P&O Ferries

Debate between Nigel Evans and Robert Courts

Thursday 17th March 2022 Commons Chamber

[Robert Courts]

I thank the hon. Member for her comments. She is quite right: lives have been upended and jobs scrapped. My sympathy and thoughts are wholly with the people who had this terrible news this morning. She is absolutely right about the video, which I have seen. I agree. This is devastating news, and to be shown a video on a television screen rather than told the news face to face is not how we expect loyal, hard-working workers to be treated. She mentioned crews being marched off; I have heard the same reports. I expect people to be treated with dignity and respect at all times, throughout their employment.

Employment laws apply, of course. It is difficult for me at the moment to comment in any detail on where that might be. I urge anyone affected to consider legal advice. Clearly that is something that they should do, but it is difficult for me to comment on that, particularly as this is a fast-moving situation.

The hon. Member asked me to review contracts that may exist. I have asked my officials to do that. I apologise, but I cannot give her any details at the moment, although I will be able to provide information to the House in due course if required. Conversations about freeports would have to take place across Government, involving, in particular, the Treasury and the Department for Levelling Up, Housing and Communities. The hon. Lady asked me to convene urgent talks with the unions; I will speak to them this afternoon. It is possible that that will be an initial conversation and then there will be others, but I need no persuading that that will happen. She hon. Lady mentioned illegality. I ought not to go into that, but obviously the Government have a number of concerns, and I urge people to take the advice that they will need.

The hon. Lady asked me to give details of the operations. As I have said, this is a fast-moving situation, but although I am assured that there is not likely to be an operations impact, I will be monitoring that closely. I will give the hon. Lady more details when I have them, and if there are any steps to be taken, I will consider what they should be.

The hon. Lady spoke of setting this in context. I of course reject any suggestion that we have sided with bad bosses. I have made absolutely clear, today and on other occasions, that I expect people to be treated with respect at all times, and that is not the way in which these people have been treated. No one should be treated in the way in which they have been treated today.

Finally, the hon. Lady asked about seafarers. We will continue to do everything we can to support British seafarers, and I hope to be able to give the House more details about that in due course.

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

I call the Chair of the Transport Committee.

--- Later in debate ---

[Robert Courts]

I have been absolutely clear about my view of the way that workers have been treated today. I cannot comment on specific circumstances until I have had them confirmed—I have seen things reported on social media, as has the hon. Gentleman—but I have been clear that the way workers have been treated is absolutely unacceptable.

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

I thank the Minister for coming to the House at incredibly short notice and responding to questions from MPs.

Flooding: Ribble Valley

Debate between Nigel Evans and Robert Courts

Wednesday 18th January 2017 Commons Chamber

[Mr Evans]

I can only agree with my right hon. Friend. Indeed, one of Redrow’s reports talks about the company being a shining-light member of the considerate construction scheme. Steve Morgan, the chairman, talks about Redrow being in great shape and says that he is looking forward to

“another year of significant progress”.

I have a good idea: some of that significant progress can go into the attenuation ponds and the other things that need to be happening.

Another plot of land, which one could see from the road, famously had a sign saying that it was a

“development site with permission for 39 dwellings”,

but that sign could be just seen above the water. The sign was famous and did the rounds on social media. The sign was there before a single house was built. It is not a good idea, and we really should not put any houses on an area susceptible to that sort of flooding, but what sort of attenuation would that site need to make sure that that water did not flood the houses and was not then pushed to flood other houses?

I say to Redrow, in respect of the particular site I mention, that notice has been served by Ribble Valley Borough Council that Redrow is in breach of the conditions that were agreed to. So when are the people at Redrow going to do it—when will they provide the attenuation that they said they would? Everybody is waiting. They have a social and moral responsibility to do it. I know, as my right hon. Friend will know, that these companies have some great experts working for them and they know some tricks. They know that there are certain things they can do to delay taking the action they need to take. They have very expensive lawyers, who are doubtless listening to every word I am saying, but I say: get on with it! We do not want to see any delay or deferment. They know what they need to do and they need to do it now. That applies not just to Redrow, but to every other developer who is building houses and has conditions put upon them. They should not see that as burdensome; they should see it as playing their part in a community, so that they are not making other people’s lives a misery one or two miles down the road. They have a responsibility, and they should do it.

[Robert Courts (Witney) (Con)]

My hon. Friend is making a powerful and moving speech, touching on a number of good points. In 2007, Witney had some serious flooding, which affected a great deal of the town. I spoke briefly in the House yesterday about some of the flood attenuation schemes in Milton-under-Wychwood, which I know the Minister came to visit. My hon. Friend refers to making people’s lives a misery, and does he agree that that is exactly what we are talking about here? This is not just a matter of damage to property, which in due course, when the insurance companies pay up, can be rectified. When I speak to my constituents who have been affected by flooding, I see that the fear and worry of that happening again lives on 10 years and more after the event. “Misery” is just the right word for it.

[Mr Evans]

I thank my hon. Friend for his contribution. I think these situations are akin to mental torture; once someone has gone through this sort of flooding misery, all of a sudden they have one eye on the computer to see whether there is a flood warning coming up—they have had a few of those since 26 December 2015; indeed, they have had water coming through King Street. We must recognise the impact on people’s lives once their properties have been soiled in that way; if it has happened once, it can happen again, unless something is done about it. That is basically where we are now. Once these things have happened—the flooding happened on a wide scale, as you know, Mr Deputy Speaker—we must see what action needs to be taken.

The Environment Agency is talking about spending £2.3 billion over the next six years on a lot of the major works that need to be done, but who knows whether that money will be sufficient? We are talking about spending £3.5 billion on this place, so I suppose that puts it into a bit of context. We need to ensure that the right sort of money is put in place to help to alleviate the problem.

Companies such as Network Rail are doing a great deal of work in Whalley. It is working on the aqueduct because of the water that flowed from it. It is spending a lot of money in an area that was badly flooded—I saw it for myself the other day—so I pay tribute to it for that work. Companies such as AXA Insurance are spending a lot of money on resilience measures, because they have worked out that it is in their interests. It means that when people sadly do get flooded, the costs will be much smaller.

People can take a lot of sensible measures if they have the wherewithal to do so. I remember going into one house in Ribchester that had been flooded a bit before. I walked on the lady’s sodden carpet, and she said, “Last time this happened, Nigel, I asked the insurance company whether we could have flagging instead of carpet, but they said, ‘Oh no, like for like, madam’.” The insurers would not move, but they moved this time. They have now got the message. Hopefully it will never flood again, but if it does, the flagging means that at least something can be done about it more easily.

I know that other Members want to contribute, so I shall go quickly through the things that ought to be done for future resilience. The Environment Agency is looking at proposals for Whalley, and particularly at what action can be taken regarding the Calder. I am told that the study will take about six months, and that the agency will then put in a bid to the Government, perhaps towards autumn 2017. I hope it can bring forward that report as quickly as possible, because of the mental torture that my hon. Friend the Member for Witney (Robert Courts) mentioned. As long as people cannot see anything substantial being done, they think it can happen again, and of course it can, so I hope that the Environment Agency will look into that and other matters to see what can be done. It will be working closely with the local flood action group—Andrew Ronnan and his friends—along with the lead flood authority and local authorities.

As well as the problems associated with the River Calder, there are problems with surface water after heavy rain. A week before 26 December 2015, Whalley had been damaged because of blocked culverts, and there has been water running through since. It should not be beyond the wit of the local authority to look at those culverts and make absolutely certain that they are not blocked. There are now sensors that can enable it to do that. Lancashire County Council should pull its finger out, have a look at the areas that are prone to flooding and get it sorted.

The drains are also a problem. Kellie from the hairdressers was out cleaning the drains herself, post-26 December. More floods were expected, and she saw that some of the drains were blocked. There are simple things that can be done, and I hope that they will be done.

As for planning, local authorities ought to be able to say quite simply that there should be no housing on a flood plain. That should be sufficient. When companies go to appeal, as they do, and use their expensive lawyers to dance rings around local authorities that are rather strapped for cash, it should be sufficient for the local authorities to say, “No, it is a flood plain”. Even with attenuation, if houses are built on a flood plain, huge amounts of water may still be retained by the fields, as in the example I referred to. Builders must take responsibility for complying with conditions that are imposed on them.

I pay tribute to the Woodland Trust, which is planting trees all over the place. We do not pay enough regard to the usefulness of trees, particularly in preventing soil erosion, which can easily happen. The trust has planted thousands of trees in our area, and we must do more of that.

Insurance resilience measures must come in as well. The early payment of insurance money is important to people so that they can get on with the job. We must also look at this matter of having to get three quotes. Some insurance companies insist on it, but they are lucky to get one quote. Our area was blighted by flooding on Boxing day; it is not hard to imagine how difficult it was to get even one quote. Some companies are just not interested in providing a quote, so different measures must be put in place to cover reasonable costs, so that people can just get on with the job.

One person came to see me last week, one year on from the flooding. He had put in a £110,000 claim—it was part business, part hereditament. He had used a broker, which had insured with one company. The company then part-insured with another company, which went bust. The man received £35,000 of his claim. He was going to get another £20,000 before the other company went bust. He does not know when he will get paid, even under the financial compensation rules, which, when they kick in, pay out 90%. I have to say: 90% of what? Things must be made easier. When a person goes to an insurance company, the responsibility must lie there. They should not have to chase around the houses, worried witless that they will not get the proper compensation that they need. They will already lose some of it, simply because of this offsetting of the bet, as I call it—or the offsetting of the risk. The person paying the premium, which in this case is just under £5,000 a year, should not have to suffer.

The emergency services learned a lot that day, as they had to institute a one-way system. Such best practice needs to be spread around the country, because what has happened in the Ribble valley will, sadly, happen in other areas in the future. Spreading best practice can be done. Whalley and Billington Flood Action Group has done its own resilience programme, telling people of the simple things that they can do, including providing phone numbers that they can use, when flooding happens. Those sorts of things are absolutely superb, and I do hope that local authorities can learn from one another about the actions that they need to take, including providing advice to people now. We are in the winter now, and, sadly, some villages may well get flooded between now and summer.