Roma Community: Levelling Up

Baroness Hayman of Ullock Excerpts

Monday 27th June 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Greenhalgh (Con)]

We set out a clear mission in the levelling-up White Paper to narrow the gap in healthy life expectancy by five years. We are creating clear guidance for the community, as I have already mentioned, and I am sure that more of the plan will be revealed in the health disparities White Paper in due course.

[Baroness Hayman of Ullock (Lab)]

My Lords, my noble friend asked about the national strategy and progress, but surely one of the problems is the Government’s ongoing resistance to cross-departmental strategies on race equality issues. How will the levelling-up Bill address this? How will it get that resistance sorted and get departments to genuinely work together to improve outcomes for the Roma community?

[Lord Greenhalgh (Con)]

My Lords, we have a lead Minister who is responsible for equalities matters and has taken on the brief as Communities Minister. My honourable friend Kemi Badenoch is charged with those duties and I am sure will bring forward plans in due course.

United Kingdom: The Union

Baroness Hayman of Ullock Excerpts

Thursday 23rd June 2022 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Hayman of Ullock (Lab)]

My Lords, I thank the noble Lord, Lord Lisvane, for bringing this excellent debate to the House. It has been extremely interesting and was very much enhanced by the valedictory speech of the right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Blackburn, and we wish him good luck for the future.

I draw the House’s attention to the Conservative manifesto for the 2019 general election, where it said that

“strengthening the great Union between the United Kingdom’s four nations”

was one of the ways the Conservatives intended to

“unleash our country’s full potential.”

In a recent QSD, the Minister repeated the Government’s commitment to strengthening the union, by

“protecting and promoting its combined strengths and the values that we all share, and ensuring that the institutions of the United Kingdom are used to benefit people in every part of the country”.

I am sure, having heard this debate, that we would all agree with those sentiments. He said also that the Government were “great believers in devolution”, and that the new IGR arrangements would

“herald a new era for collaboration across the United Kingdom”.—[ Official Report, 9/6/22; col. GC 122.]

I am sure we would all like to see more collaboration, but, as the noble Lord, Lord Lisvane, said, devolution is not always that easy.

I thank the Select Committee for its excellent report, which helped us understand many of the issues.

I turn to some of the issues raised in the debate. A common theme was that the stresses and strains are getting worse. The departure from the European Union has clearly affected relationships within the union of the United Kingdom, as well as with the EU. I thank the noble Viscount, Lord Waverley, for going into quite considerable detail about this. As the noble Lord, Lord Lisvane, said, the present situation remains untidy; there is much to be done. We know that the common frameworks process was set up following Brexit, but that led to disagreements between the devolved Administrations and the UK Government. The House of Lords Constitution Committee concluded, in a report earlier this year, that implementing Brexit had placed the Sewel convention “under great strain”.

Disagreements have also arisen between the UK Government and the devolved Administrations over post-Brexit funding arrangements, so no wonder there are stresses and strains, and it seems that the situation is getting worse.

A number of noble Lords talked about the particular issues around Northern Ireland. We know that the DUP’s response to the protocol has had an impact on the functioning of the devolved Administration in Northern Ireland in recent months. I will not go into detail about this as it was covered excellently by the noble Lord, Lord Bruce. But the issues around the protocol are clearly very serious, and the Government, as the noble Lord said, have to take this much more seriously, and not make quick decisions based on politics rather than the likely outcomes of those decisions.

We know that non-unionist parties in Northern Ireland have expressed their strong objection to the Government’s approach to the protocol, and wrote a joint letter—which is very unusual for those parties—to the Prime Minister sharing their concerns. The noble Lord, Lord Bruce, explained the situation further, referring to the Government’s inability to sort out the problems we now have in Stormont. We will never move forward until we can resolve these issues.

One thing that has come through strongly in this debate is the importance of co-operation, collaboration and engagement, which has been mentioned on a number of occasions, and the fact that this Government have seemed incapable of doing that in a constructive way, particularly regarding the problems with Northern Ireland. If we are going to resolve these issues, surely that is what we need to do with all our devolved Administrations and with the EU, where appropriate.

Scotland has also been mentioned by a number of noble Lords. The current point of tension regarding the Scottish Government’s intention to hold a second referendum is clearly very difficult as we look at how the union is going to survive going forward. The noble Lord, Lord Cormack, in particular talked about the stresses this policy of independence is placing on the Scottish Government. Nicola Sturgeon is arguing that Brexit represents

“a significant and material change”

to the circumstances in which independence was voted on back in 2014. She will push very hard for this, and the Government need to think about how they will manage and handle this going forward.

There was also discussion about Wales. The noble Lord, Lord Lisvane, mentioned that Wales is becoming more and more unhappy with the current constitutional arrangements. The Government really need to tackle this early on. They need to talk to the Welsh Government, councils in Wales and so on about how they want to see the constitution going forward, so that we can move forward together.

Interestingly, the noble Lord, Lord Wallace of Saltaire, talked about England, particularly Yorkshire. We must not forget that the rest of the UK is a critical part of strengthening our union. Right across our country, there are local communities who feel they are being denied a voice in the decision-making which affects their day-to-day lives. The noble Lord, Lord Bruce, said, absolutely rightly, that many areas of the UK are very different. There is a widespread feeling that the UK is not working for everyone at the moment. The Government’s lack of enthusiasm for delivering power to nations and regions could also put the union under threat.

We feel that Ministers must properly examine our democracy, constitution, future direction and future purpose as a country as a basis for any new constitutional arrangements. The noble Lord, Lord Wallace of Saltaire, talked about the fact that we are the most centralised democracy. That is not healthy for the union. However, any new devolution must be delivered by working with communities—with the metro mayors, mayors, local leaders and councillors—so decisions are made together.

We also feel that the stresses on the union have been exacerbated by the economic policies we have seen recently, which have levied disproportionate public service cuts and amounted to a sense that we have not all been in this together. For this reason, the UK also needs a new and transformational economic settlement to properly level up the country and show that the union can exist to reduce regional inequalities. The right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Blackburn talked about the importance of levelling up. This must be central to any constitutional work going forward.

From this debate we have seen that there are concerns right across the UK as to the genuine desire, ability and political will of this Government to live up to the manifesto commitment I referred to at the start, to truly strengthen our union and unleash our country’s great potential. It does not seem to be happening at the moment. As we have discussed, co-operative working is really what is needed, along with—as the noble Lord, Lord Norton, said—calmness and purpose. We need a sense of the importance of making thought-out, considered decisions regarding the union and any devolution and, above all, to have respect for each other.

I am really looking forward to the Minister’s response. This has been an excellent debate, and I would particularly like to hear his thoughts on the proposed committee idea. It is good to have a debate in which there has been real, constructive thought on how we can move forward.

Housing: Private Renters

Baroness Hayman of Ullock Excerpts

Wednesday 22nd June 2022 Lords Chamber

Asked by

[Baroness Hayman of Ullock]

To ask Her Majesty’s Government, further to their English Housing Survey: a segmentation analysis of private renters, published on 16 June, what plans they have to improve conditions for private renters.

[The Minister of State, Home Office and Department for Levelling Up, Housing & Communities (Lord Greenhalgh) (Con)]

First, I declare my residential and commercial property interests as set out in the register. Our White Paper sets out how we will provide a better deal for renters and our commitment to consult on introducing a decent homes standard in the sector—the first Government ever to do so. This will mean that homes must be free from serious hazards and disrepair, warm and dry, and with decent facilities. We will also provide councils with the powers they need for robust and effective enforcement to drive up standards.

[Baroness Hayman of Ullock (Lab)]

My Lords, by planning to remove Section 21, the Government have rightly recognised that security of tenure is one of the biggest issues for renters. The White Paper talks about the need to protect renters from evictions while also talking about making the eviction process as straight- forward as possible. The Government say:

“After eviction, tenants cannot always find suitable housing nearby, interrupting their employment and children’s education”,


yet the White Paper also says:

“Claim forms for possession will be simplified and streamlined for landlords.”


I ask the Minister for clarification: is it the Government’s aim to make it easy for landlords to get their house back at short notice even if the tenant is not at fault, or is it to give tenants security and to protect them from the cost of unwanted moves?

[Lord Greenhalgh (Con)]

My Lords, the purpose of this 12-point plan of reforms is to ensure that we balance the interests between landlord and tenant, but first remove the Section 21 no-fault evictions. In doing so, we are enhancing the grounds around Section 8 so that it is easier to remove tenants who disrupt the community and cause persistent anti-social behaviour, while bringing grounds for egregious rent arrears and moving and selling grounds, because landlords have a right to ask the tenant to leave if they need to sell the property. We are making those grounds work for the landlord so that we can remove Section 21. It is all about balancing those interests.

New Homes Commitment

Baroness Hayman of Ullock Excerpts

Tuesday 21st June 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Greenhalgh (Con)]

My Lords, I recognise that this has been a very welcoming country. We have welcomed refugees from Afghanistan and there has been the very successful programme of welcoming British Hong Kongers to this country. We make no apologies for that. We recognise that there is a need to hit our new-build housing targets and that those will be homes for people who have come to this country for a better life, but we need homes for the younger generations as well.

[Baroness Hayman of Ullock (Lab)]

My Lords, the housebuilding index produced by the Chartered Institute of Procurement & Supply found that, last month, residential construction slowed to levels last seen during the first Covid lockdown. What assessment has the Minister made of the impact this will have on house prices and private rents?

[Lord Greenhalgh (Con)]

I do not recognise the cataclysmic drop since the pandemic. We hit a record number, as I pointed out, in 2020-21; there was a slight falling back, but all our internal assessments are that we will see a rebound and that the dip this year will not be pronounced or continue into the mid-decade. Hitting 300,000 is a stretching target, but we will see increasing numbers in the years to come.

Private Rented Sector

Baroness Hayman of Ullock Excerpts

Monday 20th June 2022 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Hayman of Ullock (Lab)]

My Lords, we welcome the publication of the Government’s White Paper and the recognition in the Statement that

“conditions in our private rented sector are simply not good enough”.

I want to consider some of the 12 points of action that it introduces.

Section 21 evictions will be abolished, meaning that landlords will have to prove grounds to evict tenants. New grounds will be created to allow landlords to sell or move close family members in, while grounds around persistent rent arrears and anti-social behaviour will be strengthened. Landlords will be able to evict tenants on sale or moving-in grounds only after the first six months of the tenancy. If the landlord chooses to sell and is unable to do so, they will not be able to re-let the property for three months. Otherwise, tenancies will be indefinite and can be ended only by the tenant or the landlord giving legitimate notice. It is welcome that these changes should stop landlords from evicting tenants simply to re-let at a higher rent or to avoid making repairs after a complaint, but it must be made clear how renters or local authorities will be made aware of a property that is being re-let.

Indefinite tenancies will mean that tenants have the option of moving out with two months’ notice without penalty if their circumstances change or if the home turns out not to be suitable, which, again, we welcome. This should provide renters with more flexibility. However, there is a risk that if it is too easy to prove intention to sell or move family into a property, unscrupulous landlords could abuse this, creating Section 21 by the back door. Penalties for abuse should be easy to enforce. Scotland has wrongful termination orders, which can see tenants evicted on false grounds compensated. One of the big challenges for local authorities is the lack of skills and resources to enforce the law, so this must be addressed if we are to see success in this area. Can the Minister outline how the Government intend to deliver enforcement?

With fixed terms gone, automatic rent increases in the contract are also gone. If landlords want to raise the rent, they will need to use Section 13 notices, a maximum of once a year, which can be challenged at tribunal. It should follow that tenants can challenge Section 13 notices or negotiate with their landlord with less of a threat of eviction hanging over them. Extra notice of rent increases will give tenants more time to challenge if they deem it necessary. As things stand, landlords in areas with high demand for homes will still be able easily to use unaffordable rent rises to force tenants out, so does the Minister agree that there needs to be a limit set on rent rises based on affordability?

Does the Minister also agree that a key element in giving greater security, transparency and power to tenants is to ensure that letting agencies, which act on a landlord’s behalf, work to the very highest standards? Will he commit to looking at a code of conduct for letting agents, as has been done in Wales?

I turn to the welcome measure to require all privately rented homes to meet the decent homes standard and the new right to claim back rent on non-decent homes through expanded rent repayment orders. Private renting has grown as social housing has been sold off and not replaced, and, as a result, more people are paying more for less-regulated homes. However, the need to build more social housing is a debate for another day. Bringing standards into line with the social sector will stop private landlords from short-changing renters and, through the benefits system, taxpayers. Expanding RROs is welcome; they need to be a huge deterrent to criminal landlords but are currently underused. Can the Minister confirm that local councils will be given the resources they need to properly enforce the decent homes standard?

The new ombudsman that all landlords must join is a positive step, as this has been a huge gap in regulation. Currently, if you rent from a letting agency, you can pursue complaints through a redress scheme, but not if renting directly from a landlord. However, to be successful, it needs to be well-resourced so it can deal with the sheer volume of complaints that tenants will likely raise. Can the Minister shed any light, at this stage, as to how it will be resourced? A single ombudsman is better than the two-scheme system that exists for agents. So it is surprising that, despite acknowledging the confusion and perverse incentives resulting from competing schemes, nothing has been proposed about making changes for letting agents. Can the Minister explain why this is the case?

A digital property portal will be set up to help landlords demonstrate their compliance with legal requirements. This is basically what a landlord register looks like, so can the Minister confirm whether it is the Government’s intention to introduce a national register of landlords? Although councils will be responsible for enforcing portal membership, the Government should give tenants an incentive to take action if their landlord is not registered. This already happens with licensing schemes, and tenants with unlicensed landlords can get back up to 12 months’ rent via rent repayment orders. Is this something that the Government will consider?

One in three private renters lives with children, and nearly 40% of private renters rely on benefits, yet landlords are still able to deny both those groups a tenancy. So it is good to see this addressed with a proposal to outlaw blanket bans on children and benefit claimants. However, discrimination on these grounds often happens because many landlords do not trust the welfare system to cover their tenants’ rent, so the underlying problems still need to be addressed: universal credit delays and sanctions, the benefit cap and local housing allowance rates. Further, despite rapidly rising inflation, the Government are cutting funding available to local councils to support struggling renters through discretionary housing payments by £40 million. Can the Minister explain how he thinks this is going help the thousands of renters who are struggling with the cost of living crisis?

The White Paper also pledges to monitor private sector solutions to problems with deposits between tenancies and to keep the deposit protection system under review. Disappointingly, this is a retreat from the Government’s manifesto commitment to a lifetime deposit which would allow passporting of deposits between tenancies. Problems with deposits are probably the most common negative experience for private renters, so it is frustrating to see that it is only being kept under review. Can the Minister explain why this is the case?

I will say a few words on court reform. The Government are looking to digitalise the court process, but renters who are digitally excluded must still be supported. In addition, a digital approach will not always be suitable in some cases. Does the Minister agree that more funding could be provided to the courts so that they can deal with backlogs and more legal support could be provided to the renters who need it most?

I end by thanking the organisation, Generation Rent, for all its hard work on this issue. I look forward to this short debate and to the Minister’s response.

[Baroness Thornhill (LD)]

I say to the Minister that there is general support across all sectors for these reforms in the White Paper, which we too broadly agree with. In fact, I agree with so much of what the noble Baroness, Lady Hayman, has said that I could just say, “#MeToo” and sit down—but I am not going to. I will not go through the proposals and rationales for each point in the White Paper, because I believe that there will be opportunities to do that later. I want to stress our key points that we would seek a chance to influence and explore.

First, we are disappointed by the speed at which this has gone. We are now only going into consultations and pilots, not legislation—at a time when homelessness and evictions are set to rise. Does the Minister have any timelines or milestones for us?

Our greatest area of support for these reforms—and, paradoxically, of concern—is around evictions. We totally applaud the ban on no-fault evictions, but ask whether any lessons have been learned from Scotland about the application in reality of the new grounds for eviction. How tightly are they drawn, and how have they measured success? Let us take one example which the noble Baroness mentioned: eviction because the landlord wishes to sell the home. How will that be proved and dealt with, or are the Government considering recourse, as happens in Ireland?

We know that revenge evictions are more common than we might like and hope that the decent homes standard and the annual rent rise will discourage such evictions, as do the Government. But even after a year, a tenant can still be priced out of a flat by an unreasonable, excessive rise in rent that they can ill afford. Have the Government considered encouraging rent rises only in between tenancies—a practice that many good landlords already do? Given that the cost of living crisis will not be short lived, what, if anything, will the Government do to curb excessive rent rises, or will it all be left to the market? Why have the Government yet again decided to freeze the local housing allowance?

The Government’s commitment to extending a legally binding decent homes standard to the sector is a potential game-changer, but only if there is enough capacity in the system to monitor and enforce it. Local authorities are definitely down on capacity and funding. What reassurances can the Minister give us that there will be capacity and resources within the system to enforce this standard—a vital part of the reforms?

Regarding capacity, the proposal for a private sector ombudsman is a good one. After all, there is one for the social housing sector. But we know that the social housing ombudsman is under pressure due to capacity issues already, so how will this one be any different? After years of stressed budgets and the demands of the pandemic, will the Government use one of the pilot schemes to review the available capacity of all the partners whom they will need on board to make sure these reforms work, and look at how their roles effectively all knit together?

Finally, there is a legitimate concern in the sector that these changes will force landlords out of the system at a time when we need more, not fewer. Is there a danger of unintended consequences? There is some anecdotal evidence that this is happening in areas popular with tourists, such as Cornwall, the Lake District and Edinburgh. Homes once for long-term let are now seen on more lucrative Airbnb sites. Consequently, locals are priced out of the housing market due to second home owners and they are unable to rent due to a lack of supply. Do the Government recognise this as an issue? If so, are there any possibilities of looking at ways to incentivise landlords to stick with longer-term lettings? There will be time to go into detail in the future, but hopefully not too far in the future.

Smoke and Carbon Monoxide Alarm (Amendment) Regulations 2022

Baroness Hayman of Ullock Excerpts

Monday 13th June 2022 Grand Committee

With those questions, I must say that I totally support the progress that is being made and I look forward to the questions being answered.

[Baroness Hayman of Ullock (Lab)]

My Lords, like other noble Lords who have already spoken, we very much welcome these regulations to make smoke and carbon monoxide alarms mandatory in social housing from 1 October this year. As we near the fifth anniversary of the Grenfell Tower tragedy, we believe that any measures that help resolve the building safety crisis are very welcome.

But we also think that this instrument should form only a small part of a much wider package of measures that we hope to see coming forward from the Government. I will come to the exact provisions of these regulations in a moment—although noble Lords who have already spoken have covered a lot of the points that we had concerns about. But I would like to first ask the Minister: following the publication of the Social Housing (Regulation) Bill, is he able to provide further information about the timetable of this Bill and when the Government are likely to be aiming for Royal Assent, so that those regulations come into force and we can discuss wider provisions to make social housing safer?

Turning to the specific regulations before us today, one of the things that will result will be a new responsibility to install alarms on each floor of a premise, which is really important. The Government are right to include this. It specifically helps larger properties. There is a lot more development of warehouse-type apartments, within which there is an increasing use of mezzanine floors—so I am not sure what constitutes a floor within this regulation. Would it include mezzanines, for example? Would they require an alarm? It would be helpful if the Minister could confirm what the guidance on that would be. I would be interested to hear his response to the noble Baroness, Lady Finlay, about whether it will be compulsory to have alarms in bedrooms, because that is also a very important part of ensuring safety, particularly at night.

I would like to take a quick look at penalties for non-compliance. The regulations allow for a charge of up to £5,000 per breach. I would like to ask the Minister about the fact that, under the Housing Act 2004, civil penalties for landlords go up to £30,000 for breaches. So how did the Government choose an upper limit of £5,000, despite the fact that an absence of these alarms, as we have heard, could lead to somebody dying. In fact, the Minister mentioned in his introduction that these alarms do save lives, so it would be interesting to understand the Government’s thinking and how that top level of fine came about. The noble Baroness, Lady Finlay, also asked about the prosecution of rogue landlords, and it would be interesting to know a bit more about that side of things—prosecution, fines, how they will operate and how the Government got to their decisions on that.

I would also like to look very briefly at the process of repairs and replacements of the alarms. This has been raised by other noble Baronesses. In particular, the noble Baroness, Lady Pinnock, referred to the fact that the regulations state that the landlord must act as soon as is “reasonably practicable” when notified that an alarm is not in working order. She said it would be incredibly helpful to know what the definition of “reasonably practicable” is. We know that, in other legislation requiring swift action by landlords, this has not always happened. So what will be that definition and how will it be enforced? Will the Government be offering guidance alongside this to landlords on exactly what the timeframes are? Will there be any circumstances that can excuse meeting those deadlines? What is going to be the structure of managing repairs and doing replacements in good time?

The noble Baroness, Lady Pinnock, also asked some very important questions about batteries and about ensuring alarms are properly installed. This is really good, important legislation, but it has to be practical, and it has to work and operate in the way that it is being laid out. If the issues that the noble Baroness, Lady Finlay, raised are not covered, we could find that good intentions are not always being met.

To conclude: these regulations are very much welcomed. I am looking forward to working with the Minister on the Social Housing (Regulation) Bill, which is, hopefully, going to be with us shortly, in order that we can consider other measures to make social housing safer for all occupants. I look forward to the Minister’s response to the questions today and to working with him in the future on further safety measures.

[Lord Greenhalgh (Con)]

My Lords, I thank noble Lords for their contributions to this important debate on the draft regulations. I join the noble Baroness, Lady Hayman, in saying that every single measure that can ensure that a tragedy such as Grenfell—the largest structural fire since Piper Alpha and the largest loss of life in a residential fire since the Second World War—never happens again must be welcomed. I thank noble Lords for their support.

I will turn to some of the points raised by noble Baronesses in this debate. The noble Baroness, Lady Finlay, wanted to know whether alarms are mandatory for bedrooms. Yes, there must be a smoke alarm on each storey. Also, I am happy to clarify that the definition of “living accommodation” includes bedrooms.

Social Homes for Rent

Baroness Hayman of Ullock Excerpts

Thursday 26th May 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Greenhalgh (Con)]

We do recognise that the perennial issue of bed blocking . It is important to get the balance of who accesses social housing, with proper regard for people who require wheelchair access to homes. The noble Baroness makes a very important point.

[Baroness Hayman of Ullock (Lab)]

The Government built only just under 6,000 social rent homes in 2020. That was a 12% decrease on the previous year and an 85% decrease on 11 years ago. With shortages of materials and labour, many see the target of 300,000 homes a year by the mid-2020s as almost impossible. Does the Minister still think that target is achievable?

[Lord Greenhalgh (Con)]

We try to set specific, measurable and achievable targets. I do not want to trade statistics, but I point out that in the last decade, we have seen local authorities once again building homes for social rent—18,300 homes for social rent. In the 13 years from 1997 to 2010, local authorities built merely 2,994 affordable homes. So, with councils able to build more social rented homes, we will have a very good chance of meeting those targets.

Levelling-up Report

Baroness Hayman of Ullock Excerpts

Thursday 19th May 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Greenhalgh (Con)]

As well as the metrics, within the technical annexe there is a clear plan for how to achieve what is set out in the White Paper. All of that will then be enshrined in law in the Levelling-up and Regeneration Bill.

[Baroness Hayman of Ullock (Lab)]

My Lords, an IPPR report recently found that with their cuts to council funding, the Government have taken £431 from every single person and handed back just £31 in their levelling-up funds. Does the Minister accept that the Government can meet their levelling-up tests only by working with, and properly funding, local government?

[Lord Greenhalgh (Con)]

Local government has a critical part to play in levelling up the country. I would point out the commitment through both the UK shared prosperity fund and the levelling-up funds to turbocharge the 12 missions outlined in the Bill.

Building Safety Bill

Baroness Hayman of Ullock Excerpts

Consideration of Commons amendments
Tuesday 26th April 2022 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Hayman of Ullock (Lab)]

My Lords, I thank the Minister for the constructive amendments that the Government have tabled at this stage and for listening to the noble Lords, Lord Young and Lord Blencathra, who have been very helpful during the passage of the Bill. However, there are still concerns outstanding, as has just been said, so I will speak now to my Motion H1 as an amendment to Motion H.

We on these Benches have consistently argued that all leaseholders should be protected from the cost of remediating historical cladding and non-cladding defects and the associated secondary costs, irrespective of circumstance. Although we fully acknowledge that the waterfall system set out in Schedule 8 provides leaseholders with a far greater deal of protection than was proposed when the Bill first came to us, when it was originally drafted, it does not protect all of them fully. Just as importantly, the Bill does not provide redress for the countless blameless leaseholders across the country who have already been hit with huge bills and have paid out significant sums as a result.

That is why I have tabled Motion H1 to reduce leaseholder contributions to a maximum of £250. I am aware that the Government have said that leaseholder contributions are fair in principle because they will apply in only a very limited number of cases. The Minister has said that leaseholders will pay up to the cap or a proportion of the cap in only a minority of circumstances. However, if it is only a very small number of cases that we are talking about, why are the Government so reluctant to provide proper and full support? For many people, £15,000, or £10,000 as the cap currently stands, is simply an impossible sum to find.

Leaseholders have refused to give up. They recognise more than anyone that the situation they face is simply not fair, and your Lordships’ House recognised that by supporting the amendment that I tabled on Report. I ask for noble Lords’ continued support in agreeing Motion H1 and, in so doing, to acknowledge the determination and persistence of the leaseholders and cladding groups that have been pressing for redress in this matter.

In sticking rigidly to the position that a minority of leaseholders will have to pay sums that, although capped, are still significant, in order to resolve a scandal that they played no part in causing, we believe that the Government are not acting equitably and will not ensure that the most vulnerable leaseholders will be protected. Our Motion H1 would provide such protection. If the Minister is unable to accept it, we will seek to divide the House, with a view to ensuring that all leaseholders are fully protected.

[Lord Blencathra (Con)]

My Lords, I apologise to the House for missing the first two minutes of my noble friend’s magnum opus; the last business went slightly faster than I had anticipated. I declare a personal interest as a leaseholder in a block of flats that may contain some non-cladding works that may require remedial treatment.

I have to praise my noble friend the Minister yet again for the tremendous changes that have been made to the Bill since it came from the other place. I also congratulate my right honourable friend Michael Gove on forcing all the big building companies to sign up, including bringing the Galliard Homes horse kicking and neighing to the water, although he will need to ensure that it and the other companies actually drink the water—they will throw millions at lawyers to weasel out of what they have signed up to.

I am told that the owner of Galliard Homes, Stephen Conway, has accused Michael Gove of acting like Al Capone and the mafia. My respect for young Gove increases by the minute. Conway had an estimated worth of £270 million in 2015; imagine what he is worth now. It seems to me that the owners of the big building companies have made their billions by being a bit more ruthless mafiosi than Michael Gove ever was. However, that is for another day.

Despite the excellent progress on the Bill, there are still some gaps. I regret that we do not have anything specific in the Bill protecting enfranchised leaseholders. All Governments have encouraged leaseholders to buy out the freehold. Those who have done so are still exactly the same as other leaseholders who have not, and they should get the same protection. I welcome the consultation but I hope it is speedy, and I hope that, if legislation is necessary or this can be done by regulation, that is brought in as quickly as possible.

I acknowledge that the Government have increased the number of properties qualified under buy to let, but in my opinion they have not gone far enough. As a small buy-to-let owner said to me, why does the Bill support with cost-capping a billionaire oligarch non-dom with two buy-to-let leasehold flats in Mayfair, valued at millions, yet leave completely exposed a pensioner buy-to-let leaseholder with a small portfolio of just four flats? These people are not big landlords. Although nothing can be done in this Bill now, I hope something can be done in future.

Nor am I happy that we are planning to reject buildings under 11 metres. They may not be as big a risk but they are unsellable. When an estate agent or lawyer tells prospective buyers that the flat they have looked at has some dangerous cladding—but not to worry because you will probably get out in time if it burns down—I do not think that they will find many buyers. These flats are simply unsellable.

Finally, I disagree with the removal of “zero”, and like the Opposition’s amendment of £250. I do not accept that the government caps set a proportionate balance, as was said in the other place by my right honourable friend Stuart Andrew MP, who was also an excellent Deputy Chief Whip in his time. As Michael Gove said, no leaseholders should pay a penny for any remediation works. We heard impeccable legal advice in this House from the noble Lord, Lord Marks, and a former Supreme Court Justice, the noble and learned Lord, Lord Hope of Craighead, saying that making leaseholders pay in order to avoid an ECHR challenge was misguided and wrong. As the noble and learned Lord, Lord Hope, said, the challenge will happen in any case, no matter what level the Government set the cap at, and those building companies will try it on.

If Motion H1 succeeds today, I do not want the Government in the other place to take on the role of the wonderful Ukrainian Snake Island defender, Roman Grybov, who offered sexual advice to the Russian warship. We are not the “Moscow”, and I hope that the Government will bring forward a compromise amendment, perhaps higher than £250 but much lower than the government caps.

With those quibbles, I wish to congratulate my noble friend yet again on the massive progress he has made with this measure. “One more heave”, as Jeremy Thorpe said in 1974—but hopefully with a bit more success.

--- Later in debate ---

Moved by

[Baroness Hayman of Ullock]

Leave out from “House” to end and insert “do agree with the Commons in their Amendments 184A and 184B, do disagree with the Commons in their Amendments 184C and 184D and do propose Amendment 184E as an amendment to Amendment 184 in lieu—

184E: In paragraph 6 of that Schedule, in sub-paragraph (2) leave out “zero” and insert “£250””

[Baroness Hayman of Ullock (Lab)]

I wish to test the opinion of the House.

Building Safety Bill

Baroness Hayman of Ullock Excerpts

3rd reading
Monday 4th April 2022 Lords Chamber

Moved by

[Baroness Hayman of Ullock]

1: Schedule 8, page 232, line 16, leave out sub-paragraphs (4) to (6) and insert—
“(4) The Secretary of State may by regulations make provision about the determination of the value of a qualifying lease for the purposes of paragraph 4.”Member’s explanatory statement
This tidying-up amendment is consequential on Amendment 155 at Report Stage which set the “permitted maximum” to zero.

[Baroness Hayman of Ullock (Lab)]

My Lords, through every stage of the proceedings I have supported the aims of the Bill, and I am sure the whole House will welcome any steps taken to make homes safer and more secure. While we may have differences of opinion on the most effective and fair way of achieving this, I do recognise the genuine desire of the Minister to address historic cladding and non-cladding defects. This Bill should represent a turning point for innocent home owners, and I hope that in the final stages of the Bill we can resolve the remaining issues of contention to ensure that the Bill properly gives leaseholders the protections in law that have long been promised by the Government.

I briefly draw to noble Lords’ attention the fact that I have tabled a short amendment. It has been tabled as a consequential to Amendment 155 on Report, following advice from the Public Bill Office. I hope that the Minister will accept that the amendment is purely technical.

Finally, on behalf of my noble friend Lord Khan of Burnley and me, I take this opportunity briefly to thank the Minister and the departmental team for their approach to the Bill. I look forward to working with them in future on any further legislation brought forward to address building safety. I beg to move.

Amendment 1 agreed.