Civil Aviation (Consumer Protection and Regulatory Reform) Bill [HL] Debate

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Department: Department for Transport

Civil Aviation (Consumer Protection and Regulatory Reform) Bill [HL]

Lord Kirkhope of Harrogate Excerpts
Lord Kirkhope of Harrogate Portrait Lord Kirkhope of Harrogate (Con)
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My Lords, I declare several interests in aviation, the first of which is as quite a long-term private pilot—but not, I am afraid, one now flying in the 21st-century glass cockpits referred to by the noble Baroness, Lady Antrobus; I have to rely on 20th-century cockpits for my flying. I am the honorary vice-president of the British Airline Pilots Association, and I involve myself with the All-Party Parliamentary Group for Aviation. I am also a former director of Newcastle International Airport. My interest in aviation goes back a long way and is still very current.

In general, I welcome the Bill. It presents a considerable opportunity to modernise our aviation legislative frame- work and could help to position the United Kingdom as one of the world’s leading aviation markets, particularly in the light of the recently published aviation competitiveness index, which ranks the UK, disappointingly, only sixth out of the eight aviation markets it assessed.

I say so with one substantial qualification, which I imagine the Minister anticipates. Almost in its entirety, this Bill is an enabling measure; it creates no new passenger rights and reforms no single rule; it confers powers on the Secretary of State and the authorities to do those things later by regulation. In relation to other legislation, I have raised my concerns that so much is left for later decisions, often implemented without the full scrutiny that they might deserve at the time. It therefore remains to be seen how Ministers will utilise the new powers contained in this Bill to enable meaningful reform and improve aviation regulation for the benefit of consumers and airlines alike, because that is surely what we all desire.

To take the consumer provisions first, the inherited framework referred to before, Regulation UK 261, was drafted for a different era, and it now imposes liabilities on carriers well beyond anything its authors intended, covering passenger rights when flights are delayed and cancelled and when there is a denial of boarding. This regulation followed our leaving the EU so, although in general it follows the same matters as the similar EU regulation, it is enforced by our authorities, so we have the possibility of both EU and UK regimes applying to flights between the UK and Europe. In the Government’s discussions with their European counterparts, we could certainly benefit by trying to ensure some alignment at least in this international marketplace. The European Union, which wrote the original form of the regulation, has itself concluded that the thresholds no longer work, and its Council agreed last summer to lengthen the qualifying delay to four hours on short-haul flights and six hours on long-haul flights. The power in Clause 1 is an opportunity to bring clarity, not least to the vexed question of what amounts to so-called extraordinary circumstance, which sustains a small industry of litigation and serves passengers and airlines alike very poorly.

On the enforcement powers in Clause 2, I urge greater caution, for, by the authority’s own survey, passenger satisfaction stands at its highest recorded level. Powers of direct penalty should be reserved for genuine and systemic harm and exercised with proper process, and I shall be grateful to know what safeguards the Government intend to avoid misunderstandings and unnecessary rigidity.

I come now to the part of the Bill closest to my own concerns as a pilot, on airspace. Ours is the most congested in the world. NATS handles a quarter of Europe’s traffic and barely a 10th of its airspace, yet the basic design has scarcely altered since the 1950s, when the country saw some 200,000 flights a year, against more than 2.5 million now. In 2019, I was asked by the All-Party Parliamentary Group on Aviation to undertake an inquiry into lower airspace, particularly because of the pressures on general aviation, and we came up with a number of proposals for change. We concluded, inter alia, that the methodology in which airspace design changes occur was antiquated and in need of radical reform, and called for the scrapping of legislation governing lower airspace design. I wonder if this legislation is at last going to encompass our findings. Could the Minister perhaps confirm it?

Modernisation is now very overdue, and the powers in Clause 4 to see airspace change actually implemented are sensible and necessary, but the new design service, the so-called single guiding mind, was promised to be operational by the end of last year—and I must ask, where is it? An assurance on a revised timetable would be helpful. I ask too that the smaller users of our skies, the gliders and the light aircraft, previously referred to by several speakers, including my noble friend Lord Davies, are not again quietly squeezed out, for they have as good a claim to the air as any airliner.

If we are to grow the aviation industry, with developments such as the third runway at Heathrow and capacity growth at many regional airports, we shall need to deal with the shortage of pilots to fly our aircraft. I am not persuaded that that supply can safely be left to the market alone, and I would ask whether the Government or the CAA might take an informed interest in the health of that workforce and encourage more to train for this role. The smaller private training schools need encouragement, not impediment. Of course, at the heart of this legislation will be full and ongoing consultation with professional pilots and their representative organisations to ensure that we adequately respond to the needs of the industry with a more flexible and dynamic system of training and recruitment.

Finally, I want to make a couple of points relating to NATS. First, may I press the Minister to clarify the proposals on charging for air traffic and navigation services? Those responsible to pay for those services, according to the Bill, is to change from

“owners and operators of aircraft”

to, simply, “persons”. General aviation is not, wisely, affected too much by the present arrangements, which apply largely to the airlines, and I would argue that the burden of such charges should remain as at present. Is this change more, perhaps, because of technological developments such as drone delivery systems? The Minister is nodding his head. Perhaps he could confirm that in his wind-up.

We need to protect general aviation for the future, but my second question relates to liability. When the air traffic control system failed in the summer of 2023, some 2,000 flights were cancelled and over 700,000 passengers disrupted, at a cost that the regulator has put at up to £100 million. The airlines met that bill in its totality. NATS, which we know is a profitable company that was at the very heart of the failures, paid absolutely nothing. The most that could be done was to embark on the clear complications of fining it, but with much lesser redress available. When a carrier causes the delay, it has to pay— without argument, it has to pay. When the monopoly air navigation provider causes it—guess what—the carrier pays again. That surely cannot be right, and I hope that the Minister will say whether this Bill, with all its new powers, might finally correct that imbalance.

I welcome this Bill, and I shall engage constructively as it proceeds, but I return to where I began. This Bill could do a great deal of good. It could also, I am afraid, give great disappointment. I think we all want the former outcome, not the latter, so the Government must be held closely to account.

Civil Aviation (Consumer Protection and Regulatory Reform) Bill [HL] Debate

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Civil Aviation (Consumer Protection and Regulatory Reform) Bill [HL]

Lord Kirkhope of Harrogate Excerpts
Lord Kirkhope of Harrogate Portrait Lord Kirkhope of Harrogate (Con)
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My Lords, this is Committee and I do not wish to talk about amendments that will come later, but I want to support my noble friend Lord Davies as another pilot and the honorary vice-president of BALPA.

I raised general aviation with him at Second Reading and I am waiting for answers from the Minister. There will be a specific amendment a little later in today’s proceedings, and I hope my colleagues who have spoken so far on general aviation will be here later to join me when we get to it. In the meantime, I fully support Amendment 113 and look forward to the Minister’s response to my noble friend.

Lord Grayling Portrait Lord Grayling (Con)
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My Lords, I support the amendments from my noble friends Lord Moylan and Lord Davies of Gower. This is not a failing market. This is a highly competitive environment, where both domestic and international competition are working aggressively to make it a challenge to run an airline or a freight airline in today’s world.

The need for extensive government regulation, therefore, is limited and questionable. We are not trying to solve a massive problem. There are, of course, specific issues. We will hear more, for example, about disability rights, where, yes, of course we should make sure that airport operators in particular deliver the right environment for disabled people. But first and foremost, we must ensure that the Government do not interfere in this marketplace in a way that damages the competitiveness of one of the UK’s most important economic sectors. That is why my noble friend Lord Moylan is absolutely right. As we go through this debate—not simply on these amendments but on the Bill as a whole—the Minister needs constantly to have in mind the need not to cramp the style of our sector by overregulation, and, where he is regulating, to explain why, otherwise he will not have the support of this Committee.

Finally, on general aviation, the comments made so far are absolutely right. There is a genuine issue around the future of general aviation—the loss of smaller airports, for example, to planning pressures and planning opportunities, and those who own them trying to make money out of them. General aviation needs to be looked after in this country because at a time when, as we hear, there is a growing shortage of young up- and-coming pilots, general aviation is an essential way of developing the skills that we need for the future. It is not simply a way for a few rich people to have a good time.

Civil Aviation (Consumer Protection and Regulatory Reform) Bill [HL] Debate

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Civil Aviation (Consumer Protection and Regulatory Reform) Bill [HL]

Lord Kirkhope of Harrogate Excerpts
Lord Holmes of Richmond Portrait Lord Holmes of Richmond (Con)
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My Lords, I will speak to my Amendment 63. I thank the noble Earl for the excellent way in which he introduced the group and covered the amendments with such eloquence. This is a very straightforward amendment whose purpose is clear: to have an immutable cryptographic record of such important decisions. I agree entirely with the noble Earl. The blockchain reference is merely illustrative but it also shows the unfortunate speed that I was flying at when I was drafting. I would like to have set out criteria that any technology would need to meet to achieve the objectives in the amendment. That was the approach that we took in the Electronic Trade Documents Act, for example, when we specified no particular technology but set out a series of criteria that any technology would have to meet to be able to perform the task. If we can import that into our considerations of this amendment, that would get us pretty much to where I am at.

The point is that blockchain would more than suffice for the task. There is obviously a difference between blockchain and distributed ledger technologies, which we do not need to go into at this stage, but there are technologies that have not even come to fruition, never mind to a level of usability at this stage, which almost certainly will have a part to play in such illustrations as this. It is critical, though I failed in this amendment, to have technology neutrality, because through that technology neutrality you give yourself the best opportunity of having technology future-proofing. If the Minister could respond with those thoughts in mind, which are in the text but I wrote them in white ink on a white page, I would be obliged.

Lord Kirkhope of Harrogate Portrait Lord Kirkhope of Harrogate (Con)
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In proposing Amendment 65, I must declare again my interests as set out at Second Reading. I have held a private pilot’s licence for about 40 years now. I am an officer of the All-Party Parliamentary Group on General Aviation, and I am the author of its inquiry into our lower airspace that was conducted a year or two ago. I am honorary vice-president of the British Airline Pilots Association and a former airport director. In a way, I am looking at this subject from rather more than one perspective.

At Second Reading, I pressed the Minister on Clause 6, and, in particular, on the change it makes to who must pay for air traffic and air navigation services from

“operators or owners of aircraft”

to simply “persons”. I asked what lay behind this decision and whether it was prompted by newer developments such as drone delivery, and at that point I referred to the Minister nodding his head. I am afraid that perhaps I was taking too much on in assuming that the nod related to my remarks—I make no aspersions otherwise. I said then that the burden on general aviation ought to remain broadly where it sits today.

This amendment would require the Secretary of State and the authority in exercising their functions over these charges to have regard to two matters: the growth and sustainability of general aviation, and the desirability of ensuring that those carrying out general aviation activities do not pay charges disproportionate to the use they make of the services. Many of my colleagues here who have spoken earlier in these debates have indicated their interest in general aviation, so there are quite a lot of us around, but it is important that I explain to the Committee that general aviation means civil aviation other than commercial air transport. It includes gliders, light aeroplanes, microlights, and the private and training flights of which I spoke earlier. It is not airlines and it is not, as I shall come to say, drones. On the Government’s figures in their general aviation strategy, the sector contributes, they accept, something in the order of £3 billion in gross value added and supports some 38,000 jobs. It is around 1/14th of the size of the commercial airline industry.

The figure I ask the Committee to hold in mind is that a great majority of those who sit at the front of the airliners that this Bill is chiefly concerned with—by some estimates three-quarters or more—began in general aviation, very often paying for their own training at the small flying schools the regulator knows as declared and approved training organisations. Those same schools and that same flying give us our future air traffic controllers and aircraft engineers, as well as those who pilot light aircraft. With Boeing and Airbus alike forecasting a need for several hundred thousand new pilots around the world in the years ahead, this is exactly the wrong moment to make it more expensive to learn to fly. From my involvement with the British Airline Pilots Association, I can tell the Committee that the profession, as was referred to earlier by the noble Lord, Lord Tunnicliffe, watches the health of general aviation closely, for it is from there that the profession is renewed.

I will mention drones, for I suspect they lie close to the heart of the change. The Government have been candid that the Bill is needed in part because of new users of the air—the drones and the air taxis that will follow. I do not quarrel with that. Those users will make real demands on a future digital airspace and it is fair that they should pay their share, but the drone is not general aviation. They are governed by a separate code altogether in the air navigation orders and the unmanned aircraft regulations, in their own open, specific and certified category. My concern is that, when one widens the net from the owner and operator of an aircraft to any person, one catches the drone operator one is aiming at but one may also catch the local gliding club.

The danger is of a single standard designed for the commercial airliner being pressed on everyone, bringing cost and complication to those who fly small and simple aircraft—not always terribly simple, I might add. A glider under tow or a training aeroplane in the circuit draws on a fraction of the air traffic services that an airliner consumes or, for that matter, a fleet of delivery drones one day will. The charge each meets should reflect that and no more. There is a related point that it can hardly be right to levy a charge on a person who does not use and cannot use the very service being charged for. That is the principle behind this amendment: that those who make little use of the system should bear little of its cost.

I want to be clear about what I am not asking. I am not asking that general aviation be exempted from all charges. It pays its way today and it should continue to do so. Nor am I seeking to frustrate the much-needed programme of modernisation that, rightly, this Bill provides for. I supported its general objectives at Second Reading and continue to support them now. I ask only that, as these powers are set out in greater detail, the interests of general aviation are kept in view and the principle of proportionality is clearly set out, rather than left to assurances by the Secretary of State.

If the Minister can tell me that the Government have no intention of drawing general aviation into a charging regime built for the airlines or for commercial drone activity, and that he will consider how that intention might be given proper statutory form, that would be enormously welcome.

Baroness Bray of Coln Portrait Baroness Bray of Coln (Con)
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My Lords, it is a pleasure to follow the noble Lord, Lord Kirkhope. I support the proposal from the noble Lord, Lord Grayling, of a targeted consultation with local communities.

It will surely be the case that, as part of the civil aviation Bill, there will be changes to the use of airspace overhead and the potential not only for increased numbers of flights but the redesign of flight paths and expanding airports. It must surely follow, then, that, as part of the planning and preparation for these changes, residents who may experience new aircraft overflights, increased noise and other meaningful impacts, such as increased traffic on roads leading to local airports, should be given a meaningful role in considering these changes.

It is already the case that government and CAA policy recognises that airspace changes can have significant impacts on people on the ground and therefore includes consultation and stakeholder engagement requirements, but that sometimes feels a little like a box-ticking exercise. I feel strongly that it must be more than that. Communities that may find themselves under new or intensified flight paths deserve a meaningful voice in these decisions that seriously affect their quality of life.

I recognise that the updating of our aviation policies is an essential process from time to time, but surely the best outcomes are achieved through reasonable discussion. A stronger consultation framework may well deliver reforms more smoothly and avoid delay in being implemented, which can arise where opposition intensifies. Whereas existing consultation processes are often seen as insufficient as they take place too late in the process after key decisions have already, in effect, been made, proper engagement with those affected at an earlier stage and a clear demonstration of how their views are being considered is more likely to appear proportionate and pragmatic.

I am not suggesting that communities could or should have a complete veto over necessary airspace changes, but it would help ensure that residents who may experience substantial increases in overhead flights are fully consulted earlier and can see how their concerns are being taken into account. The key may be to introduce formal reviews of new routes after a year or so, independently conducted, and a commitment to revisit the design if impacts prove worse than forecast. The most defensible demand is surely a requirement that decision-makers must demonstrate how community representations have been considered and explain publicly why particular concerns were accepted or rejected.

Yes, residents already have consultation rights in relation to airport expansion and airspace changes, but they are limited and there is no guarantee at the moment that community concerns will materially affect the outcome. The issue is not whether consultation occurs but whether it is meaningful. Communities facing substantial increases in aircraft noise should have a guaranteed opportunity to influence decisions and receive a clear explanation of how their views have been taken into account.

Civil Aviation (Consumer Protection and Regulatory Reform) Bill [HL] Debate

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Department: Department for Transport

Civil Aviation (Consumer Protection and Regulatory Reform) Bill [HL]

Lord Kirkhope of Harrogate Excerpts
Moved by
41: Clause 6, page 6, line 28, at end insert—
“(4A) After section 80 (Secretary of State’s duties) insert—“80A Consideration of growth and sustainability of general aviation in relation to chargesIn exercising functions relating to charges for air traffic and air navigation services, the Secretary of State and the CAA must have regard to—(a) the desirability of promoting the growth and sustainability of general aviation, including its role in introducing individuals to aviation, supporting aviation skills development, and encouraging entry into commercial aviation careers, and(b) the desirability of ensuring that persons carrying out general aviation activities are not subject to charges which are disproportionate to the use made by such persons of air traffic and air navigation services.””Member's explanatory statement
This amendment seeks to ensure that decisions relating to charges for air traffic and air navigation services take account of the importance of general aviation to the sustainability of the wider aviation sector, including its contributions to aviation skills and future workforce development, and that such charges remain proportionate to use.
Lord Kirkhope of Harrogate Portrait Lord Kirkhope of Harrogate (Con)
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My Lords, we have come to the point in the evening where general aviation wants to put across its case. I will not declare all my interests in aviation, but I fly planes and am an honorary president of BALPA. I am very proud of that and of the fact that I have been flying planes now for over 40 years—with a licence. It is just as well to add that bit on.

Over those 40 years, I have seen how much more onerous the responsibilities and costs have been on those who have participated in general and business aviation in this country and elsewhere. Regulations have in many cases rightly been tightened to guarantee safety. However, the sheer cost of operating aircraft has increased dramatically, as have the costs incurred by those who have established training organisations around the country. The reason for my amendment tonight is clear.

I congratulate the Minister, as others presumably have been doing all evening, on being enormously receptive to the views of myself and others who have been promoting general aviation during this Bill. In my long experience here and in the other place, I can narrow down the number of Ministers who have been as receptive and helpful as he has been to a comparatively small number. He has been very helpful indeed. However, we must test him just that little bit further. Whatever he says in response to my amendment tonight, as the amendment sets out, it is a question of not just the words that we receive here in the deliberations on this Bill but of what happens next. Our wishes are not only that the Government should acknowledge the work being done in general aviation, its successes and its importance, but that the CAA also recognises that and is much more vocal and helpful than it has been in the past.

Many of the pilots who operate today in the commercial world are taught at training organisations on sometimes very small airfields around our country. The value of the contribution of that initial training to the airline business is therefore very difficult to estimate, but undoubtedly many of the people I know who fly commercially started out in training organisations in comparatively small fields around the country. In a way, my amendment is an attempt not only to get a greater acknowledgement on a permanent basis but to look at the economics.

The second part of my amendment asks that there should not be a disproportionate cost to general aviation in relation to air and navigation charges. My noble friend Lord Moylan has just touched on this point in his question to the Minister about the availability of and the charging for these services. My amendment specifically states that there should not be any impediment through

“charges which are disproportionate to the use made … of air traffic”

and navigational services by general aviation. That is quite clear: it is not just a question of availability, but of the actual use. We want to make sure that what has happened so far, which is reasonably satisfactory in that the charges are proportionate to the use, is continued and that there is no extra penalty put on GA and business aviation, to which we owe so much. I beg to move.

Lord Barber of Ainsdale Portrait Lord Barber of Ainsdale (Lab)
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My Lords, I will speak briefly to Amendment 69 in my name. I begin by declaring my interest as the current president of BALPA. This amendment proposes an annual report by the CAA on pilot licence holders. I am grateful for the chance to discuss the issues and the trends lying behind this proposal with my noble friend the Minister.

We know that there are significant numbers of commercial pilots approaching the mandatory retirement age of 65. We have ambitions for real growth in this sector, which could increase the demand for pilots. Yet there are real concerns about the difficulties of potential pilots accessing the necessary training, given the significantly high costs involved, so a careful monitoring of all these issues is justified. This amendment proposes one way of addressing these concerns about trends affecting the whole sector, but I know that the Minister has been thinking about these challenges and I look forward to hearing his thinking on the most appropriate way to respond.

--- Later in debate ---
Lord Hendy of Richmond Hill Portrait Lord Hendy of Richmond Hill (Lab)
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My Lords, I begin with Amendment 41. I thank the noble Lord, Lord Kirkhope of Harrogate, for this and for his kind remarks. I also heard the noble Viscount, Lord Goschen, and other noble Lords clearly on this subject.

General aviation is an important part of the UK’s aviation industry, covering a wide range of public service, commercial and recreational activities. As the noble Lord remarked, it plays an important role in introducing people to aviation and helping to develop the skills pipeline for future aviation careers.

Clause 6 seeks to provide the CAA with greater flexibility as to who can be charged for air traffic services provided under a licence. This will ensure that, as the UK’s airspace evolves, the costs of providing those services can continue to be recovered fairly and proportionately, in line with the well-established “user pays” principle.

As the noble Lord will be aware, these costs are currently recovered primarily from commercial airlines, while general aviation is largely exempt. Any future changes would be subject to the CAA’s statutory consultation process, with affected parties retaining rights of appeal. The Civil Aviation Authority also has an obligation under the Transport Act 2000 to further the interests of operators and owners of aircraft, including in relation to the availability and cost of licensed air traffic services. This would and does naturally include considering impacts on the sustainability and growth of general aviation. Given those existing safeguards, the established charging process, and the fact that there are currently no plans to introduce new charges for general aviation users, I do not believe the amendment is necessary.

I turn to the amendment from my noble friend Lord Barber of Ainsdale, which would require the CAA to report on anonymised demographic trends among commercial pilot licence-holders. Demographic trends among skilled aviation personnel are a matter of interest to the industry, the Government and the Civil Aviation Authority.

The Civil Aviation Authority already collects demographic information on commercial pilots and other skilled personnel. This supports robust regulatory decision-making, enables the CAA to identify relevant trends and allows it to publish data on licence-holders where it considers that useful. Indeed, the CAA has published annual data on different categories of licensed pilots, including commercial pilots, broken down by age and sex, since 1994.

The proposed requirement to publish such statistics and analysis with a particular frequency could impose additional costs on the CAA. These would have to be met from the CAA’s scheme of charges and thus would be a burden on the aviation sector. For those reasons, I consider the amendment unnecessary and ask my noble friend not to press it.

More broadly, I reassure the noble Lord, as well as my noble friends Lord Barber of Ainsdale and Lord Tunnicliffe, of the importance that the Government place on maintaining a robust pipeline of flight crew, particularly pilots. The department is addressing workforce challenges through targeted programmes, such as Generation Aviation, and through evidence-based assessments of skills needs. The department will shortly commission a skills gap analysis across all aviation professions as a follow-up to analysis that was conducted in 2023. This will consider factors including retirements and sector growth, helping to identify emerging workforce pressures at an early stage.

In response to the noble Lord, Lord Grayling, the Government recognise and value the important role aerodromes play in their local communities. That is why the National Planning Policy Framework ensures that planning authorities consider their economic, leisure, training and emergency service roles when making planning decisions about them.

I thank noble Lords for their engagement on this matter and I trust that, as a result, they feel reassured. I ask the noble Lord to withdraw the amendment.

Lord Kirkhope of Harrogate Portrait Lord Kirkhope of Harrogate (Con)
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I feel that the matter that I brought through this amendment has been well aired. I am grateful for the contributions of my noble friends Lord Goschen, Lord Grayling and Lady Foster. I am particularly happy that my noble friend Lord Moylan, our spokesman, is satisfied with a very slight chastisement of me. I go away humble, of course, but not humiliated. I am delighted that the Minister has responded in the way he has. I am pleased that the amendment tabled by the noble Lord, Lord Barber, has been discussed, because it is also important in this group. As a result of that, I beg leave to withdraw my amendment.

Amendment 41 withdrawn.