Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Theresa Villiers and Lord Robathan

Wednesday 11th March 2015 Commons Chamber

[Mr Andrew Robathan (South Leicestershire) (Con)]

8. What recent progress has been made on the status and operation of the National Crime Agency in Northern Ireland.

[The Secretary of State for Northern Ireland (Mrs Theresa Villiers)]

I welcome the vote in the Assembly that will enable the full operation of the National Crime Agency in Northern Ireland. This will ensure that the people of Northern Ireland are afforded the same protections from serious and organised crime as those in the rest of the United Kingdom.

[Mr Robathan]

When the NCA is up and running in Northern Ireland, will my right hon. Friend speak via the Chief Constable to ensure that the agency investigates the destination of funds from serious and organised crime? Many of the serious and organised criminals in the border area are the people giving funds to the IRA, and it is important that those funds do not fund political parties.

[Mrs Villiers]

I am sure my right hon. Friend will understand that I cannot comment on individual cases, but I know that the full implementation of the NCA in Northern Ireland is a welcome step. I pay tribute to the Justice Minister and others for securing that result, and I know that they will bear down on all the perpetrators of such activities and on any who receive the funds that those activities create.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Theresa Villiers and Lord Robathan

Wednesday 28th January 2015 Commons Chamber

[Mrs Villiers]

I last discussed that with the Home Secretary on Tuesday morning. There are some very good discussions under way between the Justice Minister, members of the Social Democratic and Labour party and the Home Secretary on these matters. There is some optimism that real progress is being made, and I urge all involved—I urge Labour to work with its sister party, the SDLP—to work on this, because the NCA provides excellent services. At the moment, Northern Ireland is not getting the full benefit of the protection that it can offer.

[Mr Andrew Robathan (South Leicestershire) (Con)]

The Secretary of State may have seen some rather surprising reports in the newspapers today. Given that she is talking about serious crime and is talking to parties in Northern Ireland about that, has she talked to Sinn Fein, because apparently the Labour party has been talking to Sinn Fein about a possible link-up after the general election? Did she see that?

[Mrs Villiers]

I was briefed on those stories in The Sun this morning. I certainly discuss many matters with Sinn Fein and the other Northern Ireland parties. It is crucial that all parties—Sinn Fein, the SDLP and all the parties in the Executive—get behind the introduction of the full powers of the National Crime Agency in Northern Ireland, because that is a means by which we can ensure that we do more to keep people in Northern Ireland safe, and it helps to relieve pressure on PSNI resources.

On-the-Runs Scheme

Debate between Theresa Villiers and Lord Robathan

Tuesday 27th January 2015 Commons Chamber

[Mrs Villiers]

I thank the shadow Secretary of State for his questions. It is useful to remind the House that this scheme never offered an amnesty, and that it was designed to give individuals who were not wanted an indication that they were not wanted by police, so the letters issued in relation to the Downey case and this one were clearly issued in error.

On the Chairman of the Select Committee’s question about the connection between the 95 individuals and intelligence or indications relating to 300 crimes, these are of course matters for the police to investigate, but I would emphasise that a connection to intelligence or evidence is not necessarily sufficient to justify arrest or prosecution.

I welcome the shadow Secretary of State’s repetition of the apology he gave on behalf of the previous Government for the errors made in these cases, and I, of course, am happy to reiterate the apology I made on behalf of this Government for the pain and hurt caused to all families affected by the OTR scheme. I think there is consensus that the scheme should, at the very least, have been handled in a much more transparent way.

I acknowledge that the way the family in this case found out about the connection to the OTR scheme was very problematic. My understanding is that the PSNI has issued an apology for that, and I join in confirming that apology. It is, of course, as I said in response to the previous question, important that the PSNI is properly resourced for all its functions, which is why the Government have provided extra security funding of £230 million and one reason why we have provided funding for help in investigating the past. Even with those additional resources, it is clear that Operation Red Field, the investigation into all the OTR cases, will take some years.

[Mr Andrew Robathan (South Leicestershire) (Con)]

The Secretary of State is to be congratulated on bringing some transparency to this scheme, via the Hallett inquiry. Such transparency was needed, because the previous Government set up the scheme and kept it under the carpet, if not secret from the nation. Does she agree that it was one of the shabbiest deals they did, notwithstanding the shadow Secretary of State’s apology? Will she further reassure me, the House, the country and the courts that she has taken legal advice on her statement that nobody can rely on one of these letters any more?

[Mrs Villiers]

I have taken into account a number of factors in deciding how to respond to the Hallett report, and they of course include legal advice on the best way to guard against further trial collapses as a result of abuse of process. My right hon. Friend has referred in clear terms to his view of the scheme. As I said, I think there is agreement that it was deeply unfortunate that the scheme was not handled in a more transparent way. That is something for which I have apologised, but I emphasise once again to the House that it was never an amnesty and it was never a scheme to let people wanted for arrest get off without arrest or prosecution; it was, from the start, intended to be a scheme that merely indicated to those who were not wanted by the police that that was the factual position at the time in question.

Stormont House Agreement

Debate between Theresa Villiers and Lord Robathan

Wednesday 7th January 2015 Commons Chamber

[Mrs Villiers]

I fully appreciate how strongly the right hon. Gentleman feels. I am absolutely determined to continue to work with him and with Northern Ireland’s party leaders to find a way forward to ensure that we find a way to resolve the parading impasse. As we have had the chance to discuss, the trouble with the panel was that it did not have enough support. It never had nationalist support. The Unionist coalition that had called for it to be set up in the first place could not produce a public statement in support and had actually broken up—some of the smaller parties had walked out. None of the smaller parties were making the case for the panel publicly, and there was a distinct lack of enthusiasm among the smaller parties. I regret the way the news came out. I have apologised to the right hon. Gentleman for that, but now we need to move forward and find something that will work to try to resolve the impasse in north Belfast.

[Mr Andrew Robathan (South Leicestershire) (Con)]

I congratulate my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State, the Under-Secretary of State for Northern Ireland, my hon. Friend the Member for South West Wiltshire (Dr Murrison) and all the staff who worked on this. It is a real achievement. My right hon. Friend knows that I am not much given to flattery, but it is a real achievement for which she deserves congratulations. She said that this is not the end. Going forward, will she ensure that those who were perhaps stumbling blocks—I understand Sinn Fein was a little bit difficult about welfare reform—are not allowed to stop this process in its tracks, and that we all work towards an Northern Ireland that is exactly like the rest of the United Kingdom, where people can go about their daily lives without fear, without corruption and without criminality?

[Mrs Villiers]

I thank my right hon. Friend for his kind comments. I echo his praise for my hon. Friend the Under-Secretary of State for Northern Ireland, who worked with great assiduousness and devotion on these matters alongside, as my right hon. Friend pointed out, many of the civil servants in the Northern Ireland Office. It is a tremendously important step forward that the political parties together were able to find a compromise on welfare reform. It does involve a top-up from the block grant to reflect Northern Ireland’s circumstances. Agreement on welfare reform was essential to putting together a sustainable budget. The important thing now is for a final budget to be agreed by the end of January and for progress on a welfare Bill passing through to consideration stage in the Assembly before the end of February. Those are the next steps.

Northern Ireland (All-party Talks)

Debate between Theresa Villiers and Lord Robathan

Monday 15th December 2014 Commons Chamber

[Mrs Villiers]

I can assure the right hon. Gentleman that the north Belfast panel will be constituted shortly. I agree that national security matters are at stake, not least because the current dispute over welfare reform and budgets means that the Police Service of Northern Ireland is facing significant funding cuts. Those cuts could impact on its ability to deliver community policing, which is an important part of our counter-terrorism strategy as a means of building support for policing within the community.

[Mr Andrew Robathan (South Leicestershire) (Con)]

Will the Secretary of State be slightly more specific about what is holding up the talks? In particular, she mentioned Sinn Fein’s opposition to reform of welfare. She will know that Sinn Fein wishes to see the destruction of the Northern Ireland entity, which is not exactly the position that most other people take. Is it a fact that we may have to impose a solution—I am not entirely clear about how that can be done—to ensure that things move forward?

[Mrs Villiers]

I shall be as brief as possible. There remain significant differences of view on a number of matters. There is no sign as yet that Sinn Fein will move its position on welfare reform. Further progress is needed on a specific plan for efficiencies within the Northern Ireland Executive. On the past, issues around thematic work and inquests will be quite difficult to resolve. On parading, the discussions that took place in the summer under the party leaders’ talks indicate that the criteria for adjudicating parades and the sanctions to be attached to a code of conduct remain the main sticking points.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Theresa Villiers and Lord Robathan

Wednesday 29th October 2014 Commons Chamber

[Mrs Villiers]

This is a very serious matter, and as the hon. Lady has said, the Chief Constable is concerned about the extent of the reductions proposed. A real concern is that a number of the cuts are in-year cuts, which makes achieving them through efficiency reforms very difficult. The Government will continue to support the PSNI with substantial extra security funding, but the Chief Constable now believes that the reductions proposed by the Executive will impact on his ability to police terrorism. We are working closely with him to ascertain exactly what that impact will be, and to see what steps can be taken to mitigate it.

[Mr Andrew Robathan (South Leicestershire) (Con)]

13. I pay tribute to the PSNI, which does a marvellous job in very difficult circumstances. Will my right hon. Friend consider whether it would be assisted by the National Crime Agency operating in Northern Ireland, and in particular by tackling the gangs that are still operating down in South Armagh—the same gangs that used to shoot and murder British soldiers, and that are still trying to murder police officers? They should be brought to book by the NCA.

[Mrs Villiers]

I agree with my right hon. Friend in paying tribute to the PSNI, and allowing the NCA to operate with its full remit in Northern Ireland is essential if we are to combat organised crime effectively. This matter does impact on PSNI funding, because its inability to receive the full support of the NCA and having to do the work that the NCA would otherwise do for it places additional pressures on the PSNI.

Hallett Report

Debate between Theresa Villiers and Lord Robathan

Tuesday 9th September 2014 Commons Chamber

[Mrs Villiers]

I agree that it is absolutely vital that the parties get round the table again on flags, parading and the past. There is so much to be gained in Northern Ireland from finding an agreed way forward. These issues are hugely difficult, and every day they have the potential to cause real gridlock and disruption to Assembly decision making. We all want the devolved institutions to succeed. They have a big programme of government to deliver. They have achieved a lot, but unless they can find a way to unblock the two issues of flags, parading and the past on the one hand, and welfare reform on the other, their ability to deliver for their electorates will be significantly impaired. I will continue to press all the parties to come together to find a deal and a way forward, as they have successfully done so often in the past.

[Mr Andrew Robathan (South Leicestershire) (Con)]

I apologise to you, Mr Speaker, to my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State and to the House for not being present at the very beginning of the statement.

Given that the situation regarding the letters has been clarified and that there is no longer a process to be abused, would my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State consider talking to the relevant authorities in the PSNI, the Metropolitan police and perhaps the Garda about whether the case against Mr Downey could be re-opened? As she said in her statement, if the evidence is sufficient to warrant prosecution, people will be prosecuted, and it appears that the Metropolitan police had evidence to pursue an allegation against Mr Downey.

[Mrs Villiers]

Once a stay of prosecution is granted, it is more or less impossible for it ever to be lifted. That means that I think it is inconceivable that Mr Downey could ever stand trial on a future occasion in relation to the Hyde park bombing. It would, of course, be possible for the police to look at other cases and other evidence in relation to Mr Downey; there would be nothing to stop them doing so.

Hallett Review

Debate between Theresa Villiers and Lord Robathan

Thursday 17th July 2014 Commons Chamber

[Mrs Villiers]

The right hon. Gentleman asked whether the scheme was devolved. As I have said in the House on many occasions, in August 2012 my predecessor and the then Attorney-General decided that it would not be appropriate for the Northern Ireland Office to accept any new cases, and that any fresh cases should be referred by Sinn Fein to devolved police and prosecuting authorities.

A debate has raged on the exact position of the scheme in terms of devolution. I discussed the matter with the Minister of State for Justice this morning. I think that the best way of putting it is that the Northern Ireland Office will not shirk its responsibilities in learning from these mistakes, correcting any errors, and taking any appropriate action that is needed to remove barriers to prosecution. We will do that in partnership with the Department of Justice, and respecting the devolution settlement. Exactly who does what and how it is done will be a matter for reflection in the coming days, and I will undoubtedly update the House in due course.

As for the closure of the scheme, I announced some months ago that it was closed. The Government will not be issuing any fresh “not wanted” indications. As I have made clear today, what we will do is play our part in correcting any mistakes and ensuring that everything that possibly can be done is done to remove any future barriers to prosecutions in other cases.

[Mr Andrew Robathan (South Leicestershire) (Con)]

On a personal note, I knew Anthony Daly. One can only imagine the pain that the Downey case has caused his family, and the families of the others who were murdered in Hyde park and Regent’s park. I very much regret the judgment of Mr Justice Sweeney, and I join those such as Lord Pannick, the distinguished jurist, who believe that the interests of justice should have trumped the mistake made by the police. Indeed, the allegations made against Downey were so serious that to all laymen such as myself, the judgment was extraordinary. On the subject of the OTR scheme, does my right hon. Friend believe that although the scheme was not secret, it was nevertheless deliberately obscured from public view and kept out of the public domain by the previous Government?

[Mrs Villiers]

Lady Justice Hallett found no evidence that it was deliberately obscured but, as I have said, it would have been far better if both Governments involved in the scheme had been more transparent about the way in which it operated. If we had been, we would not have faced the misunderstanding, the hurt and the upset that have been triggered as a result of the Downey judgment. It is important that we learn lessons from that lack of transparency and ensure that any future process on the past that is agreed is transparent and accountable.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Theresa Villiers and Lord Robathan

Wednesday 16th July 2014 Commons Chamber

[Mrs Villiers]

The Government have stepped in, providing an additional £231 million to support the PSNI’s efforts in regard to national security matters. That will help across the board, assisting community policing as well. It is, however, of grave concern that the failure of Sinn Féin and the SDLP to agree on welfare reform is having an impact on the budgets of other Departments in the Northern Ireland Executive, and, sadly, that includes the PSNI.

[Mr Andrew Robathan (South Leicestershire) (Con)]

With your indulgence, Mr Speaker, let me first commend my right hon. Friend for her excellent work to secure peace and prosperity for all the people of Northern Ireland.

My right hon. Friend may recall that about three weeks ago I visited south Armagh, where is little security and where criminality runs rife despite the PSNI’s best efforts. We need the National Crime Agency in south Armagh, and in Northern Ireland as a whole. Will my right hon. Friend please put pressure on the good people of the SDLP, who are opposing that, and on Sinn Féin, which has been subsidised in the past by the very terrorists who are still running the criminality in Northern Ireland?

[Mrs Villiers]

I warmly commend my hon. Friend for all the brilliant work that he did in Northern Ireland. I also warmly welcome his successor as Under-Secretary of State for Northern Ireland, my hon. Friend the Member for South West Wiltshire (Dr Murrison).

I agree that NCA capability in Northern Ireland is crucial. Only recently I had a conversation with Keith Bristow, the head of the NCA, who commented that a major child protection operation had been inhibited in Northern Ireland. The NCA had had to ask the PSNI to carry out work that was being carried out by the NCA everywhere else in the United Kingdom. That put further pressure on PSNI resources, which need not happen.