National Health Service (Amended Duties and Powers) Bill

Debate between Tony Baldry and Eleanor Laing

Friday 21st November 2014 Commons Chamber

[Sir Tony Baldry]

I have given way to the hon. Gentleman once, and as the hon. Member for Easington (Grahame M. Morris) accused me, ungallantly and unfairly, of filibustering—even though everything I have said is relevant and to the point—I would like now to make a little more progress and come to my final point, or almost my final point.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Mrs Eleanor Laing)]

Order. It is not possible for the right hon. Gentleman to filibuster, because if he was not in order, I would not allow him to continue speaking.

[Sir Tony Baldry]

I know that; you know that, Madam Deputy Speaker; I just wanted to make quite sure that the hon. Gentlemen below the Gangway knew that I was speaking relevantly.

I want to say something about the transatlantic trade and investment partnership. This is another of those things that people run around saying will be the end of civilisation as we know it. The transatlantic trade and investment partnership will not change the fact that it is up to the UK Government alone to decide how UK public services, including the NHS, are run. Any assertion that TTIP will undermine the NHS is a complete red herring. The position has been confirmed by both the European and the US negotiators, and indeed the chair of the all-party group on European Union-United States trade and investment. Excluding health from the agreement would prevent our pharmaceutical and medical devices sectors from benefiting from TTIP.

As we approach the next general election, I hope the Labour party will not treat the NHS as a political football. I hope we will not see, as we have at every general election since I have been an adult, the Labour party running around saying that it has 24 hours to save the NHS or that the Conservative party is seeking to privatise it, which is completely and utterly untrue. We all have a collective interest in ensuring that our NHS continues to be the best health care service in the world. There are huge challenges ahead for health care in this country, with an ageing population and ever-increasing improvements in medical technology. We should be facing up to those changes in an adult and responsible way. The Labour party should not be reneging on the clear commitments it made in both legislation and policy when it was in government. This Bill is totally unnecessary and it should not pass.

--- Later in debate ---

[Sir Tony Baldry]

On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. There is so much noise coming from the Opposition Bench below the Gangway that it is impossible even for someone who is as near to the Minister as me to hear what he is saying. Given that Labour Members appear to support this Bill, it would be a courtesy for them at least to listen to the Minister with some attention.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Mrs Eleanor Laing)]

The right hon. Gentleman knows very well that all Members exercise their right to speak loudly, quietly, in stage whispers and in other ways in this Chamber. I am listening very carefully to the level of noise, and if it reaches much higher than it already has, I will ask Members to be more courteous to the Minister. However, I am quite sure that the Members present will wish to be courteous to the Minister and to hear what he has to say.

Care Bill [Lords]

Debate between Tony Baldry and Eleanor Laing

Monday 10th March 2014 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

Order. Before I call anyone from the Back Benches, let me say that the shadow Minister has been most courteous in bringing her remarks to a conclusion when I indicated that that might be a good idea. It would also be a good idea, if Members wish to be courteous to their colleagues, if they would limit their remarks to some five minutes. That way everyone will get to speak. If anybody speaks for more than 10 minutes, I will remind them of the fact.

[Sir Tony Baldry (Banbury) (Con)]

I am not quite sure who to be bad-tempered with. As the House knows, I am not characteristically bad-tempered, but I think my bad temper should probably be directed at the usual channels, given that the timetable motion went through on the nod. We have to deal with 21 new clauses and 20 amendments on an important Bill in two hours, which by my calculation allows three minutes per clause or amendment. The hon. Member for Leicester West (Liz Kendall) spoke perfectly reasonably, given the number of amendments that have been tabled, but it is impossible to do justice to all this in two hours. The usual channels should bear in mind that some of us feel rather bad-tempered about the time provision. These things, as we all know, are agreed between the usual channels; it is not one side or the other that is responsible.

I wish to speak briefly about new clause 3. The Bill does fantastic things for carers, and I think it would be a real tragedy if, once the Bill completes its passage, carers or their advocates felt that it was a missed opportunity. I shall not repeat what my right hon. Friend the Member for Sutton and Cheam (Paul Burstow) said. The Minister will doubtless say that clause 6 and the duty to co-operate deal with this point. Clearly, the duty to co-operate is very important for local authorities and the NHS. In the past, GPs may not have sought to identify carers as well as they could because they did not think there was much they could do for them. Now they will be able to ensure that there is a carer’s assessment. If the Minister intends to resist new clause 3, could he seek to ensure that we have statutory guidance for the NHS on the services that it should provide for carers?

I fully understand that for those aged over 75 the aim will be to have named clinicians, and those clinicians should, as part of their duty, ensure that carers are identified, but of course many carers, including young carers, are under the age of 75. It would be a real pity if the Bill missed this opportunity on carers. If we could have some statutory guidance on what the Minister, the Department and all of us expect the NHS to do to identify carers, we can then have a quick rendition of the “Hallelujah Chorus” and I will not be so grumpy.

Women Bishops

Debate between Tony Baldry and Eleanor Laing

Thursday 22nd November 2012 Commons Chamber

[Sir Tony Baldry]

I agree with almost all that the hon. Lady said. The really important point is that the whole House wants the Church of England to get on with this matter. It cannot be parked, and work needs to be done urgently to try to ensure that it is resolved as quickly as possible. In fairness, the House of Bishops gave the greatest possible leadership in the General Synod. However, as I sat there, the analogy that struck me was that it was a bit like Government Whips trying to talk to the Eurosceptics; there were those in the General Synod who, whatever the bishops said to them, were just not going to listen. So, in fairness, the House of Bishops in an episcopal-led Church was very clear about the need to make change. Those bishops work every day with women clergy in their dioceses and see the fantastic work that they are doing in the Church of England. That work must be valued and cherished, and we need to ensure that any changes do not square the circle by bringing forth proposals for women bishops who would be second-class bishops. I have made it clear to the General Synod on a number of occasions that Parliament simply would not approve any Measure that introduced women bishops as second-class bishops.

[Mrs Eleanor Laing (Epping Forest) (Con)]

I am sure that the hon. Gentleman will appreciate that the whole House has sympathy with his position and great respect for the hard work that he has done in trying to resolve this matter. Does he agree that when the decision-making body of the established Church deliberately sets itself against the general principles of the society that it represents, its position as the established Church must be called into question?

[Sir Tony Baldry]

The hon. Lady makes a perfectly good point, and it is one that I have repeatedly made. As a consequence of the decision by the General Synod, the Church of England no longer looks like a national Church; it simply looks like a sect, like any other sect. If it wishes to be a national Church that reflects the nation, it has to reflect the values of the nation.

UN Women

Debate between Tony Baldry and Eleanor Laing

Thursday 10th March 2011 Commons Chamber

[Mrs Eleanor Laing (Epping Forest) (Con)]

I beg to move,

That this House recognises that around the world women continue to suffer discrimination and injustice simply because of their gender; notes that underlying inequality between men and women is the driving force that results in 70 per cent. of the world’s poor being female; recognises that empowering women will drive progress towards all the Millennium Development Goals; welcomes the launch of UN Women, the UN Agency for Gender Equality and the Empowerment of Women, on 1 January 2011; recognises that the agency is an example of UN reform to improve efficiency and co-ordination; and calls on the Government to provide support to the new agency to ensure it has the resources required to end the discrimination that keeps millions of women in poverty.

May I begin by thanking the Backbench Business Committee, and in particular its Chair, the hon. Member for North East Derbyshire (Natascha Engel), for choosing to hold this debate in the week in which we celebrate not only international women’s day, but the centenary of the first international women’s day? Some Members of this House and people further afield have questioned the need for this debate, and have suggested that there is not much interest in the subject. The fact that you, Mr Speaker, have put a time limit of eight minutes on speeches, and the number of Members I see in the Chamber prove simply and beyond doubt that those people are wrong. We need this debate. I am the first to say that we will not change the world by having a debate in the House of Commons, but it is our duty to ensure that the issues before us are kept high on the political agenda in the United Kingdom and across the world. That is what I hope this debate will achieve.

In 1911, on the first international women’s day, women in Britain were still fighting for basic rights, including the right to vote, as we all know. I like to think that if I were 100 years older, I would have been an ardent suffragette, although I am pretty sure that I would not have been an ardent socialist suffragette. I would have needed my own movement to separate the two. I am sure that every Member in the Chamber this afternoon, and not just the women, would have supported the suffragist movement.

I was privileged in New York three years ago to be one of the UK Parliament’s representatives to the UN Commission on the Status of Women. When I met and listened to the presentations of women from all over the world, it struck me forcefully that the problems that our great-grandmothers struggled with at the time of the first international women’s day a century ago are still faced by most—not some, but most—women across the world today. As the motion states,

“around the world women continue to suffer discrimination and injustice simply because of their gender”.

I welcome the setting up of UN Women, which is properly called the UN Agency for Gender Equality and the Empowerment of Women. I congratulate our Government on their support, particularly through transitional funding, for the new organisation. We all know that the United Nations has not always been the most efficient of organisations, but we must recognise that the new agency is an example of UN reform and is intended to improve efficiency and co-ordination. I welcome the Government’s approach to that aspect of the UN. The agency will not be just a talking shop. It is through empowering women that we, as an international community, will drive progress on all the millennium development goals, which everyone in this House supports.

I applaud the appointment of Michelle Bachelet, the former President of Chile, as the first executive director of UN Women. Most Members will agree with what she said when the agency was launched:

“Think of how much more we can do once women are fully empowered as active agents of change and progress within their societies”.

She said:

“My own experience has taught me that there is no limit to what women can do.”

[Hon. Members: “Hear, hear.”] I heard a little, “Hear, hear.” [Hon. Members: “Hear! Hear!”] Thank you very much. Every woman, and indeed most men, in this House will agree with that statement—there is no limit to what women can do. To put joking aside, I never say that women can do everything that men can do.

I will be careful in my remarks, Mr Deputy Speaker, to respect the rules on parliamentary language. As I heard Jenni Murray, the excellent presenter of “Woman’s Hour” on the BBC, say earlier this week, “I will be very sparing in my use of the F-word. I will try very hard not to mention feminism.” [Interruption.] I am being goaded into mentioning feminism. I will mention it and I will also mention equality. However, although the concepts of feminism and equality are good to talk about, they are not what this debate, the motion and our aims are really about. I prefer to talk about empowerment. The point of empowering women, rather than just helping them or saying that they ought to be equal, is that doing so and giving them the practical skills that they need can make a difference in the societies in which they live and operate. It may come as a surprise to know that women earn only 10% of the world’s income, even though they work two thirds of the world’s working hours—and I bet that does not include looking after the children. Evidence shows that when women earn and manage their own money, they are more likely than men to spend it on educating and feeding their children.

I am not being narrow-minded and concentrating on feminism, and I do not argue that men have got everything wrong and that women can put it all right, but I do argue that wasting the potential skills and abilities of half the world’s population because of discrimination is simply appalling. If we really want to help developing nations, as well as continuing to help our nation, Europe and the western world, we must recognise the role of women.

I do not have time to develop all the details of the work that has to be done, but the House knows them well and many speakers will develop these points this afternoon. We have to tackle violence against women in all its forms, here in our own country and especially across the world and the horror of such violence in war zones. We have to tackle trafficking, forced labour, the fact that women are deprived of education, the fact that women need to control their own fertility to have any chance of empowerment or being able to contribute to their society, and the fact that women’s health is ignored in so many parts of the world. There is also, of course, the continued fight for democratic representation. I look forward to hearing what many colleagues will say on those and other subjects this afternoon.

I have been talking about women across the world, but let us not pretend that we have conquered the problems here in Britain. We can look around us, because 22% of MPs are women. I am sure other Members will agree that when we meet people at UN meetings and other international gatherings, they are astounded to hear that in Britain, just over a fifth of Members of our precious and much-respected House of Commons are women.

[Tony Baldry (Banbury) (Con)]

My hon. Friend is sounding a bit like a vicar we used to have when I was a child, who constantly used to blame those who were in church for those who were not.

My experience, having sat on a selection committee, is that some of the people who are hardest about not selecting women candidates for Parliament are, perversely, women on selection committees.

[Mrs Laing]

Absolutely right; my hon. Friend is totally correct. We have all been through it, and I have seen it. I know that it happens in our party, and I hear anecdotally that it does in other parties, too. He is also right to say that those in church are blamed for those who are not there. We need more women to come forward to be part of the democratic process, but we need to make it possible for them to do so. If I were to cover the points that I have made many times before on that subject, I would take far more than the five minutes still left to me, but I hope that other Members will address it this afternoon.

We have a long way to go, but I also say to the House—and I mean it—that the percentage of women in the House is not what really matters. What matters is making our voices heard when we are here. What matters is punching above our weight, and let us face it, our weight is generally much lower than that of our male colleagues. There is now a critical mass of women in this place that there was not when I first came here 14 years ago, and it is up to us to make our voices heard. That is exactly what we are doing this afternoon.