Postal Services in Scotland after 2014

Debate between Pete Wishart and Iain McKenzie

Wednesday 10th July 2013 Westminster Hall

[Mr Iain McKenzie (Inverclyde) (Lab)]

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Hood. I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Glasgow South West (Mr Davidson) on securing this important debate.

The twin worries for Royal Mail in Scotland are privatisation and separation; both are equally worrying for a high-quality service that we have come to love and expect. As I am sure we are all aware, a number of questions have been raised on a variety of subjects regarding Scottish independence from the United Kingdom, ranging from EU membership, NATO, currency, passports and many other universal British institutions. The list is extensive. We ask such questions to scrutinise the plans of those who would break up the UK and challenge their scaremongering. Today, we add Royal Mail to the list of questions about what will happen. Royal Mail is an institution residing firmly in that list. We should be told how well that important service would function if it were retained in an independent Scotland.

Currently, Royal Mail has 11,500 branches across the UK and employs thousands of people throughout Scotland. It is a crucial service, ensuring that UK businesses and the economy run smoothly. For example, Royal Mail estimates that it can deliver an average of 84 million items of mail every working day. There is no disguising the scale, the efficiency and, ultimately, the importance of that institution across the United Kingdom. Royal Mail serves not only big cities but the far-flung areas of our country. The price of a stamp guarantees delivery, regardless of difficulties encountered from dispatch to destination.

To give a bit of history, it all started way back in 1635 when Charles I made the postal service available to the public, with the cost of postage being paid by the recipient; I hope that that does not give the Government any idea. However, it took a further century before the uniformed postie was seen on the streets, delivering door to door—something that we have become accustomed to and expect from our postal service.

Upon the Union of the Crowns, one of the King’s first acts in London, where he had decided to move to and set up home, was to establish the royal postal service between London and Edinburgh. At last, Scotland was part of a regulated postal service and, as time passed, Scotland grew in confidence, prosperity and assurance of a reliable communications service throughout the UK. Eventually, all across Scotland, we have come to use and rely on Royal Mail.

The service has grown and changed over the centuries. Royal Mail is now an integral part of business and private life; we simply could not imagine life without it. I am of an age to remember the GPO—the General Post Office—an organisation inclusive of Royal Mail and British Telecom. British Telecom was part of the ’80s privatisation drive, which is being pioneered again, but even the late Mrs Thatcher considered Royal Mail worth keeping.

The universal nature of delivery means that small businesses can rely on Royal Mail and have confidence in the quality of service and delivery, regardless of where they reside on the UK map. We must debate what the Royal Mail would look like if Scotland separated from the rest of the United Kingdom. The questions that need to be encompassed include whether there will be continuity of employment in the mail service and whether the number of depots and jobs all remain in Scotland post-independence—or might we see job losses?

[Pete Wishart]

Was the hon. Gentleman not paying attention to the news this morning? The Government are going to privatise Royal Mail. What would he prefer—the Tories and the Liberals, with their privatised Royal Mail, or us, the people of Scotland, running the postal service to our requirements?

[Mr McKenzie]

Labour is the only party to defend the universal service obligation. The debate is about what a postal service in Scotland would look like post-2014. The two challenges to Royal Mail are not only privatisation, as I have rightly pointed out, but separation.

In my constituency, the sorting office at Knowe road employs about 150 people working full time, with some part time. Working in teams, they deliver throughout my constituency, which is diverse, with some rural and mostly urban communities. Daily, the Inverclyde office receives mail by road from Glasgow, where the large city sorting depot employs many hundreds of people more, directing the mail across the country, and that is replicated in all Scottish cities.

Individually, our engagement each day remains with the postie. Well known to the community, posties deliver to our doors in all weathers, six days a week, and that brings me to the quality of service and the delivery six days a week. Under privatisation and, as well, an independent Scotland, would we be guaranteed a six-day service? Could it be maintained? After all, we have come to expect our Saturday mail delivery; if ended, what would be the impact on business?

The price of a stamp has already been discussed by my hon. Friend the Member for Glasgow South West. What price for first and second-class stamps? Would there be a first and second-class service in a separate Scotland? Would sending a letter or document to the rest of the UK be classed as overseas mail? If so, how much would that cost? Those are all questions that we need answered. Furthermore, how would that affect Scotland’s businesses? Has all that been taken into account?

What of our postcodes in an independent Scotland? Postcodes are used to identify our homes throughout the UK quickly. Would they be retained in their present form or, as we have already heard about in Ireland upon separation in 1917, would the postcodes be changed? What would our postcodes look like?

There is a risk that a new mail service would not be anywhere near the size, scale and complexity of Royal Mail at present. Royal Mail is clearly vital for business, the economy and our everyday life. Much as we need electronic mail to speed and support business, we still require the physical mail. The rise of the e-mail and its challenge to the physical letter is now being outweighed by the rise of online shopping and the resultant increase in parcel delivery. Will Scottish online shoppers be penalised? Independence will mean being outside the UK, so will the cost to deliver increase?

Surely, before the Scottish people vote on the most important constitutional decision in their history, such questions need to be answered, and as soon as possible. Who knows, but, bizarrely, the ever-increasing popularity of the postal vote could contribute to keeping the UK together and Royal Mail in Scotland?

This morning, we have highlighted yet another concern for Scottish people—the impending referendum in 2014 and the future of Royal Mail beyond 2014. From applying a stamp to a letter to recognising the postie coming down our street in distinctive uniforms and vans, we have become accustomed to and reliant on the Royal Mail service as part and parcel of being in the UK. After all, one of the first acts of the Scottish King on coming to London to unite the Crowns was that he sent the royal mail north. Like many Scots, he recognised a good thing when he saw one; we still recognise Royal Mail as a good thing, and we want to keep it.

Disruption to Royal Mail services across the UK will impact not only on the Scots, but on the rest of the UK. We must hear how the SNP intends to sign, seal and deliver a mail service in an independent Scotland.

Scottish Referendum (Trident)

Debate between Pete Wishart and Iain McKenzie

Thursday 7th March 2013 Westminster Hall

[Pete Wishart]

I have given way to the hon. Gentleman twice already.

A yes vote would get rid of a weapon of mass destruction, and we are not allowed to keep it anyway. If we were to become a new nation after independence, as the no campaigners claim we would, we would not be able to keep nuclear weapons under the non-proliferation treaty. New nations are not allowed to host nuclear weapons, so it would be illegal under international law for us to have them. We would have to get rid of them and it would be up to the UK how to deal with that.

Scotland wants rid of nuclear weapons. As my hon. Friend the Member for Angus put it, even Scotland’s Westminster MPs want rid of Trident. Not long ago, in 2007, 33 voted against Trident and 22 voted for it. They are in good company, because the majority of people in Scotland want rid of it, as do the Churches and the trade unions. Every part of civic society supports the notion that we must get rid of that weapon of mass destruction. That is why I say that Trident will be an iconic issue in the referendum—because so many people in Scotland oppose it.

[Mr McKenzie]

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

[Pete Wishart]

I cannot give way, because more hon. Members want to speak.

Trident is a system for the Brezhnevs of the world, not the bin Ladens. It is for another age, and people understand that. Yet the Government will spend up to £100 billion on renewing it. Can we believe that? In a triple-dip recession—a time of austerity, the bedroom tax and hard living for most of our constituents—they are prepared to spend £100 billion on the renewal of Trident. That is an appalling decision for any Government. Scotland’s share of the upkeep alone is £163 million, and there is so much more that we could do with that, as my hon. Friend the Member for Angus said. Faslane will have a fantastic future as a conventional naval base. As an independent country we will be able to respond to our own defence needs.

Public Sector Pensions

Debate between Pete Wishart and Iain McKenzie

Thursday 8th December 2011 Commons Chamber

[Mr Iain McKenzie (Inverclyde) (Lab)]

I think that we all agree that there is an economic crisis in the UK, but it was caused neither by excessive public spending nor by the “gold-plated” pensions and pay of public sector workers. It was caused by a recession triggered by the banking collapse of 2007. Employees in the public sector have been subject to pay freezes and continuous efficiency savings, and time and again they have risen to the challenge and accepted that they need to play their part in these difficult times. They now find the future quality of their retirement is at stake and their much-prized pensions, which are possibly one of the main attractions of a public sector career, will be greatly reduced.

The Government tell us that the average public sector worker will be better off following the change to their pension, but what they quote as average earnings is not what Opposition Members regard as average earnings. Many public sector workers in my constituency of Inverclyde earn nowhere near the average the Government quote and will not be better off with this change in their pension. The Government tell us that we must follow the lead taken on pensions by the private sector, but I believe that that would be a race to the bottom on pension provision.

The private sector visited its pensions long before the world-wide finical crisis hit. It took contribution holidays and savagely stripped employees of decent pensions while excluding new employees from joining final salary schemes. Indeed, I recall my predecessor, the late David Cairns, some time ago naming and shaming a major private sector employer in my constituency over its unacceptable cuts to its pension scheme.

[Pete Wishart]

We have just discovered that Labour Members are down to a one-line Whip, which means they will not vote on the motion. Surely they could put aside what they describe as their historic hostility to the SNP and do the right thing by public sector workers by supporting the motion. Why are they not backing it?

[Mr McKenzie]

I thank the hon. Gentleman and will now carry on.

We want to see not an equality of misery in pensions, but fairness. Public sector pensions are not gold-plated, but I accept that they require collaborative review. Instead, public sector workers are being told that they must work longer, pay more and expect less. Trade union leaders who called the strike action on 30 November were branded as militants by Government Ministers, and the Prime Minister described the day of action as a “damp squib”—hardly diplomacy, if they are indeed engaged in negotiations.

We again see the Government promote policies that are hurting but not working, and their plan to guide us out of these difficult times is clearly failing. For Scotland, this is a double whammy, with the SNP Government in Scotland in many ways excelling this Government in the failure league. We need to accept, as the Hutton report did, that public sector pensions are not gold-plated and that many public sector workers, especially women, will retire on an annual pension of around £5,600 a year.