Children and Families Bill

Debate between Baroness Benjamin and Baroness Northover

Tuesday 28th January 2014 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Benjamin]

My Lords, I support this amendment. It has the best interest of the child at its heart and is targeted to raise awareness among those in our communities who may not realise the psychological, mental and traumatic long-term damage that they are inflicting upon the child. This issue was brought to my attention many years ago and sadly it continues today. I dearly hope that the Government will accept this amendment, as it is necessary to protect our children. If not, I hope that the Government agree at least to work with communities to make it clear that these acts are child abuse and will not be tolerated. The sooner that this takes place the better.

[Baroness Northover]

My Lords, I too thank my noble friend Lady Walmsley for continuing to press the case with regard to these children, even if there are differences of view between us as to how this is best tackled. I thank the noble Baroness, Lady Howarth, for her helpful contribution in Committee in bringing to our attention the Trust for London report on the issue, and she has contributed again from her wide and deep experience. I also thank my noble friend Lady Benjamin for her contribution.

Since this amendment was debated in Committee, my noble friend Lady Walmsley has in correspondence helpfully explained in detail some of the issues that concern her. I hope that I have been able to put her mind at ease on some, if not all, of them and I am grateful to her for the opportunity to explain the position. We share her commitment to safeguarding children from this and all other forms of abuse. A belief system can never justify the abuse of a child. We need to ensure that children are not subjected to abuse, or left vulnerable to potential abuse, because someone alleges that the child is possessed.

The Government believe that the current law is sufficient for this purpose: it provides adequate protection to children from the type of abuse that this amendment is trying to prevent. I will come to that in more detail in a moment. I set out much of the legislative framework during our debate in Committee. I shall not repeat those details again, but I reiterate that while the existing legislation does not specifically mention communication of a belief that a child is possessed by spirits, the current offence of child cruelty already captures conduct likely to cause a child unnecessary suffering or injury to health. Where the conduct could not be covered by the offence of child cruelty, it could be caught by other criminal offences, depending on the circumstances of the case.

I hope that my noble friend Lady Walmsley will be pleased that since Committee, to get further clarity on the guidance, officials discussed the issues around witch branding with the Crown Prosecution Service, which makes any decision on whether a prosecution should be pursued. The CPS was able to provide a copy of guidance for prosecutors that the service produced some time ago. That guidance, a copy of which I have sent to my noble friend, illustrates the legislation and offences that could be considered in different circumstances. We believe that it covered all situations where a child might face potential harm, including those where the perpetrators of potential harm are third parties, such as rogue pastors.

Our approach needs to ensure that the scope of the current legislation is better understood to enable it to work as it should. To do this we must raise awareness among the relevant communities and faith groups. We must provide support and guidance to practitioners to help them understand what behaviours could constitute a criminal offence. Department officials are working with the National Working Group on Abuse Linked to Faith or Belief, and will be discussing with it further how best to disseminate information on this issue to the relevant communities and groups. We understand that some members of the working group are also considering revising the 2007 guidance on this issue and we are grateful to the group members for this. They are the experts, and they have the links to the relevant communities. We are happy to support the development of the new guidance.

When bringing the CPS guidance to the attention of group members, officials took the opportunity to address any potential misunderstanding about which people are covered by some of the legislation. Some members of the working group felt that there had been confusion about whether the 1933 Act could apply to anyone other than parents or those in a parental role, as my noble friend Lady Walmsley said. Officials have now made it clear that while third parties, such as rogue pastors, could not be prosecuted under the 1933 Act, they are covered by other legislation, as set out in the CPS guidance.

Any person whose words or behaviour cause severe alarm and distress to a child could be prosecuted for an offence under Sections 4 or 4A of the Public Order Act 1986. There are other elements. Those responsible can extend beyond those with parental responsibility. For example, they can include babysitters or teachers while they have care of the child.

My noble friend Lady Walmsley will be extremely familiar with Blackstone’s Statutes on Criminal Law because it probably accompanies her noble husband everywhere. It covers this in B2.136 on page 283 on child cruelty. It states that other persons such as babysitters or teachers may also have a responsibility while a child or young person is their care. It is covered. I hope that my noble friend is reassured by that. I am sure that she will agree that, as pointed out by the noble Baroness, Lady Howarth, it is culture that needs to change. We need to tackle that, and schools can play an important role in protecting children from a range of risks. We are working with other government departments and representatives of head and teacher unions to develop processes to raise awareness among staff and pupils of safeguarding risks such as these. Of course, there is a range of other areas in which we are working to try to tackle this. I hope that my noble friend is sufficiently reassured and will withdraw her amendment.

Children and Families Bill

Debate between Baroness Benjamin and Baroness Northover

Monday 18th November 2013 Grand Committee

[Baroness Benjamin (LD)]

My Lords, I, too, strongly support the amendments of my noble friend Lady Walmsley.

I will speak first to Amendment 243. For many years I was a school governor. One of my roles was that of child protection officer, for which I had to undergo training provided by the local council. These training sessions were attended by people across the borough, with responsibilities not just in schools but in community centres, Saturday schools and churches. At one such session I realised the worrying extent of superstition in these latter environments, involving children who, it was believed, were possessed by evil spirits.

The protection officers who also attended the training asked for better policies and advice to be put in place in establishments other than schools. They highlighted the need for training to protect children from what they believed was serious physical and mental abuse, driven by traditional superstition and sometimes religious beliefs. This abuse punished children who showed strong will or who misbehaved, perhaps because of learning difficulties, or because of conditions such as autism or dyslexia, or undiagnosed conditions which parents and families might not have been aware of or familiar with.

I also support Amendment 246. It has been brought to my attention, for some years now and from people across the country, that many children have had to endure corporal punishment and beatings in part-time educational institutions if they do not remember or learn work set for them, or achieve what is expected of them. This cruelty has to stop. We must not ignore any plea to safeguard all children, no matter where they are, what communities they live in, or where they come from. I therefore wholeheartedly support these amendments and hope that the Minister will put in place measures to protect these unfortunate children who have had to endure such awful and highly illegal abuse and cruelty.

[Baroness Northover]

My Lords, these amendments both relate to safeguarding specific groups of children. I will turn first to Amendment 243. While of course we believe that people should be free to express their views, I assure my noble friend Lady Walmsley and others that what is absolutely not acceptable is where expression of belief is intended to or causes harm to a child. My noble friends have made very powerful cases. Sometimes children are harmed by their parents or others. As a society we must be satisfied that we have the criminal offences to prosecute those who commit such behaviour. The Government have a key role to play, as do voluntary and other organisations working in the sector. We commend them for their work in shining a spotlight on this problem.

It is essential to raise awareness among the relevant communities and faith groups, and also among social workers and other practitioners—as the noble Baroness, Lady Howarth, said—who may come into contact with families where such accusations have been made. It is only through awareness of the potential threat posed to a child’s well-being by such accusations that families, communities and practitioners can be empowered to prevent harm from taking place and, failing that, to act with confidence in reporting concerns to the relevant authorities.

At this point I would like to look at the criminal law. My noble friend made a powerful case that she thought that these kinds of witchcraft cases were excluded. The noble Baroness, Lady Howarth, said the opposite. We have considered the amendment carefully and we do not believe that it is necessary. We agree with the noble Baroness, Lady Howarth, in this regard. This is quite simply about child protection and human rights. If we cannot include these kinds of cases, what does our child protection mean? Although existing legislation does not specifically mention communication of a belief that a child is possessed by spirits, the current offence of child neglect already includes conduct likely to cause a child unnecessary suffering or injury to health. In addition, conduct not caught by the Section 1 offence could be caught by other offences, depending on the circumstances of the case.

For example, any person, not just a child’s parents or carers, who caused physical or psychiatric harm to a child—which I think is what my noble friends Lady Walmsley and Lady Brinton are talking about—could be prosecuted for the offence of assault. Similarly, any person whose words or behaviour cause serious alarm or distress to a child, or made the child fear that violence could be used against them, could be prosecuted under Sections 4 or 4A of the Public Order Act 1986 —or, if the behaviour formed part of a course of conduct, it could constitute an offence under the Protection from Harassment Act 1997.

In addition, any person who encourages or assists such conduct could be prosecuted as a secondary participant, or on the basis of an offence under Part 2 of the Serious Crime Act 2007. For example, a religious leader who encourages or assists parents or others to abuse or neglect a child, in the belief that the child is possessed by evil spirits, could be guilty of an offence. We must ensure that our child protection policy is overarching, and includes cases such as these and all other manifestations of child abuse.

Prisons: Mothers and Infants

Debate between Baroness Benjamin and Baroness Northover

Tuesday 10th July 2012 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Benjamin]

To ask Her Majesty’s Government what action they have taken to reduce the number of mothers imprisoned with their infants in England and Wales.

[Baroness Northover]

My Lords, sentencing in individual cases is a matter for the independent judiciary. Where a judge or a magistrate sentences a mother to custody, mother and baby units are made available to ensure that the best interests of the child are met, enabling the mother and child relationship to develop and to safeguard and promote the child’s welfare. The number of women imprisoned with babies has remained broadly stable at around 50 over the past two years.

[Baroness Benjamin]

I thank my noble friend for that answer. Essential, emotional attachments are made between mother and baby during the first 18 months of a child’s life, but imprisoned mothers with babies are often denied these necessary bonding opportunities because of the restricted environments they are placed in—even within the mother and baby units, which are often far away from the women’s homes. Will the Government encourage the courts to consider the welfare of the baby before sentencing the mothers to custody and can we please have more smaller, baby-friendly secure community units as an alternative?

[Baroness Northover]

My Lords, the Government are fully committed to reducing the number of women in custody, and that is already happening. Recent sentencing changes should help that further. If a woman or a man is a sole or primary carer, that should be considered as a mitigating factor in sentencing. Recent guidelines from the Sentencing Guidelines Council have reiterated this. There are seven small mother and baby units, the largest having 13 spaces, which support the development of mother and baby relationships. In deciding whether a mother and baby should be referred to one of these units, the interest of the child is paramount.

International Women’s Day

Debate between Baroness Benjamin and Baroness Northover

Thursday 1st March 2012 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Benjamin]

My Lords, I too thank my noble friend Lady Verma for securing this debate, as it celebrates International Women’s Day, a very important time of the year when all of us can focus on the value of women in the world. It is also a time when women can pause from their multitasking for a few deserved moments to give each other a virtual hug of encouragement.

I am a proud woman who has played her part in contributing towards our country’s economy, but I would not have been able to do that if my parents, especially my mother, had not made so many sacrifices, which enabled their six children to benefit from their efforts. My beloved mother was born the same year as Her Majesty the Queen, and I would like to take this opportunity to congratulate Her Majesty on reaching the great milestone of her Diamond Jubilee—what an achievement, and she is still going strong.

My mother, who sadly is no longer with us, was an incredible woman. She worked so hard to get money to make it possible for her children to have a better life. My father, who always encouraged us, was a jazz musician in the 1960s so he did not earn much money. To bring in extra cash for the family to live a comfortable life, my mother took on three jobs. She cleaned offices early in the morning, at the crack of dawn. I used to help her during the school holidays and thought it was a great adventure to do so at the time. That is why I believe we must never look down on anyone, especially those who clean—you never know their circumstances. She was also a childminder during the day while we were at school, looking after other women’s children while they went out to work. In the evenings she did the laundry for the boys at a public school.

Years after that, my son, who is now a lawyer, went to that same school, and I became a governor of the school for 10 years—who would have thought? Later my mother gave up her evening job to stay at home because my eldest sister had got low marks for her school exams. My mother felt she owed it to us to be there for us, to push and motivate us. She taught her children to have a strong work ethic, which would be to our advantage. She used to say, “Keep at it, because the harder you work the bigger the rewards, not just financially but for that great sense of achievement, which is priceless”.

She reminded us every day that being from a culturally diverse background meant that you had to work twice as hard to be acknowledged, to achieve equality or to reach your goal. For us and many like us from minority backgrounds, sometimes the glass ceiling seems to be made of toughened glass. Even now, it is often almost impossible to break through. But you just have to keep on going. Nothing comes easy.

Women across the country have fought for equality in all aspects of life for centuries. They stormed Parliament, they chained themselves to railings; they even died for their cause—to play their part in making our country a more prosperous place. All women need are opportunities in order to progress.

I was chair of the Women of the Year Lunch for five years from 1995 to 2000, and the subject of equality and fairness was always top of the agenda. The lunch was co-founded in 1955 by the legendary, late Tony Lothian, who pushed the boundaries to get the recognition women justly deserved. I would like to take this opportunity to recognise and praise the work of Marie Colvin, killed a week ago in Homs. She won the Women of the Year Window to the World Award in 2001 for her bravery and work in journalism. She often said, “I go into places by choice but the people I am covering have no choice”. She will be truly missed.

Even though women have made huge inroads into almost every area of business and careers, there are still places that are like citadels, surrounded by impenetrable walls, which are barred to them. But I believe that, given a chance, women of all cultures could make an even bigger difference to our economy, bringing with them rich qualities that are sometimes lacking in boardrooms across the land.

It is not just the women in the workplace who make a huge contribution to our economy. There are also the women I call the unsung heroines of our economy. Yes, we must celebrate the contribution of the women who make a conscious decision to stay at home and care for their children. I have often heard women say, “I am only a housewife”. I say to those women they should be proud of themselves because they are just as worthy as anyone else in the workplace and the contribution they make in their own special way to the country is long term.

My mother did just that and her contribution has turned out to be worthwhile through her children, who all went on to have successful careers. So let us not forget the women who stay at home and undertake the very difficult task of childcare, managing the household, nurturing, guiding and motivating their children. They can be the best inspirational role models to their children. Even though it is a job that is not always celebrated or acknowledged, it is invaluable and serves as the backbone of our society, giving children the confidence to take up their place in society and contribute in a positive way. I applaud them for choosing to forgo their careers and become some of the country’s biggest economic assets—

[Baroness Northover]

I apologise for interrupting my noble friend, but I remind noble colleagues that when the clock hits six, you have had six minutes. I apologise.

[Baroness Benjamin]

Thank you very much but I just want to get that last phrase in. Thank you.

[Baroness Northover]

I point out that it will eat in to the Minister’s reply at the end if noble Lords overrun. This is a time-limited debate. I would appreciate my colleague’s understanding in this instance.

[Baroness Benjamin]

Let us congratulate all women on International Women’s Day and use it with pride. Our country needs you now more than ever. Thank you so much for being patient with me.