Parliament: Elected House of Lords

Baroness Royall of Blaisdon Excerpts

Wednesday 10th November 2010 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Royall of Blaisdon]

My Lords, this is a debate of fundamental importance to both the House of Commons and the House of Lords. I pay tribute to the continuing force and validity of the considerations and conclusions of the Joint Committee on Conventions, chaired by my noble friend Lord Cunningham of Felling, to which many noble Lords have referred today.

I have to disagree with the noble Lord, Lord Tyler, about the conclusions of that report—they were approved by all parties in both Houses—on the implications of any future change in composition for the relations between the two Houses:

“If the Lords acquired an electoral mandate, then in our view their role as the revising chamber, and their relationship with the Commons, would inevitably be called into question, codified or not ... should any firm proposals come forward to change the composition of the House of Lords, the conventions between the Houses would have to be examined again”.

That conclusion was right when the committee reported in October 2006 and it is right now. I am the only member speaking in tonight’s debate of the Government’s committee on further reform of your Lordships’ House, chaired by the Deputy Prime Minister. I can tell the House that the committee has given some consideration to this point, although not much, and that as yet it has come to no clear conclusion.

My own view, in addition to a point that I have repeatedly made—that the issue of any further substantive reform of your Lordships’ House is of such constitutional significance that it should be put to the people of this country in a referendum—is that, if the group chaired by the Deputy Prime Minister does come up with firm proposals to change the composition of the House of Lords, as specified by the Joint Committee, then the conventions between the Houses should indeed be examined again, in line with the agreed recommendation of the Joint Committee.

I believe that the right body for such an examination would, again, be a Joint Committee of both Houses and I roundly reject those, including the Deputy Leader of your Lordships’ House, who claim that such a view is the last refuge of reform refuseniks. I am a reformer; I want an elected House and I do not want to delay the process. For that reason, I suggest that a Joint Committee on conventions be convened to meet in parallel with the pre-legislative scrutiny committee on the draft Bill. I should be grateful for the Minister’s views on that. As I said, I am not a reform refusenik but I believe that the relationship between the two Houses and their powers is fundamental to the successful reform of this Chamber.