Overseas Development Assistance: Gender-based Violence

Baroness Massey of Darwen Excerpts

Tuesday 28th April 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Sugg]

My Lords, DfID does not currently favour earmarking specific overseas development aid as that limits its flexibility to respond to unseen priorities, a case in point being our Covid-19 response. However, I agree with my noble friend that there is more the UK can do to prevent all forms of violence against women and girls. That is why we have made the largest single investment in preventing violence against women and girls of any bilateral donor, through our new What Works to Prevent Violence Against Women and Girls Programme.

[Baroness Massey of Darwen (Lab)]

My Lords, does the Minister agree that as well as providing services, sexual and reproductive health programmes are also important in empowering women to be more comfortable about their bodies and to resist violence? Will she therefore tell us how much DfID is allocating to sexual and reproductive health programmes for women?

[Baroness Sugg]

I agree with the noble Baroness. Particularly in the face of Covid-19, with overwhelmed health systems trying to cope with the disease outbreak, sexual and reproductive health services will be even harder to access, putting even more lives in danger. We are working with our partners to support them to continue to reach populations, and to make sure that every woman and girl can continue to realise her right to choose.

Sustainable Development Goals

Baroness Massey of Darwen Excerpts

Wednesday 10th July 2019 Grand Committee

[Baroness Massey of Darwen (Lab)]

My Lords, I am delighted that the noble Baroness, Lady Sugg, has introduced this debate on SDGs. They are not exactly a household topic but are of extreme importance to us all, as well as for the future of our varied societies—indeed, for our planet. I pay tribute to my noble friend Lord McConnell who has inspired an all-party group on SDGs and consistently pursued discussions at all levels, from young people to Ministers, on how we as a nation can contribute to these goals and targets.

I want to talk about some of the issues affecting children and young people, and how the SDGs must both protect and empower them. Any global or national goal needs to be broken down and focused on communities, including children, so that any impact can be measured—and felt. Children and young people should be at the heart of any initiative inspired by the SDGs. They are terribly important; they should be allowed to add their influence. Let us give them their voices and their rights. I wish every nation had a strategy for children and young people. We have heard powerful speeches today about poverty. Foremost in any strategy on children should be child poverty: we are not cracking this and we must.

Certain targets, of course, focus on children and young people. These include goals 3 and 4, target 5.3 and other gender-related targets such as those on female genital mutilation, child, early and forced marriage, and comprehensive sexual health education. I want to raise other targets which are concerned with abuse, exploitation, trafficking and all forms of violence against children, including targets 16.2 and 8.7, which call for immediate efforts to,

“eradicate forced labour … modern slavery and human trafficking, and secure the … elimination of the worst forms of child labour … and, by 2025, end child labour in all its forms”.

I should declare an interest as a member of the British delegation to the Parliamentary Assembly of the Council of Europe. I have written a report entitled Ending Violence Against Children: A Council of Europe Contribution to the Sustainable Development Goals—particularly target 16.2 on abuse. This report was endorsed by the Parliamentary Assembly two weeks ago and I shall present it at the high-level policy forum in New York next week. My association with the Council of Europe has shown how important it is to work internationally and then focus on our national issues and local issues in communities.

On sexual and reproductive health in young people, I am grateful to the UK Network on Sexual and Reproductive Health and Rights for its comments on the DfID strategy for sexual and reproductive health. I want to be assured that the Government will continue to recognise and support DfID programmes on the subject. DfID asserts that it is “a global leader” on sexual and reproductive health, and so it is. It has done some magnificent and brave work and committed a great deal of money to programmes on it, sometimes in the face of controversy and opposition. It has funded and supported programmes on family planning and contraception, AIDS, maternal and newborn health, female genital mutilation and education.

Adolescents and young people are a key group. Their health and social development are sometimes neglected or ignored because we think they are all healthy, yet an estimated 21 million adolescent girls become pregnant each year in developing areas. About half those pregnancies are unintended and end in abortion. The abortions may be carried out under dangerous conditions and many young girls die. Comprehensive sexuality education is a key intervention in ensuring that young people have the knowledge and skills to avoid unwanted pregnancy and sexually transmitted infections.

Resources for sexual health are essential. Data collection, sometimes lacking, is also essential. The UK Network on Sexual and Reproductive Health Rights makes the important point that programmes should be integrated and comprehensive. Sexual health involves promoting choices across a number of areas; for example, gender-based rights and family planning. Sexual and reproductive health should also integrate with areas such as population, climate change consequences, and vulnerability to depletion of natural resources and natural disasters.

A focus on young people is essential if we are to make the world a safer, happier place. A focus on their health and well-being is also bound to save money in the long run. I hope that the Minister agrees on importance of the rights of young people in all that we do and of consulting them on what issues they think matter.

I am proud that the Council of Europe and other international bodies have actively engaged with ending violence against children and striven to make it a political priority. The UK is of course a member of the Council of Europe and will remain so despite Brexit. This is of mutual benefit and we should use that lever to support both the Council of Europe and ourselves because in the UK we have developed strategies and focused resources on the terrible scourge of child abuse. However, it is difficult to tackle. It is often unspoken; it is often hidden. The Council of Europe Strategy for the Rights of the Child contributes to implementation of the agenda for sustainable development and refers to:

“Building a Europe for and with children”.


It promotes an integrated approach to the elimination of all forms of violence against children, such as sexual exploitation and abuse online and offline, trafficking, corporal punishment, bullying—including cyberbullying —and gender-based violence. The programme also promotes positive parenting, child-friendly justice, good health and social services.

We know that violence against children exists in many contexts: the family, the peer group, schools, and sport and other activities. It is common in conflict situations, in youth justice, and with migrants and refugees. Ending violence against children is one of the most important goals and a precondition to achieving many of the others. Violence against children has horrific emotional, physical and psychological consequences. We can share good practice across nations in tackling this abuse.

There are challenges to delivering any of the goals we are talking about today, and certainly in combating violence against children and safeguarding sexual and reproductive health. Such challenges include a lack of data and the inability to draw conclusions from data, and co-ordination and developing priorities. Nationally, these priorities need to be decided with the involvement of stakeholders, such as local communities and children themselves, and should not make assumptions about what the needs are. Priorities must also be monitored, to ensure that we are on the right track. Another challenge is our attitude towards children themselves. Children have rights and responsibilities and they deserve to be heard in order to express their concerns.

How do we prioritise goals and targets? Government departments have many, sometimes conflicting, objectives, and sometimes they do not even talk to each other about priorities. The Council of Europe and the UN have much to offer in the area of prioritisation. For over a decade, the council has talked about the fight to end violence against children and has developed standards, guidance, support, capacity building, monitoring, the exchange of good practice, co-operation, data collection and awareness-raising campaigns. It has liaised with NGOs and other influential organisations at both national and international levels to address common areas of concern. As others have said, we in the UK have much to offer and to be proud of in all these areas. We also have much to learn.

I am delighted that the SDGs are being monitored; we are in the process of monitoring them now. As a result of this, will we be able to share good practice, develop integrated programmes and support each other to provide a better world for current and future generations? Can the Minister reassure me that young people will be at the forefront of our concerns, perhaps even with a strategy for children?

Brexit: Proposed UK–EU Security Treaty (European Union Committee Report)

Baroness Massey of Darwen Excerpts

Wednesday 16th January 2019 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Massey of Darwen (Lab)]

My Lords, I must first thank the noble Lord, Lord Jay, for introducing this debate with such rigour and for his excellent chairing of the EU Home Affairs Committee, of which I enjoy being a member. The past two years have been exciting, busy and sometimes perplexing, and he has handled the many Brexit-related issues with enormous skill and determination.

Many of those issues, processes and priorities are still relevant at this time of kaleidoscopic uncertainty. We know that issues regarding Brexit are complex, and need time and due process to be considered properly. Security is one of the most complex. Our report expresses concern about timescales; this problem is being demonstrated by colleagues working on statutory instruments. There are hundreds to consider, with so little time to do it well. We know from experience that the time needed to negotiate EU agreements with third countries is long, in view of the density of the issues. My noble friend Lord Browne described this graphically.

Among our witnesses during the inquiry for the report, considerable variation of opinion was offered on the issue of a treaty. For example, one witness doubted that a treaty could adequately replace existing instruments because it is unlikely that European law will stand still. Other witnesses felt that a treaty would be the best way to ensure an effective security relationship between the UK and the EU and show political commitment.

Sir Rob Wainwright, a former director of Europol—the excellent Brit noted by my noble friend Lord West—has expressed the view that in an,

“ideal world there would be no change to the UK’s current arrangements”,

on security. However, he also recognised that this scenario was “not realistic”. The delicacy of agreements and negotiations on security was apparent in both our inquiry and the one we carried out in 2016 on policing and security. For example, as stated in our report, the EU’s JHA covers a wide spectrum of police, judicial, criminal, civil and family law matters. Some EU member states have negotiated balances between retaining certain powers and sharing others with the UK. This sharing and co-operation may of course continue, whatever happens.

What also struck me was how great the role of the UK has been on various committees in Europe. We have led in several fields. This is likely to diminish. We may get co-operation, but we will not have the leadership we have had—what a pity. It is recognised that the EU benefits from security co-operation with the UK. On 19 June, the director of GCHQ stated:

“These threats are more complex and more global and none of us can defend against them alone”.


The European arrest warrant, a key element in security issues, raises particular concerns. I cannot go into the intricacies now, but I ask the Minister to qualify the UK’s likely position on the EAW post Brexit, given the committee’s concern in its conclusion on page 24 of its report.

The House of Commons Exiting the European Union Committee report states at paragraph 88:

“The Political Declaration appears to rule out continued UK participation in the European Arrest Warrant”,


as the warrant,

“is linked to EU membership, including free movement of people, the Charter of Fundamental Rights and EU citizenship”.

The political declaration states that the two sides will seek replacement extradition arrangements instead, establishing procedures,

“to surrender suspected and convicted persons efficiently and expeditiously”,

as a replacement for the European arrest warrant. What does that mean? What procedures are we talking about and under what timescale? Our committee concluded:

“We have, however, seen no evidence that sufficient progress has yet been made towards negotiating a comprehensive security treaty”.


Is the Minister confident that within the next few months, we will have a security treaty that will sufficiently protect our country? What does she think the Government should do, given that we seem unprepared to guarantee security measures? I look forward to her reply.

Violent Crime

Baroness Massey of Darwen Excerpts

Thursday 29th November 2018 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Massey of Darwen (Lab)]

My Lords, I thank my noble friend Lord Harris for introducing this debate so effectively. He has long experience of local policing and crime issues, so he speaks with authority.

I have been struck by two recent headlines. One was in the Times, which described the stabbing to death of a 16 year-old boy on a Saturday night. The boy’s sister said that he was stabbed to death because of his postcode. The boy was from Wood End in Coventry, one of the most deprived areas of the Midlands. Knife crime happens most frequently, but not exclusively, in deprived areas. Tackling deprivation and improving deprived areas should be an aim if we are to combat crime of any kind, especially violent crime.

The second story was in the Telegraph on Tuesday of this week. It was about the police facing calls on mental health issues every two minutes. They have thus been distracted from increasing demands to tackle knife crime, child exploitation and other serious crimes. Again, this is significant. First, it shows the increase in mental health issues, long known to be a problem, and, secondly, it demonstrates forcefully that the police are stretched in all kinds of ways—fewer numbers with a greater number of issues to deal with.

Young people are at the centre of all this and they need attention. They must also be listened to, and I shall come on to that in a moment. In a debate that I introduced recently on life chances and social mobility, the noble Lord, Lord Baker, spoke of disenchantment among some pupils by the ages of 13 or 14. They feel that they are not listened to and are not learning anything, and they have high absentee rates and display bad behaviour. Some are expelled from school, as was touched on earlier. I quote the noble Lord, Lord Baker:

“The capacity of heads to expel has now grown out of all proportion ... an expelled child is on the road to a culture of gangland”.—[Official Report, 1/11/18; col. 1437.]


He is right, and I long for the report on expulsions that the Government have commissioned.

We are doing our young people a disservice by not educating them to enjoy learning of all kinds, including social skills and how to work with others. It is well known that our prisons are full of people who are illiterate and have poor mental health and social skills. One in 10 young people has a mental health disorder—three in every classroom. Seventy-five per cent of adults with mental health issues experienced symptoms by the age of 18. Black males are most likely to have mental health issues and are also most likely to be the people in prison. What happened to early intervention for them?

Acts of Parliament, policies and guidelines are welcome and can be the beginning of change but, as many have said, it is at the local level where the real change has to begin: better services for children, which are not just about safeguarding; schools which provide a holistic and respectful culture; help for struggling families and for parents who have difficulties with their children; and local facilities such as play areas, libraries and youth clubs. Sadly, between 2012 and 2016, around 600 youth centres closed and one children’s centre closed every week.

With this barrage of cuts to services affecting young people, we should perhaps not be surprised that there are social problems. Family poverty is increasing, with all the implications of that for depression, deprivation and subsequent trauma. The Government wish to make savings in many areas but these kinds of cuts are storing up trouble—costly trouble, with the long-term effects of crime, unemployment and truancy. Services such as mental health services are striving to deal with these issues, which could have been prevented or dealt with earlier. Do the Government understand that?

I want to turn to the importance of involving communities, and in particular young people, in solving problems. I have been working with groups of young people in seminars and round-table discussions for the last year. These are always chaired or co-chaired by the young people themselves. We have worked on two issues: child mental health and child-friendly justice. Right at the beginning of one seminar, one young woman said, “We are experts by experience; you should listen to us”. I agree with her.

Young people sometimes say that mental health issues frequently underlie disruptive or criminal behaviour. School exclusions are frequently described as unfair and counterproductive. Some children get used to multiple exclusions and constant changes of school or accommodation. Examples have been given of children excluded for trivial things such as having socks not at the right height or the wrong colour coat. This is ridiculous. There were many examples of missed opportunities to intervene and turn a life around. In particular, there was often no consistent adult support available to enable the child to tell their story.

Some young people reported going through up to 40 behaviour interventions without links being made between services and people, and having no single key person as advocate or support. They also said that multi-agency working was a priority. An example was given of a boy aged nine who was in trouble for selling drugs because his mum needed the money to pay the rent. The underlying causes of youth crime need re-investigation.

There was a feeling among young people that they had no champion and no voice. They felt they could have been engaged in decisions to help them identify the problems. Young people recognised and could give examples of good practice. Some police forces are actively seeking to involve young people in discussions about drugs, gangs and knife crime. Many NGOs have young people’s consultation panels. Some local authorities seek the opinions of young people in matters that affect them. Are the Government also taking into account the views of young people?

My noble friend is right to ask for a cross-government approach to tackling policing, law enforcement and policies on gangs and drugs. We need agencies to work together, as he said. He is right to spotlight health services, youth provision and opportunities for young people. Young people do not come in bits. They are, like all of us, made up of different characteristics and needs in a single person. Health, education, the police and other local services for children and young people need support, encouragement and funding to work together in this way. Our young people deserve no less.

Domestic Violence: Women

Baroness Massey of Darwen Excerpts

Thursday 8th March 2018 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

I will certainly take back my noble friend’s suggestion. He touches on a very important point: not only might these women be taken to different hospitals each time, but the woman might feel too frightened to report what she has gone through. The whole purpose of some of the Government’s initiatives is that women should no longer feel frightened to come forward and get the support they need through these terrible traumas.

[Baroness Massey of Darwen (Lab)]

My Lords, am I right in thinking that in February 2017 Theresa May announced a domestic violence and abuse Act? We have seen no moves towards that Act, as far as I know. A consultation was promised; more consultation is now being promised. What does this consultation consist of? Do we need more consultation, or should we just get on with it?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

I can assure the noble Baroness that the VAWG commitments that Theresa May made, both as Prime Minister and previously as Home Secretary, are still firm. It is not an either/or in terms of the commitments that the measures in the Bill will cover. They will enshrine a definition of domestic abuse; they will introduce a new domestic abuse commissioner and a domestic abuse protection order that I talked about earlier; and they will include proposals for ensuring that the sentencing in domestic abuse-related offences duly recognises the devastating impact that these offences have on children, as I explained to the noble Lord earlier. Moreover—the noble Baroness, Lady Gale, will be interested to hear this—we will introduce measures to adopt extra-territorial jurisdiction over remaining sexual offences so that we can advance towards ratification of the Istanbul convention.

Role of Women in Public Life

Baroness Massey of Darwen Excerpts

Monday 5th February 2018 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Massey of Darwen (Lab)]

My Lords, I so welcome this debate. I thank the noble Baroness, Lady Vere, for introducing it with such vigour. Speeches from men and women in such debates are always enjoyable and powerful. It is always wonderful to hear how so many amazing women are being celebrated. Women may not be content, rightly, with underrepresentation in Parliament or in top jobs, with unequal pay and other gender discrimination, and with unacceptable harassment and abuse, but women have much to be proud of and to rejoice in.

I am proud that last week, in the Second Reading of the withdrawal Bill in your Lordships’ House, 48 women spoke confidently and incisively on divisive issues. From these Benches, I was proud of the scintillating performances of my noble friends Lady Smith and Lady Hayter, a team who have worked tirelessly, endlessly and patiently to present so effectively the complexities facing us regarding Brexit. The debate was relatively respectful and good humoured on all sides, from men and women. It was an example of knowledgeable and analytical presentation, enhanced, I believe, by the presence of women, just as I believe that today’s debate is enhanced by the participation of 10 men—most of them are not here, but there were 10 altogether. I am proud that women are moved to protest against put-downs, insults and affronts to their bodies. On 20 January, women in the United States marched in cities to protest against the Trump concept of their place in society. My daughter, an American, was there and sent me a picture of a placard saying: “We are the granddaughters of the witches you never burned”. Anyone from Lancashire or Massachusetts will appreciate that remark and celebrate women’s resilience and determination.

It is a good sign that one daily newspaper last week had a huge spread on the history of women’s suffrage. It is wonderful that cities around the UK will be celebrating the 100th anniversary of the Representation of the People Act in dynamic ways in the coming months. I know there are problems with grass-roots funding for projects and I regret that, but today in my local tourist office in Lewes, Sussex, I saw a wonderful window display on women and the vote, together with comments from young people expressing their disappointment that they are not able to vote at 16. I agree with them. I look forward to the Museum of London’s “Votes for Women” exhibition, our own parliamentary “Voice and Vote” in Westminster Hall and the Pankhurst Centre in Manchester’s year-long celebration of the suffragette movement.

Manchester was, of course, where Emmeline Pankhurst held the first meeting of the Women’s Social and Political Union in 1903. It may not be generally known that Pankhurst was voted the greatest northerner in history in a recent poll. A statue to her will be unveiled in Manchester in 2019. I was born and brought up close to Manchester and I am proud of the northern suffragettes; not all upper-class ladies but also women who worked in mills and in domestic service. In passing, I say that while we celebrate women in public life we should also celebrate the women who may never be in public life, nationally or internationally, but who work hard and diligently to bring up children, to care for members of their family, to do volunteer work, work in the professions and toil in the lower ranks of politics—we all know what that is like. Here’s to them.

Just after the women’s march, I read in an American magazine comments on the #MeToo movement. It reminded me that women attain professional goals, or sometimes simply do a job, under duress and discrimination. This means that courage and drive play a part. I quote from that article:

“Women in positions of power know one thing for sure: they’re leaving the world a much better place than they found it”.


Studies have shown that female participation in the labour market improves the strength of economies. From working on boards and in Parliament, I believe that women’s contributions improve the depth and quality of decision-making. There is much more to be done in persuading women into and retaining them in public life. It is true that powerful women will leave a legacy, but not without tapping the shoulders of the next generation to continue the fight.

Speaking of tapping the shoulder, Millicent Fawcett acknowledged Mary Wollstonecraft as the “leader in the battle” for votes. One was born in 1759, the other in 1847. Fawcett will shortly have a statue in Parliament Square. Wollstonecraft, for some inexplicable reason, has no memorial except her novels, histories, the great treatise “A Vindication of the Rights of Women” and, of course, as the mother of Mary Shelley. Surely it is time that she received some visible accolade as a leader in the feminist movement.

I move on to more recent events, with two women of contrasting backgrounds that I want to mention again. Nancy Astor became the first woman MP to take her seat in the House of Commons. In her maiden speech she spoke these words:

“I am simply trying to speak for hundreds of women and children throughout the country who cannot speak for themselves”.—[Official Report, Commons, 24/2/20; col. 1631.]


It is a familiar theme in our Parliament. Margaret Bondfield, a working-class girl from Somerset, became the first female Cabinet member in 1929, in a Labour Government. She witnessed first-hand the drudgery of women and the lack of prospects for women shop workers, and became an active union member, determined to improve equality for women. I cite but two examples of women politicians down the years who have striven mightily for justice and democracy. There have so been many and I am delighted that today we acknowledge and celebrate them.

Greece: Migrant and Refugee Support

Baroness Massey of Darwen Excerpts

Wednesday 17th January 2018 Lords Chamber

Asked by

[Baroness Massey of Darwen]

To ask Her Majesty’s Government what, if any, support they are providing to the government of Greece, the UNHCR or Greek or international non-governmental organisations to help meet the challenges of winter for migrants and refugees in hotspots in the Greek islands.

[The Minister of State, Department for International Development (Lord Bates) (Con)]

My Lords, the UK is supporting the European Union, which, with the UN High Commissioner for Refugees and other organisations, is working tirelessly with the Greek Government to improve the conditions for refugees. The EU has allocated more than €1 billion in emergency funding to Greece.

[Baroness Massey of Darwen (Lab)]

My Lords, I thank the Minister for his response and I know that he is genuinely interested in this issue. Perhaps I may focus on unaccompanied children in these hotspots. How many unaccompanied minors are in hotspots and what are the UK Government doing to liaise with organisations which support and protect these children?

[Lord Bates]

The Government are very concerned about the reports of conditions in the camps on the five hotspot islands which currently operate as receiving centres. The current numbers are 394, of whom 299 are unaccompanied children and 95 are separated children. The greatest number of unaccompanied children are on Lesbos island, where there are 168, along with 66 separated children.

Childcare

Baroness Massey of Darwen Excerpts

Wednesday 5th March 2014 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Northover]

My Lords, we review very closely the effectiveness of our policies across this area and look very closely also at what is happening in other countries. We certainly recognise the importance of good-quality childcare, which is why we have sought to increase support to 15 hours a week free childcare for all three to four year-olds and for two year-olds from disadvantaged homes.

[Baroness Massey of Darwen (Lab)]

My Lords, is the Minister aware of the report published recently by the Institute for Public Policy Research which states that where childcare is publicly funded, rates of maternal employment are higher? What can be done, therefore, about the fact that nearly half of local authorities do not have sufficient childcare places?

[Baroness Northover]

Yes, I have read the report to which the noble Baroness refers. It is of course extremely important that we have good-quality childcare so that the trend of mothers returning to work can continue. As for the availability of childcare places, however, we have found, using information from providers, that there are 300,000 unfilled places nationally—which is encouraging. In other words, there are places. I realise that the information to which the noble Baroness refers comes from local authorities. One has to worry somewhat about the quality of their data when they do not square with what the providers are saying.

Children: Affordable Childcare

Baroness Massey of Darwen Excerpts

Thursday 9th January 2014 Lords Chamber

Moved by

[Baroness Massey of Darwen]

That this House takes note of the case for increasing access to affordable childcare.

[Baroness Massey of Darwen (Lab)]

My Lords, I am very pleased to have secured this important and timely debate and am delighted to see so many speakers here today with a variety of expertise and experience. I thank colleagues from the Library for their excellent briefing and those in the voluntary sector who work tirelessly on behalf of families and children. I hope that we can deliver a wake-up call today not just to this Government but also to future Governments. Like many other issues, this should not be a party-political issue—it is too important for families. I believe that with the issue of affordable childcare, we have a situation that is out of hand.

Healthy child development should surely be at the heart of this discussion. It is an issue that often gets lost, yet research is clear about what children need to thrive—security, attention to physical, emotional and intellectual needs, and love. The long-term impact of early years care is well known. In today’s world, parents may be caught in the conflicts of what is best for their child. The situation has certainly changed from when I had young children, where it was usual for one parent—usually the mother—to be at home looking after the child or children until they went to school. I was fortunate in being able to do and enjoy that. Some women said that they were better mothers for having their children looked after by others for at least part of the day and being able to work.

Pressures on my—our—children’s generation are different and more complex. The pressures of the cost of living, the workplace environment and taking time out have increased, even though maternal and paternal leave after birth has thankfully improved. Parents want an alternative to the family situation where their child or children will be well looked after. As I and I am sure others have seen, most parents go to great lengths, whatever the cost, to decide what that care will be, whether it is with a childminder, including a relative, a nursery—either private or local authority—or other arrangements. I know many young parents feel guilty about this but for many reasons childcare has to be the way forward for them. How does that work out? Is high-quality childcare affordable? Governments—any Governments—need to ensure that parents have affordable, high-quality choices about what happens to their children at a key stage of life.

Some facts are clear. Since the last election, the cost of nursery places has risen by 30%—five times faster than pay. The average cost for a part-time nursery place of 25 hours a week has gone up to £107. There are 576 fewer Sure Start centres with three lost every week. There are 35,000 fewer childcare places. The Government offer of childcare for disadvantaged two year-olds is struggling because one in three councils do not have enough places. Some 60% of local authorities in England have sufficient childcare for working parents and in 36% of local authorities parents have reported lack of childcare to their family information service. Only 30% of English local authorities—16% in Wales—can provide sufficient holiday care for working parents, despite the obligation to do so under the Childcare Act 2006. Six local authorities report an average cost of holiday childcare exceeding £175—the maximum amount of help that a parent on low income can claim through working tax credit support for childcare costs, leaving many parents out of pocket.

Some 91% of nursery care, 94% of sessional and pre-school care, and 67% of after-school care is delivered by the private and not-for-profit sector. It has been estimated that 7% of childcare costs in group settings is due to rent or mortgage costs. A parent buying 50 hours of childcare per week for a child under two now faces an annual bill of almost £11,000 per year—£14,000 in London. Many colleagues will know such parents and how they struggle to make ends meet.

The Every Disabled Child Matters coalition is concerned that access to high-quality, affordable childcare is seriously problematic for these parents. The cost of childcare for a disabled child is prohibitive and discourages or prevents parents of these children from working. Policy developments are failing to recognise this.

Since 2007-08, local authorities in England and Wales have been required to carry out childcare sufficiency assessments and identify gaps in the provision of childcare. In 2010, only 23% of local authorities said that they had sufficient childcare for disabled children. By 2013, the situation was worse with only 14% of local authorities reporting sufficient provision.

Where childcare is available for disabled children, it is costly. Thirteen per cent of respondents to a survey by Working Families stated that they were paying £10 an hour more for childcare for a disabled child, and 66% complained of extra costs. In addition to costs, parents of disabled children are also concerned that the care for their child should be of good quality—a very significant issue. As Every Disabled Child Matters states:

“It is vital that we remind ourselves that childcare is not only about enabling parents to work but ensuring that children benefit from it.

Recently, Ed Miliband has set out plans to extend free childcare for three and four year-olds from 15 to 25 hours a week for working parents, funded by an increase in the bank levy, and to increase the legal guarantee of access to wraparound care from 8 am to 6 pm in primary schools. He has said that parents are facing a childcare crunch as they seek to balance work and family life. Does the Minister agree?

A Resolution Foundation report has acknowledged that the Government announced in the Budget last year that they will spend an extra £1 billion per year on two types of childcare support: 600,000 working families eligible for universal credit will potentially be eligible for extra childcare support from 2016, and 2.5 million higher income families not eligible for universal credit will be able to claim tax-free childcare through a new system of vouchers worth up to £1,200 a year per child. A higher level of childcare support is welcome for those families on universal credit who will be eligible for more help. However, the proposed extra support will not benefit the majority of families with children, particularly those on low wages, who struggle most with the increasing cost of childcare. Low-paid second earners who work part time will be worse off if they increase their hours than if they did not work at all.

The Joseph Rowntree Foundation highlighted late last year that more than half of families living in poverty are in work. The cost of childcare is a significant contributor to their problems, particularly due to the way that income support works, with a taper sharply reducing support as parents enter work and childcare costs increase. Sadly, the report concludes that parents are no happier with their work-life balance and attitudes to family-friendly working appear to have gone backwards among employers during the recession.

At a recent conference of the Family and Childcare Trust, issues of childcare were discussed in depth and many questions asked. The keynote address states that it must be remembered that only one-third of children attending formal childcare are aged three or four and therefore qualify for the universal element of the free early education offer. Although the number of childcare places has risen, parents still have difficulty finding affordable childcare at the times they need it. More staff are qualified, but childcare is still a low-wage profession and the annual turnover of staff is three times the average of that of a good school. That will clearly impact on quality and availability. Quality of staff in early years settings and recognition of the profession’s impact and importance is an issue that has often been raised in your Lordships’ House and needs to be an ongoing concern.

I turn to some of the responses to the issue of affordable childcare. Many professionals in the field of child and family welfare have raised several key points. First, childcare is a fragmented sector, with the expansion in the private and voluntary sectors. In a fragmented sector, there are challenges in achieving profitability without an impact on quality. There is potential for isolation and there are weak links to quality support.

Secondly, vision, direction and long-term strategy from political parties must not be lost in competing on policy, whether it be from the expansion of the free offer or tax-free childcare. Thirdly, the free offer is at the heart of childcare and hugely popular with parents, but problems remain. Many parents are not in control of when and where they access free childcare. Around 20% of parents are not happy about being able to access a good provider.

The key to affordable success, it has been suggested, lies in a simpler funding system. Multiple funding streams directed separately into a market environment lacking coherence will not achieve high-quality and flexible access for parents. Such a system also leads to administrative deficiencies. Those funding streams must be brought together. The Scandinavian model gives power and funding to local authorities to plan local provision and gives parents legal access to services. Interestingly, the Institute for Public Policy Research has produced an interim report on childcare as a strategic national priority. This report states that a wide-ranging expansion of childcare would pay for itself over time. It estimated that attracting 280,000 mothers back into the workforce would generate an extra £1.5 billion in tax revenues and make savings in benefit payments. We await the final report of the IPPR, which will indicate possible ways forward. I hope that they will be noted by policymakers.

I have tried to show that this is a complex area and needs simplifying. What is clear to me is that the Government do not seem to have policies on long-term strategies which are compatible with providing quality, accessible and affordable childcare for the majority of working parents, particularly those on lower incomes. I hope the Minister will reassure us that this is being thought through with all parents in mind and that we shall see greater clarity, simplification and understanding about the welfare of children and parents.

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Massey of Darwen]

My Lords, I thank the Minister for her response. I also thank all noble Lords who have taken part in this debate for their very powerful contributions. It has been such a good debate that for the first time ever my notes are longer than my speech was, but I assure the House that my response will not be as long as my speech.

I have learnt a lot today and had some ideas reinforced. I heard an important concept put forward: an all-party commission on childcare. There is a great deal of consensus between us in this House, as always when we speak about children. I shall not refer to noble Lords by name, but they will know who they are. Speakers on all sides said that all is not well, much has been achieved, but we still have some way to go.

Personal reflection is always very important, and we had it about a 16 month-old child on the hip, a wasp’s mother and wet patches, and my noble friend Lady Prosser spoke about campaigning and organising. We have mentioned key issues which could form the basis for discussion on this large social change. Some of these issues seem to be about how the system can be made simpler and more flexible, coherent and accessible. Let us look at structures, including holiday care. Let us look at spending smartly, as a noble Lord said, and at how we can show that childcare can ultimately pay for itself if it is rightly funded. Let us reinforce what we know about women and employment. Childcare is good for women, families and the economy. Let us look at good practice, not just abroad but in the UK. Let us look at the benefits of early intervention and how it can prevent problems later on. At the same time, let us look at the early years workforce. It is key that childcare must be of the highest possible standard and must benefit children. Let us look at inspection. Let us look at issues about disabled children and childcare. Let us look at in-work poverty. Let us look honestly at social mobility and childcare. That is just for starters. Much work has been done and is being done by all parties on childcare, families and children, but, in thanking the Minister again, I ask her to suggest some cross-party forum way where we can forge and examine these issues realistically and honestly.

Motion agreed.

Children and Families Bill

Baroness Massey of Darwen Excerpts

Monday 18th November 2013 Grand Committee

[Baroness Massey of Darwen (Lab)]

My Lords, I support Amendments 242 and 244 in the name of the noble Earl, Lord Listowel, but ask the Committee’s permission to sit down while I speak. I also support my noble friend Lady Hughes in her forceful speech about early intervention.

During our consideration of the Bill, many concerns have been raised about services working together for the benefit of children. Indeed, an earlier amendment—we discussed it some days ago, or possibly some weeks ago—was specifically about promoting integration, with lead professionals taking a role in ensuring that integration happens. I remember—again, it was some time ago—the noble Baroness, Lady Howarth, in one of her many excellent and wise contributions, saying that without data, strategy is not possible; the noble Baroness, Lady Hughes, also hinted at that. I agree with that and I think that the amendment could support the development of a strategy for children and families at a local level.

The amendments tabled by the noble Earl, Lord Listowel, are an extension of that concept of integration and improving data sharing in children’s centres. The noble Earl has described the need for NHS trusts to share with authorities records of live births to parents resident in their area in order to facilitate the identification of and contact with new families through children’s centres and other early outreach services. To this end, as he said, this should include the format of arrangements, the safeguarding of information, the regularity of data transfer, timescales and safeguards against inappropriate sharing.

All this reminds me of a report that some noble Lords may remember, Every Child Matters, which came out in about 2004—I can see lots of nods. This was a consultation on what matters for children, followed by a government document, in the wake of the horrendous death of Victoria Climbié and the report by the noble Lord, Lord Laming, which concluded that the poor co-ordination of services, including health, police, education and social services, had contributed to that child and other children falling through the net. It was a seminal document. It had influence in involving children and young people in setting priorities and in getting services for children to work together, to look at their functions in working together and to talk to one another. This group of amendments shows that we need to look at all that again; we need to look at the integration of services.

As others have said, poor data sharing can prevent organisations, including children’s centres, from helping vulnerable children and their families. If they had birth data, they could address the needs of such families early. I remember one children’s centre that I visited in the north of England having courses for young mothers. These courses became a group support initiative to talk about breastfeeding, about bringing up babies and toddlers and about which services people could access—for example, classes on a variety of issues. Crèches had been set up at the centre. Sometimes the centre was able to offer intensive support for parents who had difficulties with finances, for example.

The organisation Action for Children has set out reasons for effective data-sharing systems and has listed some difficulties, which I hope the Minister will be able to address. Those difficulties include the fact that children’s centres may be split across district and health services; there may be no data-sharing protocols; and there may be a feeling that such systems are too resource-intensive. However, there are serious impacts in not sharing data. The noble Earl has listed some such impacts of delaying the identification of vulnerable children and their families and delaying help for such families.

When data sharing is effective—according to Action for Children, it is effective in 32% of children’s centres—local arrangements have been set up between health and the local authority. There have been meetings and good relationships between, for example, health visitors and midwives, and there has been early identification of vulnerable families and of children who are likely to have difficulties, such as those with disabilities. As others have said, this help should be offered early in order to be most effective.

One of the key issues is that data sharing forms a basis for people from various disciplines who support families to meet and to talk about the concerns, not just swap bits of paper. It has always seemed to me that people talking about issues to one another, either formally or informally, is a very good way of ensuring integrated support for families. I look forward to hearing the Minister’s reply.

[Baroness Tyler of Enfield]

My Lords, I support Amendment 242, to which my name is attached. The noble Earl, Lord Listowel, has already set out very clearly the arguments in favour of piloting the registration of births at children’s centres, but I will just confirm my personal support for this amendment.

Children’s centres do many good things, but one of their absolutely core values lies in their ability to reach out to some of the most vulnerable and disadvantaged groups: people who, for all sorts of reasons, are unlikely to enter into sustained contact with public services without help in doing so, but who are also the most likely to benefit from them. We have already heard the statistics from the recent children’s centre census from 4Children. That is encouraging in showing us that the widening reach is really happening and that more children’s centres are being successful in reaching out to some of the most disadvantaged. The location of birth registration services within children’s centres will really help with early intervention in the lives of disadvantaged children.

I am sure that all noble Lords in this Committee are well aware of the evidence of the huge importance of early intervention and how incredibly important what happens in the first three years of a child’s life is. Indeed, as I know from my work on the All-Party Group on Social Mobility, in some ways those first three years can almost determine life chances for a lifetime. They are absolutely critical. That is why I think that getting parents through the doors of children’s centres, ideally within six weeks of their child’s birth, and exposing them to the range of services, help and support available is critical. It is also vital to help nurture those early relationships between parents and professionals, which, again, can make such a difference. That is why I am absolutely delighted that encouraging parents to register children’s births at a local children and family centre is now part of Liberal Democrat party policy.

My final point is that the proposed birth registration pilot scheme should be seen as part of a wider strategy to provide more integrated and cohesive public services. Children’s centres not only provide childcare, as we talked about earlier, but a range of valuable help, including parenting sessions, health and well-being advice, information on jobs and employability, et cetera. For example, things such as co-locating health visitors within children’s centres enable parents to have the opportunity to speak to a health visitor about any concerns they may have, for example in relation to their child’s sleeping patterns, breastfeeding and their own health and well-being. Co-locating important services in this one-stop-shop way has a whole range of very powerful benefits. It should increase take-up and should also be value for money. It makes terribly good sense and is a real win-win. Can we try it out rather than just talk about it?

[Baroness Massey of Darwen]

I apologise for addressing my noble friend Lady Jones as my noble friend Lady Hughes throughout my speech. They are not the same person.

[Baroness Northover]

My Lords, we all merge into one after a while. I start by emphasising to noble Lords that the Government believe that children’s centres provide a very important service and have a vital role to play in supporting outcomes for children and families.

I turn, first, to the issue of data sharing. We agree on the importance of information sharing. Clearly, professionals should work together to identify families who are in need of support and offer them that support. Indeed, the Department for Education’s statutory guidance for children’s centres is clear that health services and local authorities should share information, such as live birth data, with children’s centres on a regular basis where doing so enables professionals to work better with one another to provide services for families. Moreover, current legislation makes it clear that information can already be shared where there are local agreements and processes in place that meet the legal requirements about confidentiality, consent and security of information. Naturally, we wish to support information sharing between professionals. In order to encourage this, my colleagues at the Department of Health have undertaken to liaise with NHS England and other partners to promote the sharing of live birth data and to explore the practical issues.

--- Later in debate ---

Moved by

[Baroness Massey of Darwen]

245: After Clause 78, insert the following new Clause—
“Independence of the Children’s Commissioner
In Schedule 1 to the Children Act 2004 (Children’s Commissioner), in paragraph 1 (status) after sub-paragraph (2) insert—“(3) The Secretary of State shall not undermine the Children’s Commissioner’s independence and shall ensure that the Children’s Commissioner is under as few constraints as reasonably possible in determining—
(a) the Commissioner’s activities,(b) the Commissioner’s timetables, and(c) the Commissioner’s priorities.””

[Baroness Massey of Darwen]

My Lords, in moving Amendment 245, I will speak to Amendments 257 and 260 in this group and kick off what I think will be a useful discussion on the new arrangements for the Children’s Commissioner for England. I am sure that the amendments in the names of my noble friends Lady Hughes and Lady Jones and of other noble Lords will give rise to a pithy debate on this important issue.

The reforms to the role of the Children’s Commissioner for England have been welcomed by the Alliance for Reform of the Children’s Commissioner, which includes a number of significant children’s organisations. I am grateful to the department for the helpful note that we received on the Children’s Commissioner last week. I am not sure that it resolves all the issues, but hopefully we will have a useful discussion that will enable us to think through more of those issues.

As many noble Lords know, it was something of a struggle to get the then Government to agree to England having a Children’s Commissioner. Some people in this Room were instrumental in lobbying for the appointment and then contributed to the review of the Office of the Children’s Commissioner carried out by John Dunford in 2010. The review culminated in his report and recommendations, published in November of that year. One key recommendation—perhaps the key recommendation—was that there should be a focus on children’s rights in the work of the Children’s Commissioner. As a result, the new commissioner will take over the joint responsibilities of the Children’s Rights Director and the Children’s Commissioner.

The Bill can strengthen children’s rights generally. We have had, and will have in the future, debates on children’s rights in a variety of contexts. The Bill should reflect the Written Ministerial Statement of 6 December 2010, which made the commitment that the Government would give “due consideration” to the Convention on the Rights of the Child when proposing new law and policy. We still have a way to go with that. Many of John Dunford’s recommendations cannot be implemented without looking beyond the role, function and powers of the Children’s Commissioner and placing duties on public authorities and on Ministers. We will discuss that in later amendments.

The Children’s Commissioner will be a key force in safeguarding the rights and welfare of children and it is important that we get it right. There are three main issues: the appointment of the commissioner; the independence of the commissioner; and the promotion of children’s rights. The appointment of the Children’s Commissioner must be open, transparent and non-political in order for the commissioner to be sufficiently independent to champion children’s rights and to have credibility. The Children’s Commissioner is appointed by the Secretary of State but, as I understand it, is listed in the code of practice of the Commissioner for Public Appointments, so Parliament is involved in a pre-hearing process. However, the UN accreditation committee recommends that the involvement of Parliaments is provided for on the face of legislation rather than just being a political commitment. In Scotland and the Republic of Ireland, it is the national Parliament that appoints the commissioner. The degree of independence is critical in determining the success of this role. The new commissioner must be under as few constraints as possible in determining his or her activities, timetables and priorities. My amendments would see a clear legislative statement on such independence, which would bind future Governments.

In another place, MPs considered an amendment to require the Secretary of State not to interfere with the work of the Children’s Commissioner. The Government responded that the legislation already repeals provisions that currently allow the Secretary of State to direct the commissioner’s work, but that does not go as far as an explicit prohibition on interference. The Minister in another place cited the Equality and Human Rights Commission as an example of a body that is able to act independently. The legislation that set up the EHRC has similar provisions to those in my amendment. I welcome assurances that the Government will not interfere with decisions on priorities for the work of the commissioner, but such an assurance does not bind future Governments as a clear legislative statement would. The UN Committee on the Rights of the Child has made it clear that national human rights institutions for children should meet these standards.

The Minister may respond that the commissioner will have full membership of the European Network of Ombudspeople for Children. This is welcome, but it is not enough. The Children’s Commissioner should satisfy the Paris principles to the standard that the Children’s Commissioner should have the status of a national human rights institution.

Amendment 257 sets out criteria for the appointment of the Children’s Commissioner for England, stating that he or she must have adequate knowledge and experience in all matters regarding children, must involve children in decision-making and must be able to act independently of government. I am aware that this issue was discussed in another place and that the Minister stated that it would be desirable to draft the person specification at the time of appointment. That is fine so far as it goes, but setting out in legislation some objective minimum standards would be preferable to ensure that the person has the right skills and experience.

In another place, an amendment required the Secretary of State to have regard to the views of Parliament and others in appointing the Children’s Commissioner. The Minister circulated a note to the Public Bill Committee that set out how the appointment process would work. The Government indicated that it would not be convention to set out in legislation that Parliament should consider a particular matter. Amendment 260 would place a duty on the Secretary of State to have due regard to the views of any parliamentary committee that has published a view on a proposed appointment or removal from office of a Children’s Commissioner.

All these amendments would support the important principle that the Children’s Commissioner must be independent of government and must be well experienced in matters regarding the rights of the child. Who will be on the panel that interviews candidates and what are likely to be the selection criteria? I am not looking for an answer now, but I am interested. We in this House and children’s organisations will be watching the process with interest and concern. I beg to move.

[Baroness Lister of Burtersett]

My Lords, I rise to speak to Amendment 262, which has my name on it. I am speaking on behalf of the noble Lord, Lord Lester of Herne Hill, who is very sorry that he is unable to be here.

I want to make a point about independence in support, in particular, of my noble friend’s Amendment 245. At Second Reading, many noble Lords raised concerns about the Office of the Children’s Commissioner for England receiving sufficient funding from government to carry out its functions effectively. The Minister subsequently wrote to noble Lords acknowledging the need for sufficient resources to give effect to the reformed office’s work. He went on to say that decisions involving funding will always need to be taken in the context of the prevailing economic circumstances and competing priorities for public funding. That is understood but, whatever the economic circumstances, such decisions must not compromise the independence of the commissioner that my noble friend talked about or his ability effectively to carry out his work.

Legislation should therefore set out appropriate safeguards, such as those contained in Amendment 262. There is a danger that, unless properly resourced, the changes proposed in the draft legislation will raise expectations about the commissioner’s potential impact that the office simply cannot meet. The adequacy of the budget will determine whether the commissioner is able effectively to promote and protect children’s rights. According to the UN Committee on the Rights of the Child, it is the duty of states to make reasonable financial provision for the operation of national human rights institutions in the light of Article 4 of the convention. The mandating powers of national institutions may be meaningless or the exercise of their powers limited if the national institution does not have the means to operate effectively to discharge its powers. The Paris principles, mentioned by my noble friend, also underline the importance of ensuring that national human rights institutions have access to adequate resources. They state:

“The national institution shall have an infrastructure which is suited to the smooth conduct of its activities, in particular adequate funding … in order to be independent of the Government and not be subject to financial control which might affect its independence”.

The Dunford review drew attention to the fact that the Children’s Commissioner had a low budget compared to children’s national human rights institutions in other jurisdictions. At the time of the review, this country was spending 24p per child on the Children’s Commissioner compared to, for example, £1.89 in Ireland —hardly a richer country than this one—£1.27 in New Zealand and £3.74 in Northern Ireland. UNICEF undertook a global study of independent human rights institutions for children. It underlined that independence is the defining feature of such institutions and that sufficient and sustained financial resources are key to that independence.

On the issue of independence, I wish to raise another matter, which has been of concern to the Joint Committee on Human Rights, of which I am a member. In its report on the draft clauses preceding the Bill, the JCHR accepted the need for financial control of and public accountability for the public money spent by the Children’s Commissioner but was concerned about whether the degree of financial control exerted by the Government through the standard NDPB framework agreement was compatible with the requirement in the Paris principles that national human rights institutions should not be subject to financial control that might affect their independence. It therefore called, in December 2012, for the proposed new framework agreement between the OCC and DfE to be made available in draft as soon as possible so that it could be scrutinised for compatibility with the Paris principles requirement of effective independence from executive control.

The Government in their response promised to review the framework agreement in light of the committee’s comments and to make a copy of the revised document available for scrutiny. No new framework agreement had been published by the time the Bill was introduced, however. In the JCHR’s report on the Bill in June this year, it recommended that all the changes that had been made to the framework agreement between the Equality and Human Rights Commission and DCMS in order to safeguard the EHRC’s accreditation as an “A” status national human rights institution should also be made to the Children’s Commissioner’s framework agreement and it again asked for the revised framework agreement to be made available for scrutiny before the Bill reached Committee in the Lords.

With Committee stage fast approaching, but still no revised framework agreement published, the JCHR wrote again to the Minister on 30 October, asking the Government to make every effort to arrive at a revised agreement with the Children’s Commissioner and to make it available to Parliament before today’s debate on the proposed amendments to the Bill concerning the commissioner’s independence. Notwithstanding that request—or requests, in the plural—the Government have still not published a revised agreement. Towards the end of last week, they published and circulated a note summarising the main changes that will need to be made to the framework agreement when the Bill comes into force. These include a number of exemptions from efficiency controls that have been made in the EHRC’s revised framework agreement, which the Government say that they will “seek to replicate” in the Children’s Commissioner’s framework agreement.

The Government’s stated willingness to replicate the changes made to the EHRC’s framework agreement is welcome, but it is most regrettable that the revised agreement itself is still not available. As so often, the devil is in the detail. It will not be possible for Parliament to be sure that the framework agreement is compatible with the Paris principles until it has seen the text. It is not clear, for example, how the requirement of government approval of the commissioner’s marketing and advertising plan is compatible with independence when, as I understand it, efficiency controls, which must be satisfied for the plan to be approved, require such expenditure to be essential for the Government’s objectives, not the commissioner’s.

The same issue was resolved with the EHRC. I hope that it can be so with the Office of the Children’s Commissioner. Will the Minister give noble Lords his reassurance that he will discuss the detail of the framework agreement with the Office of the Children’s Commissioner as soon as possible and make a draft of the revised agreement available before Report, so that noble Lords can be satisfied on this crucial question of independence from inappropriate executive control?

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Nash]

We will take this away and consider it further. As regards the point made by the noble Baroness, Lady Hughes, on accountability and to whom it should be, our view is that the commissioner should be wholly independent as regards his or her views and priorities from both government and Parliament. However, I accept that Parliament should be able to scrutinise what the commissioner does and have an opportunity to debate issues that he has raised.

I hope that my responses on these important points provide assurances to noble Lords and I urge the noble Baroness to withdraw her amendment.

[Baroness Massey of Darwen]

My Lords, I thank the Minister for that response. This has been an incredibly perceptive debate and noble Lords have provided a lot of expertise. My noble friend Lady Hughes said at the beginning of her speech that it is the right time to review the role of the Office of the Children’s Commissioner. I agree with that. We have experience of two commissioners, both of whom have put the voice of the child at the centre of activity and have done significant work with vulnerable children. The Minister listed some things that the Children’s Commissioner could do. However, as many noble Lords have pointed out, funding is an issue, and we need to look at that again.

Others have mentioned the scope of the commissioner’s remit, accountability, quality assurance and the JCHR. For me two key issues have come out of our discussions today to which I certainly want answers before Report. One is that we absolutely need the framework agreement before we get to Report. In fact, we need it some time in advance of getting to Report; otherwise, how can we debate this seriously? How can we put down sensible amendments if we do not have the detail of that framework agreement? Stemming from that, I need to think about—as I am sure others do—what should go in this legislation; obviously not in too much detail but issues have come up today that certainly need more consideration when we think about what goes in the legislation.

I hope that the issue of the framework agreement will be resolved long before Report. That will influence what we think should go in the legislation. In the mean time, I beg leave to withdraw the amendment.

Amendment 245 withdrawn.

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Lister of Burtersett]

But because it was not an explicitly children’s rights-based institution, it did not have the status internationally that other children’s commissioners have. So this is a step forward and I am glad to be able to support the Government. In fact, I was one of those who criticised my own Government for failing to write in an explicit children’s rights-based remit.

The Joint Committee on Human Rights, of which I am a member, welcomed the reforms as,

“constituting a significant human rights enhancing measure”.

However, we believe that the reforms do not go quite far enough and therefore proposed this amendment. The intention is that the Bill should expressly define the rights of children in England to include the rights in the UN Convention on the Rights of the Child for the purposes of defining the commissioner’s primary function. At present, the Bill simply requires the commissioner to “have regard” to these rights. I am sure noble Lords will agree that that is a much weaker formulation.

The recommendation that the commissioner’s primary purpose should be defined explicitly with reference to the UN convention should not be construed as just the icing on the cake, for it is about the ingredients of the cake itself. This was recognised in the Dunford report commissioned by the incoming coalition Government. It recommended that the new role of the Children’s Commissioner should include,

“promoting and protecting the rights of children under the UNCRC”,

so I am afraid that the Minister was not totally accurate when he said that the Government had taken on board all the recommendations of the Dunford report.

The UNICEF global study of independent human rights institutions for children underlined that:

“There is one non-negotiable attribute of all independent human rights institutions for children: a mandate rooted in the Convention on the Rights of the Child”.

However, the JCHR’s “negotiations” or dialogue with the Government on just such a mandate came to naught and the Bill retains this weak requirement simply to have regard to the convention. The Government’s original objection that the UNCRC has not been directly incorporated into UK law was met by our carefully worded amendment, which does not imply incorporation, as the Government now acknowledge. They then fell back on two arguments. The first was that,

“the UNCRC contains a broad mix of rights and aspirations, rather than a more classic formulation of rights such as those in the ECHR”.

Secondly, they argued that some UNCRC articles are broader than children’s rights as such and include, for example, parents’ rights or the state’s responsibility to create an environment in which children’s rights can be realised.

The committee was not persuaded by those arguments and responded:

“It is a matter of common consensus that the UNCRC contains some very important children’s rights. The fact that some of its provisions are couched in aspirational terms, or impose responsibilities and obligations on the State, does not detract from this fact”.

Indeed, these aspects of the convention are surely true of human rights treaties generally and have not deterred other states from incorporating the full convention into domestic law. In any event, the amendment is carefully worded with this possible objection in mind: it defines the rights of children to include, not the UNCRC itself, but “the rights in” the UNCRC.

As Carolyne Willow, a long-standing children’s rights expert, has argued, the suggestion that the reference to parents,

“somehow diminishes children’s rights, is muddled. Article 18(2) of the treaty sets out the basis for states supporting parents—in order to guarantee and promote the rights of children. This is no different from recognising and assisting carers in order to uphold the rights of disabled people, or guaranteeing support to adoptive parents as a means of securing the child’s right to a family life”.

The JCHR believes that the Children’s Commissioner,

“should be entrusted to interpret the UNCRC and to take a sensible and properly advised approach about the children’s rights that it protects”.

The Government’s refusal to accept our recommendation suggests that they do not trust the commissioner to do so. The arguments put up by the Government are weak and leave me puzzled as to why they are so resistant to embedding the commissioner’s welcome children’s rights-based remit in what the Alliance for Reform of the Children’s Commissioner describes as, “the authoritative international legal statute for children’s human rights”. I hope that the Minister will take this away and think again.

[Baroness Massey of Darwen]

My Lords, in this varied and lengthy group, I want to focus on Amendment 266A, although I support others to which my name is attached. The amendment states:

“Any person whose functions are of a public nature must in the exercise of his or her functions … respect, protect and fulfil children’s rights; and … seek … the views of children in matters affecting them”.

Here, it harks back to the Children’s Commissioner not having sole responsibility for children’s rights. Others have expressed powerful convictions that all children have rights, even though the rights of vulnerable children—for example, asylum seekers, trafficked children or those in custody—are sometimes neglected. What really concerns me here is that we seem to fail to grasp the issue of listening to children and seeking their contribution to improving systems which should work for them. I cannot understand why. Involving children in these matters which affect them has at least two functions: it not only helps children feel engaged and more likely to respond positively but helps make systems and structures better. It makes for better decisions about children. As I have said before, we have become better at listening to children and young people, but it is inconsistent. The noble Lord, Lord Ramsbotham, will know the answer to this much better than I do, but I wonder how much young people in custody are consulted. From all I hear, not very much.

Concern for child rights and consultation with children work in practice. I mentioned earlier the Every Child Matters report. Schools were at the centre of that and I want to give an example of how schools can improve school life and achievement by listening to, respecting and valuing the contribution of children. UNICEF’s Rights Respecting Schools programme is a resounding success according to an independent evaluation. It encourages child-driven polices on behaviour and school activities. At its heart are school councils and classroom discussions on rights and responsibilities.

It seems to me that any organisational system functions better if those within the system are consulted and involved. Children are totally capable of having a view about what is best for them, and many organisations—not only schools but children’s services, health services and youth clubs—do consult children and are the better for it. The state has an opportunity to task other bodies with the job of promoting and protecting children’s rights. A duty on public authorities to give due regard to children’s rights in their decision-making would ensure that all areas of government are aware of their obligations towards children.

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Tyler of Enfield]

My Lords, my name is attached to Amendments 263 and 264. I want briefly to say why I feel so strongly that they are extremely important.

Like other noble Lords, I see smoking in cars primarily as a child protection issue. As we have heard, children’s lungs are smaller and they have faster breathing rates. That makes them particularly vulnerable to second-hand smoke, especially within the confines of a car. As we have heard, very often children are not able to stop adults smoking in their presence. Adult members of the public are protected by smoke-free legislation on public transport and in the workplace, but large numbers of children remain exposed to high concentrations of second-hand smoke when confined in family cars. I just do not think that is right.

My second point is that we simply cannot afford to wait any longer. We know that roughly one in five children reports being regularly exposed to second-hand smoke in cars. It has catastrophic health consequences. Finally, we know that there is very strong public support for this. In a recent survey, 80% of the public and 86% of children supported a ban, as do many health organisations.

Turning very briefly to standardised packaging, there is a very clear reason why people in the tobacco industry are always so opposed to amendments such as this. It is very straightforward. They know that the designer cigarette packet is a very effective advertising tool. Most worryingly, it is particularly effective on young people. I had many examples I was going to give; I shall reserve them for Report.

The other argument I would like to address is the one about the nanny state poking its nose into the lives of individuals. We are told that people know the risk and make an informed choice regarding whether or not to smoke. Of course, the problem is that the choices made by young people are not always informed. I am sure that we know from our personal experience how impressionable young people can be. I certainly do.

I remember going into a sweet shop aged about 14 or 15. There was a pack of cigarettes there. I will not give the name because I do not want to advertise it. I thought it was terribly elegant and glamorous and that if I bought that pack—which I did—I would be very elegant and glamorous. I do not think either of those held up, but really strong messages are coming across in that packaging. I have looked at the most up-to-date evidence. It is absolutely clear that standardised packs are less attractive to young people and improve the effectiveness of health warnings.

We have a duty to the children of this country to move on this issue once and for all. The time for talking is over and the time for action has arrived.

[Baroness Massey of Darwen]

My Lords, my name is on Amendment 263 and I shall be very brief indeed. We have just been discussing the Office of the Children’s Commissioner. We have just been talking about child protection. This also is a case of children’s rights. Children have the right to not be sitting in a smoke-filled car.

I was part of a debate on the Private Member’s Bill of the distinguished former surgeon, the noble Lord, Lord Ribeiro, who is here and will speak later on. He made a significant point. He said that awareness and behaviour change need to be coupled with legislation, and that smoking law at the moment does not cover cars.

The noble Lord, Lord Crisp, said that there are four questions to be asked. Is it dangerous? Yes. Are the dangers material and significant? Yes. Is it something that that affects other people? Yes. What are the downsides? They are modest. They are about having the freedom to smoke in a car when your children are present. It should not be allowed.

[Lord Ribeiro (Con)]

My Lords, I hear my name mentioned and I think I ought to say something very briefly. Your Lordships are influenced only by evidence. The evidence following the legislation in 2006 in Scotland and 2007 in England has already shown measurable effects in improving healthcare, particularly among non-smoking bar workers, in whom one study found an 89% reduction in cotinine concentration, which is a specific marker for tobacco smoke exposure.

That benefit should not be restricted to bar workers but should be the right of children who find themselves confined in cars where adults are smoking. I support this amendment very strongly. I hope that my noble friend the Minister will be minded to consider it. I realise that the Government have a programme for behavioural change and education and may wish to pursue that. The research, however, points to the fact that there is an improvement if we reduce second-hand smoke.