John Bercow
Main Page: John Bercow (Speaker - Buckingham)Food Labelling (Halal and Kosher Meat)
John Bercow Excerpts
Sir Gerald Kaufman (Manchester, Gorton) (Lab)
I oppose the Bill. I declare an interest. I am an orthodox Jew and I was brought up in a household where only kosher meat was eaten. None of these issues was raised throughout my childhood, adolescence and early adulthood.
I do not believe for a moment that the hon. Member for Shipley (Philip Davies) has the tiniest anti-Semitic feeling in him and I am sure that he is not proposing the Bill for that reason. However, large numbers of Jews would be very greatly distressed if what he proposes were to become law. I speak not only about Jews, but Muslims. I represent many thousands of Muslims in my constituency—good, decent, law-abiding people who, because of their religious allegiance, will eat only halal meat. I do not see why Jews and Muslims alone should be compelled by law to have the meat they eat labelled in a way that no other meat is labelled.
If the hon. Gentleman’s proposed Bill had a wider remit—for example, if it said that all chickens had to be labelled in a certain way if the birds had been battery hens—or if he had proposed that meat had to be labelled in a certain way if the animals had been kept in dreadful conditions before being killed, and killed in an extremely brutal way, as shown in the documentary narrated by Sir Paul McCartney, which revealed the astonishing, abominable and utterly dreadful conditions in which large numbers of animals, whether cows, pigs or whatever, are kept, I would at least regard him as consistent. But he is not being consistent. He has picked on two small minorities who share the way in which the meat they eat is killed. Indeed, when Muslims first came to Manchester and Leeds and wanted their animals killed in a halal way, they went to Jewish slaughter houses in order to do so.
During my whole upbringing, I ate only kosher meat. I am afraid that I did not keep to that in later years, but I still will not eat pigmeat of any kind because my mother and father brought me up in such a way that that meat is what we call “trayf” in Yiddish, and I will not eat trayf food. I think that the hon. Gentleman is picking out two small minority religions that have a special way in which the meat they eat is killed and asking that they, and they alone, have their meat labelled.
I say this as someone who has spoken on animal welfare in this House for many years. I was the leading person who got the hunting ban passed, because of my understanding of the procedures of this House—I say that with some vanity, but it is a fact. I have been involved in the campaign to ban the keeping of wild animals in circuses, something on which I do not recognise the hon. Gentleman as having been hyperactive.
The proposed Bill would have profound implications for religious feelings, and I would be letting my faith and my family down, alongside many good, decent, fine and religious Muslims in my constituency, if I did not state my total opposition to it. I suggest that the hon. Gentleman withdraw the motion so that the House does not even have to vote on it.
Mr Speaker
I thank the right hon. Gentleman for his observations on faith, family, eating habits and the legislative record; the House is indebted to him.
Question put (Standing Order No. 23).
Mr Speaker
I will take a very brief further point from the right hon. Member for Exeter (Mr Bradshaw), a former Secretary of State for Culture, Media and Sport, and then respond to the point of order.
Mr Ben Bradshaw (Exeter) (Lab)
Further to that point of order, Mr Speaker. Given that on 20 July last year, the Culture Secretary himself said that any conversations that the Prime Minister had had with James Murdoch were irrelevant, specifically because he, the Culture Secretary, was taking the decision in a quasi-judicial way, is it not paramount that the Prime Minister also come to the House to correct the record at the earliest opportunity?
Mr Speaker
If a matter of privilege is being raised, hon. or right hon. Members should write to me about it. I feel, on the strength of what I have heard, that I am quite able to respond. I say to the shadow Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport and to the right hon. Member for Exeter that I have received no indication from the Secretary of State that he intends to come to the House. The point that the right hon. and learned Lady and the right hon. Gentleman have made is clear, on the record and will have been widely heard.
Mr Speaker
I do not intend to allow this matter to run for any length of time, but I am prepared to hear the hon. Member for Rhondda (Chris Bryant) and then we will see how it goes.
Chris Bryant
I am very grateful. Further to that point of order, Mr Speaker, there may be an issue of privilege, and you are absolutely right that if any Opposition Member wants to allege that the Secretary of State has lied to the House, that is a matter of privilege and we should write to you, notwithstanding the fact that the Committee of Privileges is in the slightly complicated position of being reconstituted. However, surely the matter may also be one for the House in a different way, because the code of conduct for Ministers is a not only a matter for the Prime Minister but written into a resolution of the House. Surely it is appropriate that the Secretary of State should come here to explain himself in relation to the code of conduct.
Mr Speaker
I note what the hon. Gentleman has said. He will also have noted, I hope, what I said, which was that what the right hon. and learned Member for Camberwell and Peckham (Ms Harman) and the right hon. Member for Exeter said will have been heard on the Treasury Bench. I think it is a safe prediction that it will have been heard by the Secretary of State at whom it is directed, and I do not think there is anything that I now need to add or can usefully add. The observations have been made, and they are on the record. I thank right hon. and hon. Members for their comments.
Mr Speaker
I would not want the hon. Lady to feel that she has been unjustly excluded or discriminated against in any way, for that is not my practice, as she knows, so we must hear her.
Margaret Curran
Further to that point of order, Mr Speaker. There is another dimension of the evidence heard today and the revelations at the Leveson inquiry. May I ask that the Secretary of State for Scotland be called to the House because of the implications of those revelations for the people of Scotland and the allegations against Alex Salmond and his involvement in those matters? They are of great concern to the people of Scotland and I believe they bear further examination.
Mr Speaker
I would say to the hon. Lady that those on the Treasury Bench will have heard what she has to say. The person to whom she has just referred will also have heard, or will hear very soon. It is not a matter for the Chair today. I have heard the points of order, and have responded in such a way as I think is proper at this time. I think we will have to leave it there for the present.