Great British Energy Bill

Lord Cryer Excerpts

Report stage
Tuesday 11th February 2025 Lords Chamber

[Viscount Hanworth (Lab)]

I have been asked to speak on his behalf. Is that liable? That was his request.

[Lord in Waiting/Government Whip (Lord Cryer) (Lab)]

Yes.

[Viscount Hanworth (Lab)]

I will be brief.

The noble Viscount declares an interest as a member of the advisory board of Penultimate Power. In speaking to his amendment, I will rely on text that he has provided. He is concerned that Great British Energy might be devoted to the pursuit of the immediate agenda of NESO—the National Energy System Operator—to the detriment of the nuclear agenda, which has a longer time scale. The recent NESO documents have concentrated on wind and solar power, alongside the capture and storage of carbon dioxide emitted by standby stations, but they barely mention nuclear power.

The noble Viscount, Lord Trenchard, acknowledges that the Minister declared that it would be within the competence of Great British Energy to invest in nuclear power and to do the other things in relation to nuclear. Here I must use the own words of the noble Viscount, Lord Trenchard:

“I’m afraid that on reflection I don’t think that was clear enough. The Minister’s mention of GBN suggests that its continuation restricts the scope of GBE in relation to nuclear”.


He goes on to say:

“The Minister seemed to be saying that GBE could always invest in a nuclear power project; but that this should fall primarily within the scope of GBN. The Energy Act 2023 specifies that GBN’s objectives are to facilitate nuclear energy projects. However, it is silent on the provision of financial assistance for such projects”.

--- Later in debate ---

Finally, the noble Viscount, Lord Trenchard, makes a revealing observation that 18.3% of our energy supply on 8 February was imported from abroad and that it contained a substantial amount of power generated by French nuclear power stations. This dwarfed the contribution of wind, at 7.6%, and of our own nuclear fleet, which amounted to 10.2% of the total. I thank noble Lords for their indulgence in allowing me to speak on his behalf.

[Lord Cryer (Lab)]

I apologise for intervening. For future reference, moving an amendment on behalf of another Member is permissible, but reading a speech out on behalf of another Member is not, according to the guide.

[Lord Howell of Guildford (Con)]

My Lords, as the noble Viscount, Lord Hanworth, pointed out, it is a bit odd if we think about it. Since we started on this Bill, the Prime Minister has been making some very lively speeches, but going in a different direction. According to the newspapers, he wants to power the energy-hungry data centres needed for artificial intelligence. We all know about those: they are being built and they cannot get enough juice. He expects this own party to back small nuclear reactors in their constituencies. The headline is, “Starmer to Push Past Nimbys and Build Many New Nuclear Plants”. This is all extremely welcome to me. It is the sort of tone we have to adopt 10 times over to meet the challenges and the vast amount of clean electricity that we need. So it is strange that we are here in the meanwhile pursuing an area where nuclear is “verboten”, to use a German term. The noble Viscount, Lord Hanworth, has got a point. I would like a comment from the Minister on whether we are still on the right track or whether we should scrap the whole thing and start with a different policy of him backing the Prime Minister.

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Petitgas (Con)]

It seems to me that, earlier, the noble Lord, Lord Teverson, answered a question that was not the exam question. I do not understand why he brought immigration numbers into the equation, and I do not understand why—

[Lord Cryer (Lab)]

Order! We cannot have an exchange like this.

[Lord Hamilton of Epsom (Con)]

I thank my noble friend for answering the question for me.

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Teverson (LD)]

On a point of personal clarification, I mentioned it because there was an undertaking, made publicly, that net immigration would come down to 10,000.

[Lord Cryer (Lab)]

Order! We are not discussing an immigration Bill. We are discussing an energy Bill, so could we stick to order and stick to the scope of the amendment?

[Earl Russell (LD)]

My Lords, I shall speak against Amendments 23 and 24. If the Conservative Benches had put forward something saying that Labour should be held to account for the promises that they have made, then yes, they should. Should those promises be enacted in this overpoliticised amendment? No, because that is not the way that we do things.

This is a very politicised amendment. It does nothing to help bill payers, nothing to make Great British Energy any better at delivering for bill payers and nothing to reduce costs for bill payers. Amendments 23 and 24 are amendments for leaflets and nothing more. They are pointless, petty grandstanding.

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Offord of Garvel (Con)]

My Lords, I rise to speak in support of my noble friend Lord Fuller’s amendment. In tabling it, he raises a matter of utmost importance: our nation’s food security and the agriculture industry, which has been subjected to punitive tax measures by the Government.

This debate is not about whether we should install renewable energy technologies; it is about where we should develop renewable energy. At best, we can hope that, indirectly, GB Energy will help to power and heat British homes in a bid to achieve clean power by 2030. However, it is imperative that the Government’s race to renewables does not come at the expense of British agriculture and food production. It should be known that, when land is used for solar farms, it does not see agricultural use for decades. We must look to protect the most versatile and fruitful land to feed the nation. This is not to say that there will not be land that can be used for renewable energy production. Ultimately, we cannot find ourselves in a position where we have warm homes but no food on our plates. Our energy security trumps food security.

My noble friend raised his concerns in Committee but, regretfully, the Minister’s response was rather unsatisfactory. It is essential that the protection of agricultural land for renewable energy development is embedded in law. With that in mind, I urge all noble Lords to support my noble friend. The amendment in his name presents us and the Government with an opportunity to take decisive action to reserve agricultural land for food production. I will support my noble friend Lord Fuller if he wishes to test the opinion of the House.

[Lord Cryer (Lab)]

My Lords, I turn to Amendments 50 and 52 in the name of the noble Lord, Lord Fuller, and spoken to in his prose poem of a speech. The importance of maintaining our natural resources to support UK agriculture and of supporting local stakeholder consultation in affairs that affect their surroundings and quality of environment are values that we share with the noble Lord. However, for the reasons that I will now set out, I must resist these amendments.

Great British Energy will be subject to the same rigorous planning processes that currently exist to protect agricultural land and minimise the effects on food security. The National Planning Policy Framework includes the preservation of agricultural land for food production as a key consideration in its legal framework governing renewable energy products. It emphasises the need to protect the best and most versatile agricultural land—namely, as the noble Lord, Lord Fuller, said, grades 1, 2 and 3A.

More broadly, looking beyond these specific amendments, the Government recognise that food security is national security—again, as the noble Lord, Lord Fuller, said. The Government do not believe that the accelerated rollout of solar generation poses a threat to food security; I will come on to that in a minute. The total area used by solar farms is very small: even in the most ambitious scenarios, less than 1% of the UK’s agricultural land would be occupied by solar farms. Furthermore, solar generation can be co-located with agriculture, and many projects are designed to enable continued livestock grazing alongside energy generation. Innovation may also reduce the impact of solar farms on agriculture. The emerging science of agrivoltaics is developing innovative ways in which solar can be integrated with arable farming

On statistics, it has often been argued that the land use framework says that 9% of land will be used for energy development. The noble Lord, Lord Fuller, mentioned the 9% figure; although he did not actually say that that would cover energy generation entirely, it was implied. This is not actually correct. The 9% figure covers agricultural land that would be used for the creation and restoration of habitats—I emphasise “restoration of habitats”—such as woodland, heathland, grassland and peatland. It does not cover generation alone. Defra will publish in the near future a land use consultation as an important first step in starting a national conversation on land use. There is also evidence that solar can improve biodiversity in certain areas and under certain circumstances when it is installed on agricultural land.

For these reasons, I hope that the noble Lord is assured that Great British Energy will always consider the effects on our agricultural land as a necessary element of its regulatory approvals and will, therefore, withdraw his amendment—although I am not holding my breath.

[Lord Fuller (Con)]

My Lords, I listened carefully to what the Minister said. I will not respond in detail and this is not the place, save to say that you do not have to be an expert or a regular listener to “Gardeners’ Question Time” to know that not much grows in the shade. The suggestion that agrivoltaics on arable land might be some sort of amelioration is for the birds.

I am itching to withdraw this amendment, but the Minister and I are so far apart. He says “less than 1%”. The land use framework contemplates more than 9% being taken out of production. There is an appropriate tension to be drawn between food security and energy security. I am afraid that I have not received the assurances that I require. Therefore, I beg leave to test the opinion of the House.