Legacy of Northern Ireland’s Past
Debate between Baroness Hoey and Viscount Younger of Leckie
Viscount Younger of Leckie (Con)
I am sure that the noble Lord will be part of the proposals that we have put forward and that we will engage with him. I am not able to give an answer to him at the moment. He is right that nobody is above the law. I appreciate his general welcome for these proposals and I recognise, as he also will, that these measures are intended to bring greater certainty for all communities, including veterans and the families of victims. Our proposals—again, they are proposals—will move the focus away from this endless cycle of investigations into the past and on to a future based around reconciliation and delivering answers for all victims.
Baroness Hoey (Non-Afl) [V]
My Lords, does the Minister understand the dangers of an amnesty—let us call it what it really is—playing into the hands of Sinn Féin/IRA’s long-term war strategy of rewriting history to establish moral equivalence between legitimate soldiers and police, who donned the uniform and in the vast majority of cases served with restraint and honour, and the terrorist, whose sole aim was to murder, bomb and destroy lives? Does he accept that this moral equivalence is exactly what these proposals are bringing about?
Viscount Younger of Leckie (Con)
I would like to correct the noble Baroness: this is not an amnesty, and we never said that it was or would be an amnesty; it is a statute of limitation. There is a difference, which is that there will be no pardons. However, we must be clear that, with the passage of time, the number of convictions flowing from any investigative process is likely to be extremely low, as I said earlier. If our focus is criminal justice, we will fail almost every family.
Ballymurphy Inquest Findings
Debate between Baroness Hoey and Viscount Younger of Leckie
Viscount Younger of Leckie (Con)
The Government want to find a way forward that provides information for all those caught up in the Troubles, helps families to get the answers that they want and lays the foundation for greater reconciliation and a shared future for all communities. As I said earlier, we must not dismiss the past but find a way forward on reconciliation because we must think about the future and young people in Northern Ireland. We must find a way not to dismiss the past, but to secure the future of Northern Ireland, which is very bright.
Baroness Hoey (Non-Afl)
My Lords, I welcome the full apology given by Her Majesty’s Government to the families of those killed in Ballymurphy. Fifty years is a long time to wait for justice and this verdict. I pay tribute to them for their fortitude and determination. Truth and justice must be possible for everyone but, sadly, there are too many victims in Northern Ireland who will never have justice, particularly those who saw many of the IRA terrorists given royal pardons or on-the-run letters by a former Prime Minister. Does the Minister agree that there is now an imbalance of legacy trials against our state forces, the vast majority of whom did their best to protect people? Maybe it is time for Her Majesty’s Government to announce their own public inquiries into unsolved terrorist atrocities.
Viscount Younger of Leckie (Con)
Well, it is clear that certain court cases that have been brought forward have been unsatisfactory. As the noble Baroness alluded to, we are talking about events that happened 40 to 50 years ago, so it is extremely difficult to find admissible evidence that is helpful. But I go back to the point that, in bringing forward issues on legacy, as we have pledged to do, we must do our best to get to truth, find justice and get the information that victims’ families want.
Northern Ireland: Citizens’ Rights
Debate between Baroness Hoey and Viscount Younger of Leckie
Baroness Hoey
To ask Her Majesty’s Government what assessment they have made of the rights of Northern Ireland citizens in comparison with citizens of the rest of the United Kingdom.
Viscount Younger of Leckie (Con)
My Lords, the United Kingdom is a family of nations and a union of people. The recognition and protection of rights are fundamental values of our union. That is reflected in the Government’s unwavering commitment to the Belfast/Good Friday agreement, of which guarantees of rights are an essential part. The Government will take every opportunity to strengthen Northern Ireland’s place within the UK and will continue to ensure that the rights of all Northern Ireland’s people are protected within it.
Baroness Hoey (Non-Afl)
My Lords, surely, one fundamental right that all United Kingdom citizens should enjoy in a democracy is being able to elect those who make the laws for the economy. The protocol, introduced without one single person in Northern Ireland agreeing to it, has now placed Northern Ireland in the outhouse of the United Kingdom family, with a foreign jurisdiction making the law and a foreign court overseeing it. Does the Minister recognise that the constitutional position of that part of the United Kingdom has changed utterly with the loss of that fundamental right?
Northern Ireland: Violence
Debate between Baroness Hoey and Viscount Younger of Leckie
Baroness Hoey (Non-Afl)
My Lords, no one in government should underestimate the frustration, the disappointment and even the anger across Northern Ireland at the protocol, but it is not the only reason for the recent violence, which we all the condemn. There is an underlying feeling that the east-west relations aspect of the Belfast agreement has been disregarded and that north-south relations have been given more importance. When will Her Majesty’s Government stop taking the neutral position that they seem to adopt? Like the Irish Government, who speak up for Irish nationalism, when will the United Kingdom Government start speaking up for the British union?
Viscount Younger of Leckie (Con)
We have been doing just this. The union is very important. We have said again and again that Northern Ireland is a firm part of the United Kingdom. On the noble Baroness’s question relating to east-west, I suspect that she is referring to the current challenges and the details that need to be sorted out as a result of Brexit. Much work has been done to ensure that food supplies, parcels et cetera are delivered to Northern Ireland from Great Britain and that supermarket shelves are full, as they should be.
Covid-19: Northern Ireland Economy
Debate between Baroness Hoey and Viscount Younger of Leckie
Viscount Younger of Leckie (Con)
The noble Lord makes a good point about the support that is needed for Northern Ireland, and I reiterate that the £2.8 billion will go a very long way to supporting its economy. I am particularly aware of small businesses and the major businesses, such as Moy Park and Bombardier, all of which need our support. We are working in tandem with the Northern Ireland Office and the Northern Ireland Executive to do this.
Baroness Hoey (Non-Afl)
My Lords, the extra money across the whole of the United Kingdom shows the value of the union, but does the Minister agree that money alone is not what strengthens the union and that, actually, Her Majesty’s Government must do more to speak out for the union, as they do in relation to Scotland? Does he accept that, sometimes, it is better that the Government make their views known very clearly and do not just assume that they always have to be on the neutral side of what is happening in Northern Ireland?
Viscount Younger of Leckie (Con)
The noble Baroness is correct, and I reiterate that the unit in No. 10 is looking to see what more can be done—and there is more that needs to be done—to promote the value of the union. Of course, the noble Baroness will be aware that, in 2021, we mark the 100 years since the creation of Northern Ireland, which paved the way for the formation of the United Kingdom as we know it today, so it is a golden opportunity to step up our progress on this front.