Direction of Government

Lord Garnier Excerpts

Wednesday 2nd September 2026 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Smith of Basildon (Lab)]

I know the noble Lord, and I think he has spoken to my colleagues in the Northern Ireland Office about this matter. Having taken advice from my noble friend the Northern Ireland Minister, who is sitting next to me, I know that she has had conversations with the Irish Government on this and those conversations will continue. If he wants to take that up further with her then we will be happy to talk to him, but he can be assured that conversations and discussions continue on that issue.

[Lord Garnier (Con)]

My Lords, the Prime Minister yesterday said that the other place had ignored for far too long the question of IPPs. Will the noble Baroness accept that this House has most certainly not ignored it? Across the whole House, there has been a concerted campaign to rid this stain from our justice system. He promised legislation “soon”. What does “soon” mean? We need to get this legislation up and running, whether it begins in this House or in the other place, as soon as we return in October.

[Baroness Smith of Basildon (Lab)]

I am grateful to the noble and learned Lord. He is right, and I have made this point; there have been a number of discussions and debates in this House on the issue. It is a difficult issue, and I know he is aware of its complications and how complex it is. I think it is understood that for people who have served significantly more than the sentences imposed on them at the time to be held so much longer is wrong. The noble Lord, Lord Cameron of Chipping Norton, said that we should end the sentences and he was quite clear-cut, and across the House there has been quite a strong view on that.

When any prisoner is released, we have to deal with issues of public safety, whether that is on IPP, on early release or at the end of sentences. That is why we have invested so much additional money and support into the Probation Service; I think it was £700 million extra for recruiting new probation officers. I cannot give the noble and learned Lord an exact timetable for this, and I certainly could not promise to bring it back in October because the legislation has yet to be drafted—it was not drafted before, and we need to ensure that we get it right. Can I keep in contact with him on this? I am happy to do that and keep him informed. I am sure he will have views on how the legislation could be drafted. I will keep him and the House updated, but there will be no undue delay. This is something on which we want to move forward as quickly as we are able.