Oral Answers to Questions

Ben Lake Excerpts

Tuesday 1st October 2019 Commons Chamber

[Ben Lake (Ceredigion) (PC)]

On the subject of growth deals, may I ask the Minister, in addition to discussions on the Moray growth deal, what discussions has he had with Cabinet colleagues on the progress of the Mid Wales growth deal?

[Mr Clarke]

We are committed to bringing forward growth deals across the UK. Obviously, in the devolved Administration areas, we want to bring forward money from our side, but with effect from the Welsh and Scottish Governments as well. We want to see progress across the UK; it is not restricted to Scotland.

Spring Statement

Ben Lake Excerpts

Wednesday 13th March 2019 Commons Chamber

[Mr Speaker]

Who’s up for a single sentence?

[Ben Lake (Ceredigion) (PC)]

Will the Chancellor clarify the extent to which reduced business investment and fewer tax reliefs have contributed to higher corporation tax receipts?

[Mr Speaker]

Splendid.

Making Tax Digital

Ben Lake Excerpts

Tuesday 19th February 2019 Commons Chamber

[Mel Stride]

I thank my hon. Friend for making that important point. We are encouraging businesses to engage with the software community, which has been part of our engagement more generally with stakeholders over a number of months. New software products are coming to the market all the time, and, as I have said, no fewer than 160 different products are already available.

[Ben Lake (Ceredigion) (PC)]

It is good to see that the Government recognise that accessing adequate broadband remains a challenge to many businesses, especially those in more rural areas. Will the Minister elaborate further on the exemption that will be introduced to reflect that fact, and tell us how it might apply to areas such as Ceredigion, where 9% of lines receive speeds lower than 2 megabits per second?

[Mel Stride]

The standard speed of 2 megabits per second is perfectly adequate to run the kind of software that we are looking at here. I have touched on the issue of digital exclusion, and we will ensure that businesses that really cannot find appropriate broadband speeds, that are extremely isolated or that are among the 5,000 businesses and individuals already exempt from submitting digital VAT returns are still excluded. We will look at every single case carefully and on its merits.

Santander Closures and Local Communities

Ben Lake Excerpts

Thursday 14th February 2019 Westminster Hall

[David Linden]

That is spot on, because there is a question of sustainability for postmasters. We know that a huge number of previous Crown post offices have been transitioned to franchise partners, and we are seeing evidence that those partners may no longer find the offering attractive. Interestingly, Martin Kearsley, the banking director of Post Office Ltd, gave evidence to the Treasury Committee. When questioned on whether the Post Office makes a profit by offering basic banking services on behalf of providers, he answered:

“It does not currently. We are in discussions with the banks to change that position…What we do is charge the banks for the provision of the network and the transactions their customers do with us. We then share that model with our postmasters.”

We know that profitability is an issue for postmasters, but it is not the only one. When questioned about the fairness of postmasters having to offer banking services, Mr Kearsley said:

“we have seen a huge increase in the amount of cash coming into our branches. That is challenging, we recognise that and we are working hard to address it. That means postmasters spend a lot of time counting cash. We have provided new equipment to try to help. We have modernised and streamlined the processes, so that that can be done more effectively and rapidly, but we recognise that that is a challenge for them right now and we continue to innovate to fix those problems.”

The question is how on earth we can reasonably expect the post office network to pick up the slack from banks that have abandoned their customers, when the current model is demonstrably not sustainable.

That leads on to the question of the level of service provided. Although many everyday banking transactions can be completed at post offices, there are restrictions on what can and cannot be done. There are limits on deposits and withdrawals, for example. Currently, only 5% of consumers withdraw cash, and 2% deposit cash, primarily at a post office, and there is anecdotal evidence from Citizens Advice to suggest that level of service may be a major factor in that.

The lack of regulation is also concerning. While banks are regulated by the Financial Conduct Authority, the Post Office is not. Banking customers are not necessarily Post Office customers, so the same duty of care simply does not exist. Let us face it: franchise holders are in this to make a living, and banking is not profitable for them. When staffing and training costs are factored in, banking can be loss-making for post offices. All things considered, while I am sure that some postmasters will go above and beyond, they are certainly not compelled or incentivised to do so.

When all is considered, it is little surprise, then, that post offices suddenly close. There are 35 fewer permanent post offices in Scotland today than there were in 2011. On top of that, communities continue to be plagued by temporary closures. In my own constituency, Tollcross post office closed in December 2017. Although the Post Office calls it a temporary closure, in reality it has still not found someone willing to take the service on, 14 months later. That is just one community suddenly left without service.

In the neighbouring constituency of Rutherglen and Hamilton West, I gather that the post office in Rutherglen closed suddenly without explanation last June, leaving thousands of people without service in what is a highly populated area with a busy high street. In the Glasgow North West constituency, the Dumbarton Road post office closed suddenly in November last year, with local residents left in the lurch ever since. When these offices shut, there is no replacement service. The Post Office does not offer a mobile service in the interim. There is no universal service obligation in place to ensure that an alternative service is offered on a temporary basis while the problem is fixed. In reality, communities are simply left without.

[Ben Lake (Ceredigion) (PC)]

I congratulate the hon. Gentleman on securing this important debate. He makes the good point that when branches close, there are often no alternative sources for people to access cash and banking services. My hon. Friend the Member for Carmarthen East and Dinefwr (Jonathan Edwards) fully supports the hon. Gentleman’s endeavours, but unfortunately he is engaged in the debate in the main Chamber. My hon. Friend has seen, just as I have in Ceredigion, that when branches close, the post office network is often simply not there, and communities are left in the lurch.

--- Later in debate ---

[Kirstene Hair]

The hon. Gentleman makes a vital point. Many people want face-to-face interaction. For some people, the person they speak to when they go to the bank might be the only person they speak to all day, so it helps with combating loneliness, which we all know is so important. The hon. Gentleman makes the very valuable point that these staff get to know people; they create a relationship with their customers and look out for them on a personal basis.

As for the Post Office offering, one in three rural post offices closed between 2000 and 2009, and that decline has continued. We have to understand that post offices cannot always and will not always be able to accommodate all those who want to use them. It just seems to me that this is such a short-term approach, because if we have no post offices, if we have poor broadband and if we do not have mobile coverage, the digitisation method and post offices do not support all customers but support only a proportion of them. It is really important that Santander tries to explain to customers who do not have those points of access how it will still be a banking provider that those customers would want to deal with.

Protecting our high streets is also incredibly important. My high streets across Angus and in constituencies across the country are struggling very much. Post offices and banks are central to our high streets. They ensure that we have continued footfall day after day. When these sites are lost, the potential for these areas is hampered. Let us take the town of Kirriemuir in my constituency as an example. Kirriemuir was nominated in the Great British High Street Awards 2018; in my eyes, it was robbed, because it did not win. The area has a fantastic variety of high-quality local businesses that support numerous initiatives, for local residents and benefit the community. I am thinking of the efforts of the Kirriemuir and Local Business Association and Kirrie Connections. That is a high street shop, but in fact it is a dementia hub, which I visited only last week. People go there to spend time with those who are going through similar experiences to them.

I had the pleasure of being there when the judges were in Kirriemuir and looking round the town, which has so much pride in its offering. But now, it has lost its last bank. It will lose its ATMs. Businesses are forced to react because, as hon. Members have said, where will customers get their cash? Will investors be put off from coming to the town? Where will local businesses deposit their takings? When I was going round as part of small business Saturday, businesses raised with me time and again the fact that there are more card transactions because less cash is available and the fee on those card transactions is absolutely hammering them at a time when things are very difficult on our high streets. In addition, what of those constituents who want to use only cash? I understand that elderly people do not want a bank card or credit card; they want to pay only with cash. Why should we suggest that they should not be able to do so, if a bank and ATM are removed?

At a time when we should be doing everything for our high streets, we should be encouraging more footfall and not increasing the pressures, difficulties and uncertainty. One suggestion has been put forward time and again by my constituents: why cannot banks operate out of one building? Why can we not have a banking hub whereby all banks are located in one building? That means we keep a set of premises going, we keep choice for constituents and they do not have to travel as far as they might have to if a bank closed down.

[Ben Lake]

The hon. Lady makes a very important point about banking hubs. Mine is just a point of information. It is ironic that some co-located branches used to exist in my constituency in the 1970s; two or three different banks would share the same location. Perhaps it could be a case of back to the future.

[Kirstene Hair]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for his intervention, which shows that banking hubs would work. They would work in many communities. They would keep that vital place on the high street. They would keep choice and keep accessibility. Those who cannot log on online or do not want to could of course come and have a face-to-face discussion with someone in the bank. That is a really important point that we should be putting across, and I would be keen to know what my hon. Friend the Minister thinks of that proposal.

My final point is about transport, which I know other hon. Members have already discussed. Those who do not want to or cannot use phones or computers to do their banking will of course need to travel to the nearest bank branch, but customers who were using the Brechin branch will now have to travel 15 miles—it is a 30-mile round trip—to Arbroath, and those in Forfar will have to make a similar journey to get to Dundee. What about those with mobility issues? What about the elderly? What about those who do not have their own car? What about those who rely heavily on public transport links, which are also in decline? Those people have to rely more heavily on family and friends. Indeed, vulnerable groups perhaps have no choice but not getting to the bank.

It is really important that we look into all the aspects that affect our constituents. An elderly lady who came into my constituency office the other day remarked that the whole situation was crazy. I agree with her: it is far from desirable. Although I have been in this place for just over 18 months, I have always felt that the most powerful debates here are those in which we have cross-party consensus. I look forward to the Minister’s reaction on the impact that these closures will have on our high streets, on post office support—because we also see post offices in decline—and on the idea of banking hubs. We all need to work together to ensure that we soften the blow of bank closures for each and every one of our communities.

ONS Decisions: Student Loans

Ben Lake Excerpts

Tuesday 18th December 2018 Commons Chamber

[Elizabeth Truss]

I think that is probably something my hon. Friend should take up with the Department for Education.

[Ben Lake (Ceredigion) (PC)]

The ONS accounting changes will apply to loans issued by the devolved Governments as well as by the UK Government, so will the Chief Secretary clarify whether these changes will in any way constrain the Welsh Government in the implementation of their higher education policy?

[Elizabeth Truss]

The Welsh Government have the autonomy to pursue their own higher education policy.

Leaving the EU: Higher Education in Wales

Ben Lake Excerpts

Wednesday 23rd May 2018 Westminster Hall

[Hywel Williams (Arfon) (PC)]

I beg to move,

That this House has considered the effect of leaving the EU on the higher education sector in Wales.

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Sir Christopher.

Higher education is now devolved; Brexit, though, is not. As we have seen in the last few days, there are some people—just some in Wales—who are delighted to reverse the progress of devolution achieved with so much effort over the last 19 years of our Assembly’s life, delighted to relinquish power and responsibility, and happy to enfeeble our Assembly on the pretext of easing Brexit into the world. After the fine words of resistance, after the pledged solidarity with Scotland, they are glad to compromise on behalf of the Welsh nation without a fight. I am reminded of Idris Davies’ poems in The Angry Summer, particularly number 48, referring to the breaking of the triple alliance in 1921, “The Telephones are Ringing”. Perhaps some hon. Members were there at the time, or perhaps not. A few lines will suffice:

“The telephones are ringing

And treachery’s in the air.

The sleek one,

The expert at compromise

Is bowing in Whitehall.

And lackey to fox to parrot cries:

‘The nation must be saved.’

What is the nation, gentleman,

Who are the nation, my lords?”

When the smoke and the noise of Brexit have cleared, the actions of some people in Wales in yielding our powers to London will be seen clearly for what they are. Yes, the telephones are ringing and treachery is in the air.

This debate is doubly timely, being about Brexit and devolution, two of the major problems that have plagued the mainstream parties here for many years. This Government, with such great finesse, have brought down on their own feeble shoulders both problems simultaneously. Plaid Cymru has been consistent on devolution, of course, and on the EU as well. We were in favour of remaining and then in favour of continued membership of the customs union and the single market. I am gratified to see other parties now moving crab-like in our direction. That would be a real compromise, which would avoid many of the predicaments that now face us, particularly in respect of higher education.

This is the first debate specifically on Brexit and higher education in Wales. There is a danger that issues that are important in themselves, even vital to the future of our country, become obscured and forgotten in the morass of mind-numbing detail around Brexit.

In a debate in this Chamber sometime last autumn I asked the hon. Member for Aberconwy (Guto Bebb), when he was merely a Wales Office Minister and had not been translated to greater things, what had happened to all the legislating we used to do on the economy, justice, benefits and pensions before we became obsessed with the fate of European Union regulations about the size and shape of fish fingers. His reply was that that was a good question. He said little else. Higher education is one of the vital issues to our country that may be overshadowed.

I have argued in this place that a thriving university sector, teaching, researching and applying that research, is central to the intellectual, moral and economic health of Wales. That has long been recognised. When we were last independent, a mere 600 years ago, the Pennal letter, sent by Owain Glyndŵr to the King of France in 1406, outlined, among other matters, his three key policies, one of which was to establish two universities, one in the north and one in the south. That was the time when great universities were being established throughout our continent, from Padua to Oxford and beyond. I sometimes wistfully imagine what our future would have been had that great ambition been fulfilled. As it was we were detained by other, less noble matters until the 19th century. Nevertheless, the long struggle to establish our universities with the support of working people throughout Wales—quarry families, colliers and others—shows clearly the value that we, as a Welsh society, place on education.

Enough of the history; let us turn to something that this Government really do understand—hard cash. Higher education contributed about £1.4 billion to the Welsh economy in 2017. Indirectly, it powered about a further £1.4 billion through related industries. In part, that was facilitated by the European Union through funding grants or loans to Welsh institutions and through the student mobility and research collaboration that freedom of movement enabled. In the rest of the UK, the private sector provides 45% of total research funding. In Wales, that drops to about 10%, which highlights the fragility of our economy and the greater importance of European money to Welsh institutions.

I will make some specific points about structural funds, research and collaboration, EU students and EU staff. First, we get money from structural and investment funds in Wales partly because of our poor economic performance over decades and to ensure social cohesion. Those moneys address the shortfall in innovation funding and in private investment in research and development in Wales.

Swansea University hugely expanded its Bay campus with £95 million of EU funding. The Cardiff University brain research imaging centre was opened using £4.5 million of EU funding. In my constituency, Bangor University secured £5 million of EU funding to help to create the centre for environmental biotechnology. All those projects were funded through Europe, and all are essential to the prosperity of our university sector. It is essential that that funding scheme, or an equivalent, continues undisturbed.

[Ben Lake (Ceredigion) (PC)]

I congratulate my hon. Friend on securing this important debate. Before he moves on, I add that the Aberystwyth innovation and enterprise campus has also benefited from the European regional development fund.

[Hywel Williams]

My hon. Friend makes a telling point, which could be repeated for the seven universities throughout Wales. To a greater or lesser extent, they all depend on European money. It is essential that that funding stream continues undisturbed, because research, and particularly scientific research, does not follow the fads and fashions of what today’s politicians see as all-important or what tomorrow’s politicians ignore as old hat.

After we leave the EU, decisions on the allocation of those moneys should be taken by the Welsh Government. Any replacement funds should ensure that money is directed on the basis of need, as well as being place-based and Wales-specific. It is essential that money does not go disproportionately to the south, or rather to the south-east and London. We know full well what happens when funding allocations are not protected: the loudest voices, which are closest to the centre, drown out the rest. A simple example comes from a Labour Minister in the Welsh Assembly, who said, when talking about rail infrastructure in Wales, that Wales has 5% of the population, 11% of the rail network and 1.5% of the network infrastructure investment. The voices from Wales are weak; those from the south-east are strong. That is why the money must be protected.

I am not convinced that the UK Government had those basic principles of meeting need or protecting funding in mind when they designed their legendary UK shared prosperity fund. Perhaps the Minister can shed some light on that.

Oral Answers to Questions

Ben Lake Excerpts

Tuesday 22nd May 2018 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

Since 2010 the shadow Chancellor has predicted that the UK would go into recession on no fewer than eight separate occasions—that is eight out of zero. But the UK economy is growing steadily and is now 10.7% bigger than its pre-crisis level, and the Office for Budget Responsibility expects it to continue to grow in each year of its forecast to 2022. While we know that the shadow Chancellor does not think that a growing economy matters, let me tell him why I do: a growing economy means more jobs, more prosperity and more security for working people.

[Ben Lake (Ceredigion) (PC)]

What consideration has been given to the contribution that varying certain business taxes, such as VAT, according to the nation or region of the UK could make to encouraging economic growth?

[Mr Hammond]

The Government’s view is that a unified rate of VAT across the United Kingdom is an important part of our single market of the United Kingdom, which is an essential economic good for the whole of this country.

Draft Welsh Ministers (Transfer Of Functions) Order 2018

Ben Lake Excerpts

Tuesday 8th May 2018 General Committees

[Stuart Andrew]

I thank all hon. Members for their contributions. I welcome the fact that the Opposition support the order. The order delivers on our commitment to transfer the remaining Minister of the Crown functions to Welsh Ministers and provides the clarity I have referred to.

On teachers’ pay, I am glad that the hon. Member for Vale of Clwyd said that we have listened. That is the approach that we have tried to take: careful consideration of all of the issues that needed to be looked at in great detail. I pay tribute to people right across UK Government Departments and in the Welsh Government for the significant work they have done.

My right hon. Friend the Member for Preseli Pembrokeshire gives valuable insight and I am glad that he was able to contradict the picture of what happened in the discussions on the 2017 Act. On his point about powers, they are absolutely going to the Welsh Government, and it will be for them to come up with the plans and policies that they want on teachers’ pay. That responsibility will lie with the Welsh Government.

[Ben Lake (Ceredigion) (PC)]

The draft order transfers a wide range of functions to Welsh Ministers, particularly in relation to agriculture and the environment. We still do not know what the specific consequences of clause 11 of the European Union (Withdrawal) Bill will be. Are there any functions in the draft order that may need to be retracted once the regulations in that clause are made clearer? If so, what will be the scrutiny procedure for bringing back any of the functions that are being transferred today?

[Stuart Andrew]

Of course, these are the particular functions that we have identified at the moment. Clause 11 of the withdrawal Bill is a totally different issue. If any more powers need to be transferred to the Welsh Government, we will bring another order before the House so that they can be considered properly.

The hon. Member for Vale of Clwyd also mentioned civil contingencies, and he is absolutely right to point out the joint approach that has taken place. I join him in paying tribute to all those who work in the emergency services and keep us safe. They do a superb job. The clarity that we will now have in the management and planning of those will be welcomed right across the board.

On elections, the draft order makes clear the areas of election law to which the electoral functions that are being transferred will apply. It made sense to do that in this way, because the draft order would otherwise have become quite an unwieldy document. We felt that this was the best way to take this forward, and it means that it is now very clear that the functions for elections to local government and to the Welsh Assembly are now with the Welsh Government.

Leaving the EU: UK Ports (Customs)

Ben Lake Excerpts

Monday 19th March 2018 Commons Chamber

[Ben Lake (Ceredigion) (PC)]

Wales is ideally based as a land bridge for many Irish exporters. Indeed, more than 70% of Irish road freight comes into the UK through Welsh ports. If a border is placed in the Irish sea, Welsh ports could face severe delays and disruptions. Will the Minister outline what assessment the Government have made of the potential impact on Welsh ports, and of whether trade will be diverted or displaced elsewhere?

[Mel Stride]

The good news for the hon. Gentleman is that there will be no circumstance under which this Government, or a British Prime Minister, will negotiate a deal in which we have an effective customs border between Northern Ireland and other parts of the United Kingdom.

Oral Answers to Questions

Ben Lake Excerpts

Tuesday 16th January 2018 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

The hon. Gentleman will know that I have been arguing for the last year for a jobs-first, prosperity-first Brexit, which means negotiating the closest possible relationship with the EU after we leave that union, and that is what we intend to do.

[Ben Lake (Ceredigion) (PC)]

The contribution of the UK internal market is of course important to the economy of Wales. Under Westminster rule, the economy of London and the south-east of England has steamed ahead while Wales remains one of the poorest nations in western Europe. Will the Chancellor commit to ending this rank inequality by rebalancing the UK internal market to ensure that it is not based on a set of Westminster diktats but is instead a partnership of the four nations of the UK?

[Mr Hammond]

Yes, we have identified regional disparity as one of the drivers of low productivity in the UK. Raising the productivity performance, particularly that of our great cities outside London, is key to raising UK’s performance overall.