Employer National Insurance Contributions

Debate between Daisy Cooper and Toby Perkins

Wednesday 4th December 2024 Commons Chamber

[Mr Perkins]

I am glad to hear that Liberal Democrats support the extra money for the health service, special needs education and social care. I apologise for my impatience, because I am sure the hon. Member is just about to get there, but can she tell us where the £25 billion should come from if not from this national insurance rise?

[Daisy Cooper]

I welcome that intervention. In the debate on the National Insurance Contributions (Secondary Class 1 Contributions) Bill yesterday, I addressed that question head on. I will try to remember my notes, which are sitting with Hansard. The hon. Gentleman will be aware that the OBR has said the £26 billion is actually reduced to £10 billion when behavioural changes and rebates to the NHS and care are factored in. On raising that £10 billion, we have said we would reverse the tax cuts that the Conservatives gave to the big banks, raising £4 billion. We could raise a further £3 billion by increasing the remote gaming duty and the digital services bill.

We set out proposals in our manifesto to reform capital gains tax in a different way from the Government. Our measures would have raised about £5 billion, so unlike the Conservatives—who did not set out the impact of the £10 billion to £20 billion of cuts that, based on their manifesto, would have been inevitable—we as a constructive Opposition have set out suggestions. I urge Labour Members to take up our ideas, if not in this Budget then certainly in the next.

We are approaching Small Business Saturday, when I am sure we will all be in our constituencies talking to small business owners. We know that small businesses are the engine of our economy and the backbone of our communities, and in many cases, they make our high streets what they are. When it comes to health and care businesses, though, I am concerned that this measure takes with one hand and gives back with another, but with no guarantee that the money that comes back will cover the costs. As such, I urge the Government to rethink these changes to national insurance contributions, but if they do not, I urge them at the very least to exclude health and care providers from these measures.