UK’s Relationship with Mexico

Debate between Dan Carden and Lyn Brown

Thursday 7th September 2023 Westminster Hall

[Dan Carden]

I am delighted that we had the opportunity for this debate and to hear that there is real expertise on Mexico and on the relationship between the UK and Mexico. I thank the hon. Member for Dudley North (Marco Longhi) for his support over the last few months and engaging with issues in the region. I also thank my right hon. Friend the Member for Islington North (Jeremy Corbyn), who has such a fascinating history, as well as a relationship with the current President of Mexico, which, as the Minister graciously said, is such a benefit to the UK and our relationship. I am grateful for my right hon. Friend’s attendance today.

I thank the hon. Member for Aberdeen North (Kirsty Blackman) for her contribution on the special relationship between Scotland and Mexico, as well as my hon. Friend the Member for West Ham (Ms Brown), who was covering today but I think is eager to get to Mexico in the years ahead.

[Ms Lyn Brown]

Indeed.

[Dan Carden]

As the Minister said, I was able to visit Mexico last November through the Inter-Parliamentary Union. It was a brilliant visit. We were able to have meetings in the Congress, including in the Senate, and to meet the Mayor of Mexico City, Claudia Sheinbaum, who is now a presidential candidate. We watch her progress with interest. We also went to Oaxaca, which is a beautiful state, and visited Monte Albán, one of the heritage sites that my right hon. Friend the Member for Islington North talked about. Those ancient civilisations are a great part of Mexican history.

Mexico is an awe-inspiring country. It has its challenges; there is no doubt that there is a human rights crisis in Mexico, but it offers opportunities for Mexico’s allies, such as us, to work with it. The Minister talked about our ability to share our expertise on the rule of law. I would love to see the Government do more of that with Mexico. I know that if we have a strong developing relationship between the UK and Mexico then we can support it in those areas. We also have a lot to learn from Mexico. Our voting records at the UN show that the values of the British people and the Mexican people—and hopefully its Governments, for a long time to come—are shared. That is why the relationship is one that we can cherish and develop, and one that can be strong going forward.

Let me finish by paying tribute once again to both ambassadors: my friend Jon Benjamin in Mexico City, and Josefa González Blanco, who joins us in the Public Gallery today.

Question put and agreed to.

Resolved,

That this House has considered the UK’s relationship with Mexico.

Prison Officers: Pension Age

Debate between Dan Carden and Lyn Brown

Tuesday 16th November 2021 Westminster Hall

[Ms Lyn Brown (West Ham) (Lab)]

I am very grateful to our SNP colleagues, and to you, Sir Charles. It is an absolute pleasure to see you and to serve under your chairmanship. The view from the front line is absolutely clear; prison officers and governors have told me exactly the same thing: they simply do not believe that they or their colleagues can be safely running around floors in their mid-60s.

From the conversations that I have had, most of those nearing retirement age have decades of service in prisons behind them. Imagine it: decades of rigorous physical effort—bending through doorways and wrestling with violent prisoners on the floor—the repeated mental strain of conflict and constantly being in flight or fight mode at work. It must be exhausting to witness and deal with terrible circumstances, day in, day out. Worst of all is dealing with the trauma caused by brutal assaults at work.

I am sure the Minister understands the physical toll all of that takes, because we all know that being a prison officer means dealing with very damaged people. It means stepping into danger to protect colleagues or prisoners or to stop a situation that is escalating out of control. It means someone being on their feet for long hours, walking the halls, never knowing when the next crisis will emerge. The Minister will note that, thankfully, violence against prison officers fell during the pandemic. However, in the most recent stats, the rate of assaults on staff was still 177% higher than in 2010, and the level of violence is now rising fast: up 14% in the last quarter.

[Dan Carden (Liverpool, Walton) (Lab)]

I have HMP Liverpool and Altcourse prison in my constituency, and I am pleased to work with the Professional Trades Union for Prison, Correctional and Secure Psychiatric Workers and prison officers. Would my hon. Friend agree with a prison officer who has written to me, saying:

“We are the police behind these walls! Yet police in the community can retire at 60”?

Is this not simply about decency and fairness for our prison officers?

[Ms Brown]

I certainly agree with that. It is about decency and treating people fairly, and we are simply not seeing that. Whether or not a job becomes more dangerous depends in large part on what happens with recruitment and retention, and that is affected by the Government’s decisions on pension age.

It cannot be said often enough that the safety of our prisons and prison officers depends on staff experience. It depends on the extent to which prison officers and staff have the jailcraft to maintain good relationships with prisoners, understand the real dynamics going on in a wing, and de-escalate, by using many different mechanisms, dangerous situations before they become violent and out of control. That depth of experience has been stripped away over the past 10 years as more and more long-serving officers have left the service. In prisons today, 25% or more of staff have no experience at all of the pre-pandemic regime—that is frightening. I hope the Minister will tell us what plans she has to stop the service being hollowed out even further.

We rightly have a system where even senior managers walk the wings and respond to incidents alongside colleagues. They must also maintain the ability to restrain big and dangerous adult men if the escalation fails, and be kept safe doing so. Much upward progression still requires operational fitness, and moving to a non-frontline role will often involve a demotion and pay cut. Faced with those options and with retirement still years away, many will not remain in the service and their enormously valuable experience will be lost. Does the Minister agree that it is just too difficult for a prison officer in their mid-60s to be rolling around on the floor with a violent prisoner? Does she accept that we have a retention crisis in our prisons, which affects the all-important link between retention and safer working conditions?

Over the past year, this Government have rightly called our prison officers hidden heroes, so surely it is time to put those warm words into action. We will not solve the problems in our prison system until people know that their skills and experience will be valued and developed, and their hard work rewarded. The whole of this debate has simply involved asking the Minister to negotiate in good faith and understand the true value and nature of the work, the dedication shown and the importance of retaining experienced prison staff.