for Nottingham North also raised the question of the Ministry of Defence moving material by air, and asked how that differs and whether it has been breaking the international convention. What I can say is that the transportation of nuclear materials for the purposes of the Ministry of Defence is not covered by the convention on the physical protection of nuclear material or the nuclear industry’s security regulations; it is an entirely separate matter, and outside the remit of this piece of legislation.

[Mr Jones]

If the Minister does not know the answer to this question, perhaps she can write to us afterwards. At Dounreay, for example, where there is plutonium, there is a difficulty in determining whether it is a by-product of the civilian nuclear process or whether it will go down the other stream and into our nuclear weapons programme. Is the Minister saying that if this material is deemed to be military it would therefore fall under one regulation, but for this purpose it would go down the other route if it was for civilian use? That would affect what she just told us about the regulations on the transportation of this material. It could be the same material but possibly have different owners.

[Andrea Leadsom]

The hon. Gentleman’s interpretation is correct. First of all, material is identified as being under the auspices of either the MOD or the civil nuclear programme, and the regulation is dealt with accordingly. As I have said, the Ministry of Defence is not covered by either the convention or the Nuclear Industries Security Regulations 2003—it has its own regime—so the definition of which material comes under which regime is something that needs to be identified.

The hon. Member for Nottingham North also asked who moves the material. The amendments to the regulations bring the transport of civil nuclear materials by air clearly under the regulation of the Office for Nuclear Regulation. They do not state what specific organisations will move material. As I say, for security reasons we do not comment on operational decisions made for the specific transport of material, but any organisation carrying out the transportation of nuclear material to, from or within UK airspace would need to be approved as a carrier by the Office for Nuclear Regulation and regulated accordingly.

[Mr Jones]

Will the hon. Lady give way?

[Andrea Leadsom]

No, I am going to answer the question about who transports nuclear material, and then the hon. Gentleman may intervene. The hon. Member for Nottingham North asked whether civilian airlines could transport nuclear material. The Office for Nuclear Regulation would be entirely responsible for approving the transport security statement and plans, so no one would be able to fly material without the approval of the Office for Nuclear Regulation. We do not believe that there are any commercial carriers that are capable of securely carrying civil nuclear material, or that currently do so.

[Mr Jones]

I am a bit perplexed by that, because the explanatory memorandum states that:

“There is no expected impact on business, charities or voluntary bodies as the Department anticipates that only government assets and not those of private firms will be used to transport nuclear material by air”.

Is the Minister saying that the only people who will transport nuclear material will be the Ministry of Defence? I am not aware that her Department, or anyone else, has the transport assets to do that. Perhaps the Minister will come on to this, but could she also answer the point I raised about the MOD subcontracting to private firms?

[Andrea Leadsom]

As I have already mentioned a couple of times, for security reasons we cannot comment or speculate on different methods of transport, other than to say that the Office for Nuclear Regulation is entirely responsible for the transport plans. As I have already made clear, we do not believe that any commercial transportation group is capable of transferring civil nuclear material, but it is for the Office for Nuclear Regulation to determine all those plans, including the regulation of those who are authorised to carry out the transportation. That includes the vetting of the individuals, the security of the personnel, the security of the vehicles used and the training regimes that are in place.

[Andrea Leadsom]

Again, I absolutely respect the hon. Gentleman’s concern and I absolutely share it. First, this is not something that would happen every day. Having looked as a Minister at some of these transportations, I know that the amount of planning is vast, as can be imagined. It is extremely carefully and rigorously carried out by the Office for Nuclear Regulation, which exists to regulate nuclear matters—nothing else. I can absolutely assure him that the safety of the public, the transportation, the staff involved and so on would be completely uppermost in its thoughts.

The hon. Member for North Durham asked exactly what categories of material would be transported. The regulations will apply to a broad range of nuclear materials, as set out in regulation 3 of the 2003 regulations and the schedule to it. Quite a broad range of possible waste is being transported.

[Mr Jones]

Would that include, for example, medical isotopes? They are perhaps not as great a concern as large radioactive materials from Dounreay and elsewhere, but are isotopes for medical use covered by the regulations?

[Andrea Leadsom]

Yes, civil nuclear products, which could include a wide range as set out in the 2003 regulations, would potentially all be included. Likewise, the hon. Member for Nottingham North raised the matter of terrorist risk. Again, for security reasons we do not comment on operational security issues, but very robust safety and security measures are in place for all movements of nuclear materials. That is absolutely key.

One hon. Member, possibly the hon. Member for North Durham, asked whether the regulations extend to overseas territories. The answer is no. If there was an operational need, we would discuss putting appropriate regulations in place with the overseas territory.

The hon. Member for Midlothian asked about safety and what happens if there is an accident. Appropriate emergency response arrangements exist at nuclear sites and for all civil nuclear transports across the country. All relevant parties are made aware in advance of any movements and are of course ready to respond in the case of an emergency.

[Andrea Leadsom]

The hon. Gentleman will appreciate that there is always a balance between telling everyone what is going on, precisely because of the importance of security, and ensuring that the most robust steps are taken to ensure the safety of the public and those involved with transportation.

[Mr Jones]

I may be wrong, but I understand that gold command in an area is usually informed of those types of transportation.

Draft Infrastructure Planning (Onshore Wind Generating Stations) Order 2016

Debate between Lord Beamish and Andrea Leadsom

Monday 22nd February 2016 General Committees

[Andrea Leadsom]

I will try to respond to everyone’s questions. They were coming at me thick and fast, but hopefully I have caught them all.

First, I thank the hon. Member for Southampton, Test, who asked how this statutory instrument will affect the DCLG and the planning process overall, and in particular whether onshore appeals will still take place. The call-in powers and recovery capability of the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government will remain. Call-in powers are used by the Secretary of State, or in Wales by Welsh Ministers, when a decision is taken to move an application away from a local planning authority and to make the decision themselves. Similarly, recovered appeals are used when those Ministers decide to make the final decision on an appeal themselves, rather than the Planning Inspectorate making it on their behalf. The Secretary of State or a Welsh Minister will reserve the right to call in applications and recover appeals. That power is already devolved in Wales.

Secondly, the hon. Gentleman asked whether there are any transitional arrangements. A transitional arrangement applies when a valid planning application for a wind energy development had already been submitted to a local planning authority when the written ministerial statement was made last year and the development plan does not identify suitable sites. In such instances, a local planning authority may find the proposal acceptable if, following consultation, it is satisfied that the proposal has addressed the planning concerns of the affected local communities and therefore has their backing. In the case of appeals, it would need to be considered by planning inspectors on a case-by-case basis.

The hon. Member for North Durham raised the same question and asked what happens in the local planning authority process for determining whether there is local agreement. It will normally be the case that local planning permission will be given where there is scope in the local plan, as agreed by the local authority, for general approval of wind farms in its area. If a local planning authority has not yet identified sites for wind farms, there is a transitional arrangement whereby it may find a proposal acceptable following consultation with local communities, which was set out in the DCLG ministerial statement that was laid before the House last June.

[Mr Jones]

I am grateful for that reply, but County Durham, for example, is still going through the process of developing its local plan because it was rejected by the inspector. Where does that leave a county such as County Durham, which at the moment does not have a local plan in place, when determining where the sites should be?

[Andrea Leadsom]

As I said, in that transitional period, the local authority would need to consult local communities to address any concerns that they may have and only then approve a planning application when the site has the backing of local communities. That was set out in the ministerial statement in June last year. I think I have answered the hon. Gentleman’s question—

[Mr Jones]

You haven’t.

[Andrea Leadsom]

I will give way one last time.

[Mr Jones]

What the Minister is saying is that if local people object, the application can be turned down. Surely guidance has to be given to the local authorities on what is and is not a suitable site. There is guidance for every other type of thing. She is arguing for a situation in which, in a place such as County Durham where there is no plan, if local people object, the proposal will be stopped. I am sure developers would not like that.

[Andrea Leadsom]

The national planning policy framework encourages local councils to consider identifying suitable areas for renewable energy; equally, local neighbourhood plans can identify sites. As I have said to the hon. Gentleman, it is absolutely the case—it was in our manifesto—that we are determined that local communities have the final say, so he is exactly right: in the event that the local authority cannot get the backing of the local community, it will turn down that application, and that is the point about our manifesto commitment.

Moving on to the point made by my hon. Friend the Member for Waveney, I am grateful for his support for the measure, which takes local planning absolutely to the forefront for all onshore wind. I am also grateful to my hon. Friend the Member for Montgomeryshire for raising the very important point about how, under devolution, the Welsh Government decide how they intend to hear onshore wind farm applications. I can only confirm to him that it will be for them to decide, and I share his concern that given that this Government’s policy is to ensure that local communities have their say and have the last word, it will be unfortunate if that is not the case in Wales for those in his community who want it to be, but this is a devolved matter and it will be for Welsh Ministers to decide.

[Andrea Leadsom]

As I think I said, the national planning policy framework encourages local authorities to identify sites that are suitable for renewable energy. It also encourages neighbourhood development plans to do the same. I want to be clear that this Government believe in devolving powers to local authorities. We made a manifesto commitment that local communities will have the final say on onshore windfarms.

[Mr Jones]

Will the Minister give way?

[Andrea Leadsom]

I will not give way again; I have answered the question three times. It is absolutely our settled position that local communities will have the final say. The ministerial statement issued by the Department for Communities and Local Government in June last year sets out the process by which local communities will be able to have their say on onshore windfarm applications. By transferring decisions out of Whitehall to local planning authorities, combined with the measures set out by the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government, we are putting local communities in the driving seat. That will deliver our manifesto commitment by ensuring that new onshore wind—

[Mr Jones]

On a point of order, Mr Nuttall. I thought the purpose of these Committees was to scrutinise the piece of legislation before us. The Minister is refusing to answer the legitimate concerns expressed by my hon. Friend the Member for Southampton, Test and the points I have raised. It is not the case that it is somehow left up to people to decide. A planning appeal has to go through a legal process. I expect the Minister to answer those points.