Security of Government Devices

Matt Western Excerpts

Thursday 16th March 2023 Commons Chamber

[Oliver Dowden]

I thank my right hon. Friend for his questions. I will take the second point first. I am happy to meet him and provide further information about the sites where Hikvision is used. I should say that this point applies to surveillance technology from Chinese companies; it is not just about Hikvision.

The broader point my right hon. Friend makes is a legitimate one, and it is a balance that the Government have to try to get right. It is the case that many social media apps use huge amounts of data harvesting, and it is also the case that sophisticated foreign hostile state actors are perfectly capable of using many mechanisms to obtain bulk data aside from direct ownership. On balance, we believe that this is the correct approach.

Ministers of course need to exercise heightened caution in respect of the rules. It may be that communications devices are used for routine administration and so on, but substantive Government business should be conducted on Government devices. In addition, bespoke security advice is provided to Ministers, and they are expected to adhere to it.

[Matt Western (Warwick and Leamington) (Lab)]

I am slightly surprised at the delay in introducing this, because I was under the impression that we had been briefed nine to 12 months ago by the security services that there was such a risk from TikTok and so on that we were strongly advised to remove it if we had it on our phones. Given the Oakeshott papers and the amount of ministerial correspondence that seems to be going on, we do not know, when we get messages from a Minister, whether that is on a private phone or a Government phone. Will the Minister explain how we should know that in the future, and what the risk is of our data actually being drawn down by a ministerial phone?

[Oliver Dowden]

On the first point, the Government already had a list of allowed apps, and TikTok was not on it. That was for most Departments, but some Departments do not adhere to it, so this is about ensuring that we close the remaining gaps.

On Government data used on private phones, we will shortly be issuing refreshed guidance on non-corporate communications. Essentially, substantive Government business should be conducted only on Government phones. If Members of this House are contacted about substantive Government business, that should be from a Government phone.