Northern Ireland (Executive Formation and Exercise of Functions) Bill

Stephen Pound Excerpts

2nd reading: House of Commons
Wednesday 24th October 2018 Commons Chamber

[The Secretary of State for Northern Ireland (Karen Bradley)]

I beg to move, That the Bill be now read a Second time.

I inform the House that the noble Lord Caine, who will be well known to many Members of this House, cannot be with us because, sadly, his father passed away this morning. I am sure that we will all join together in sending our condolences to him and his family. We send him, and his mother in particular, our very best wishes. [Interruption.] Lord Caine.

[Stephen Pound (Ealing North) (Lab)]

Jonathan.

[Karen Bradley]

Yes, Jonathan to you, Mr Speaker, I am sure.

I begin by inviting the House to join me in remembering those who lost their lives in the horrific Shankill Road bombing, the Greysteel massacre and the series of attacks that followed. These atrocities took place 25 years ago, but their effects are still felt by those who lost loved ones and by the dozens of people injured. Those who lost their lives will never be forgotten. People from across the community in Northern Ireland suffered in those dark days, and we must not forget that suffering.

When the people of Northern Ireland voted, by a huge majority, in favour of the Belfast agreement, they voted for a shared future in which no one would have to experience the suffering and loss that took place during the troubles. None of us in this House should forget, or underestimate, what was lost before the Belfast agreement, or what has been achieved since.

The Government remain completely and unequivocally committed to the Belfast agreement, not just because of what it stands for, but for what it has delivered for the people of Northern Ireland. At the heart of that agreement is a devolved power-sharing executive Government, and restoring that Executive remains my top priority. Northern Ireland needs devolved government. It needs all the functioning political institutions of the Belfast agreement and its successors. The only sustainable way forward lies in stable, fully functioning and inclusive devolved government. As Secretary of State, achieving this aim is my absolute priority.

The Bill delivers on a number of commitments that I set out in my last statement to the House on 6 September. It is an important step towards our goal of restoring the devolved power-sharing Executive and Assembly. It seeks to provide for a fixed period in which an Executive can be formed at any time. It provides the space and time for this Government to continue our engagement with the political parties in Northern Ireland, and with the Irish Government where appropriate, so that we can renew the talks process, with the shared aim of restoring devolved government at the earliest possibility. The Bill also provides the Northern Ireland Departments with the certainty and clarity they need to continue to deliver public services during this fixed period.

--- Later in debate ---

[Stephen Pound (Ealing North) (Lab)]

During the course of this afternoon, two common threads have emerged that have run through all of our discourse. One of those is the unfailing courtesy and respect with which Members have addressed each other across the Chamber. This has been an occasion not for people trying to score parochial or party political points but to try, really try, actually to achieve what is best for those we care the most for: the people of Northern Ireland; the people of this United Kingdom. The second thread is the sadness that we are here at all, as has been expressed so eloquently by so many Members, and the feeling that we have somehow failed as politicians and as legislators because we have had to bring this Bill before us.

The opening comments by the Secretary of State will have engendered great sympathy from across the House and, I should imagine, outside it. She took a huge number of interventions, and she spoke entirely honestly and from her heart. The conclusion that I drew from her words was that if there were any other way of proceeding, we would take it—if there were any other possible mechanism, that is the mechanism we would seek—but we are in a situation where it is simply impossible to continue, and not just because of the great long list of concerns that have been expressed.

If anyone thinks that there is any shortage of urgency about addressing those concerns in Northern Ireland, they should have a look at the briefing paper put out by the House of Commons Library, which lists page after page of long-outstanding issues. We know all about the A5 and the York Street interchange; we know about nurses’ pay and the NHS. We know about all these issues, but we cannot do anything about them. There is the issue of dormant bank accounts. There are things that would be so good for the people of Northern Ireland. We must somehow break this logjam and move forward. Of course, in an ideal world, we would have an Executive and an Assembly, but we are not there yet. We have to do something now.

We should pay credit to David Sterling, the head of the Northern Ireland civil service. There are some pretty tough jobs in the civil service, but his has to be one of the toughest. He has said on the record that he needs to be given legislation, to give “greater clarity and certainty” to decisions, not just because of the decision of Mrs Justice Keegan in the Mallusk case, but for the whole operation of the Northern Ireland civil service. We are asking them to carry the ball when we are not prepared to give them cover.

The hon. Member for South West Wiltshire (Dr Murrison) referred to the Secretary of State as sailing a tight and narrow course between Scylla and Charybdis. He may have been piling Pelion on Ossa when he made that statement, because I think we tend to know that, but that is exactly it—the Secretary of State has been walking on eggshells. What we have here is not an attempt to give a blank cheque and carte blanche to the Northern Ireland civil service, but an attempt not to restrain them and constrain them in such a way that they can do nothing. There will be an element of accountability. There will always be judicial review, and there will always be very active local Members in Northern Ireland who will not be silent if matters are failing to be raised.

The shadow Secretary of State, my hon. Friend the Member for Rochdale (Tony Lloyd), referred to a poverty of ambition. I think, in all sincerity, that we could be more ambitious. At the moment, we are firefighting; we are responding to crisis. I do not see that we are laying out alternatives and ways in which we can move forward. The hon. Member for Amber Valley (Nigel Mills) asked, “What can we do best?”, and that is the question we must all ask ourselves. At the moment, we are providing cover, and we are allowing the civil service to act, but we are not solving the problem or resolving it in any way whatsoever.

I think the hon. Member for Paisley and Renfrewshire North (Gavin Newlands) spoke for us all when he said that the Bill is accepted reluctantly. I think we all accept it, but with great reluctance. In the intervention from the hon. Member for East Londonderry (Mr Campbell), he referred to two words that echo throughout Northern Ireland. I have to say, there are two words I have always associated with it in the past—the first is “No” and the second is “Surrender”. I am glad we have parked that and moved on. Now the two words are, “We’re ready!” and I am delighted to hear that.

The hon. Member for Belfast East (Gavin Robinson), whose constituency I have had the enormous pleasure of visiting with him, called for a more interventionist approach. He is absolutely right, and I agree with that. It must be so desperately frustrating that the community groups and organisations he works with are being starved of funds and resources and starved of that accountability and link to legislation. He is doing everything he can. If only we could do more to help him. Sadly, the words that I remember from him are,

“we are where we are.”

That is the tragedy, but we have to get from where we are to somewhere forward.

I had the great honour of shadowing the right hon. Member for Hemel Hempstead (Sir Mike Penning) when he was a Minister. He is one of eight Ministers I have shadowed over the years; I do not know whether the fact that they all sought promotion immediately afterwards has anything to do with me. He spoke from a position of knowledge. He is held in great affection in the House, and we wish him well in everything he does.

My hon. Friend the Member for Pontypridd (Owen Smith) talked about torpor, drift and lassitude, which sounds a bit like a firm of solicitors in Swansea. I know exactly what he means—torpor, drift and lassitude are, in some ways, the characteristics that are seen from outside.

The hon. Member for Chelmsford (Vicky Ford) spoke from an Omagh background. I welcome her to our regular sessions here on this subject. We are always looking for new input. Her comments were very emotionally grounded, and we all respected them.

The hon. Member for Belfast South (Emma Little Pengelly), in a typically excellent and elegant speech, referred to the democratic deficit. She also talked about an unaccountable civil service. I am not entirely sure that the civil service is unaccountable. I think it does operate in daylight, and there is transparency. The main point she made—this is one thing that none of us must ever forget from this afternoon’s deliberations—was about the implementation of the Hart report. We simply cannot allow the Hart inquiry report to lie on the table. It is too important. She spoke with such passion that I challenge anyone not to bend their every sinew to try to achieve the implementation of that report.

I have to say that I have never heard the hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon) speak faster. I have a terrible feeling that a new category in the Olympics has recently been introduced—speed talking. I am very fond of the hon. Gentleman, and did he not quite rightly say that this is about bread and butter? This is indeed about bread and butter.

I think the hon. Member for South Antrim (Paul Girvan) spoke for all of us when he said—let this be the coda of this debate—that we do not want to be going back. We do not want to go back, we will not go back, we cannot go back: Northern Ireland deserves better. What we do this afternoon is not going to resolve the problem, but it will be a small step on the way and will allow some element of normality. Above all, however, we must never, ever go back.

Northern Ireland Budget (No. 2) Bill

Stephen Pound Excerpts

2nd reading: House of Commons
Monday 9th July 2018 Commons Chamber

[Stephen Pound (Ealing North) (Lab)]

If one thing has been consistent throughout this extremely well-informed and passionate debate, it is the roiling, boiling frustration of people who want to see something done, who need to see something done and who want to speak up for their constituents but are prevented. It is crucial that that message comes out loud and clear.

The debate started with a very telling contribution from the right hon. Member for Hemel Hempstead (Sir Mike Penning) and ended with a contribution about the PSNI from my good friend, the hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon). We sometimes forget that in the absence of political leadership, it is the forces of the PSNI who have to pick up the pieces. In that vacuum, it is the PSNI that we turn to. We must never, ever forget that they are the people who are doing the hard work.

Many people will remember the death in 2011 of Ronan Kerr, a young PSNI officer killed at Killyclogher. I remember that when I stood with Peter Robinson, the then leader of the DUP, at Beragh, about half of the PSNI officers made the sign of the cross and about half of them snapped off a very, very sharp salute. I thought, “This is future of policing in Northern Ireland.” I actually felt that there was some real hope. If we, as politicians, cannot show the same confidence, strength, trust and belief in the future as that cross-community expression of belief, we are letting them down—but, above all, we are letting down all the people of Northern Ireland. I respect the right hon. Member for Hemel Hempstead. I was his shadow once. I was a very insubstantial shadow because he was a very substantial Minister. He did an excellent job, and I appreciate his comments today.

I welcome the hon. Member for Paisley and Renfrewshire North (Gavin Newlands) to the SNP Front Bench. On behalf of not just my colleagues on the Labour Benches but, I hope, the whole House, I pay our respect and thanks to the hon. Member for Edinburgh North and Leith (Deidre Brock), who was an excellent Northern Ireland spokesperson for the SNP. I assume that she has been promoted. In the present febrile state of British politics, she could be in the Cabinet for all I know. I consider it unlikely, but who knows? I am grateful for the hon. Gentleman’s comments and for the hon. Lady’s work.

I gently say to the hon. Gentleman that I have known the DUP and individual DUP Members for many years. He encouraged them to seek further benefit—further financial advantage and fiscal goodies—from the Government. If there is one group of people on God’s green earth who need no encouragement, it is the Democratic Unionist party. I am sure that they are grateful for his warm advice, but when it comes to upping the ante, they wrote the book.

We heard from the right hon. Member for East Antrim (Sammy Wilson). Every time I hear the weather forecast, I always imagine some dreadful warning of a gale that is coming from Larne and I know that he is about to get to his feet. What his pupils must have thought in the days when he was a very distinguished economics lecturer, I cannot imagine. I presume that there is an entire generation of deafened people from East Antrim who were taught by him. He talked about a flat budget. I think that there has in fact been a 4.2% uplift from the opening position, so it is not a flat budget from that point of view. However, I entirely understand that doing this tonight simply takes us forward to the end of the financial year. We are not actually solving the problem but simply allowing matters to proceed in the present time.

My hon. Friend the Member for Pontypridd (Owen Smith) spoke lyrically and from a position of great strength and knowledge. He talked about the lacuna of scrutiny and the spectacular inactivity that we are suffering from. That is such an important point, and we keep coming back to it—the absence of scrutiny and the inability of questions to be answered. It was also mentioned in an intervention. I look to the Government Benches for some way in which this can be addressed, because surely right hon. and hon. Members must have the right to ask questions, even during this period. When he referred to the fact that we must not turn away, he made a desperately important point.

I am in no way going to criticise the right hon. Member for East Antrim, but he referred to the presence of certain people in the House tonight. Some Labour Members may not be here physically, but the Labour party and my colleagues will never, ever turn our backs on Northern Ireland. We will never, ever shunt this off into the distance. We will always be thinking and concerned about Northern Ireland. If we are not here physically, then, believe you me, we are here mentally and here emotionally. Our commitment is as strong as it always has been, and I hope always will be in future. I suppose that I should, in passing, congratulate the non-abstentionist Northern Ireland MPs who are here tonight. Every single one of them is here present, and the record will show that as much as the television pictures will have shown it earlier on.

The hon. Member for Belfast South (Emma Little Pengelly), in one of the most important speeches I have heard for a long time, brought this whole matter to a head: she referred to her constituents. Sometimes, when we talk about political theory, financial matters and fiscal arrangements, we almost operate on an ethereal level where we do not consider the day-to-day needs of our constituents. She talked about the reality of the health transformation programme, which is not going forward because of the absence of a devolved Assembly and an Executive. She talked about the impact on schools and the inability to undertake the cross-community work that I am so proud of and that she is such a strong exponent of. We heard the voice of a constituency Member of Parliament who was not making a political point from some theoretical standpoint or for party political advantage, but speaking on behalf of her constituents—constituents whom we are not serving best at present, in the absence of a devolved Assembly or an Executive.

I would like to associate myself and my colleagues with the expression of regret to William Dunlop. I cannot imagine any family who stand higher in the annals of road racing and motorcycling, nor who have been cursed on the one hand by so much tragedy but blessed on the other hand by so many achievements, than the Dunlop family. There can be no finer example of sportsmanship and achievement in road racing; what a great family. I think that we all extend our sympathy to them. I know that the family will be sustained by the memories of a truly great road racer—not just one, but a whole family.

The hon. Member for North Antrim (Ian Paisley) talked about unintended consequences and called for direct ministerial rule. I looked across to those on the Government Benches to see whether they were leaping forward at that and champing at the bit, longing to do it. I like to think that none us here actually want to see that. I understand the hon. Gentleman making that point out of frustration and anger, but I do not think we have come to that stage just yet. It is infuriating. The shadow Secretary of State, my hon. Friend the Member for Rochdale (Tony Lloyd), and I met Graham Keddie from Aldergrove airport, who cannot move things forward in the absence of even getting something signed off.

We ended with policing. In the years that I have listened to the hon. Member for Strangford, I realise that something has changed: I now understand every word he says. His mellifluous and poetic tones, which I have to say initially were challenging, are now as clear as crystal to my ear. Let us never forget what my hon. Friend—I will call him my hon. Friend—ended by saying: let us get it done, and let us make it happen. I think that the whole House is as one with him.

Oral Answers to Questions

Stephen Pound Excerpts

Wednesday 20th June 2018 Commons Chamber

[Karen Bradley]

I have had such discussions with the Chief Constable regarding County Down and all of the other five counties of Northern Ireland.

[Stephen Pound (Ealing North) (Lab)]

Further to the question of the hon. Member for North Down (Lady Hermon), Michel Barnier has said this week that the United Kingdom could not remain in the European arrest warrant system post Brexit. What plans does the Secretary of State have to meet this concern, and to address the issue of the 300 additional PSNI officers for which there will be a vital need post Brexit?

[Karen Bradley]

As I have said, I discussed this matter with the Chief Constable this morning. We need to make sure that there are arrangements in place so that the way in which the arrest warrant has operated, very successfully, in Northern Ireland can continue.

Northern Ireland (Regional Rates and Energy) Bill

Stephen Pound Excerpts

2nd reading: House of Commons & 3rd reading: House of Commons
Wednesday 21st March 2018 Commons Chamber

[Stephen Pound (Ealing North) (Lab)]

I thank all right hon. and hon. Members who have used expediency as their watchword this afternoon. Would that brevity was always the order of the day here.

The Secretary of State rightly referred to “a necessary intervention”, and the points that she and the Chairman of the Northern Ireland Affairs Committee, the hon. Member for South West Wiltshire (Dr Murrison), made about the current situation being unsought by any of us and something that we have to manage were very well made.

I want to concentrate on one aspect of the Secretary of State’s contribution, which was her very welcome mention of small business rates. This was picked up by the hon. Member for South Antrim (Paul Girvan). Some of us have had the great pleasure of attending small business Saturday throughout Northern Ireland. It has taken me from Downpatrick to Coleraine, but I have to say that the high point was probably visiting Quails in Banbridge. People have said that Quails is the Fortnum & Mason of County Down, but I think that Fortnum & Mason is the Quails of Knightsbridge.

[Nigel Dodds]

The hon. Gentleman mentions Quails, which I know very well since it is not far from where I live, but just for the sake of completeness and inclusiveness, he should also mention Fred Elliott, an excellent purveyor of meat products in Banbridge.

[Stephen Pound]

There are strict rules in this House against the wearing of advertising. I appreciate that the top of my head is available, but I would prefer it not to be emblazoned with anybody’s name. I am more than happy to give credit to Fred Elliott, although I have to say that Quails is quite remarkable.

We have heard a range of speakers coming mostly around the same point, although they occasionally went off in slightly different directions. None was more recondite and esoteric than that of the right hon. Member for East Antrim (Sammy Wilson), who raised the terrifying prospect of the DUP standing in my constituency and those of other Members. That is something that I am prepared to wrestle with, although I have visited the right hon. Gentleman in Carrick and Larne and, the last time I visited Carrickfergus Council, a tank was parked outside the city hall. He apparently uses it for canvassing, so I would prefer him not to proceed.

[Bob Stewart]

rose—

[Stephen Pound]

I will be happy to give way to the hon. Gentleman, but I should say in advance that I am unable to identify the precise type of tank.

[Bob Stewart]

I just want to point out to my hon. Friend—because he is a friend—that Carrickfergus was the first battle honour of the Cheshire Regiment, in 1689.

[Stephen Pound]

I cannot begin to match the Cheshires when it comes to battle honours, as most of my fighting took place in Union Street in Plymouth, sadly—but that is another story, and not one that we will necessarily hear today.

The hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon) summed up. When he rises to his feet, additional Hansard reporters are drafted in—two of them have been carried out with wet towels around their heads. I am quite sure that the hon. Gentleman’s contribution was excellent; every 50th word certainly resonated with the House. If the Hansard reporters were paid on a piecework basis, they would all retire by the end of the week.

The hon. Gentleman always makes important points, and he rightly referred to my very pleasant visit to Newtownards, where I was the guest at an extremely enjoyable dinner held in the Elim Pentecostal church on the Ards peninsula. There was not an enormous amount of liquid hospitality, to be fair, but the welcome was extremely warm and the company extremely stimulating.

Something is hanging over all that we have discussed today. The reality is that we are talking about being in a place where we do not necessarily want to be. The hon. Member for Edinburgh North and Leith (Deidre Brock) talked about this being a serene and benign process. She was right to make that point, but we should also be aware of the alternative. If there is serenity and benignity, it is in this place, not necessarily in others.

The hon. Member for North Antrim (Ian Paisley) made powerful points, which I hope will be answered soon—they have to be. We then heard from the hon. Member for Belfast South (Emma Little Pengelly). That was an intensely powerful, really important speech—and not only in setting out the Democratic Unionist party’s fiscal policy, which appears to echo Gladstone’s famous dictum that money should fructify in the pockets of the people rather than be taken in taxation. She then referred to today’s visit from the people from WAVE Trauma Centre, whom the shadow Secretary of State was delighted to welcome.

When we hear the stories of those people—people who have lost their legs or been paralysed; in one case, a man’s father died of a heart attack when his son was shot—we realise what the alternative is in Northern Ireland and why it is absolutely crucial that we should never, ever cease bending every single sinew to ensure the continuity of the peace process. I would like to thank Sandra Peake and Alan McBride from the WAVE centre and pay tribute to those who have come across today: Mark Kelly, Jennifer McNern, Paddy Cassidy, Robert Barfoot, Dr Mary Hannon Fletcher, Peter Heathwood, Cathy McCann, Alex Bunting and Paul Gallagher. They have suffered in a way that most of us in this House can never begin to imagine.

If we do not do every single thing we can to ensure the continuity of the peace process and stability in Northern Ireland, we insult those people and their families. We do not give them credit for their suffering. We simply have to do our very best. Everyone today has spoken from that standpoint. This is one occasion on which I hope we are as one in the House. There have been differences of emphasis by all means, but let us never, ever forget that, if we cannot manage this process in the right way, plenty wish to do it in the wrong way.

We on the Opposition Front Bench are as one with the Secretary of State and her Minister. We support them in what they are doing, but above all we recognise the suffering that many have experienced—the almost unimaginable pain and trauma that they have known. We will never, ever let you down.

Oral Answers to Questions

Stephen Pound Excerpts

Wednesday 21st March 2018 Commons Chamber

[Karen Bradley]

The hon. Gentleman makes an important point. There are more crossing points in the 310 miles of land border between Northern Ireland and the Republic than there are on the whole eastern land border between the European Union and non-member states. However, I think that it will reassure the hon. Gentleman to know that both Mr Barnier, who was working in the European Commission at the time of the Belfast agreement, and my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Exiting the European Union are very familiar with that border.

[Stephen Pound (Ealing North) (Lab)]

Now that spring has come and there is a lightness and warmth in the air, may the equinoctial optimism extend to all politicians in Northern Ireland!

I know that the Secretary of State is well aware of the important role played by the British-Irish Intergovernmental Conference, particularly during the previous period of direct rule, when there were 18 meetings between 1999 and 2007. With no devolution, and with the horrors of Brexit looming ever larger, what plans does she have to reconvene the BIIGC, and when and where will it be reconvened?

[Karen Bradley]

It seems ironic that on the day when there are exactly 12 hours of daylight, we have scheduled 12 hours of programmed time in which to debate Northern Ireland legislation.

[Stephen Pound]

Not enough.

[Karen Bradley]

It may well not be enough; it will depend on how the shadow Secretary of State feels.

I regularly discuss with both the Tánaiste and the Taoiseach issues relating to our commitments in the Belfast agreement, and I continue to reflect on those matters.

[Mr Speaker]

I am bound to say that I am a little disappointed that there was a less than fully attentive audience for the legendary thespian performance of the hon. Member for Ealing North (Stephen Pound), to which many of us have become accustomed over the last two decades, but there are always other occasions on which people can listen more closely—and should.

[Stephen Pound]

Shall I do it again?

Northern Ireland Budget (Anticipation and Adjustments) Bill

Stephen Pound Excerpts

2nd reading: House of Commons & 3rd reading: House of Commons
Tuesday 20th March 2018 Commons Chamber

[Stephen Pound (Ealing North) (Lab)]

We have had an extraordinarily interesting afternoon. It started with almost a political first—almost a parliamentary first—when a Secretary of State came to the Dispatch Box longing to give up power and desperate to slough off some of the responsibilities of office. Most of us—obviously, I exclude myself and hon. Members present—are climbing the greasy pole with all rapidity, but, no, the Secretary of State spurns the trappings of authority and wants no part of them.

I have to say I have enormous sympathy, because, in all honesty, what we have heard this afternoon is almost an admission of failure. We heard an admission that we are discussing issues that we simply should not be discussing; we actually need to talk about the things that really matter to this House, and representatives of Northern Ireland need to talk about things that matter there.

We heard an extremely forensic analysis of the Bill from the hon. Member for South West Wiltshire (Dr Murrison). He brought to the Bill the same scalpel-like skill that he used to bring to human beings—most of whom survived—and he broke it down, particularly in his comments on the role of the Northern Ireland Audit Office. He said, quite correctly, that permanent secretaries should not be dealing with the closure of health facilities. In many ways, that brought us to the nub of what we are talking about this afternoon.

The hon. Member for Edinburgh North and Leith (Deidre Brock) said she was in reluctant agreement, but, in a very potent phrase, she said we have to somehow keep the lights and the heat on. We do not normally talk about heating in these debates, but in this case talking about keeping the lights and the heat on was entirely appropriate.

The contribution from the hon. Member for Lewes (Maria Caulfield) has attracted much support and comment. She not only spoke from the heart and from a position of authority, but she spoke the essential truth. The references she made to, for example, the Belfast city deal were very potent because such matters really concern the people of Northern Ireland—rather more than what we are saying in this Chamber.

The right hon. Member for East Antrim (Sammy Wilson) showed yet again what an immense loss he is to the world of higher education. An entire generation of schoolchildren in Northern Ireland learned at his feet, studied underneath him and survived. He again gave us a master class, and he was right to talk about misconceptions. Like his pupils, I feel honoured and a better person for having heard him.

The right hon. Member for Belfast North (Nigel Dodds) widened the scope of the Bill somewhat and brought us to Brexit, among other things. He incorporated an extraordinary amount of detail, but that was quite correct in many ways, because the Bill does have an impact on so many areas. He also talked about going about the people’s business, which is a potent phrase. We should be going about the people’s business in our constituencies, whether they be in Northern Ireland or here; we should not be doing this. Not for the first time, the right hon. Gentleman spoke not just good sense but with a great sense of rightness on his side, and it was good to hear it.

I hope that the hon. Member for Belfast South (Emma Little Pengelly) will not think me patronising when I say that she has grown in stature during the short time that she has been in the House. She spoke superbly, saying, again from the heart, that today is a sad day. In that, I think she enunciated the spirit of the House. She talked about the democratic deficit and referred in passing to the paucity of Members here present. That is their loss, because we have heard some excellent speeches, including that of the hon. Lady. She also talked about the impact on children with special educational needs and on education, which are issues on which we should be concentrating.

The hon. Member for South Antrim (Paul Girvan) talked about the roads that needed repairing and problems in health and higher education. Mr Deputy Speaker, if I may prevail upon your legendary generosity of spirit, I will say that it was a great pleasure yesterday to meet the hon. Gentleman with Grace Nesbitt, one of his constituents —oddly enough, she worked in the Department of Finance—who came here to receive her well-deserved OBE, accompanied by her absolutely delightful daughter, Rhoda.

Normally when the hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon) stands up, I feel that we have saved the best for last. I thought he was to be the last speaker, but he introduced us to the giant pothole of Newtownards. I have no doubt that it will before long become one of the signature destinations in Northern Ireland. We have had the Giant’s Causeway and the walled city, and we will soon have the giant pothole of Newtownards. I understand that it would be difficult not to score a hole-in-one where the giant pothole is concerned, and the thought of the DUP accidentally opening an Australian branch is one that does not worry me overmuch, but I understand that a certain concern is being expressed in the antipodes. He also talked about important things, such as bursaries for medical students, and it is the combination of the local minutiae—the bread-and-butter issues of his local politics—with the big issues that makes him such an excellent speaker.

The hon. Member for North Antrim (Ian Paisley) suddenly led the debate into a completely new direction, and the entire House almost leaped to its feet in animation as we started to talk about golf, tourism and the North West 200. We could have carried on like that for another couple of hours.

[Bob Stewart]

The hon. Gentleman talks about the North West 200 and the Portrush, Coleraine and Portstewart triangle. Is it sheer coincidence that right in the middle of that triangle is the Bushmills distillery?

[Stephen Pound]

I am more familiar with Bob Stewart than Portstewart, but there may well be a distillery along that route. I also remember that there are demountable traffic signs and that the street furniture can be moved to the side thanks to Joey Dunlop’s inspirational leadership. Mr Deputy Speaker, although I have referred to your legendary generosity of spirit, I think that even you may be tempted to rise and ask me to sit were we to go into more discussions on that.

Ultimately, we are talking about a subject that none of us really wants to be addressing in this Chamber. Last Thursday, I attended the excellent housing conference organised by agendaNi in the Titanic centre to hear people talking about housing issues in Northern Ireland, the problems of substandard housing and the problems of needing to adapt properties for people with special needs. Those are the issues that we should be talking about. This afternoon, we talked about the York Street interchange—that should be discussed in Stormont and not in Westminster. It is important and it matters to the people of Northern Ireland. We should not even have to mention that here and now.

The Under-Secretary of State for Northern Ireland, the hon. Member for North West Cambridgeshire (Mr Vara), was referred to earlier by the hon. Member for North Antrim, who remarked on him traveling around the highways and byways of Northern Ireland, stirring up expectations and giving people the anticipation of delivery. I have every confidence and faith in the Minister. I consider him a friend—I appreciate that may breach parliamentary protocol, and it has probably doomed his career. I think we have a duty to be evangelical and optimistic. The great people of Northern Ireland—some of the greatest people I have ever had the privilege of meeting—deserve better. In fact, they deserve more than better; they deserve the best, and they deserve that from their elected representatives in their own part of the world. What we have done today has been technical and necessary, but I wish that we had not had to do it.

Northern Ireland Finances

Stephen Pound Excerpts

Monday 12th March 2018 Commons Chamber

[Karen Bradley]

I am being corrected by the Opposition Front Bencher.

[Stephen Pound (Ealing North) (Lab)]

It doesn’t happen very often.

[Karen Bradley]

It always happens.

The right hon. Gentleman is right to say that these decisions do need to be taken. We do want to see devolved government. We want decisions and scrutiny to be undertaken in Stormont. That is the right place for those things to happen. I am not going to put a timeframe on it because we need to find something that has consent. As he will know, under the Belfast agreement, for constitutional changes in Northern Ireland, we would need the consent of all communities. Therefore, I do need to work through all the suggestions that have been put to me, but I would welcome suggestions from him, given his extensive experience of doing the job.

Northern Ireland

Stephen Pound Excerpts

Tuesday 12th December 2017 Ministerial Corrections

The following is an extract from Questions to the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland on Wednesday 15 November 2017.

[Stephen Pound (Ealing North) (Lab)]

Has the Northern Ireland Office produced an analysis of the impact of Brexit on Northern Ireland, or contributed to the rumoured “58 articles”—the sectoral analyses that we know have been produced? Will the Secretary of State commit himself to publishing all such material, as his colleagues in the Department for Exiting the European Union have already so nobly done?

Oral Answers to Questions

Stephen Pound Excerpts

Wednesday 15th November 2017 Commons Chamber

[James Brokenshire]

Obviously we respect the European Union’s desire to protect the legal order of the single market and the customs union, but that cannot come about at the expense of the constitutional and economic integrity of the United Kingdom. As we have said, we recognise the need for solutions that are specific to the unique circumstances of Northern Ireland, and we all have a responsibility to be thoughtful and creative, but that cannot amount to the appearance of a new border within the United Kingdom.

[Stephen Pound (Ealing North) (Lab)]

Has the Northern Ireland Office produced an analysis of the impact of Brexit on Northern Ireland, or contributed to the rumoured “58 articles”—the sectoral analyses that we know have been produced? Will the Secretary of State commit himself to publishing all such material, as his colleagues in the Department for Exiting the European Union have already so nobly done?[Official Report, 12 December 2017, Vol. 633, c. 2MC.]

[James Brokenshire]

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for highlighting the sectoral work relating to 58 areas of activity, which deals with how trade is currently conducted with the EU and what the alternatives might be. I can say that Northern Ireland has contributed to the cross-Government work at an official level, and the hon. Gentleman will be well aware of the commitments that DExEU has made in relation to the publication of that ongoing work.

Northern Ireland Budget Bill

Stephen Pound Excerpts

2nd reading: House of Commons & 3rd reading: House of Commons & Report stage: House of Commons
Monday 13th November 2017 Commons Chamber

[Stephen Pound (Ealing North) (Lab)]

The hon. Member for North Antrim (Ian Paisley) has given a powerful coda to what has been, as those in all parts of the House would recognise, an extraordinarily well-informed and important debate on a desperately significant subject. There is not much doubt that an enormous amount of good will has been expressed towards the Secretary of State, and gratitude for the work he has done and the effort he has made.

If there is one thing that slightly depresses me about the debate, it is that we are probably going to have to do the whole thing all over again in a few months’ time. As we approach the next financial year, many of us will be thinking of the consequences of setting a new budget for it. I am not saying that my Christmas will be totally destroyed—that this will completely tarnish the gilt or dull the sparkle of tinsel—but it will certainly be slightly diverted by thinking of that prospect ahead.

Every speaker has referred to the appalling circumstances and situations that are prevailing today. Omagh has been mentioned. I have grown into having a great affection for the people of Omagh in the many years that I have attended the commemoration of the horrendous massacre that took place on 15 August 1998, when, as we all know, 29 adults and two unborn children were killed. I remind the House, as if it needs reminding, that next year is the 20th anniversary. I am sure that many of us will wish to be present there to show solidarity with the people of Omagh.

There has been an enormous amount of good will, and I am particularly grateful for the statement that has been issued since the start of this evening’s debate by Simon Coveney, Minister for Foreign Affairs and Trade, who has committed the Irish Government to continuing to work to facilitate as much discussion as possible to support the talks. We are grateful for that north-south dimension. [Interruption.] I am not entirely sure where that noise came from. It was a little bit close.

All the speakers this afternoon have said pretty much the same thing: we do not want to be here, but we accept the fact that we have to be here to do something. The hon. Member for South West Wiltshire (Dr Murrison) referred to the democratic deficit, and I think he put his finger on it. Most of the speakers referred to the fact that there is a lack of accountability, a lack of transparency and a democratic deficit. This may be a necessary evil, but it sticks in many people’s throats.

I am grateful to the right hon. Member for Belfast North (Nigel Dodds) for mentioning the appalling circumstances of the Northern Irish football team; I think he was the only person to do so. We express our gratitude and respect to Steven Davis, particularly for the dignity he showed when Stuart Dallas was chopped down with an absolute leg-breaker that did not attract a red card, whereas a ball on the upper shoulder was given as a penalty in a disgraceful and reprehensible display of bad refereeing. We are, I hope, united on that.

The right hon. Gentleman referred to the wish to have a general election now, and he implied that there were those in the House who did not wish to have one now. I cannot always speak for my Labour friends, but we are more than willing to have a general election at any time the Government wish to mention. We are ready, and we are willing. When the nation calls, Labour will be there to answer that call; be assured of that.

The right hon. Member for North Shropshire (Mr Paterson) struck not a discordant note, but a slightly different note when he referred to his wish not to be beastly to the Northern Ireland civil service, but at the same time seriously to consider the benefits of direct rule. I almost thought that there was a job application in there somewhere. I hope that the rest of us feel that we do not wish to return to direct rule.

[Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab)]

rose—

[Stephen Pound]

I will happily give way to my party friend and colleague.

[Kate Hoey]

I thank my party friend and colleague. He said something about Labour being there, and I wondered whether that meant that he was about to announce that, finally, the Labour party will allow people in Northern Ireland not just to join—it has done that only recently—but to put up candidates?

[Stephen Pound]

Time is short tonight, Madam Deputy Speaker. There are things that I could say, and there are things that I would be happy to say, but the tugging on the back of my coat from my hon. Friend the Member for Pontypridd (Owen Smith) cannot be denied.

The hon. Member for Edinburgh North and Leith (Deidre Brock) put her finger on it when she talked about hospitals and schools—and I hardly even need to mention the parlous state of the A5. There are things that need to be done, and we should get on with dealing with them. I think everybody accepts that. The hon. Member for Amber Valley (Nigel Mills) rather succinctly described what we are doing this evening as the “least worst option”. Not for the first time, he has discovered les mots justes, and I congratulate him on that.

In a typical contribution, the hon. Member for East Antrim (Sammy Wilson) stunned the Chamber, as he always does. He seemed to imply that we had lingered too long before introducing any legislation. We have already used section 59 of the Northern Ireland Act 1998 twice: once to passport 75% of the budget and then, in July, to passport 95% of it, so things have happened. He also implied—in a way that was untypically provocative for the gentle hon. Gentleman—that somehow the Labour party was not in favour of increased public spending. We are in favour of increased public spending across the board. We want it in Wales, we want it in Scotland, we want it in England, we want it in Ealing and we want it in Northern Ireland. We are in favour of increased public spending; we are just not in favour of bespoke public spending.

If I may say so, the hon. Member for Havant (Alan Mak) spoke powerfully against the idea of direct rule, and he spoke with cogency and brevity. I would like to say the same about the hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon)—I really would—but, not for the first time, the emotion, the power and the strength of his commitment to his constituency and his part of the United Kingdom forced him to expand further and extrapolate more than he probably wanted to do initially. However, his exegesis on this theme was welcomed by us all. I have never spent a few hours listening to him and regretted them.

The hon. Gentleman said that, after all, what we have is not “what the people want”, and I think that is so important. Not for the first time, my friend quite rightly put his finger on it by saying that this is not what the people want. The right hon. Member for Lagan Valley (Sir Jeffrey M. Donaldson) also cogently said that we cannot continue with this impasse, and how right he was.

I must say that the final speech, from the hon. Member for North Antrim, was statesmanlike and powerful. I hope he will not resent my saying so. He used the metaphor of a train leaving the station, which for many of us had echoes of Michael Collins and Lloyd George, but the trouble is that the train is not moving: it is stuck in the sidings and is not going anywhere at present. I would like to see the train moving, with all of us aboard that freedom train, but in the meantime, we have to inject the financial lubrication necessary to keep the wheels turning, and that is what we are doing tonight.

The Opposition will not oppose the Bill. Reluctantly, we will support this sensible measure, which keeps the show on the road, but we look forward to a devolved Assembly and a reconstituted Executive. I think that is something that every right hon. and hon. Member in this Chamber wants to see as soon as possible.