European Union (Future Relationship) Bill

Baroness Royall of Blaisdon Excerpts

3rd reading & 2nd reading & Committee negatived & 2nd reading (Hansard) & 2nd reading (Hansard): House of Lords & 3rd reading (Hansard) & 3rd reading (Hansard): House of Lords & Committee negatived (Hansard) & Committee negatived (Hansard): House of Lords
Wednesday 30th December 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Royall of Blaisdon (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, I speak as a Brit but also as a European. I will always be a proud European, though sadly no longer a citizen of the European Union. I remind noble Lords of my interest, as set out in the register, as Principal of Somerville College, Oxford. It is a proud day for everybody associated with the university, and I pay tribute to the extraordinary vaccination team and to the partnership with AstraZeneca which means that hundreds of millions throughout the world will be vaccinated on a not-for-profit basis—a reminder that we live in an interdependent world in which collaboration among scientists and researchers is crucial. The most extraordinary co-operation that we have enjoyed in the last 40 years is as part of the EU, but we are now on the outside, looking in, grasping at this very thin deal.

One of the great benefits to our universities has been participation in Horizon 2020 and the previous research and innovation programmes. The financial benefits were huge, but likewise the networking and the freedom of movement for our academics. I am glad that the UK will continue to participate in Horizon Europe and I look forward to details, including on freedom of movement for academics, researchers and students.

Students—indeed, all young people—seem to have been entirely forgotten where the deal is concerned. It is our young people who will suffer the long-term economic, social and cultural consequences of both Covid and Brexit. It is their horizons that have been drastically narrowed and their opportunities that have been curtailed. They will no longer have the freedom to live, work and study throughout the European Union. Those who are performing artists will no longer have permit-free access across the EU, and newly qualified doctors, nurses, dentists, pharmacists, vets, engineers and architects will no longer enjoy mutual recognition of their professional qualifications.

Everyone engaged in Erasmus is devastated that we will no longer be participants. I agree with the noble Lord, Lord Ricketts, that it is short-sighted and mean-spirited. In January, the Prime Minister categorically said that its future was secure. The failure to live up to that statement will once more diminish the trust of young people in not only government, but politics, which is far more dangerous.

The Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster suggested that Erasmus was being abandoned because, in addition to funding the new Turing scheme, the Government wished to invest more in disadvantaged young people. They could and should do that. He implied that Erasmus was for the elite, whereas in reality it is for students, trainees, apprentices, pupils, adult learners, youth workers and professionals of all organisations active in education, training and the youth sector. It is a brilliant tool of soft power, nurturing mutual understanding between not just individuals but institutions. It is also a great vehicle for social mobility, not to mention the learning of languages. We have few details of how the Turing scheme will work, so a large number of Written Questions will follow from me.

I recognise that we have to look to the future, and I will play my part in ensuring that all young people with whom I have contact, privileged and disadvantaged, understand the value of friendship, co-operation and collaboration with our European partners.

European Union (Withdrawal) Bill

Baroness Royall of Blaisdon Excerpts

Tuesday 30th January 2018 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Royall of Blaisdon (Lab)]

My Lords, that was a superb speech. The sky is indeed foul, but it is up to us to try to do something about it.

The speeches today and tomorrow are many, but there will be few disagreements. The vast majority, like mine, will show acute concern about the rudderless nature of the Brexit misadventure, the lack of vision or of preparation and the fact that, as the noble and learned Lord, Lord Hope, said, the Bill comes to us in a sorry state. I am profoundly dismayed about the way in which the Prime Minister continues to put party before country, desperately trying to find a fudge that will keep her in government, if not in power, and placating the Brexiteers, whose thirst for leaving the EU is unquenchable. I fear that this fudge will mean that everything possible will be done to ensure that the much-promised meaningful vote will not be about a firm framework for the future but rather about a heads of agreement which has been described as an expression of intent and aspirations. As ever, for the Prime Minister it will be the politics of her party rather than the policies for our country that will determine success if we exit the European Union on 31 March next year.

All the detailed negotiations that will determine the future prosperity of our country and the security of our citizens will, as we always advised, take place after 31 March, during a transition period. That is crazy. The detailed negotiations will take place at a time when we will have no voice and no influence in the Council, the Commission or the European Parliament. I realise that because of the all-pervading influence of the Brexiteers it would be anathema, perhaps suicidal, for the Prime Minister to suggest that, rather than a lengthy transition, we should seek to extend the Article 50 deadline, but that would be the right thing to do. It would ensure that Ministers remained in control during the negotiations. We are constantly told that the main reason why people voted to leave the European Union was, indeed, about control.

I share the concerns expressed about this fundamentally flawed legislation: the undermining of legal uncertainty; the extension of delegated powers; the impact on our economy and quality of life, et cetera; the impact on the protection of jobs and the rights of workers and consumers; the impact on the protections for women and girls, including those that they currently get from the European protection orders; the guarantee of the peace process; and so much more.

My right honourable friend Sir Keir Starmer did a brilliant job in the Commons and has shown real leadership and huge skill in extending the parameters first set down by my party. I know, too, that my noble friends Lady Smith and Lady Hayter will do likewise. Indeed, they will provide great leadership for this House. I will certainly support their amendments, which, I am sure, will receive wide support across the House. I will also, however, urge them to go further and to embrace membership of the single market and the customs union, which is critical for all parts of the United Kingdom, especially Northern Ireland. That is what we have agreed to do as part of the transition process, but for the sake of our economic and social well-being we need it to be permanent. If we do not secure our economic future in this way, we will not be able to implement the education, health and social policies that are urgently needed to heal our deeply divided society and address the burning inequalities identified by the Prime Minister.

In some of the poorest areas of the UK, EU funding has made a huge difference. It is essential that areas such as Cornwall and the Isles of Scilly, which would have qualified for £350 million from EU structural funds in the next budgetary period if we remained in the EU, continue to be properly funded. Can the Minister reassure me that there will be a properly funded, locally led successor to EU regional aid?

Focusing briefly on education, I remind noble Lords of my interests in the register. In Oxford in 2015, 18% of our staff, 15% of our students and 14% of our research funding came from the EU. Each of those areas is now being undermined by Brexit. In terms of research, development and innovation activities, in the last seven-year financial framework the UK as a whole contributed €5.4 billion to the EU and the EU contributed €8.8 billion to the UK. Not only is the UK the most active participant in Horizon 2020, but our institutions co-ordinate about 20% of the projects that have been funded so far. Our collaboration and our influence are extraordinary. With Brexit, the number of EU academics resigning has gone up exponentially, suggesting that it is increasingly difficult for our universities to attract the best in the world. This is critical for our research and our reputation.

What assurance can the Minister give that our new relationship with the EU will not jeopardise the ability of our universities to participate in future EU framework programmes and conduct world-class collaborative research with EU colleagues, to host ERC grants and influence future research agendas or to recruit and retain the best staff, and to recruit students, regardless of nationality? We should heed the words of Chekhov:

“There is no national science, just as there is no national multiplication table; what is national is no longer science”.


Research and innovation are just two of many areas in which we collaborate with our European partners: exploring ideas, exchanging best practice, finding common solutions to common problems, benefiting our own citizens as well as those in other countries and strengthening relationships. Some partnerships are bigger than others, but all contribute to fostering understanding between peoples and organisations.

I am proud that the People’s History Museum, which I chair, recently secured €271 million from the EU as part of the Culture Lab project involving partners from six member states. Our pilot project will explore the impact of Brexit on migrant communities in the UK and the EU and we will work with local migrant and non-migrant communities to explore how, as Jo Cox said,

“we are far more united and have far more in common than that which divides us”.—[Official Report, Commons, 3/6/15; col. 675.]

For me, those words encapsulate not only what I believe to be the reality of the United Kingdom but the reality and the ethos of the European Union. In 2012, the EU received the Nobel Peace Prize for advancing the causes of peace, reconciliation, democracy and human rights in Europe. The right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Leeds was absolutely right. Membership of the European Union, and what comes afterwards, is about more than trade and the economy; it is about values, tolerance, respect, a space to disagree agreeably and hope not hate. In this difficult and dangerous world, it is our responsibility to seek the best possible outcome as we break our ties with this alliance of sovereign states, which has changed our continent and our country for the better.

Higher Education and Research Bill

Baroness Royall of Blaisdon Excerpts

Report: 3rd sitting (Hansard): House of Lords
Monday 13th March 2017 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Royall of Blaisdon (Lab)]

My Lords, I am pleased to have added my name to the hugely important amendment moved by the noble Lord, Lord Hannay. I, too, regret that the noble Lord, Lord Patten, cannot be here due to ill-health, and we of course wish him well.

The noble Lord, Lord Hannay, gave a powerful and comprehensive introduction to the amendment, the content of which we have discussed many times in your Lordships’ House with agreement from all parts of the Chamber. The Bill presents us with a great opportunity to address the concerns expressed in debate and in various Select Committees of both Houses. For example, in recent years, six parliamentary committees have recommended the removal of students from the net migration target.

Apart from the Government, I have spoken to no one who is against the measures in the amendment: quite the contrary, there is strong support. I have spoken to overseas and UK students, academics, administrative staff of higher education institutions, people working for the bodies responsible for standards and quality, and many of our citizens from all backgrounds in different parts of the country. They understand, as my noble friend Lord Darzi said at Second Reading, that we must secure and sustain our ability to excite, attract and retain the world’s greatest minds. This is fundamental to the excellence of the UK university system.

Like the polling undertaken by UUK, my conversations provide clear evidence that even those people who are anxious about immigration welcome foreign students and do not think they should be included in the migration figures. They do not want immigration rules that are any more restrictive than the current ones placed on undergraduate and postgraduate students and academics: not now nor in future, when our immigration policy is revised to deal with Brexit. To use somewhat unparliamentary language, it is a no-brainer.

As the noble Lord, Lord Hannay, said, the case for the shift in policy set out in the amendment is unanswerable. The problem of bogus students studying at institutions has, thanks to government action, been dealt with. We still await the results of the consultation on the study immigration route and a firm rebuttal of the destabilising statement made by the Home Secretary at the Conservative Party conference, but the statistics on overstaying students are, to say the least, questionable, and new data demonstrate that the number of overstayers is negligible.

Undergraduate and postgraduate students are visitors, not economic migrants. Their contribution to our higher education institutions is enormous: not just the fee income, which enables universities to thrive and innovate, but their economic impact on the wider community; the culture they bring, which enriches the experience of our students; the soft power that lasts a lifetime; and the huge addition to and influence on the invaluable research being undertaken in our universities, which affects the economic and social well-being of our country, our capacity to deliver industrial policy and so much more.

It is absolutely clear that we should and, indeed, must welcome overseas students, especially as we begin life in a brave new global Britain, where collaboration and soft power assume a greater importance. The Minister can say until he is blue in the face that overseas students are welcome, that there is no cap on the figures and that our offer compares favourably with our competitors. The fact is that even if all those things were true, the perception is very different. We can all cite numerous examples of potential students now choosing to study elsewhere. The statistics given by the noble Lord, Lord Hannay, are clear evidence of this.

If the Government agree to the amendment, this perception will be changed immediately and the flow of Indian students and others now choosing to study elsewhere will be stemmed. I hope the Minister will not rely on the argument about best practice in migration calculations, which requires us to follow the stipulations of the UN. This has always been a weak argument, but post-referendum, when the Government proudly assert their determination to take back control, it is risible—likewise, the Minister’s statement that it would be inappropriate for the Government to seek to influence how statistics are compiled. What are the Government for?

The amendment would provide a strong signal in the increasingly important and competitive higher education market that this country really welcomes international students.

[Baroness Garden of Frognal (LD)]

My Lords, I have added my name to the amendment, as I did in Committee. I add my regrets that the noble Lord, Lord Patten, is not here and wish him well. My support comes for all the important reasons set out so persuasively by the noble Lord, Lord Hannay—and it was evidence-based persuasion, which is always the very best sort.

Our higher education sector has derived immense benefit from collaboration with European research establishments—not just financial, but benefit in research, scholarship and international understanding and good relations. In this new, uncertain world, those relationships are ever more important.

We have discussed international students at length; they are valued and valuable and should in no way be deterred by any undue immigration categorisations or controls. In the light of the overwhelming view not just of this House but of people around the country in all the messages we have heard, I hope the Minister can assure us that the amendment will be accepted.

Charities: Government Grants

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Wednesday 10th February 2016 Lords Chamber

[Lord Bridges of Headley]

I entirely agree with that. I pay tribute to the excellent work that charities do up and down the breadth of this country and to the considerable contribution that many millions of people make in time, energy and commitment. I point out to your Lordships that, obviously, this clause is aimed at the £130 billion paid out in grants annually. While we may be talking here about charities, we should not forget the £74 billion of grant funding that goes to local government, the £24 billion to ALBs and public corporations, the £8 billion to international recipients and the £4 billion to the private sector.

[Baroness Royall of Blaisdon (Lab)]

Would the Minister agree that charities are and must be seen to be independent of government, regardless of their financial arrangements? Would he also agree that any perception that charities are being limited in what they can and cannot say about public policy issues because of their funding would be damaging to public trust in civil society?

[Lord Bridges of Headley]

Of course I agree with that, but I strongly believe that this clause does not do that. I point out that for a number of years government departments have included a provision that taxpayers’ money should not be used for political activity and this new clause simply clarifies what that means.

Civil Society

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Thursday 11th June 2015 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Royall of Blaisdon (Lab)]

My Lords, this is a crucial debate about our future well-being, because our country can only thrive and be at ease with itself if citizens of all ages, ethnicities and backgrounds are empowered to participate. I am therefore grateful to the right reverend Prelate the Bishop of St Albans for tabling the Motion but also for spurring me on to reread the excellent pastoral letter.

The letter rightly speaks of the new direction our politics ought to take. The present system, which has served us well, is broken. Huge swathes of the population do not participate either as members of political parties or, more importantly, through exercising their democratic right to vote. Putting that cross in a box is a powerful act that can change the way in which we are governed at local, national and European levels, but too many think it is irrelevant to their lives. How many times do we hear on the doorstep, “What’s the point?”, “It won’t make any difference”, “You’re all the same, you’re only in it for yourselves” or, “I don't know enough about politics to vote”? I find it deeply depressing that only 43% of young people voted in the general election, whereas 78% of the over-65s voted. We are failing these young people. It is not that they are apathetic—far from it, they might be frustrated but they are also enthusiastic and creative; they know how to navigate the digital world in which we live—but their energies are channelled elsewhere. It is great that the older generation participated but younger people are our hope; they are our future and democracy needs their participation.

This in turn means that Governments focus more on policies for older people—with the dreadful exception of social care—so that young people find voting even more irrelevant. Our political system becomes even more remote because policies respond not to their needs, only to what decision-makers perceive as their needs. It is also clear that many people who lead the most challenging lives do not vote. For example, only one-third of people with learning disabilities vote. I pay tribute to a fantastic initiative, My Vote Counts from Gloucestershire Voices, an organisation run by and for people with learning disabilities.

We have to change the system. We should embrace community politics, working with and for communities, listening and engaging not lecturing, and focusing on the common good—on which the right reverend Prelate spoke. Enough of the adversarial politics, the shouting and hectoring, and enough of the adversarial approach to ideas in which opponents must always be wrong. It will be no surprise that I disagree with some of the Government’s policies. I simply do not understand why they will not allow 16 and 17 year-olds to vote on their future in the EU referendum, especially as we have evidence from Scotland about engagement and participation. However, I strongly support government initiatives such as the National Citizen Service and encourage my party to do likewise.

That brings me to active citizenship and volunteering, which are good for the individuals concerned and for the people and communities they seek to help: a win-win situation. I am proud to be a member of Step Up To Serve’s advisory council and I work closely with the NCS and other fantastic organisations such as City Year, London Citizens and Girlguiding UK. They do a tremendous job supporting young people to become volunteers, as well as nurturing their life and leadership skills, giving them confidence and enhancing their CVs. They help our youngsters create change, shape the world around them and build communities. Personally, I would like to explore the idea of extending the City Year model of a year of service to more organisations, as they do in the US—but that is for another day. Sadly, many of these organisations lack leaders—people prepared to give their own time. For example, I understand that more than 40,000 young boys would like to become Scouts but there are simply not enough leaders in their communities to help them. Much more needs to be done to ensure that the quality of volunteering makes the experience worth while for all concerned.

However, this is not just a matter for the voluntary organisations themselves. The state has a role. Funding is needed to train and support volunteers. Volunteering must always provide added value and never be a means of displacing paid jobs. The Government must invest in volunteering to ensure that citizens have the time and resources to engage in community life, and that they are empowered. The pastoral letter is absolutely right when it says that,

“a modern nation, where ties of kindred and neighbourliness are often very weak, requires state-sponsored action to underpin the welfare of each citizen”.

As a new report by Citizens Advice suggests, we need a new form of responsive volunteering which can address current social challenges such as an ageing population, loneliness and isolation, increased pressure on public services and labour-market insecurity. There are some fantastic examples around—for example, the superb volunteering scheme at King’s College Hospital and the charity Care Home Volunteers—but the potential is huge for volunteers and society.

This also raises the question of the devolution of power, of which the right reverend Prelate spoke. This is welcome but power should not only be devolved to local authorities, it must also flow to civil society and communities so that they can play their proper part in the decisions that affect them most. We also have to ensure that they are strong enough, have the requisite capacity to use those powers, and adhere to the principle, of which I have learnt today, of bridging social capital. Power must be shared between generations. Segregation and mistrust between the old and the young harms the communities that we need to rebuild and build.

In passing, I would like to say a word to local planners and developers. Vast new housing estates in which there are no shops, cafes, doctors’ surgeries or community facilities are simply not acceptable. This point is well understood by housing associations, which provide a socially useful good that is often much wider than the homes that they build and maintain. I met with the excellent Two Rivers Housing Association in the Forest of Dean on Monday to discuss the specific challenges that it would face in rural areas if it had to sell more homes. Even if it received an influx of capital receipts, which is unlikely, it could not spend the money in the villages of the Forest of Dean, where I live, because land is too expensive. I also learnt of the good things that it is doing to diversify, including setting up an ethical estate agency—no, that is not an oxymoron—and a facilities management service, which provides apprenticeships, training and jobs for local people, often tenants, paying the living wage. This is another means of investing in and sustaining the local community, as well as the charity itself, which would be under threat from the right to buy. Like credit unions and other intermediate institutions, housing associations have a strong unifying potential, serving poor people and others, but also wanting to benefit the wider community.

There is so much more to say about civil society and new politics and communities—not looking back with rose-tinted spectacles to the bygone era of the past, but responding to the needs of our citizens in the 21st century. I very much hope that we will have further opportunities to debate this issue.

House of Commons Commission Bill

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Thursday 12th March 2015 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Royall of Blaisdon (Lab)]

My Lords, I am grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Wallace of Saltaire, for the clarity with which he has introduced the House of Commons Commission Bill. This is a short, uncontroversial Bill that, in essence, is a matter for the Commons and we are glad to support it. I pay tribute to the House of Commons Governance Committee, which was quoted extensively by the noble Lord, Lord Tyler. It was chaired by my right honourable friend Jack Straw, and it did an excellent job that led to this small Bill, which will have a real impact on the good governance of the Commons.

This comes at a crucial time when Parliament is about to make a hugely important decision about the restoration and renewal of this glorious building, safeguarding it for future generations. We must never forget, in taking these decisions or in our daily work, that Parliament belongs not to the parliamentarians but to the people of this country. As my honourable friend Angela Eagle said:

“We must … future-proof our institution—not only our building, but our Parliament—to ensure that the transparency of what we do and our accessibility … continue to be among the best”.—[Official Report, Commons, 22/1/15; col. 422.]

The governance of both the Commons and the Lords is critical as Parliament evolves to meet the needs of people and our democratic system in the 21st century. The Commons Commission and the House Committee in your Lordships’ House have a crucial role in providing leadership relating to restoration and renewal, as well as the governance of our Parliament. We support the Bill, which implements key recommendations from the report of the Governance Committee that require legislative action. They will lead to sensible and timely changes that will increase the professionalism and effectiveness of the Commons. But of course, these are matters for the Commons and its Members. They must make the decisions that relate to their House, just as we must make the decisions that relate to this House.

However, as one Parliament, the decisions of each House in this sphere have implications for the other. As the Minister said, this Bill changes the remit and membership of the commission, which will include the new director-general of the House of Commons. His or her role will bring changes to the management and governance structure in the Commons, which in due course could have implications for our own House.

Notwithstanding the fact that we have a House of Commons and a House of Lords, each with its own purpose, traditions and identities, we are part of one Parliament. While the integrity of each House must be retained, there is so much more that we could and should be doing together in order to ensure efficiency and savings from the public purse. I recognise that there are already some shared services which work well, for example, IT services and security, and I am very supportive of the new joint procurement service.

We on these Benches are always keen to see how we can keep your Lordships’ House as efficient and effective as possible. Just in the past few months, an internal report was published by a working group of members of my own group looking at the internal structure and management of this House. The excellent report produced by the group, chaired by my noble friend Lord Hunt of Kings Heath, agreed:

“The Clerk and domestic Committees should be charged with developing greater collaboration with their equivalents in the Commons. Wherever possible, joint departments should be established”.

I am pleased that following the report of the Straw committee and deliberations within our own House, a review has now been established by the Clerk of the Parliaments to look at this issue.

I firmly believe that at a time of austerity, when we as parliamentarians are encouraging government departments and local councils to work together more and share services, we in Parliament should be taking the lead. Yes, we have two distinct Houses, but we have one Parliament and the crucial decisions that have to be taken in respect of restoration and renewal, followed by the delivery of the project, could be the impetus for great changes with regard to the management of the building.

The House of Commons Governance Committee, as the noble Lord, Lord Tyler, said, encourages,

“the two Houses to begin the process of drawing up a phased medium term programme towards a single bicameral services department supporting the primary parliamentary purposes of each of the two Houses”.

Personally I am very much in favour of such a programme but at each step of the way there must be strong emphasis on the need to retain the integrity of each House, and appropriate service agreements must ensure that the will and needs of the Lords is not subsumed by the Commons in any way. Where change is concerned, I am proud to say that, despite our older profile, we have often been the modernising House, prepared to do things differently and adapt to the times. For example, we led the way with the televising of Parliament, opening up our proceedings to the wider world when desire for transparency had not become the demand that it rightfully is today.

I return to the matter of governance rather than management and warmly welcome the agreement that there should be regular meetings between the commission and the House Committee. By the time of the first meeting, which is already scheduled, the membership and remit of the commission will have changed as a consequence of the legislation before us and we will have embarked on a review of the governance structure of our own House thanks to the establishment of the Leader’s Group by the noble Baroness, Lady Stowell. I warmly welcome this initiative. The current structure is opaque and I believe not fit for purpose in a 21st century legislature in which our citizens rightly demand transparency and accountability.

The Leader's Committee will naturally consider the purpose and function of the House Committee. I note that Clause 2 states:

“The Commission must from time to time set strategic priorities and objectives in connection with services provided by the House Departments”.

This seems to me to be extremely important and something which we already strive to do in the House Committee but I believe that changes are necessary to ensure that its priorities and objectives are truly strategic and benchmarked, and can be properly measured by, for example, key performance indicators. As we celebrate our history and traditions, too often we forget that we are a large organisation working in the 21st Century and we must adjust accordingly.

On these Benches we are looking forward to a constitutional convention, as proposed by my right honourable friend Ed Miliband MP, which will consider the future of your Lordship’s House, not as too often in the past in isolation but as part of the wider constitutional changes that are taking place in our country. The deliberations will no longer take place behind closed doors in Whitehall and be the preserve of politicians but will be extended to the people of this country. The constitution of this country belongs not to one or many political parties but to our citizens, so the process must be inclusive. This will undoubtedly bring about profound change but in the mean time we have to ensure that the governance of our House, the management of our services and the restoration and renewal of our magnificent building are carried out in the most open, efficient and effective way.

Strategic Defence and Security Review

Baroness Royall of Blaisdon Excerpts

Tuesday 18th November 2014 Lords Chamber

[Lord Wallace of Saltaire]

I find it very interesting that the noble Lord should describe the possibility of the SNP taking a very large number of seats in Scotland away from the Labour Party as assisting the Labour Party.

[Baroness Royall of Blaisdon (Lab)]

My Lords, coalition at the end of a fixed-term Parliament is a difficult beast. I would like to know what the Government’s policy is on having a strategic defence review in every Parliament as a statutory review. It is very difficult to ask a member of the Liberal Democrat Party because that is not, I think, its policy. I wonder whether the noble Lord could answer on behalf of the Government.

Scottish Referendum

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Monday 13th October 2014 Lords Chamber

[Lord Wallace of Saltaire]

My Lords, I repeat that we have heard these calls, that we are currently considering them and that we will wish to proceed as far as possible on an all-party basis.

[Baroness Royall of Blaisdon (Lab)]

My Lords, the Minister mentioned that disillusionment with London and Westminster in particular is a problem that has been thrown up by the referendum and in more recent polls, so why are the Government bent upon having a government Cabinet committee of all-white, all-male privy counsellors as a way of taking devolution forward?

[The Lord Privy Seal (Baroness Stowell of Beeston)]

I am on it.

[Baroness Royall of Blaisdon]

I beg noble Lords’ pardon. Clearly, there is going to be one woman on the committee, which is fantastic; nevertheless, it is a London-based committee. Why can we not now have an agreement in principle from the Government on a constitutional convention to take these things forward rather than the piecemeal way in which the Government are doing things at present?

[Lord Wallace of Saltaire]

My Lords, I think it is a little harsh to refer to the immediate reactions in the weeks since the Scottish referendum as piecemeal. We are moving fast to produce a number of draft clauses next January, before the election. We recognise that there is a limit to how much we can achieve before the forthcoming election but if the noble Baroness would like to suggest that the Cabinet committee should meet regularly in York, Lancaster or Chester just to make sure that it has less of a London perspective, I expect that the committee will think about that as well.

Egypt: Human Rights

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Thursday 26th June 2014 Grand Committee

[Baroness Royall of Blaisdon (Lab)]

My Lords, while I quite often agree with the noble Lord, Lord Ramsbotham, on this occasion I fundamentally disagree with him. I agree that we should be critical friends, but this is a country where there is no proper judicial process, where hundreds and thousands of people are sentenced to death, where journalists are banged up for seven years for doing nothing, where there is no freedom of speech and where women’s rights are totally abused. It is right to be critical, and probably right to be a friend, but I do not share the confidence that the noble Lord puts in the country of Egypt.

This has been an excellent, if depressing, debate, and I am grateful to the right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Coventry for tabling the Question. The catalyst for the Arab spring was the struggle for dignity, and I fear that, after three years of challenges and change, few people have had their dignity enhanced—quite the contrary. The current human rights situation is a degradation of dignity. There is no equality of citizenship.

Journalism is not a crime—at least, it should not be—but it is a crime in Egypt. My noble friend Lord Williams spoke graphically about the sentencing and imprisonment of the three journalists on charges that they provided aid to a terrorist organisation by broadcasting falsified news. This, combined with the previous imprisonment of other journalists, makes Egypt one of the worst jailers of journalists in the world. The chilling effect on freedom of speech of imprisoning those who report what is happening in the country is dramatic and it risks shifting Egypt back towards its authoritarian past. This effect will be felt not only by Egyptian and overseas journalists in Egypt but by its people. These sentences can be interpreted only as the military-led Government’s attempt to silence dissent in the country.

In the trial, the prosecution offered no evidence that was publicly available which would have shown that the journalists supported the Muslim Brotherhood or that they had broadcast anything that was not accurate. In fact, there were Kafkaesque scenes in the courtroom. It is evident that what the journalists experienced was very far from due process—in fact, quite the contrary. I hope that Her Majesty’s Government will continue to pressure Egypt to release the journalists.

I turn to another pressing human rights issue that Egypt is facing at the moment: women’s rights. There were many brave women protesting in Tahrir Square in 2011, demanding change for their country and society, but their voices have not been properly heard and they paid a price, as the noble Baroness, Lady Hodgson, said. Indeed, that price grows even higher. Like the noble Baroness, I was shocked to learn that according to UNICEF 91% of married Egyptian women aged between 15 and 49 have been subjected to female genital mutilation. While support for the practice has been falling in the past 20 years, and while it was legally banned in 2008, it is still broadly an accepted practice in Egypt. This acceptance is particularly prevalent in areas with lower levels of education, which underscores the importance of promoting better education for girls. I was encouraged to read that in March this year, for the first time, a doctor was prosecuted for FGM after a 13 year-old girl died in his clinic last year. I hope that this will not be an isolated case and that the new Government take the issue seriously.

Violence against women more broadly has been a grave problem in Egypt. The new Government have criminalised the physical and verbal harassment of women and set harsh punishments for these crimes. However, real progress will be made when enforcement against these crimes takes place. During the inauguration of President al-Sisi, many women were sexually assaulted in Tahrir Square, including a gang rape. In describing the current situation for women in Egypt, Human Rights Watch calls it an “epidemic of sexual violence”. In the past year, Egyptian authorities have taken little action to prevent or investigate violence against women or to prosecute those responsible. According to recent surveys, women face alarmingly high levels of sexual and gender-based violence. This includes widespread sexual harassment in public, as well as high levels of domestic violence. More broadly, women remain underrepresented in public life, are paid less than men and are prevented from advancing to higher positions. It is clear that FGM, domestic violence and street sexual violence are all connected and form a broader pattern of crimes against women.

It is imperative that the new Egyptian Government take the issue of women’s rights seriously, and that it becomes a high priority. However, I have a pessimistic lack of confidence, although I hope it will be confounded. The future of the country as a whole depends on women not being afraid of being assaulted when walking down the street or while at home. A democratic, progressive Egypt must include women from all walks of life, especially in leadership positions. The death sentence on hundreds of Muslim Brotherhood members is abhorrent, notwithstanding what the noble Lord said.

Sadly, it is clear that the new Government are cracking down on other political parties to deter people organising and uniting. Party-political activists are fearful of arrest. I pay tribute to friends who are members of the Egyptian Social Democratic Party, which has the support of my party, and who have been doing some fantastic work to build and grow their party, but a proposed new law on party politics would ban parties fielding candidates and allow candidates to stand only as independents.

These actions detract Egypt from the secure, stable, democratic future its people rightfully deserve and have fought tenaciously to secure, but voting does not equal democracy. Human rights, freedom of speech and freedom of political expression must underpin any democratic system. I fervently hope that the new Government will come to understand that, so that Egypt can look forward to a fair and prosperous future. I also trust that our Government will be tough, but of course I recognise—as the noble Lord, Lord Williams, said—that diplomacy is not always easy.

Intelligence and Security Committee

Baroness Royall of Blaisdon Excerpts

Tuesday 4th March 2014 Lords Chamber

[Lord Wallace of Saltaire]

My Lords, I of course have to agree with that.

[Baroness Royall of Blaisdon (Lab)]

My Lords, I have to preface my remarks by saying that I speak as a member of a party that values marriage but also values all stable relationships.

Sir David Omand, the former director of GCHQ, has said that,

“staff in the intelligence agencies would welcome deeper but more informed oversight, not least to protect their reputation”.

Notwithstanding the new Act, it is clear that in this digital age the pace of technological change is so rapid that I am sure the noble Lord would agree that the ISC should be strengthened further in terms of digital and technological expertise. What plans might there be for those to be strengthened in the current circumstances?

[Lord Wallace of Saltaire]

There is the question of the size, scale and expertise of the staff of the committee. The 2011 Green Paper raised the question of whether the current two commissioners, the Intelligence Services Commissioner and the Interception of Communications Commissioner, might be combined into one and given rather greater authority. What we are discovering about the speed of change with the internet—not just the hoovering up of information on the internet by government agencies but the whole question of the hoovering up of our personal information by private agencies—is an issue that we all clearly need to discuss further. The Government have been developing a draft communications data Bill on which we will all have to consider how we move forward, probably in the first Session of the next Parliament.