Financial Statement and Budget Report

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Wednesday 6th March 2024 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

As many as are of that opinion say Aye—[Hon. Members: “Aye!”] Of the contrary, No—[Hon. Members: “No!”] [Interruption.] Order. Let me explain, for the clarification of the House, that the Question on the provisional collection of taxes is asked at this stage. All Members will have the opportunity, having heard the debate in detail, to vote on each of the motions on Tuesday 12 March, at the end of the Budget debate. I would hesitate to call a Division at this point, when the House and the world is awaiting the response from the Leader of the Opposition. [Interruption.]

I will put the Question again, and if it is very clear to me that there are more Ayes than Noes, I will take the decision on the voices. The Question is—

[Sir Jacob Rees-Mogg (North East Somerset) (Con)]

On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker.

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

No, I do not need a point of order, thank you. We are in the middle of putting the Question. As many as are of that opinion say Aye—[Hon. Members: “Aye!”] Of the contrary, No—[Hon. Members: “No!”]

Retained EU Law (Revocation and Reform) Bill

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

2nd reading
Tuesday 25th October 2022 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

I appreciate the sensitivities. The hon. Gentleman knows that the content of the right hon. Gentleman’s speech is not a matter for the Chair, and not one on which I will comment, but he has made his point.

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

I now give way to my right hon. Friend the Member for South Northamptonshire (Dame Andrea Leadsom).

Business of the House

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Thursday 2nd December 2021 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

Order. Before the Leader of the House answers the points made by the hon. Gentleman, I feel it incumbent upon me to clarify that the hon. Gentleman is absolutely right in what he said about my ruling on what the parliamentary leader of the SNP, the right hon. Member for Ross, Skye and Lochaber (Ian Blackford), was permitted to say in this Chamber during the Opposition day debate earlier this week. However, I must make it absolutely clear to the House, because I do not think this has been widely understood, that that was very specifically in the context of the debate being on a censure motion about a particular person, and the use of any word that implies that a Member of this House has not told the truth is allowed only in that very narrow context. This is not to be taken as a general ruling that these words can be used. There are, of course, always polite and moderate ways of making points, and that is how they should be made here in this Chamber.

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

I am delighted that the hon. Gentleman is so easily pleased. Had I realised that he would become sweetness and light merely by my momentarily wearing a mask, I may have been tempted to do it before the Christmas season or the season of Advent was upon us.

The hon. Gentleman wants to bat back and forth opinion polls, and I note that, as I told him last week, even SNP supporters do not think that having a referendum on independence is very important. I think they want to see the SNP Government in Scotland getting on with running Scotland properly—making the health service work, building the roads and dealing with all the problems that they are singularly failing to deal with. They could not even get the new advice out to vaccination centres so that people could get their vaccines when the advice was changed around the country at large.

The hon. Gentleman wishes me to go to the House of Lords, which is very flattering of him. He is clearly unaware of the 1539 Act about places in Parliament—the House of Lords Precedence Act 1539—which allows the Lord President, when not a peer, to go and sit in the House of Lords. It is not a privilege I have ever taken up, as I am worried that their lordships might be a bit surprised, but the Lord High Chancellor, the Lord Privy Seal, the Lord President of the Council, the Lord Treasurer—a position currently in commission—and various others have the right to go and sit in the House of Lords when they are not peers, so I assume that is what the hon. Gentleman was talking about.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

How remarkable that there are two survivors from a disaster 92 years ago—they must be shortly due to receive a telegram from Her Majesty to congratulate them on their longevity, if they have not already. I would indeed like to join the hon. Gentleman in congratulating the organisations that have built and paid for the memorial of this terrible tragedy, killing 71 children—all children. I particularly praise Paisley Rotary, because I am a Rotarian for Midsomer Norton and Radstock rotary. The unsung work that Rotarians do up and down the country is really heroic in so many of our communities. They do things that other people do not necessarily want to do and they just get on with quietly. They do not ask for a lot of thanks, so I particularly thank Paisley Rotary.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

I cannot help saying to the Lord President of the Council that my grandfather was a founder member of Paisley Rotary club. The question from the hon. Member for Paisley and Renfrewshire North (Gavin Newlands) is really important in Paisley, as was the right hon. Gentleman’s answer.

I call Mr Liddell-Grainger.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

That is exactly the sort of thing where raising it in Parliament ought to solve the problem. I will take this up with the Home Office if the hon. Gentleman will send me more details. There is nothing more frustrating than when the Government say, “We were considering your application. Now you have passed the deadline, so we can’t consider it.” That is something that happens in bureaucratic systems and the great joy of democracy is that we flush bureaucracy away on these occasions.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

And the prize for patience and perseverance—

Points of Order

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Thursday 2nd December 2021 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

As the hon. Gentleman knows, that is not a point of order for the Chair. I am not really impartial on the matter of Scots law. If the Lord President wishes to respond, he may do so.

[The Leader of the House of Commons (Mr Jacob Rees-Mogg)]

Madam Deputy Speaker, I was absolutely clear that I think it is good and thoroughly beneficial when people go back to work, including in the DWP. I did not mention Scots law; that was not within the remit of my answer.

[Chris Law (Dundee West) (SNP)]

rose—

Business of the House

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Monday 29th November 2021 Commons Chamber

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

I do not want to be unhelpful, but that question might have been better asked during the statement of my right hon. Friend, the Secretary of State for Health and Social Care who would have been able to give a direct answer. I suggest that the hon. Lady raises it in the debate tomorrow.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

We now move on to the next item of business. I will delay for a moment to let people leave the Chamber quietly and safely with the usual social distancing.

We now come on to the House of Lords (Elected Senate) Bill.

Business of the House

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Thursday 18th November 2021 Commons Chamber

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

My hon. Friend is making me think of Jaws from the James Bond films and what might happen if teeth are stuck in, or those children who have railway tracks put on their teeth to straighten them up. His question is very important. The pandemic has had a significant effect on dentistry, and we continue to work on recovering NHS dental services. We are addressing regional shortages of dentists by working with the NHS to try to ensure that training place numbers are better aligned with the needs of local populations. NHS England and NHS Improvement are developing proposals for dental system reform, working closely with the Department of Health and Social Care and other interested parties. I think this is being chewed over. There is some mastication going on, and I hope that we will not all become indentured servants.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

Dreadful!

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

This is an issue that the Government take seriously, and it has been considered by my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport. The Digital, Culture, Media and Sport Committee, of which the hon. Gentleman sponsoring the Bill, the hon. Member for Cardiff West (Kevin Brennan), is a member, launched an inquiry into the economics of music streaming, which heard from key actors in the music industry, including artists, record labels and streaming platforms.

The Committee’s report was published on 15 July and made several recommendations to the Government for a broad set of regulatory interventions, intended to address issues with artists’ streaming royalties, and including a performer’s right to equitable remuneration similar to that proposed in the Bill. However, the Committee’s report did not provide sufficient evidence to support legislative action. The impact of introducing a new equitable remuneration right would be significant, so, while the Government are not unsympathetic, more evidence is needed before any action can be taken.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

Before I call the hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon), and while the hon. Member for Gateshead (Ian Mearns), the Chair of the Backbench Business Committee, is still in the Chamber, I draw the attention of the House to the fact that, in my capacity as Chairman of Ways and Means, overseeing matters in Westminster Hall, I have just been informed that the Backbench Business Committee has been unable to fill the slot available for Backbench Business debates on Tuesday 30 November. Yet I have sat here listening to people asking for debates and the Lord President rightly referring them to the hon. Member for Gateshead.

I feel it necessary to make this point—I hope it is heard more widely—that it would appear that Members are coming to the Chamber to ask the Leader of the House for a slot for a debate, but they are not at the same time applying to the hon. Member for Gateshead for a debate through the Backbench Business Committee. The Lord President has acknowledged the need for debates over the past 40 minutes; the Chairman of the Backbench Business Committee is sitting here noting all these requests for debates, and yet those Members have not applied to his Committee for slots. Something is wrong here. I feel it necessary to make that point; it would be a pity to lose the opportunity to do so, since I have just been informed of this slot on 30 November. The hon. Gentleman tells me, “Applications by tomorrow,” so if you want your debate, do not ask the Leader of the House—apply to the hon. Member for Gateshead.

Business of the House

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Thursday 28th October 2021 Commons Chamber

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

I find myself in complete agreement with the hon. Gentleman. It is not something that I was aware of. I was not aware of Cuthbert Taylor, but that he should have been banned for his colour at any point in our history is simply monstrous, and any organisation that was involved with that ought to try to right a wrong. As it is a very specific issue, it is very suitable for an Adjournment debate, but as it is a very serious issue I hope it will be an Adjournment debate in the Chamber.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

The prize for perseverance and patience goes to Olivia Blake.

Business of the House

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Thursday 15th July 2021 Commons Chamber

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

My deepest sympathies go to Mrs Dixon. It must be terribly difficult when dealing with a death in the family then to find that probate is not working efficiently and that she is being passed from pillar to post. On the assumption that the hon. Gentleman has already been in touch with the Lord Chancellor and his Department, I will take this up with the Department immediately after business questions to try to ensure that at least he gets an answer in relation to Mrs Dixon, although I cannot necessarily promise a statement on the wider issues concerning the probate service.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

We now go by video link to James Murray. [Hon. Members: “He’s here!”] Oh, we don’t. It tells me here that you are virtual, Mr Murray, but here you are.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

Indeed I do. Flooding causes devastation for communities, homes and businesses. Local flood risk management, including surface water, falls to local flood authorities—county and unitary authorities—which must identify and manage those risks as part of their local flood risk management strategy. I understand that Thames Water is building a huge super sewer around London, which I hope will be better able to cope with flooding or sudden storms when they come, rather than having the marvellous sewer built by Bazalgette in the 19th century overwhelmed. My hon. Friend raises a point that is of great concern to Members across the House. In a country such as ours, with the rainfall that we have, we need to be able to cope with storms.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

I will now suspend the House for three minutes in order that arrangements can be made for the next item of business.

English Votes for English Laws

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Tuesday 13th July 2021 Commons Chamber

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

Ministers have their different areas of responsibility. Within Ministries some areas are devolved and the Ministers will obviously consult with devolved Ministers; it is important that we have a good relationship with them. Other areas are not devolved and remain the competences of the UK Government, and those matters are decided by the Ministers themselves on behalf of the whole of the United Kingdom. This system is quite well known and understood.

The House will be delighted to note that I am now coming to the end of my speech. The right hon. Member for Orkney and Shetland (Mr Carmichael) said that I was being generous with my time, but I am not really; I am being generous with the House’s time, and I am aware that this debate is time-limited. The motion seeks to make the process of legislating on matters that deliver for everyone in the UK just a little easier, and it is on that basis that I commend the motion to the House.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

There will obviously there will be a limit of three minutes on Back-Bench speeches, but as Members have already worked out, most will not have the opportunity to speak. I see that they are dealing with that by making interventions, which is fine because that is what a debate is all about.

Business of the House

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Monday 12th July 2021 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

I will allow that question because it is very specific.

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

My right hon. Friend is coming on to some of the topics that will be discussed tomorrow. It is in effect a deponent motion: it is passive in form, but active in meaning.

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

My right hon. Friend is a former Chief Whip, and he will know that the progress of business is dependent upon the loquacity of hon. and right hon. Members, which is not something it is possible for me to predict.

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

How true!

Business of the House

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Thursday 24th June 2021 Commons Chamber

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

I believe that it is Yorkshire Tea National Cricket Week, so it is a good occasion on which to be raising this matter. The previous recordholder was Sameer Khan Yousufee, who ran two and a half miles before getting to bowl. I am a bit worried about the over rates—if they keep on bowling at that rate the dismal rates that we get in test matches will be even slower, though I do wonder quite how fast Wes Hall or Michael Holding might have bowled had their run-ups been even longer than they were. I am also quite intrigued by the commentary. How would even Henry Blofeld keep going for the quarter of an hour or so—[Interruption.] The hon. Member for Bristol West (Thangam Debbonaire) heckles me to say that she is sure he would. She is probably right, but it would be quite a challenge to keep it up for all that time. It is absolutely brilliant that we should have this record. I am glad that a wide was not bowled and hope that it was not a no ball either. We should do everything we can to encourage grassroots cricket; it is part of our nation’s story, something that we can be proud of and one of our great exports to the rest of the world.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

That is the most incomprehensible answer that I have ever heard the Lord President give, but I appreciate that that is my failing, not his, in an understanding of the subject. I will now suspend the House for three minutes, so that preparations can be made for the next item of business.

Business of the House

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Thursday 25th March 2021 Commons Chamber

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

The Government have introduced an unprecedented package of support for businesses throughout the pandemic and are working closely with local authorities to ensure that funding can get to the right places as quickly as is practicable. The additional restrictions grant continues to enable local authorities to put in place discretionary business support. Local authorities are free to provide support that suits their local area, including support for those businesses that are not required to close but whose trade has been severely affected by restrictions, and those businesses that fall outside the business rates system, such as market traders. But it is a discretionary system and if we believe in local accountability and local decision making, sometimes we have to accept that the local decisions will not be the decisions that we ourselves would have made.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

I am sure that the Lord President of the Council will welcome the launch of the Dame Vera Lynn appeal.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

My hon. Friend is absolutely right. The Government recognise the strain that has been put on children and their families over the past year. Ensuring that children can play and socialise safely again is a great priority. They also have fun; am I allowed to use the word “fun”, Madam Deputy Speaker? Children ought to enjoy themselves. The Scouts and Brownies ensure that children enjoy themselves. They look at that great figure Bear Grylls and think, “Perhaps I can eat a slug too; what will my parents have to say?” [Interruption.] There may also be vegetarian scouts who do not want to eat slugs; I accept the heckle from the Opposition Bench.

That is very important, as is the mental health of children, which the Government are doing a great deal to support, with an extra £79 million to boost mental health support for children and young people. Some 22,500 more children and young people will have access to such services next year, and an additional 345,000 by 2024. The last year has been difficult. Let us hope that the Scouts and Guides, wonderful features of our civic life that they are, will open up soon and that children will be able to enjoy themselves and, dare I say it, do those things that their parents probably do not always approve of until they find out about them later.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

So true.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

I absolutely congratulate my hon. Friend and his constituent Emma Lou on winning the mascot design competition for the 2022 Commonwealth games, which will take place in Birmingham. I am delighted to hear that they are going to be the best ever—we take that as a firm promise from my hon. Friend—and to hear about Perry the bull, inspired by the city’s famous Bullring.

I remember as a child a story about Ferdinand the bull, who did not like to fight but liked to sit there smelling the flowers, until he got stung by a bee and therefore charged around like billy-oh. The bullfighting catchers were around that day and they took him off, and then he sat in the bullring sniffing the flowers. It was a bit of a disappointment for the audience. I hope Perry is a more active bull, with his fantastic horns and his colourful hexagons. It is very encouraging that the mascot has been chosen—and would I pose for a photo with Perry? I would be honoured, Madam Deputy Speaker, and I hope you will join me.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

I am sure I would be delighted, Lord President.

Points of Order

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Thursday 25th March 2021 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for his very reasonable point of order.

[The Leader of the House of Commons (Mr Jacob Rees-Mogg)]

indicated assent.

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

I can see that the Leader of the House agrees that it is reasonable.

I may be mistaken, but after the hon. Gentleman asked his question of the Leader of the House I am pretty sure that I heard the Leader of the House give an answer to the hon. Member for City of Chester (Christian Matheson) saying that he had been slightly mistaken about dates and confirming that the relevant date was in fact 17 February.

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

Yes, that is what I understand from the questions I received. I thought that the hon. Gentleman indicated a week ago and then the hon. Member for City of Chester indicated 17 February. I think, but this is not an absolute statement on oath, that 17 February is the accurate date.

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

Thank you. I heard the Leader of the House say that in answer to the hon. Member for City of Chester and I hope that the matter has now been cleared up. I thank the hon. Member for Midlothian (Owen Thompson) for giving us all the opportunity to make sure that the information given here in the Chamber is always accurate.

I will now suspend the House for three minutes in order that arrangements can be made for the next item of business.

Electoral Commission

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Monday 22nd March 2021 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

Before I call the Leader of the House to move the motion, I inform the House that Mr Speaker has not selected the amendment in the name of Mr Peter Bone.

[The Leader of the House of Commons (Mr Jacob Rees-Mogg)]

I beg to move,

That an humble Address be presented to Her Majesty, praying that Her Majesty will appoint John Pullinger CB as the Chair of the Electoral Commission with effect from 1 May 2021 for the period ending on 30 April 2025.

The Speaker’s Committee on the Electoral Commission has produced a report—its first report of 2021—in relation to the motion, which sets out in some detail the process by which Mr Pullinger was selected. It may help if I set out the key points for the record. Electoral commissioners, including the chairman of the commission, are appointed under the Political Parties, Elections and Referendums Act 2000, as amended by the Political Parties and Elections Act 2009. Under the Act, the Speaker’s Committee has a responsibility to put in place and oversee a procedure for the selection of candidates for appointment to the Electoral Commission.

On this occasion, the Committee asked Mr Speaker to appoint a panel to recommend a preferred candidate for the post. The panel consisted of Philippa Helme CB, independent chairman; Tony Hobman, a former electoral commissioner; Sarah Laessig, a former civil service commissioner; and two members of the Speaker’s Committee: the hon. Member for City of Chester (Christian Matheson) and my hon. Friend the Member for Hazel Grove (Mr Wragg), the Chairman of the Public Administration and Constitutional Affairs Committee. Following an open competition and interviews with shortlisted candidates, the panel’s unanimous view was that John Pullinger CB should be appointed as chairman of the Electoral Commission.

The Speaker’s Committee on the Electoral Commission considered the panel’s report and recommendation at its meeting on 26 January. It agreed to put John Pullinger’s name forward for the statutory consultation with the leaders of each registered party to which two or more Members of the House of Commons belong. That consultation provides an opportunity for the party leaders to comment, but they are not required to do so. No objection to John Pullinger’s appointment was received in response to the consultation.

The Speaker’s Committee subsequently held a public hearing with John Pullinger on 1 March to test his suitability for the role. A transcript of the hearing has been appended to the committee’s report. Following the hearing, the Speaker’s Committee agreed to recommend to the House that Mr Pullinger be appointed as chairman of the Electoral Commission for a four-year term.

John Pullinger was Librarian of the House of Commons from 2004 to 2014—he is remembered by many hon. and right hon. Members, and I hope that gives them confidence that a friend is being appointed—and he was the UK national statistician from 2014 to 2019. He is currently a fellow of the Academy of Social Sciences, a visiting professor at Imperial College London, and a governor of the National Institute of Economic and Social Research. I hope that the House will support this appointment, and I wish Mr Pullinger every success in his important role.

Business of the House

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Thursday 4th February 2021 Commons Chamber

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

My hon. Friend raises an extremely serious issue. I am glad that his constituency is benefiting from the direct action that the Government are taking to help authorities tackle serious crime, and I commend him for joining the local street patrol to see at first hand the difficulties that his constituents face as a result of criminal and antisocial behaviour. As my right hon. Friend the Home Secretary set out in her statement on 20 January, the Government are providing £148 million of taxpayers’ money to dismantle criminal gangs, tackle drug supply and support drug treatment services. As my hon. Friend mentioned, Project ADDER—it stands for addiction, diversion, disruption, enforcement and recovery —will trial a new approach to drug misuse, combining a targeted police approach with enhanced treatment services. It will run for three financial years in five areas—Blackpool, Hastings, Norwich, Middlesbrough and Swansea Bay. I encourage my hon. Friend to raise this further at Home Office questions on 8 February.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

We return to Stroud and Siobhan Baillie.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

My right hon. Friend has the most brilliantly obscure knowledge, because the approval of all coins does indeed come before the Privy Council on the suggestion of the Royal Mint. I hope that, as Lord President, I do see a proposal from the Royal Mint in due course. Captain Sir Tom Moore dedicated his life to serving his country and others, and he showed the value of all life when he, in his 100th and 101st years, showed that somebody of great age can make as important a contribution as anybody else in the country did over that past year, and it is a reminder to all of us of the value of life, and why it has been right to protect life as far as we possibly can during this incredibly difficult period.

“Requiem æternam dona eis, Domine:

et lux perpetua luceat eis.

Requiescat in pacem. Amen.”

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

Amen.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

I must confess I am surprised that my hon. Friend is modelling herself on the right hon. Member for Islington North (Jeremy Corbyn), as I know something of her political views; I do not think hers and his particularly coincide. However, I congratulate her on holding her local authority to account in the Chamber and representing her constituents so vigorously.

The issue that my hon. Friend raises is one for Durham County Council to consider, as it is responsible for the road in question. As I understand it, no bid from the council has as yet been forthcoming. The Government cannot currently make guarantees, but the new £4 billion levelling-up fund may offer an opportunity to support this project if local leaders make a convincing case. Further details of that fund will be announced in due course. I view it as part of my role as Leader of the House to try to facilitate meetings between Members and Ministers, so I will of course pass on my hon. Friend’s request to the Transport Secretary.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

I will briefly suspend the House in order that preparations can be made in the Chamber for the next item of business.

Business of the House

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Thursday 14th January 2021 Commons Chamber

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

May I really thank the hon. Lady for raising this issue in the House? I join her in thanking the Samaritans for the absolutely amazing work that they do that saves so many lives, and the commitment of Samaritans volunteers who take on the incredibly onerous responsibility and burden of speaking to people and encouraging them when they are at their lowest point, and having to deal with the tragedies that sometimes occur; they do remarkable work. The initiative to have an online brew day is absolutely first class, and if I possibly can join the hon. Lady, I will—although I am not sure that everybody would be that cheered to hear from me, so it would have to be a very selective audience that I talked to. [Laughter.]

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

Sorry; I did not mean to laugh. I am quite sure that the Lord President will have an excellent response on Monday. The hon. Member for Blaydon (Liz Twist) has worked very hard on this. I recall it being an excellent day last time. Let us hope that we can do the same on Monday.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

My right hon. Friend noted that the Minister responding was diffident about the reorganisation of Government. He may not be surprised if I am diffident too in this regard, because that is a right that belongs to the Prime Minister. I would like to commend the debate on Monday, because the Government fully recognise the importance of the UK hospitality sector, which makes a vital contribution to the UK economy. I am grateful to my right hon. Friend for raising this, because in my own constituency I have had certain correspondence and great concern from a wedding services company that has found maintaining its livelihood during this pandemic so exceptionally difficult.

Ministers in both the Department for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy and the Department for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport have worked closely with business leaders across the hospitality sector throughout the pandemic to ensure that their interests are represented. That engagement has helped to form the Government’s comprehensive package of support, including measures such as the reduction in VAT, the job retention scheme, the hospitality grant, and indeed the eat out to help out scheme. I will obviously pass this matter on to the relevant Secretaries of State, but my right hon. Friend might want to write to the Prime Minister directly with his suggestions for the reorganisation of Government.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

In order to enable the necessary arrangements for the next business to be made, I will suspend the House for three minutes.

Business of the House (Today)

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Wednesday 6th January 2021 Commons Chamber

[The Leader of the House of Commons (Mr Jacob Rees-Mogg)]

May I preface this by thanking the House for getting everything ready to come back today? I seem to need to amend my business statement in future to say that there will be a recall of Parliament on a frequent basis, but I hope this will change as we move into the new year.

The plan for Back-Bench business on Fridays is that it should continue. Therefore, Members will be able to participate in that, and will be able to do so remotely. Westminster Hall will continue, but will continue physically, as will Committees. There is a small broadcasting team shared between both the House of Lords and the House of Commons. When we looked into the cost of extending remote participation to Westminster Hall, it was going to be over £100,000, and there are limits to how much taxpayers’ money can be spent on this. However, it is important to ensure that proper scrutiny takes place, and it is very popular with Members and the Backbench Business Committee. So private Members’ Bills are to continue, Committees are to continue as they are and Westminster Hall is to continue as it is.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

Thank you for that informative piece of information.

Question put and agreed to.

Virtual Participation in Debate

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Tuesday 24th November 2020 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

Mr Speaker has selected the amendment in the name of John Baron.

[The Leader of the House of Commons (Mr Jacob Rees-Mogg)]

As this matter has been much discussed in this House, I will move it formally.

Motion made, and Question proposed,

That:

The Order of 4 June 2020 (Virtual Participation in Proceedings During the Pandemic (Temporary Orders)), as amended on 22 October, be further amended by adding at the end the following paragraphs:

() The Speaker shall draw up and publish a scheme to permit Members who are certified by a medical practitioner as clinically extremely vulnerable (or equivalent) according to relevant official public health guidance issued in England, Wales, Scotland or Northern Ireland, to participate virtually in such debates as are designated for virtual participation by the Speaker.

() The scheme drawn up by the Speaker shall include:

(a) arrangements for demonstrating and registering eligibility for virtual participation in designated debates;

(b) any other provisions the Speaker considers necessary to secure the effective implementation of this Order.—(Mr Rees-Mogg.)

Restoration and Renewal

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Thursday 16th July 2020 Commons Chamber

[The Leader of the House of Commons (Mr Jacob Rees- Mogg)]

I obviously cannot respond to every point made, but if any have been made that require a response, I will write to right hon. and hon. Members. I also encourage those Members who did not get called to speak to send their speeches to the challenge panel of the review board so that their views can be on the record. That is very important. If any Members have left the Chamber already, I will make sure they are notified of that suggestion. I will also send a copy of today’s Hansard to the challenge panel so that they have the views of all right hon. and hon. Members.

This has been an excellent debate. We have listened to a lot of new and developed thinking, including some fresh thinking from Members who entered in 2019, which is extraordinarily helpful. Two things are clear. One is how proud we are of this extraordinary building. We have heard Churchill quoted about how we make our buildings and then they make us. That comment is so right. How proud we are of this magnificent building, which symbolises the democracy we cherish and the pride we take in it.

The other thing that we realise is that in a time of economic difficulty we cannot spend vast amounts of money without ensuring that there is value for money. Everything that is done must be done with value for money in mind. If we have to take a little bit of inconvenience, so be it.

Question put and agreed to.

Resolved,

That this House has considered Restoration and Renewal.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

In order to allow the safe exit of hon. Members participating in this item of business and the safe arrival of those participating in the next, which is the statement, I am suspending the House for three minutes.

House Business during the Pandemic

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Monday 8th June 2020 Commons Chamber

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

That is very gracious, but customarily, if Members sit on the Benches chuntering, they might give the impression that they wish to contribute more formally, so that our friends in Hansard may hear their wise words. May I suggest that the hon. Gentleman think through his intervention, and I shall be delighted, nay, honoured to hear from him later. [Interruption.] Does the hon. Member for Rhondda also wish me to give way?

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

Order. Just because the hon. Member for Brighton, Kemptown was doing something wrong does not mean that that the hon. Member for Rhondda has to copy him.

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

Thank heavens, Madam Deputy Speaker, that we have you as Chairman of Ways and Means, to keep us in order in all our ways and many of our means.

The Zoom Parliament allowed some scrutiny to take place, and I was an enthusiastic advocate of having it. On 21 April, the choice was a Zoom Parliament, or no Parliament. Not only did we see Ministers coming to the Dispatch Box, but we were able to examine people’s homes and their bookcases. However, we also recognised its inadequacy. Hybridity was not sufficient.

Proceedings during the Pandemic

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Tuesday 2nd June 2020 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

Order. We might have gone back to having interventions, but that does not mean that we can have long interventions.

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

The ancient right to attend Parliament goes back to 1340, and, as the hon. Member for Rhondda (Chris Bryant) pointed out, this is something that has been used against the Crown in the past. It is a most important and long-standing right. There must always be an exemption for Members to attend Parliament. What I was going on to elaborate is that I will be bringing forward, as I promised on 20 May, a motion tomorrow to allow Members who, on medical grounds, are unable to attend to continue to appear for scrutiny—questions, urgent questions and statements—remotely. That will be brought forward tomorrow, as I promised on 20 May when we discussed these matters in response to an urgent question.

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[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

Order. Just before the Lord President answers the intervention, I am also concerned about the rights of as many Members as possible to participate this afternoon. Several Members have intervened more than once. Let us have a bit of restraint.

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

Sometimes the hon. Member for Rhondda makes the point for me more eloquently than I could have made it myself: there is an absolute right of Members to attend Parliament. It is a most antique right. It predates the Stuarts and, as I keep on saying, it goes back to 1340. Members may attend if they wish to.

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[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

Order. I thank the hon. Gentleman, but I do not need his point of order. I have been trying to move the debate forward, but Members are so excited at being back here and being allowed to intervene that they are doing it far too often. No more interventions.

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

The interventions prove my point: we need interventions to make Parliament work properly. We need proper debate. We need to be back. We need to have a proper, full-blooded democracy, and that is what we are getting.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

I call the shadow Leader of the House, Valerie Vaz. I trust that Members will not unnecessarily make interventions upon the right hon. Lady, because I am hoping she will not take more than five or six minutes. Otherwise, we simply will run out of time.

Liaison (Membership)

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Wednesday 20th May 2020 Commons Chamber

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

We are having an election; there may be a Division—

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

Order. The right hon. Gentleman will not interrupt.

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. I turn to the amendment in the name of the right hon. and learned Member for Camberwell and Peckham (Ms Harman) and others. It seeks to limit the eligibility of those who can chair the Committee to existing Select Committee Chairs. The Government have chosen to put forward a distinguished Member to chair the Liaison Committee. It is for the House to decide—extending the degree of democracy—whether it agrees the Government’s motion and thereby approves my hon. Friend’s appointment. In this way, the motion is the most democratic way of providing a mandate for the Chairman of the Liaison Committee.

It is worth noting that it has not always been the case that the Committee has elected its own Chairman from among the ranks of Select Committee Chairs. In fact, as recently as 2010, when the right hon. and learned Member for Camberwell and Peckham was Leader of the House, a Member who was not a pre-existing Select Committee Chairman was the Liaison Committee Chairman, in accordance with an earlier, similar motion agreed by the House.

The Government respect the work of the Select Committees of this House and their independence in holding the Government to account. Today’s motion will allow the Liaison Committee to begin its work. As is right, the House can now decide whether the motion is agreeable, including whether the chairmanship be taken up by my hon. Friend the Member for Harwich and North Essex. I hope we can achieve a resolution today and allow the Liaison Committee to begin its important work in scrutinising the Government and supporting other Committees in this House. I commend this motion to the House.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

Thank you. We have a very short time left for this debate, so I must ask that every speaker now takes no more than three minutes. I call Valerie Vaz, who is asked to speak for no more than three minutes.

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[Mr Rees-Mogg]

Within this House, one always knows that it is a weak argument when it is overstated, and I have to say that I have never heard a more overstated argument than that which we have received from the Opposition Benches.

The idea that my hon. Friend the Member for Harwich and North Essex (Sir Bernard Jenkin) is not one of most independent-minded Members of this House is patently absurd. He has stood up for this House, as my hon. Friend the Member for Wellingborough (Mr Bone) has pointed out, throughout his parliamentary career. One of the threads running through the career of my hon. Friend the Member for Harwich and North Essex is that he has stood up for the interests of the House of Commons, be that in ensuring that the sovereignty of the House of Commons and of Parliament generally is maintained, or ensuring that the House of Commons was not overwhelmed by a shift of power to the House of Lords. He has held Ministers to account, and I am glad that the Chief Whip has come into the Chamber because my hon. Friend has been the bane of the life of Chief Whips since he was elected in 1992. It is therefore well known that he will be independent minded.

I also think it is peculiar to suggest that a vote of the whole House is less democratic than a vote of the clique within the House. That obviously cannot be true. Allowing the whole House to vote is the most democratic form we have. In this House, we boldly express our opinion publicly so that our voters know precisely what we think. We do not need to hide away in the shadows. We are happy to say that my hon. Friend the Member for Harwich and North Essex is the right person for this job and that is why he has support.

I would say to the hon. Member for Edinburgh East (Tommy Sheppard) that constitutionally he does not fully appreciate how the system works. The Executive and the legislature have a symbiotic relationship. The Executive is drawn from the legislature. We are not like the United States, where there is no interconnection. Therefore, we always have in this House, and always have done going back into the mists of time, a relationship between the Executive and legislature, but that does not mean that the votes of the legislature are not democratic votes. They clearly and self-evidently are.

Moving on to the amendment and why I oppose it on behalf of Her Majesty’s Government, it is very straightforward. We are widening democracy, widening scrutiny and allowing the whole House to come to a decision on who should chair the Liaison Committee. We are taking away that decision, admittedly, from a smaller group to give it to a larger group, which is the proper thing to be doing.

Nobody, not one person who has spoken today, has suggested that my hon. Friend is anything other than impartial—[Interruption.] I hear various chunterings from the Opposition Benches. The principle of the House deciding is the most ancient principle of the House of Commons. That is the right way for us to do it. We decide by our vote. That is the art of democracy and this is the right procedure to be using to ensure that happens. [Interruption.] Oh, we have a chunter, “There’s only one candidate.” Did anybody else decide to amend the motion to suggest another candidate? Perhaps Opposition Members do not know how the procedures of Parliament work. May I give them a little bit of advice? If they are ever in any doubt as to how the procedures of the House work, there are many able, hard-working and thoughtful Clerks who will give them advice and they can work out how to put down amendments, but no other name came forward. Nobody else had any confidence in any other Member to do this job, which I know will be done extraordinarily well by my hon. Friend.

I happen to know that actually the Government have appointed someone who will be so independent-minded that if anyone thinks that he will be an easy ride, that person is mistaken. I commend the motion unamended to the House.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

I must now conclude the debate and put the question in accordance with the Order of today. Before I put the question, I confirm that Mr Speaker’s final determination is that the question on the amendment should be decided by remote Division. There is therefore no need for me to collect the voices, or for Members present in the Chamber to shout aye or no. The question is that the amendment be made. The question falls to be decided by a remote Division and the Clerk will know initiate the Division on MemberHub.

Business Statement

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Tuesday 15th October 2019 Commons Chamber

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

The hon. Gentleman heckles, elegantly and loudly as always, saying that today is Tuesday— I know today is Tuesday, and it will be followed by Wednesday and a European Council on Thursday and Friday. Things will be decided at that Council that will allow us to decide whether we need to meet on Saturday.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

The right hon. Gentleman is correct to mention heckling going on. Obviously, I will not allow heckling. I did not recognise heckling there—a statement of the obvious, yes, but not quite heckling. If it gets any worse, it will be heckling and I will have to stop it.

[Anna Soubry (Broxtowe) (IGC)]

Will the Leader of the House confirm that there is no provision anywhere in the Act of Parliament that we recently passed—now called, quite properly, the Benn Act or the safeguarding Act—that says that this House must meet on Saturday 19 October? If there is, will he tell us which clause or subsection that requirement is in?

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

I thought that in my previous answer, I was pointing out the blindingly obvious to one hon. Member. I shall now do so to a right hon. Member: the Act sets the 19th as the deadline for certain things and votes to take place. Saturday is the 19th. Otherwise, consequences follow from that Act. It seems to me extraordinarily obvious.

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

I should point out that this is a very narrow business statement, and technically, I should have allowed questions relating only specifically to that, but I hope that the Lord President of the Council will forgive me for having allowed slightly wider questioning. I appreciate that there is concern about a Saturday sitting and that Members had genuine questions to ask him, which he has answered with his usual courtesy.

Leaving the EU: Tobacco Products and Public Health

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Monday 7th January 2019 Commons Chamber

[Mr Jacob Rees-Mogg (North East Somerset) (Con)]

Further to that point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. My right hon. Friend the Member for New Forest West (Sir Desmond Swayne) rightly says that this is a very important constitutional issue. At 10 o’clock, will the motion immediately go to a vote, or will it require a closure motion?

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

The hon. Gentleman makes a very good point. If the debate is still continuing, there will be no vote. However, I say once again that this matter is in the hands of Members. If Members who prolonged the urgent questions and statements earlier are listening or paying any attention—there is a very good chance that they have given up and gone home—they know that it was their actions earlier in the day that curtailed this debate. Let us not curtail it any further.

Committee on Standards: Cox Report

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Monday 7th January 2019 Commons Chamber

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. It is not customary to impose a time limit when the debate would cease if a closure is not put on the motion.

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

It is customary to impose a time limit when the person in the Chair can easily see that the demand for time is far greater than the supply. I am therefore imposing a time limit. I call John Stevenson.

Exiting the EU: Sectoral Impact Assessments

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Wednesday 1st November 2017 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

The House will be aware that the motion before us is a Humble Address to be presented to Her Majesty. That is the motion before the House. We are currently debating that motion and it is absolutely correct that there should be differences of opinion about the effect of the motion, the way in which it should be debated and what should happen to it. At this stage, I would say only that a motion of this kind has in the past been seen as effective or binding. That does not mean that I am making a ruling at this point about the nature of the motion before us today.

I will reiterate what I said before. While it is correct for the Chair to make a ruling on what happens here in the Chamber, it is for the Government to decide how they will proceed, having considered the opinions of the House. It would, of course, be quite wrong for the Government not to pay any attention to a decision taken by the House, but the way in which the Minister interprets what he and his colleagues should do after the House has expressed an opinion is a matter not for the Chair but for the Minister.

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

Further to that point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. I wondered if it might be helpful to refer hon. Members to page 819 of “Erskine May”, which points out that in a recent case the Canadian House of Commons, in not entirely dissimilar circumstances, viewed it as a breach of privilege for the Government to fail to provide information when asked for it by the House.

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for directing me to page 819 of “Erskine May”, which I will look at as soon as I have an opportunity so to do, but he will be aware of the rules on privilege, as I am, and the way in which those rules can be interpreted. Like him, not long ago I served for many weeks on a Committee considering the way in which privilege can be applied. If I were to say that it is a grey area, that would not be an exaggeration. There is no black and white in the way in which privilege is applied. But I thank the hon. Gentleman for drawing to my attention to that particular point in “Erskine May”.

Welfare Cap

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Wednesday 16th December 2015 Commons Chamber

[Mr Jacob Rees-Mogg (North East Somerset) (Con)]

I want to raise the modest question of why this Bill has not been introduced under Standing Order No. 50, as it seems to me that the primary purpose is a charge. For a Bill of this kind, Standing Order No. 50 is the usual process. I know it has the Government’s support, but I am puzzled that that approach has not been taken.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Mrs Eleanor Laing)]

The hon. Gentleman raises an excellent point, which I am sure has been taken on board by those on the Treasury Bench.

Question put and agreed to.

NHS (Charitable Trusts Etc.) Bill

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Friday 6th November 2015 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Mrs Eleanor Laing)]

Order. I must remind the hon. Lady for the sake of good form—I appreciate that she has not been in the House for very long so I am not reprimanding her—that she must address her remarks not to the hon. Gentleman, but to the Chair.

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

My hon. Friend makes an absolutely brilliant and crucial point. We want to get away from jobbery wherever it happens, and it is most likely to happen in areas where one party is in government for a very long time.

[Paul Flynn]

There is a current example of grotesque jobbery in the appointment by the Prime Minister of the Conservative Members of the Council of Europe, and three splendid Members, including the hon. Member for Christchurch (Mr Chope), have been—

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

Order. I really have tried to give as much leeway as I can this morning to this debate, but I cannot reconcile Great Ormond Street hospital with the Council of Europe. I am quite sure that, if the hon. Gentleman wishes to bring some kind of analogy from “Peter Pan”, Never Land and the Council of Europe, he can do so, but I must warn him that it will have to be really quite narrow.

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

There was an urgent question on the matter, and I do not think that there is any more for me to say on it.

Jobbery is a real problem. It comes more when a party is in office for a very long time. The system gets accustomed to appointing people who belong to routine consensus political views, and they are the ones who get the baubles.

Many of these charitable baubles are unpaid, but they come with a great deal of status in their communities, so there is a benefit to the person receiving them. It is right that such decisions should be more independent of the Government. It is right not just because of the ability to get away from jobbery, but because many people—those on the Treasury Bench will be shocked to hear this—do not trust the Government.

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[Mr Rees-Mogg]

If I were talking nonsense, Madam Deputy Speaker would rule me out of order under Standing Orders that refer to a speech being both tedious and repetitious. I do not think that I am being either of those, nor wandering—

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Mrs Eleanor Laing)]

Order. For the avoidance of doubt, I do not need the hon. Gentleman’s help to know when nonsense is being talked in the Chamber. If nonsense were to be talked or repetition were to be undertaken I would stop it immediately.

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. That is a side concern, but it is something that everyone in the House wishes to see—

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[Madam Deputy Speaker (Mrs Eleanor Laing)]

Order. Sometimes it is difficult for the occupant of the Chair to work out whether an intervention or part of a speech is in order, but the hon. Gentleman has referred specifically to the next Bill, which is not in order. I caution Mr Rees-Mogg to be careful in his response to the hon. Gentleman, and stick to the Bill. By and by we will come to the next Bill.

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

Madam Deputy Speaker, I have never sought to model myself on Nostradamus, so I am not looking into a glass bowl lit by candles to see what will happen in future. I am concentrating on the here and now—the present—and this important and beneficial Bill. I have congratulated my hon. Friend the Member for Aldridge-Brownhills on introducing such a sound and wisely based measure that does something for the good of the whole nation and which will encourage the great vein of charitable giving that has provided so much for people across the centuries and shows what can be done beyond the state.

There is a feeling that everything has to be wrapped up and organised by Her Majesty’s Government: that welfare, health and education should come from the Government, and that no other parties should become involved. That is not true. We want to allow the natural charitable instincts of the British people to bloom, and they do. The British people are some of the most generous in the world, not because they are chugged and all those things, but because it is in their nature. It is their instinct to want to support good causes. That is why, across the country, we have wards bearing people’s names which have been built as a result of the generosity of benefactors who want better health care in the United Kingdom. That is why there are organisations such as the Wellcome Trust, which is a charitable organisation that improves the quality of medicine, and why people work from a charitable basis to develop new medicines and care, particularly palliative care, much of which is provided by the voluntary sector. I was a trustee for some years of St John and St Elizabeth, a hospital near Lord’s cricket ground, which provides the only hospice in central London, funded by charitable donations from those who feel that looking after people at the end of their life is a fundamental calling, and is not something that can invariably be done by the state.

Not every charge should go to the state; not every action should be borne by the state or taxpayer. It is right and proper that we allow charity to flourish and bloom, but then we have to put it in a protective envelope and protect it not just from this Government but from Governments to come, who may see that as a useful source of revenue and think that they can cut a few corners. They may find at the end of the year that they are a little short of money, which can be raised by selling off charities as assets. There are Governments who do those things: they run into financial crises and are desperate to do them. The Bill provides a statutory framework to protect charities. When people know that their money is protected they are more likely to give generously. That is something that has underpinned all economic activity in this country for centuries: the certainty that, under the rule of law, someone’s property is theirs to do what they like with, and will be used for the purpose for which they have given it if it is donated to charity.

Reinforcing and ring-fencing that and putting it into a short Bill is a magnificent thing to do. It is one little notch that the axeman is making, cutting down the great oak tree of excessive governmental interference. I hope that we will have more private Members’ Bills of this kind, and that the axeman will swing his axe more vigorously and the cuts—the nicks—become bigger and bigger until the overarching tree comes down and we have a greater and freer society in which individuals can do more from their own talents, their property is protected and the dead hand of the state is removed as far as possible.

International Development (Official Development Assistance Target) Bill

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Friday 12th September 2014 Commons Chamber

[Philip Davies]

What I will make clear is that unlike the right hon. Member for Kirkcaldy and Cowdenbeath, who started the debate and then cleared off, I have been sitting here for the whole debate, so I am not sure how on earth you, Madam Deputy Speaker, or the right hon. Member for Coatbridge, Chryston and Bellshill (Mr Clarke), would expect me to have given him notice.

[Jacob Rees-Mogg]

Further to that point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker, I understand that the purpose of that rule is to deal with a premeditated intention to embarrass a Member, not if the point under consideration is something that has arisen in the course of the debate.

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for pre-empting what I was about to say. I am sure that the hon. Member for Shipley (Philip Davies) will apologise if he has inadvertently made a mistake, or if he wishes to explain why he has made those points.

Parliamentary Voting System and Constituencies Bill

Debate between Baroness Laing of Elderslie and Jacob Rees-Mogg

Wednesday 16th February 2011 Commons Chamber

[Mrs Laing]

The arguments of Lord Lamont and his colleagues in the other place are absolutely right, as was everything the right hon. Member for Manchester, Gorton (Sir Gerald Kaufman) said this evening; I would repeat them in my remarks, but time will not permit me to do so. Sadly, those two rights are incompatible, because the choice before this House this evening is no longer about AV referendums and thresholds. I hate AV and do not want this £100 million referendum. I have always been in favour of a threshold and have said so many times in this House, but that is not the choice before us.

Sadly, the choice before us is between a Labour Government who ruined this country’s economy over 13 years and a coalition Government between the Conservatives and the Liberals that will give the country the stability it needs to recover from the dire economic situation. This referendum on a simple majority, which is stated in the coalition agreement, is a high price to pay for that stability. I, for one, agree to pay it with a very heavy heart.

[Jacob Rees-Mogg]

I am slightly troubled by my hon. Friend’s remarks, because I was unaware that this had been put down as a confidence motion.

[Mrs Laing]

I appreciate my hon. Friend’s intervention. It is not a confidence motion, but sadly it is for some of us who have loyalty to the Prime Minister, because we are Conservatives first and foremost and want to see the stable government that is now being provided in every area other than constitutional development. We want to see that stable government and so must support our Prime Minister and his coalition. For some of us, it is done with a heavy heart, but that is the price that the Liberals have sought in order to improve their party political advantage. The right hon. Member for Manchester, Gorton is absolutely right that we ought to have a threshold, but it is too late. The Bill is at its end. Let us just get on with the process of having a referendum and ensure that the British people see it for what it is and do not vote to change our constitution.