European Union (Notification of Withdrawal) Bill

Lord Kakkar Excerpts

Monday 20th February 2017 Lords Chamber

[Lord Kakkar (CB)]

My Lords, I thank the noble Baroness the Lord Privy Seal for the thoughtful way in which she introduced this Second Reading debate. She confirmed the constitutional position of your Lordships’ House in having a responsibility to scrutinise and revise legislation and the fact that those simple principles apply to any Bill before your Lordships, including this one. However, I strongly believe that that constitutional duty and that responsibility have to be conducted in the context of this Bill. It has resulted from a referendum, the specific details and question of which were approved by Parliament—both your Lordships’ House and the other place—and put to the people of our country. The people of our country having voted decisively to leave the European Union, their decision was then taken by Her Majesty’s Government to the other place. Members of the other place, as representatives of, and exercising judgment on behalf of the people, concluded that a simple Bill designed to initiate the process of Article 50 and commence the negotiation for our exit from the European Union was the right way to reflect the will of the people. Now that it has come to your Lordships’ House, it is for us to understand that context and determine how we should go about our constitutional duties.

It is often said of surgeons that to be a good surgeon you need to learn how to operate. To be a great surgeon you need to develop judgment and learn when and, in particular, when not to operate. Similar could be said of the work of a legislative Chamber, particularly one of the nature of your Lordships’ House. There is no doubt that we are a very good Chamber and know how to revise legislation. The question is how your Lordships on this occasion exercise their judgment and determine whether the Bill should be amended in large or small part. That is not to say that many of the issues already appearing on the Marshalled List for potential amendment or debate in Committee are not vital. Many of them do indeed need to be addressed. The question is: should they be addressed as part of the Bill? Or will there be other mechanisms resulting from what has already been described in the White Paper, and the fact that your Lordships’ House in the next Session of Parliament will receive the great repeal Bill? These would provide a far greater opportunity not only for debate in your Lordships’ House regarding the very important issues that need to be considered but to reach consensus with the other place on those issues.

If, indeed, that is considered a real opportunity then the points made by my noble and learned friend Lord Hope are very pertinent—a simple and straightforward Bill achieving this first objective is the way forward. Thereafter, your Lordships’ House will have ample opportunity to consider a variety of important issues. They should not be dismissed now for ever but considered in the context of the ability to look at issues of substance relating to our departure from the European Union and to reach consensus with the other place.

There is one further issue that I would be grateful if the Minister would address. It regards the final stage of Article 50, and how Parliament should deal with the agreement reached in the context of the argument already put in the other place and agreed by Her Majesty’s Government that Parliament will have a meaningful say at the end of this process. Is that meaningful contribution to understanding the final stage to be taken in the context of the Constitutional Reform and Governance Act 2010—that is to say it will be treated as a treaty issue? Under that constitutional anchor, the other place has the ability to delay ratification of any such agreement indefinitely but your Lordship’s House can only give its opinion, with the final say resting with the other place. Or will some other part of the process, and other legislation that will come before Parliament in this two-year period represent the opportunity for a far more accurate, decided and granular review of the final agreement reached, and thereby provide the reassurance that noble Lords are looking for?

Outcome of the European Union Referendum

Lord Kakkar Excerpts

Tuesday 5th July 2016 Lords Chamber

[Lord Kakkar (CB)]

My Lords, I endorse the comments of my noble and learned friend Lord Brown of Eaton-under-Heywood and the noble Baroness, Lady Mallalieu, who, as many other noble Lords have done, made the important point that it is essential now that this Parliament and Government give effect to the expressed view of our fellow citizens in this referendum and ensure that the most effective way forward is achieved for our great nation in its future relationship with the European Union. To do anything less runs a very serious risk of undermining our democracy, undermining faith in the work of our Parliament and further consolidating some dangerous trends with regard to cohesion in society that have been identified and came to the surface in the aftermath of the referendum.

Before turning to that matter in some more detail, I shall pick up on a point made by my noble friend Lord Alton of Liverpool. In so doing I declare an interest as professor of surgery at University College London and as the UK business ambassador for healthcare and life sciences. My noble friend made the point that there are now areas of national activity that require clear advice and instruction from government in terms of dealing with the consequences of the referendum decision. One such area is that of collaboration in scientific research in Europe, which is well recognised. In the previous Session of Parliament, your Lordships’ Science and Technology Committee undertook an interesting report into the relationship between UK science and the European Union.

There is no doubt that the negotiation as it goes forward provides the opportunity to consolidate that relationship. As we heard from my noble friend Lord Alton and others, many nations that are not part of the European Union have participated in programmes such as Horizon 2020. There must clearly be the opportunity to do that. However, interestingly, there are now reports that European universities and individuals—though not the European institutions—are starting to exclude UK universities and individuals from scientific collaborations to be made in the coming weeks and months. That is clearly inappropriate.

No final decision on the disposition between the relationship of our universities and the European Union has been reached. It would be a matter of negotiation. To exclude them at this early stage runs the risk of destroying important networks and collaborations that have taken years to build. The research opportunities lost as a result could have profound impacts on our economy—research and development is vital to it—and, in the area of biomedical research, on the health of the nation. What advice are the Government able to provide to ensure that UK universities can overcome this potentially important problem by addressing these types of, let us say, unilateral decisions by individuals and institutions in Europe to exclude their UK partners?

I turn to the truly shocking and worrying increased reporting of so-called hate crimes. This is a difficult and dangerous situation. Appropriate discussion and debate about immigration to our country is absolutely justified and it has certainly formed an important part of recent political dialogue, but for that reasoned debate to be hijacked by illegitimate focus on racism and prejudice is completely wrong. It causes deep anxiety in communities from the European Union that are settled here in our great country, and in other well-settled communities. It makes them feel that they are no longer safe to live securely in their communities and in our country, and that is truly a disaster.

We have heard that Her Majesty’s Government have rightly encouraged those who are the subject of these terrible crimes to report them. It would be useful to understand when the Government’s hate crime action plan is to be published. It is very important that that plan deals in some detail with what needs to be done regarding resources for policing and support for community activities and organisations to drive forward better understanding. It is also vital that the question of settled EU individuals and communities in this country is addressed rapidly. A failure to do so runs the serious risk of allowing prejudice to become more established. That is clearly not the intention of anybody on either side of the European argument, and therefore it needs to be addressed effectively and rapidly.

In addition, we need to understand the underlying reasons for this reaction. We have heard them discussed in some detail in this fascinating debate. Those issues must not be ignored. They need to be addressed effectively to ensure that the lessons learned beyond the broader question of Europe can be understood and effectively addressed as part of public policy in the years to come. We must also use this as an opportunity to engage once again with our national values. At the heart of those national values, as we heard earlier from the most reverend Primate the Archbishop of Canterbury, are tolerance and decency. Fundamentally, as our nation moves forward, it will be tolerance and decency which will ensure our long-term success both at home and abroad.

Strathclyde Review

Lord Kakkar Excerpts

Wednesday 13th January 2016 Lords Chamber

[Lord Kakkar (CB)]

My Lords, I join in thanking the noble Lord, Lord Strathclyde, for the thoughtful way in which he introduced his review, and indeed for the very thoughtful approach he has taken to it. I believe that a review was necessary because there is a difference of opinion both within your Lordships’ House and between this House and another place over the role that this Chamber should play in the scrutiny and disposition of secondary legislation. A convention can exist only if there is consensus. On this occasion, it is clear that the consensus has started to break down and, therefore, the matter must be addressed. The noble Lord’s review is a starting point, as indeed is this important debate to take note.

We need to recognise that the debate on 26 October raised an interesting and important issue. My understanding previously had been that with regard to statutory instruments, the role of your Lordships’ House was to scrutinise them, but that our response was binary; that is, either to accept them or to reject them. A new, potentially helpful concept was introduced that the House should be able to consider a statutory instrument and provide an opportunity for the Government to think again in a meaningful and real way, and indeed that is what happened on that occasion. The third proposal in the report of the noble Lord, Lord Strathclyde, seems to provide that option in a more definite way, and if one reviews the debate of 26 October, many arguments were made. I was particularly taken by that of the noble Lord, Lord Rooker, when he said at col. 1015 that the powers of your Lordships’ House with regard to secondary legislation were “too drastic”. There must be a possibility for your Lordships, in looking at the development and evolution of conventions, to consider seriously the proposal made by the noble Lord, Lord Strathclyde.

In his review, the noble Lord also makes an important point about the need to look in addition at the way that primary legislation is drafted and, in particular, at the use of delegated powers if this new convention is established for your Lordships’ House. This is important, particularly in terms of the use of delegated powers that may have constitutional ramifications. We have only to look to the previous Session of Parliament and the passage of the Fixed-term Parliaments Act 2011 to note that there are delegated powers in that Act which provide for the extension of the life of this or any Parliament by two months on the basis of a statutory instrument. Two months is a short period, but there is an important principle here with regard to the constitutional implications of that statutory instrument. Therefore, any criteria that are developed with regard to the drafting of primary legislation and the appropriate use of delegated powers must make special reference to those with a constitutional implication.

There is then the question of the many Acts of Parliament currently on the statute book that have delegated powers, some of which may also be used for constitutional purposes. I should like to ask the Leader of the House how the Government would go about providing an opportunity for an understanding of the implications, with regard to existing legislation and delegated powers, in this specific area of constitutional importance so that we can be certain that our important role as guardians, to some extent, of our constitution can be maintained. The Parliament Act 1911 made specific reference to an ongoing and important role of your Lordships’ House at that time to ensure that the life of a Parliament could not be extended beyond five years. That provides the context of our constitutional responsibilities and therefore the need, in taking forward these proposals, to ensure that there are no unintended consequences that serve badly our country, our fellow citizens and this Parliament in the future.

House of Lords Reform

Lord Kakkar Excerpts

Tuesday 15th September 2015 Lords Chamber

[Lord Kakkar (CB)]

My Lords, I declare my interest as chairman of the House of Lords Appointments Commission and emphasise that I speak in this debate from an individual perspective.

Your Lordships have recognised in this debate that the size of the House has now become the subject of considerable concern, both within Parliament and outside. This concern has the potential to impact on the standing and reputation of your Lordships’ House and its ability to discharge its constitutional responsibilities. The debate rightly emphasised time and again the importance of recognising our constitutional role in determining the way forward in further stepwise reform, particularly on the question of the size of the House. It is well recognised that our principal role is that of scrutiny, revision of legislation and holding Her Majesty’s Government to account, but in such a way that complements the work of the other place—particularly with regard to the role of holding Her Majesty’s Government to account. Any proposal on addressing the size of your Lordships’ House should also, I believe very strongly, help consolidate our constitutional role and ensure that we can continue to discharge those responsibilities most effectively.

A number of proposals have been made in this debate on how the size of the House might be limited, among them the suggestion that there might be an age limit for participation, a term limit or a simple cull of Members. The problem with the suggestions of either an age or term limit is that they are rather indiscriminate. In adopting either proposal, your Lordships run the risk of removing from the House Members who make particularly good and active contributions, whose expertise and wisdom is of the greatest importance in discharging our constitutional role or who, in many ways, help distinguish and differentiate us from the other place most effectively. The potential problem of a cull might be that it would exclude on a permanent basis Members of your Lordships’ House who have the capacity to make an important potential contribution, especially recognising that the nature of legislation coming before your Lordships’ House is determined by the priorities of the Government in question and those priorities change over time. Any system dealing with membership of your Lordships’ House must retain the ability for flexibility in ensuring that the appropriate expertise is represented when it is necessary.

An alternative solution to a cull might be for all Members of your Lordships’ House to continue to receive a Writ of Summons, therefore forming a pool of eligible Peers from which a smaller pool of sitting Peers could be elected by each individual grouping, potentially on a sessional basis dependent upon the nature of legislation that the House would address for that particular Session. If a sessional basis were considered too short, it could be done for the duration of a Parliament. The advantage of such a system is that it would allow each grouping to determine how best to put at the disposal of your Lordships’ House, from among its wider pool of eligible Peers, those most able to contribute to the work of the House for that particular Session or Parliament. It would also allow the groupings to determine from among their eligible Peers those willing to make an active contribution, participating in the work of the Chamber, committees and other responsibilities of active, working Peers. It would provide the opportunity for those not in a position to make that contribution for a specific time to stand aside, not putting their names forward for election to the pool of sitting Peers from their grouping.

On the cap on the size of the House, I use as an example the suggestion that we reduce the current size by 50%. Under those circumstances, there would be about 410 sitting Peers from among the 820 or so currently eligible to sit in your Lordships’ House. To that would be added the Government Front Bench of some 20 Peers. That would give a House of around 440 to 450 Members. As I said, that would be composed on the basis of each grouping electing those from among the eligible Peers receiving the Writ of Summons. Only those sitting Peers would be in a position to avail themselves of any allowances, expenses or other accommodation in your Lordships’ House. Other eligible Peers would continue to receive information about the work of the House and to be eligible to be elected by their groupings to serve as active sitting Members.

This proposal might require some attention to the wording of the Writ of Summons, but may not require extensive primary legislation beyond that. If that were the case then it would be something that the House could act on in a relatively short time. It would deal with the question of the size of the House and the perception about the House being too large, as it would be reduced by a very substantial number. But it would not exclude Peers permanently and it would provide the opportunity for noble Lords, as and when their expertise would be of greatest use to the work of your Lordships’ House, to be available on the basis of the support of their party groupings having elected them to do so.