Wales Bill Debate

Full Debate: Read Full Debate
Department: Wales Office

Wales Bill

Lord Rowlands Excerpts
Committee: 3rd sitting (Hansard - continued): House of Lords
Tuesday 15th November 2016

(8 years ago)

Lords Chamber
Read Full debate Wales Act 2017 View all Wales Act 2017 Debates Read Hansard Text Read Debate Ministerial Extracts Amendment Paper: HL Bill 63-III Third marshalled list for Committee (PDF, 228KB) - (11 Nov 2016)
Lord Hain Portrait Lord Hain
- Hansard - - - Excerpts

The noble Lord may have a point in the sense that more VAT proportionately is paid by people on low incomes, and there are relatively low incomes in Wales, but I would want to see the figures. I would want to have the drains up on this proposal before I went anywhere near it, because I would not want Wales to be short-changed by such a reform. On that basis, I oppose the amendment.

Lord Rowlands Portrait Lord Rowlands (Lab)
- Hansard - -

I support my noble friend because I worry about taxation. It can be very regressive in an individual context. There is a history of it, and it could be not only in income tax but in VAT. We should be very careful before we proceed down that road.

Baroness Morgan of Ely Portrait Baroness Morgan of Ely
- Hansard - - - Excerpts

I endorse the views of my two colleagues on the Labour Benches. I think it would increase budget volatility for the Welsh Government without enhancing their powers in any meaningful way. I underline one other point, and that is that we would, potentially, have different rates in England and Wales. Imagine the chaos that that could cause communities and businesses on both sides of the border. The economies of England and Wales are closely integrated and I am mindful that having varying rates applied on opposing sides of the border could pose significant issues in the long run, so I am really sorry—it always pains me not to agree with my noble friend Lord Wigley—but I cannot support this amendment.