Baroness Doocey (LD)
My Lords, from these Benches, we join others in extending condolences for the death of Ann Widdecombe. The reaction to this tragedy has rightly included tributes from every party and from all sections of society. That is a reminder that, under fierce disagreement, there is a shared commitment to our democratic institutions and a shared vulnerability when violence enters political life.
Like every Member of this House, we were shocked and saddened by her death, the circumstances of which are subject to an active police investigation. The police have been clear right from the outset that they are treating this as a suspected murder. However, they have not yet established a motive. The situation seems to change constantly, and I suspect that it will continue to do so, as they uncover more and more evidence.
They have also asked us to respect their request not to speculate and to allow them to do their work. If only we could have the same lack of speculation on the internet and on social media. Would that not be great? Unfortunately, however, it is never going to happen.
Ann Widdecombe commanded widespread respect for her commitment to democratic debate and public services, first as a councillor, then as an MP for two decades, then as a Government Minister and, finally, as a Member of the European Parliament. This tragedy is a reminder that those who serve in public life should be able to do so safely.
We depend on people from all parties and none to put themselves forward and speak their minds without fear or favour, but my personal experience suggests that younger people, in particular, will not even consider the possibility of making politics their life. When you ask them, even though they are highly articulate and very happy to tell you what the Government should and should not do, they say, “We are not going to put ourselves forward to be shot down”. I honestly think that we all ought to work together to change this system. They should not be feeling like that. They should want to serve and realise how great it is to do so.
From these Benches, we send our sympathy to Ann’s family, her friends, her former colleagues, her constituents and her community, who will all be grieving her loss. Our responsibility now is to continue our arguments, definitely with seriousness but also with civility, and to give the police the space they need to establish the facts of her very sad death.
The Minister of State, Home Office (Lord Hanson of Flint) (Lab)
My Lords, I am grateful for the contributions from both the noble Lord, Lord True, and the noble Baroness, Lady Doocey. Everybody in this House knows that politics is about beliefs, about standing for things, and about making your views known. No one can deny that Ann Widdecombe did that in a way that was energetic, forthright, occasionally humorous and, unlike many Members of this House, occasionally on “Strictly Come Dancing”, which is important.
I spent 18 years in the Commons with Ann Widdecombe, and I cannot think of many areas where we ever agreed, but we disagreed with civility, with humanity and with mutual respect for views that we held. The loss of her in these circumstances is devastating for her family and for all who knew her, particularly for Members of this House who knew her as well. She brought conviction to our politics. She was forthright in her opinions. She argued courageously for things she believed in. She did not deserve to be murdered in this way.
As the noble Lord and the noble Baroness have mentioned, I cannot comment on the current police investigation; it is not appropriate for me to do that. What I can say in answer to the noble Lord, Lord True, is that the police are making a further statement on the developments in the murder investigation possibly as I speak—they were due to hold a press conference between 3 pm and 3.15 pm and they may well be doing that now; I am trying to check whether anything further has been said. It is important that we give the police time to examine that.
The issue that the noble Lord and the noble Baroness mentioned about Devon & Cornwall Police and the counterterrorism police is a step that has been taken in co-operation with both forces to look at further leads. It does not necessarily mean that terrorism was involved, but it is important that we give the police the opportunity to investigate. The counterterrorism police have now taken the lead on the investigation. As Laurence Taylor, the head of national Counterterrorism Policing, has said:
“We … have new information and evidence that means Counter Terrorism Policing is leading the investigation … We are pursuing multiple lines of enquiry to establish the motivation for this attack”.
Ann Widdecombe had an inimitable style in politics. She was valued by her own side and across both Houses of Parliament. She served Maidstone for 23 years as a champion for her constituents. She served the country in government as Minister for Employment and then Minister for Prisons. She served with pride and with a commitment that means that today we mourn her loss tremendously.
Both noble Lords who have spoken mentioned security for elected politicians. I can remember every case of the murder of a politician that the noble Lord, Lord True, mentioned. I have seen colleagues of mine, Jo Cox and Sir David Amess, murdered. I have watched from afar as Airey Neave, Ian Gow and Reverend Robert Bradford were murdered. It is not a way to do politics. We do our politics by discussion. It is important that we ensure that Members of Parliament and Members of this House have the support to be able to do that job free of fear. I do not think there is a single Member of Parliament who has not faced threats at some time or other, and many Members of this House do so as well.
Ultimately, it is the parliamentary authorities who are responsible for the security of this House, but we in the Home Office will work with them and we will continue to review how we can work with Operation Bridger, which is the police support, through local forces and through national support to ensure that we get that protection. It will be done on the basis of threat and of particular support for Members of Parliament who require it.
Ultimately, we will find out who murdered Ann Widdecombe and they will face a severe prison sentence in due course. But we should remember the contribution that Ann made and the affection in which she was held, and remember, dare I say, the differences we had. We should engage in our parliamentary democracy and our public life to reflect those values in the way in which we know they should be reflected—mutual respect, honest disagreement and sometimes open discussion. Ultimately, we should recognise that Parliament is there for a purpose—to reflect the will of the people—and our job is to make sure we do that, as Ann would have wanted, in a civilised, humorous but principled manner.
Lord Alton of Liverpool (CB)
My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Hanson of Flint, just referred to the assassination of Airey Neave here in the precincts of Parliament in 1979. It was the day after I was elected in a parliamentary by-election, so some of the horrors we have witnessed in the years that have passed have left an indelible mark on me, not least because Sir David Amess was a very close friend, as indeed was Ann Widdecombe, so much so that Ann was a godparent to one of my children and a close family friend.
On one occasion, after a particularly tough battle on a Home Office Bill in another place, where she at the time was a Home Office Minister, Ann told me that I was “her favourite bleeding-heart liberal”. But as the House may imagine, we often had our differences, and as recently as last month in a curry house which was a favourite watering-hole of Ann’s—where I have seen the noble Lord from time to time and indeed the noble Lord, Lord Clarke—we argued again about so many things, respectfully recognising our differences.
Ann was intelligent, principled and kind. Yes, her beliefs were founded on those twin pillars of faith and patriotism in a very toxic environment, fuelled often, as the noble Lord, Lord True, and the noble Baroness, Lady Doocey, have said, by hatred. We have to do far more to respect difference and diversity and uphold minorities in our community. We must work far harder to create a climate in which difference of opinion can be expressed with tolerance and respect. Now, we must do all we can to honour Ann’s memory. I hope there will be a book of condolence which we can all sign. In addition, we have to honour her memory by creating an environment where people can express their differences in tolerance and respect.
Lord Hanson of Flint (Lab)
I am grateful to the noble Lord and, may I say, he is one of my favourite bleeding-heart liberals as well. But, that said, his point is vital. Essentially, this is about expressing our political differences in a way that understands our basic humanity. Whatever the circumstances, and we cannot speculate as to how and why Ann was murdered, she held her arguments in a way that understood that humanity underneath.
I hope that we can look at how we can develop that still further. I know that other government departments will continue to look at how we can support the development of mutual understanding and parliamentary democracy in a way that respects differences and respects the individuals concerned. To reflect further on what the noble Lord, Lord True said, we want to look with the House authorities at Operation Bridger as it works currently for MPs. It is also worth us examining the lessons to be learned for individuals in this House and that is something the Home Office is quite happy to do in due course.
Lord Harper (Con)
My Lords, I associate myself with the remarks of the noble Lord, Lord True, and thank the Minister for what he said about our friend Ann Widdecombe. There has been much conversation in the media about whether the Government or the police take seriously the protection of those in public life. I know from my own experience, both in the Home Office and as a Minister, that they absolutely do. Members of Parliament receive enormous numbers of threats, some credible and some not. Can the Minister say one or two things about what the Home Office and the police do, and take seriously, to assess what is credible and what is not, and to put in place both the appropriate steps to advise those in public life and the necessary measures to protect them? Threats to people in public life are not just an attack on them but an attack on democracy and therefore the public. It is important that that protection is put in place.
Lord Hanson of Flint (Lab)
I am grateful to the noble Lord for his comments. He will know that Operation Bridger was established and, since 2024, the Home Office has funded a full-time network of national official advisers across all territorial police forces in the UK to bolster the Operation Bridger network. Each officer appointed by each force, funded by the Home Office, is a dedicated point of contact for MPs and, indeed, for candidates. In specific instances, such as by-elections, the police make assessments of the security threats, as they would have done in Makerfield recently and as they will do in the Clacton by-election that is occurring in August. There is a greater level of support for MPs now within constituencies than ever before. All MPs are advised to report incidents to the police and to reference Operation Bridger. The police will then do what I expect the noble Lord would do: triage those, look at what are serious, credible threats and take action accordingly, independently of government and of the House. As I mentioned, we will examine how the House of Lords can be involved in that as well.
Baroness Royall of Blaisdon (Lab)
My Lords, like my noble friend, I pay my respects to Ann Widdecombe and her family. She was an extraordinary woman. Like my noble friend, I did not agree with her, but I respected her. I associate myself with the comments that have been made about respecting politics, and the way in which a lack of respect in politics diminishes our democracy. Debate has become so polarised; it is frightening in many ways. Does my noble friend think that now is the time to do more to tackle online algorithms? Social media and the algorithms that perpetuate violence and threats against politicians have gone too far. We absolutely must do something so that we can truly restore respect in politics and have a healthy democracy.
Lord Hanson of Flint (Lab)
I am grateful to my noble friend; I do not disagree with any word she said. Increasingly, threats and views are delivered in an online way. That online way has increased the toxicity of the debate we have in the public forum. We need to ensure that we examine that. Legislation is currently available to look at the online space and how it is managed.
I come back to the main point, which I want to re-emphasise for all noble Lords: there has been a vicious murder. We do not know the motivation for that murder yet, and speculation and the discussion today have strayed into potential political aspects. We do not yet know the causes of that murder. We will have proper investigation and I hope that charges will at some point be made against somebody for that murder and that they will be held to account in the courts. We can then examine whether there are lessons to be learned, whatever happened with the murder of our colleague Ann Widdecombe.
Lord Evans of Weardale (CB)
My Lords, I offer my condolences to the family and friends of Ann Widdecombe. I have felt for many years that the Government underinvest in the protection of those in public life who face potential terrorist threats. I realise that there has been considerable progress in recent years, both on resourcing and co-ordination of support to those at potential risk, but would the Minister agree that although it is very important that there should be an assessment of the threats that individuals face, in reality that is merely informed guesswork in most cases? There is no specific intelligence. Therefore, if we opt not to take action, we expose ourselves to very considerable risk. We see the implications of that for our public life more widely. Therefore, the default should be to act, rather than to dismiss threats on the basis of their assessment.
Lord Hanson of Flint (Lab)
The noble Lord speaks with great authority about the type of threat that many elected politicians and Members of this House may face, and I bow to his experience and knowledge. We keep this under review at all times; in fact, following the murder of Sir David Amess, my right honourable friend the Home Secretary commissioned Robert Buckland, a former Conservative Justice Secretary, to examine the security arrangements for Members of Parliament and others. We expect him to report as soon as possible. It is extremely important that we keep ourselves safe, for the very reasons the noble Lord mentioned: a Member of Parliament represents 70,000, 80,000 or 90,000 people in their constituency. They are sent here by the population to do a job; they should not face threats in doing that job. They should face political discussion and debate, but should not be intimidated or face intimidation in undertaking that role.
Baroness Hoey (Non-Afl)
My Lords, Ann and I were on totally different sides in the hunting debate, which went on for many hours in the other place. All through that we remained friends, because Ann understood that differences could be respected. She was in a minority in her party on the hunting Bill and I was in a minority in my party on it. More recently, I was delighted when she came over to Northern Ireland to speak in a unionist meeting in an Orange hall, as a Reform spokesperson, against the protocol. That raised all sorts of questions: how could Ann Widdecombe, a devout Roman Catholic, speak in an Orange hall? She got a rousing reception when she came in. She said, “I’m Ann Widdecombe. I’m a unionist. I’m a Roman Catholic. I’m in an Orange hall and proud to be here”. The place absolutely erupted.
Ann was someone who understood and could cope with any kind of audience. She was also—and it is important that we say this today—a proud member of Reform UK and a close friend to Nigel Farage. Does the Minister not think it was really unacceptable that when Nigel organised a memorial, down near where she lived and with members of the family present, members of the Minister’s party, at senior level, were really nasty? They said that Nigel Farage was using her death as some kind of political football. That was disgraceful. I hope that he, as a Minister, will renege from those remarks and say that that was totally wrong. Ann would have been proud of what Nigel Farage did.
Lord Hanson of Flint (Lab)
It is important that we allow people to grieve and express their view on the death of Ann in whichever way they feel appropriate. I am not going to criticise anybody for laying flowers or a wreath at the site of Ann’s home. That is a matter for individuals to do personally. Again, what the noble Baroness has exemplified in her comments is that Ann Widdecombe was a politician who was not afraid, who was committed to a matter of principle, and who could do it in a way that deflected criticism and tried to win round support to her view. We all have our differences and members of Reform are entitled to their political views. I do not agree with them, but they are entitled to their views. What they are not entitled to is intimidation and threats, just as any other Member is not. I come back ultimately to this: let us not make a judgment on how Ann was murdered yet. Let us just grieve for her and resolve to learn the lessons in due course.
Baroness Browning (Con)
My Lords, I am grateful to put on the record of the House that I met Ann in the early 1980s and we became close friends. We worked together to become Members of Parliament. We debated with anybody and on anything, and she taught me a lot. She was ahead of me, having already fought one election. We did so well that, even before we were elected, we were invited once to go to No. 10 to have coffee with Margaret Thatcher. As we came out of the door of No. 10, Ann said to me, “Come on!” I said, “What do you mean?”, and she said, “We’ve got to get a press release out”. We went back to her office and she taught me such a lot about campaigning. She got into Parliament before me, but we were Ministers together in the Major Government and in my noble friend’s Lord Hague’s shadow Cabinet.
I always remember standing in my kitchen in Devon one day. I lived quite close to Haytor at one time, so I have sadly pictured it all horribly in the last few days. I was making a fruit salad when Ann stood in my kitchen and instructed me every step of the way on how to make it. In the end, I was so annoyed that I said, “Ann, I used to be a cookery teacher”, and she said, “I think I’ll lay the table”. I shall miss her sadly. I just pray that whoever has done this foul deed is caught quickly.
Lord Hanson of Flint (Lab)
I am grateful to the noble Baroness for her personal tribute to and recollections of Ann Widdecombe. I cannot say I ever had a fruit salad with her and I cannot say I ever went for tea in No. 10 with Mrs Thatcher, but I understand the mood in which she has placed those comments and I thank her for them. I also echo wholeheartedly her wish that, at some point and at some time, somebody will be charged with this murder, will be brought to account and will face the consequences of their foul deed.
Lord Barber of Chittlehampton (Lab)
My Lords, I am humbled by the quality of this debate and conversation about somebody I did not know. My association comes from being a resident of Devon, living on the other side of Dartmoor and having spent significant time at Buckfast Abbey, and the shock of hearing of her death was very great. I send condolences to her family and friends, many of them in this Chamber.
Looking at it from the outside, I thought Devon & Cornwall Police handled things rather well in the first few days and I think it is collaborating well with counterterrorism police now. As the investigation continues, I believe that what we all need as we get new insights and facts is to wholeheartedly support all the police involved in this investigation, the counterterrorism police and Devon & Cornwall Police, because they are collaborating very well.
Lord Hanson of Flint (Lab)
I am grateful to my noble friend and I agree with and wholeheartedly support his wish for the police to be allowed to get on with the investigation. I was just checking my phone because the police are in fact making a statement as we speak. I cannot update the House on the level of co-operation between Devon & Cornwall Police and Counter Terrorism Policing, but both have the same objective, which is to bring to account an individual, at some point and whoever that individual may be, for this crime. I wish them well in their success and I hope they have speedy outcomes to those investigations.
Baroness Stuart of Edgbaston (CB)
My Lords, I send my condolences to Ann Widdecombe’s family. I served as a Member of Parliament with her on the other side and, rather surprisingly, when I stepped down as an MP in 2017, a very kind letter arrived from Ann thanking me for my public service. There was always a side to her that we did not anticipate.
One of the things in the light of this is again quite extraordinary. Apart from the armed services, which other profession could say, as many of us in here have said, that three, four or five of our colleagues have been killed in the performance of their duty? One very concrete thing I ask of the Minister is to take a very close look at our home addresses, whether of Members of Parliament or of Members of this House. This is probably the most vulnerable data, and we need to ensure it is not publicly accessible.
Lord Hanson of Flint (Lab)
If the noble Baroness will allow, I will not give an opinion on that immediately. It is important that, through the Robert Buckland review, we look at the security issues for all elected parliamentarians and Members of this House. I say that simply because we can jump to speedy conclusions on a whole range of matters, but ultimately we commissioned a review from Robert Buckland in the light of the murder of Sir David Amess and I am waiting for that review to come back with a general review of security. We will work with the authorities in the House of Commons, and indeed with the House authorities here, to see whether improvements can be made. The bottom line in all this is that every person who holds public office has the right to hold that office free from fear and free to enjoy their property free from demonstrations. The noble Baroness will also know, as I have reminded myself in my comments now, that in the police and crime Act we passed legislation that prevents demonstrations outside the properties of Members of Parliament.
Baroness Fox of Buckley (Non-Afl)
My Lords, like many other people, it seems to me, I was an unlikely comrade of Ann Widdecombe across the political divide when we were Brexit Party MEPs. I think she started off with some hostility to me but, one way or another, we ended up hugging, laughing and arguing civilly more than we had both anticipated. We were great friends, so it is very hard to accept what has happened.
One concern from what I have heard today—it was also a feature in the Statement in the other place and in the media—is about calls to clamp down on online speech, as though that was the cause of the violence. I urge noble Lords—a little bit of homework, if they do not mind—to listen to Ann’s Oxford Union speech on free speech. It is full of moral clarity and great courage. It is preposterous for me to say this, but I am going to say it: she would not want this brutal murder to be used politically to bring in more censorship, or even for people—such as those academics and activists who have wallowed in her murder and said that she more or less deserved it—to be sacked or cancelled. She would want us to have a debate about it and to argue over it, and truth, not censorship, to prevail. Please let us not go down that road.
Lord Hanson of Flint (Lab)
I do not know what Ann Widdecombe would have wanted in relation to that, and I am not going to opine on it. I want to have a free and open debate on those matters, free from intimidation outside this House, and for people to be able to hold their views, whatever they might be, explain them, outline them, defend them and hopefully do so—as all parties in this House do—from the perspective of trying to make this great country a better place to live in for all our citizens. I am not going to give a view on what Ann would or would not have wanted. We should remember her life, not the circumstances of her death, and ensure that, whatever we do, we find whoever perpetrated this act and learn any lessons to be learned. Ultimately, we must accept that a murder has taken place and that somebody needs to be held to account for it. Today, as the whole House has done, we celebrate the life that has been ended by that act.
The Lord Speaker (Lord Forsyth of Drumlean)
My Lords, perhaps I could be permitted a few words of my own. Ann Widdecombe was a friend of mine for more than 50 years, believe it or not. She had that quality that guarantees all other virtues: immense courage. She also had great empathy for people, even those she disagreed with. In the absence of anyone on the Bishops’ Bench, perhaps I could be permitted to say that she had a deep and abiding faith, and she believed that she would be with her maker now. If anyone deserves to be with their maker, it is Ann, because of her dedication and deep-held beliefs. We may not have believed in everything she said, but all of us who are sending our condolences to her family should take pride in and have gratitude for her record of public service, which honoured us all and which adorned our Parliament and our democracy.