Illegal Migration Act: Northern Ireland

Debate between Tom Pursglove and Mark Francois

Tuesday 14th May 2024 Commons Chamber

[Tom Pursglove]

There is no merit whatsoever in the suggestion that the UK would hand Northern Ireland over to the European Union. On the matter that we are debating today, the judgment changes nothing about our operational plans to send illegal migrants to Rwanda this July or about the lawfulness of our Safety of Rwanda (Asylum and Immigration) Act 2024. We continue to work to get regular flights off to Rwanda in the coming weeks, and nothing will distract us from that or from delivering to the timetable that I set out. We must start the flights to stop the boats. I have been consistently clear that the commitments in the Belfast/Good Friday agreement should be interpreted as they were always intended, and not expanded to cover issues such as illegal migration. We will take all steps to defend that position, including through appeal—those are the words of the Prime Minister. As I say, we are operationalising the Rwanda policy on a UK-wide basis, and we will see through the commitments that we have made.

[Mr Mark Francois (Rayleigh and Wickford) (Con)]

On the Windsor framework, we told you so. On the judgment itself, legally, all roads lead not to Rome but, in this case, to Strasbourg and the European convention on human rights. The convention was drafted for perfectly honourable reasons in the aftermath of the horror of the second world war, but that was over 70 years ago. It has now clearly been overtaken by events and international migration flows. Has not the time now come for a Conservative Government to include in our election manifesto a clear commitment to seeking to negotiate that convention with our European partners, and, should those negotiations fail, to leave it? If we are not prepared to walk away, they will never take us seriously.

[Tom Pursglove]

I refer my right hon. Friend to the Government’s stance on the legal position in relation to the Illegal Migration Act. I would also say that for illegal migrants, all roads lead to Rwanda, and for the people smugglers responsible for that evil criminality, all roads lead to prison.

Immigration Update

Debate between Tom Pursglove and Mark Francois

Wednesday 1st May 2024 Commons Chamber

[Tom Pursglove]

There are, of course, established processes whereby people can access the support that is appropriate in the circumstances. I have a principled disagreement with the right hon. Gentleman on this point about detention, and I recognise that those in the Scottish National party do not support detention either for the purposes of removal. However, where people are here who have no right to be here, I think it is appropriate that they are detained for the purposes of removal. That is done entirely properly, in accordance with the law, with the proper safeguards around it. As ever, that will continue to be the case during the ongoing work as part of the Rwanda relocations.

[Mr Mark Francois (Rayleigh and Wickford) (Con)]

I welcome the statement and, in particular, the news that in some categories at least immigration is finally beginning to fall. On asylum specifically, the Irish Foreign Minister and former Taoiseach, Micheál Martin, complained bitterly just a few days ago that large numbers of asylum seekers were moving from Northern Ireland into the Irish Republic. Sky News reported yesterday that the Irish Government are seriously contemplating moving police officers to the border to interdict that flow. In effect, that would create a hard border on the island of Ireland. Some of us were lectured for years, including by today’s Opposition spokesman, that the Irish Government would never contemplate that in any circumstances, so the stench of hypocrisy is strong. Will the Minister assure me that we will never allow the Republic to return those people to Northern Ireland unless and until we can remove illegal cross-channel migrants to France? As for the contemptible remarks of the SNP spokesman, let me say that at least the UK has a Government, which is more than we can say for Scotland this week.

[Tom Pursglove]

My right hon. Friend knows that this Government are resolutely opposed to a hard border on the island of Ireland. I understand that the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland has requested an urgent meeting with the Irish Government to seek assurances that there will be no adverse implications for the smooth operation of either the common travel area or the Good Friday agreement. That is an important meeting and he is right to seek it. I reiterate that we would welcome a returns agreement with the EU. We think it is right that we explore those opportunities and we will continue to pursue that.

British Citizenship (Northern Ireland) Bill

Debate between Tom Pursglove and Mark Francois

Committee stage
Wednesday 17th April 2024 Public Bill Committees

[Tom Pursglove]

My right hon. Friend has got to the essence of how I am approaching the specific question around fee setting. He makes some very eloquent arguments about the spirit in which the Bill has been introduced about and the spirit in which it will proceed through the House, which I hope will be reflected in the other place. As I have said, I am very cognisant of these arguments. My right hon. Friend touches on a very important point in saying that this is a very long-standing campaign. People feel very passionately about this change. It is a common-sense change. I think we need to reflect on those factors when making the decision about fees which, as I have said, is being carried out as part of the wider way in which we review fees and charges and the way in which that is done.

[Mr Mark Francois (Rayleigh and Wickford) (Con)]

I place it on the record that I have the privilege to serve on the Defence Committee with the right hon. Member for Belfast East. I would like to take this opportunity to congratulate him on being elevated to the King’s Privy Council and to wish him the best of luck with his leadership of the Democratic Unionist party, albeit achieved in very difficult circumstances. A number of people have paid tribute to his tenacity. As many Ministry of Defence witnesses can attest, there is no doubt about that whatever. He is a dog with a bone and he never drops it, so I am delighted that he has been elevated in that way and we wish him and his legislation Godspeed.

[Tom Pursglove]

I am not sure I could have put it better than my right hon. Friend. I find it very difficult to say no to the right hon. Member for Belfast East. He goes about his business in this House impeccably— always with good humour, always in an incredibly polite way, but also very persuasively. I think that that is as relevant to the question about fee setting as it has been to the Bill itself and the substantive change that we are bringing about. With that, I again thank right hon. and hon. Members across the House for their support for these measures and I wish the Bill a speedy passage through the remainder of its stages in this House and in the other place.