Syria: British Armed Forces
Debate between Lord Anderson of Swansea and Baroness Goldie(4 years, 6 months ago)
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Baroness Goldie
I should say to the noble and gallant Lord that the United Kingdom enjoys a very good relationship with the Republic of Cyprus, which includes a cordial relationship as regards our sovereign base areas. Of course, our sovereign base areas have been critical to our capability to endeavour to take action against Daesh in Syria.
Lord Anderson of Swansea (Lab)
My Lords, is it not clear that, as a result of President Trump’s decision, we are witnessing a major geopolitical shift in the region in favour of Russia? What protocols or understandings are there with Russia to ensure that there is no clash between Russian planes and our own?
Baroness Goldie
I can reassure the noble Lord that we have set procedures for handling the airspace above Syria. He is right that, given the number of parties operating over Syria now, the airspace is congested, but that is no different from the conditions during earlier counter-Daesh operations. There are procedures to ensure that air activity is appropriately deconflicted and handled in a safe and professional manner. Those are the rules by which the United Kingdom abides, as do our allies.
Rwanda: CHOGM 2020
Debate between Lord Anderson of Swansea and Baroness Goldie
Baroness Goldie
Yes, I do. I thank and acknowledge my noble friend for his excellent work as the Prime Minister’s trade envoy to Rwanda and Uganda. Rwanda is one of Africa’s fastest growing economies; it achieved a growth rate of 8.6% in 2018. It is an important trading partner for the United Kingdom. The UK is the second-largest investor in Rwanda and we are committed to sustaining this partnership.
Lord Anderson of Swansea (Lab)
My Lords, Rwanda straddles Anglophone and Francophone Africa—the Commonwealth and La Francophonie. Is not this CHOGM a good opportunity to bring the two organisations more closely together? Will the Government use their best endeavours to encourage the organisers to do just that?
Baroness Goldie
The noble Lord makes an interesting point. There is a desire that the next CHOGM should reflect the success of last year’s in the United Kingdom. I am sure that all efforts to bring in interested parties and move relationships forward will be a very positive development.
Gaza
Debate between Lord Anderson of Swansea and Baroness Goldie
Baroness Goldie
I reassure the noble Lord that we are deeply concerned about the recurring violence in Gaza and the surrounding region, and we regularly lobby the Israelis about the damage that their restrictions are doing to the lives and livelihoods of ordinary Palestinians. We have also raised concerns with the Egyptian authorities, but there is no excuse or justification for terrorism. We utterly condemn the violent acts of Hamas and other militant groups in Gaza. The firing of rockets towards civilian areas is unacceptable and must stop. I agree with the noble Lord that all parties should work together to agree a long-term sustainable plan to improve the situation with help from the international community, and we welcome efforts by those who are working to develop solutions that will ultimately lead to peace.
Lord Anderson of Swansea (Lab)
My Lords, Israel is like one of those dangerous animals which, when attacked, defends itself. It would surely be more sensible to talk to Hamas and suggest that it stops rockets being launched into Israel and tunnels to Israel being built. The Israelis must know where the rockets are located and where the tunnels begin because of the quality of their intelligence operations. That would surely be the better practice.
Baroness Goldie
The noble Lord will be aware of the Government’s long-standing position: Hamas’s military wing has been proscribed in the UK since 2001 and the UK has a policy of no contact with Hamas, including the political as well as the military wing. Our position is that it must renounce violence, recognise Israel and accept previously signed agreements.
Sri Lanka
Debate between Lord Anderson of Swansea and Baroness Goldie
Baroness Goldie
The noble Baroness makes a very valuable point in relation to the Commonwealth, which as she is aware is a strong and coherent family of nations. When any one of these nations is affected like this, there is a sense of standing together and wanting to provide support. Specifically in relation to the United Kingdom, the UK has made a long-term commitment to improving human rights in Sri Lanka and is dedicated to supporting the rebuilding of the country after three decades of civil conflict. I referred in an earlier answer to the Conflict, Stability and Security Fund. The UK is providing Sri Lanka with £8.3 million over three years, which commenced in 2016. That is specifically to include support for police reform and training, reconciliation and peacebuilding, and demining in the north of the country. But that is against the backdrop of wanting to protect human rights and support the emergence of the strong constitution to which I think the noble Baroness is referring.
Lord Anderson of Swansea (Lab)
My Lords, the Minister speaks for the whole House in deploring the massacre of all the innocents in Sri Lanka, both the hotel guests and the worshippers, particularly the children. She is right also to put it in the context of a worldwide persecution of Christians, evidenced by bodies such as Open Doors, the appropriate Catholic body and the Barnabas Fund. As we await the Bishop of Truro’s report, how does she respond to the charges that we all in the UK, of all parties, have been too restrained by some form of post-colonial guilt in making appropriate representations when Christians are massacred in other countries?
Baroness Goldie
As both my right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary and the Prime Minister made clear in their Easter messages, there is profound concern at the extent to which Christians are facing persecution. The figures are deeply troubling. The UK is committed to doing everything possible to ensure that people of all faiths are treated equally, and we have a strong and proud tradition ourselves of religious tolerance. Can we learn? I am sure that we can. Is there more that we can do? We should never stop being prepared to learn. Even arising out of dreadful situations, as the noble Lord, Lord Collins, pointed out, it is possible to learn. There may be lessons that we can learn from this event. I think that it is already clear that there has been a global condemnation of what has happened, and rightly so. Equally, I think that there is a global sense of purpose to do whatever we can, collectively as nations across the world, to protect the freedom of different faiths to practise their beliefs. That of course includes Christians.
Brexit: European External Action Service
Debate between Lord Anderson of Swansea and Baroness Goldie
Baroness Goldie
I think the noble Lord’s views are well rehearsed in this respect and come as no surprise to the Chamber, although I regret the use of words such as “childish”. We have to acknowledge that the citizens of this country, asked to make a decision, made that decision, a decision which the Government, in my opinion absolutely correctly, are striving to implement and respect.
Lord Anderson of Swansea (Lab)
My Lords, at the moment in overseas posts it is normal for the British overseas representatives to meet their European counterparts and European Union representatives for regular meetings to exchange information. Is it assumed that there will be a formal relationship for this excellent procedure to continue?
Baroness Goldie
As I indicated to the noble Lord, Lord Collins, the detail of such arrangements and relationships will rest with the future, but as for the spirit in which the UK would approach these vital discussions I have tried to explain that we are in sympathy with many of the agencies, facilities, relationships and partnerships within the EU which have so helped both the EU and the UK. We would certainly want to approach these discussions constructively and in a positive manner.
Western Balkans Summit
Debate between Lord Anderson of Swansea and Baroness Goldie
Baroness Goldie
My Lords, we are clear that the Srebrenica massacre was an act of genocide; indeed, we make that clear in our engagement in the region. We will be working with leaders from the region to address legacy issues from the conflicts of the 1990s in the context of a summit, including by supporting accountability for war crimes. The noble and learned Lord will aware that the International Criminal Tribunal and its successor, the International Residual Mechanism for Criminal Tribunals, have played an important role in holding to account those responsible for serious violations of international humanitarian law in the region, including at Srebrenica. We support those efforts.
Lord Anderson of Swansea (Lab)
My Lords, for the past five years, the Berlin process has brought together the six west Balkan countries and relevant countries of the European Union. After Brexit, as part neither of the region nor of the EU, I presume that we will not be members of that. Will our influence therefore be diminished?
Baroness Goldie
What is very clear is the mutual interest that the United Kingdom and the EU have in the western Balkans area. That is an interest which I am glad to say seems to be welcomed by the west Balkan countries. The noble Lord raised Brexit. We and our friends in the EU will have regard to that mutuality of interest. A stable western Balkans area means good news for both the EU and the UK. We also have respective capacity to contribute help, be it in defence or with programme help such as the UK has contributed across the region.
Baroness Goldie
In response to the first part of the noble Lord’s question, I should point out that the summit comes under the umbrella of the Berlin process. Of course, the UK will continue to be a member of that process even after we have left the EU.
Baroness Goldie
The noble Lord seems to be adding to the discussion from a sedentary position—I am not sure what he said over the shoulder of the noble Lord, Lord Collins. My understanding is that we will be members of the Berlin process after we have left the EU—that is important. As I said earlier, in or out of the EU, the UK continues to have a strong interest in and a demonstrable commitment to the western Balkans area.
Korean Peninsula
Debate between Lord Anderson of Swansea and Baroness Goldie
Baroness Goldie
I should say to my noble friend that I am not privy to the precise communications and arrangements that exist between the Prime Minister and the President of the United States, but I reassure him that there is a high-level diplomatic exchange. There is regular evidence of that—as I indicated in the Statement, the Foreign Secretary is in touch with Secretary Tillerson. I thank my noble friend for his helpful observation that we have to work closely with all our allies. That is axiomatic if we are to make any sense of trying to have a coherent response against North Korea.
I am able to give a quick update from this holograph note that has just been passed to me. It says, “PM spoke to the President today”. There we are—hot off the press to my noble friend.
Lord Anderson of Swansea (Lab)
My Lords, what is the use of leaving a military option on the table when we know that such an option is wholly unrealistic? As the Minister has said, that is in part because of the proximity of Seoul to the border. Should we not be brutally realistic and accept that that is so? Does not she agree that one of the real problems here is that no one, even the South Koreans as I have heard from several of their leaders, really understands the inner workings of the North Korean regime? We do not know its motives. Are they triggered by some form of self-preservation of the regime? Is there some form of potential blackmail of the US and its allies? This is a fact of life: we do not have any intelligence about what motivates the North Koreans. Given the importance that everyone accepts of pressure from China, can she say whether there is any evidence at all that it is prepared to use the oil weapon?
Baroness Goldie
I emphasise that the United Kingdom Government are focusing on a diplomatic solution and, with the collective support of the United Nations member states, to achieve a regime of sanctions which has an economic impact on North Korea so that the revenues making possible the development of its nuclear capability are cut off. It is worth repeating: that is the focus of the United Kingdom Government. We would regard a military solution as a very grave option indeed.
On the role of China, again we have to work in partnership. It is clear that China has shown, particularly in its language at the recent United Nations meeting, how extremely worried it is about this. I think that the country has realised that it has to demonstrate a willingness to play its part not just as a member of the United Nations but also by supporting the sanctions regime.
The final point raised by the noble Lord was that of oil. Again, as I said to the noble Lord, Lord Alton, during the discussions at the United Nations which are to be held imminently, searching questions will be asked and a vigorous exploration made of the options. The United Kingdom believes that there are still sanctions options to pursue, and that is what I think will be the source of a robust discussion at the United Nations.
Nigeria
Debate between Lord Anderson of Swansea and Baroness Goldie
Baroness Goldie
I thank the noble Baroness for her question. We are all aware of the term “desertification”—a very long word for the drying up of ground in territories in Nigeria—and, certainly, that seems to be attributable to climate change. Across the globe, major powers recognise that there is an issue, and the United Kingdom is doing everything it can to contribute to both the recognition of climate change and its alleviation. I am sure that that will have a beneficial effect across areas of the world, including Nigeria.
Lord Anderson of Swansea (Lab)
My Lords, the United Nations predicts that, by the year 2050, the population of Nigeria will more than double, to 411 million, making it the third most populous country in the world. Is this increase not bound to lead to further internal conflict and again to mass emigration? I congratulate the Government on what they have done in co-hosting the recent family planning summit in London, but will they deplore the position of the Trump Administration in withdrawing substantial funds from their family planning programmes?
Baroness Goldie
I thank the noble Lord, Lord Anderson, for his question. Obviously, my responsibility and that of my colleagues is for the position of the United Kingdom Government, which have a positive record in relation to Nigeria. The estimates of population are extremely difficult to quantify, and reliable data are almost impossible to obtain. However, I have no doubt whatever that there is a significant population in Nigeria—it is thought to be the largest African country—and the noble Lord is right to allude to the possible consequences of population increase not being matched with education. The United Kingdom Government, both through our Nigeria Stability and Reconciliation Programme and through our significant humanitarian aid, are making a positive contribution to try to address and alleviate these challenges.
Turkey: Death Penalty
Debate between Lord Anderson of Swansea and Baroness Goldie
Baroness Goldie
I think that the noble Lord is referring to a background of transfer of Christian churches, starting in 2012. The British embassy in Ankara regularly raises human rights issues with the Turkish authorities and we will closely follow the legal process implicit in this activity. We strongly support religious freedom in Turkey and have supported civil society organisations working in this area.
Lord Anderson of Swansea (Lab)
My Lords, the Foreign Minister of Turkey is a former president of the Assembly of the Council of Europe; therefore the Turkish Government must be well aware of the consequences of the reintroduction of the death penalty, possibly after a referendum. Is it the Government’s view that Turkey will inevitably have to be suspended from the Council of Europe if capital punishment is reintroduced?
Baroness Goldie
As I indicated to my noble friend Lord Balfe, the United Kingdom Government’s position on the death penalty is crystal clear and widely known and understood. I have also indicated that Council of Europe members seem to be unanimous in their opposition to the death penalty. It would be for the Council of Europe membership to determine how to respond if—it is an “if”—Turkey went down the undesirable road of reintroducing the death penalty. However, I think that Turkey understands that that would jeopardise its position within the Council of Europe.