Face Coverings (Prohibition) Bill

Rushanara Ali Excerpts

Friday 28th February 2014 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hollobone]

I am sure that the right hon. Gentleman’s parents would be extremely proud of their son being a distinguished parliamentarian, but I am pretty sure that his mother was not veiled. The purpose of my Bill is to talk about covering one’s face and not about restricting people because they do not speak English. My intentions in putting forward this Bill are 100% honourable, because I am standing up and speaking out for the many hundreds of thousands of people in this country who are concerned about the increasing number of people covering their faces in public and who, frankly, feel that that is alien to the British way of life.

[Rushanara Ali (Bethnal Green and Bow) (Lab)]

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

[Mr Hollobone]

I am happy to give way to the hon. Lady and I welcome what she has to say. I want to respond to all the interventions that I have taken, but I am happy to give way to her at this point.

[Rushanara Ali]

The hon. Gentleman talks about the British way. As someone of Muslim background, I believe passionately in the right of any minority group, including Muslim women, to choose how they dress, and the best of British is our diversity and our inclusiveness. His choice of this Bill and his comment about what the British way is does a great disservice to our country by representing it in such a narrow-minded and intolerant way.

[Mr Hollobone]

The hon. Lady will not be surprised that I disagree with those remarks. She will know, because I informed her at the time, that a couple of years ago I visited her constituency as part of a TV programme. We did our best to speak with veiled women in her high street and I have to say that it was not an easy thing to do. It further drew my attention to the difficulties that veiled women have in undertaking normal everyday human interaction with people who are not veiled, because part of the traditional British way of life is that when somebody passes somebody else in the street whom they recognise, or half-recognise, they smile, perhaps wave and say hello; it is called neighbourliness. It is difficult for somebody to do that if their face is covered and it is also difficult for somebody else to do it to them, because there is no reaction.

Frankly, I do not want to live in a country where people—whether they are men or women—are increasingly going around with their faces covered, because it will lead to a deterioration in the quality of life. It also means that those ethnic minority women, largely from Muslim backgrounds, who do not speak English will find it much more difficult to learn to speak English, and they will remain at a disadvantage when it comes to accessing public services and interacting with the normal way of life if they cannot speak English properly.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Hollobone]

We are parliamentarians standing up for and speaking on behalf our constituents, who are concerned about these things. I do not think it helps the integration of communities in a multicultural British society when an increasingly large number of people, mainly women, go around covering their faces. That cannot promote community cohesion on any level. Do we really want to live in a Britain where a growing number of people are going around with their identities obscured? I do not, and I know that the majority of my constituents do not.

[Rushanara Ali]

rose—

[Mr Hollobone]

I fear I have provoked the hon. Member for Bethnal Green and Bow (Rushanara Ali) into intervening as well.

[Rushanara Ali]

Has the hon. Gentleman considered how many people could become criminalised and end up in the criminal justice system if they choose to follow their belief—not to follow his interpretation of Islam but their own? There are many interpretations. Some choose the interpretation that they do not have to do this, and others choose to do it. Is it right, and is it good for cohesion, if women find themselves criminalised and in prison thanks to his Bill? Perhaps he should also consider the impact on the prison population.

[Mr Hollobone]

One thing we can all agree on is that women who wear full-face veils are entirely lawful people who would want to stick to the law. I have no indication that were my Bill to become an Act those women would seek to break the law. I do not believe that they would be of criminal intent at all. In other countries where such legislation has been introduced, there have been only a very small number of infringements. In France, for example, Islamic clerics have urged Muslim women to comply with the law of the land, and there have been very few instances of women who have gone out of their way to break the law.

--- Later in debate ---

[Sir Gerald Kaufman]

I very much agree with my hon. Friend.

Over the years we have had too many restrictions on our civil liberties for all kinds of reasons. I might as well tell the House that when I was a junior Minister in the Labour Government I nearly resigned when, after the Birmingham bombings, Roy Jenkins introduced what I regarded to be oppressive legislation relating to the containment of terrorism. He did that for constituency reasons—he was a Birmingham MP. We are all subject to pressures, but the main reason I am proud to be British is that this is a country of tolerance. Indeed, tolerance is the wrong word. I do not believe that we have the right to “tolerate” women who wear the veil or to make a judgment on them, because it is their choice. I have all kinds of choices about the way I live my life, and people have the right to have opinions about them.

[Rushanara Ali]

Does my right hon. Friend share my concerns about the dangers of such legislation leading to more Islamophobic and racist attacks against women, which have been growing for a long time against the British Muslim community? Does he agree that if the Bill is supported, although I completely oppose it—