Securing Scotland’s Future: Defence Skills and Jobs
Debate between Kirsty Blackman and Patricia Ferguson
Patricia Ferguson
I thank my hon. Friend for mentioning that skills academy. It is in my constituency, so he will not be surprised to hear that I agree with him entirely about that. BAE Systems built the facility because it recognised that there was a skills gap coming and it no longer wanted to have to employ welders from the Philippines at extortionate rates and take on board all the financial responsibilities that came with that.
The academy is an inspiration, frankly. Its way of teaching changes ideas around skills that traditionally were regarded as being for men only, heavily industrial and, sometimes, dangerous. The myths about those trades have been busted by the academy. It is wonderful to see young people so enthusiastic about the jobs and the future that they know they will have because of the work that is going on.
Kirsty Blackman (Aberdeen North) (SNP)
I thank the Chair of the Committee and all the team who pooled this together, including the Clerks who assisted on it. It is shocking that, as stated in the report, less than a tenth of 1% of MOD spend is directly for SMEs in Scotland. I have spoken to the Supplier Development Programme in Scotland and not only has it struggled to get the MOD to engage with it but the MOD’s tier 1 contractors have been unwilling to engage with it.
The Supplier Development Programme is all about training suppliers in how to apply for tenders. Does the hon. Lady agree that more could be done to encourage those tier 1 contractors and the MOD to engage with programmes such as the SDP so that more smaller contractors can get parts of defence contracts? I am talking about not just welding apprenticeships but cleaners, water fountain repairers and the people who do all the things we do not normally think about but without whom the buildings would fall down.
Patricia Ferguson
I am grateful to the hon. Lady for mentioning our excellent Clerks, who ensure not only that we are kept on our toes but that we get the best possible evidence for our inquiries. She is right about the problem that many SMEs have. It is easy to think of those jobs as being very technical in nature, as she describes, but we sometimes forget about the people who provide logistics and other services to these suppliers. It is important that the opportunities to benefit from the work in the sector spread across the range of roles, particularly in those areas where employment is perhaps more vulnerable or fragile. We want to see the Government do as much as they can to allow those jobs to filter down.
Child Poverty and No Recourse to Public Funds
Debate between Kirsty Blackman and Patricia FergusonWestminster Hall is an alternative Chamber for MPs to hold debates, named after the adjoining Westminster Hall.
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Kirsty Blackman
As I said, I do not think that anybody should be subject to no recourse, but I looked at children under five as a first step, because those years are key. If it is going to be anybody with dependants of any age, I am equally happy with that. I am speaking in this debate as a Back Bencher about the issues that I have seen, rather than advancing the SNP policy. I should maybe have been clearer about that at the beginning, but this is about what things look like in my constituency and the concerns that have been raised with me.
I have heard doctors and health professionals talk about issues with rickets and malnutrition. Those are issues that we have not seen since 50 or 60 years ago, when people did not have access to good quality food. Food banks should not have to fill the gaps when we have a responsibility to all the children, everywhere, on these islands.
My other concern is about the dependency on other individuals that no recourse to public funds creates for families. If they cannot get support from the state, they may rely on friends to lend them money, support from religious communities, immoral lenders, or taking part in sex work to get money to provide food for their children. I have seen situations in which people who are being supported by religious communities are in relationships with significant domestic abuse and domestic violence, but cannot separate from their abusive partner, because they know that they will lose the support of the Church, and that is the only thing ensuring that their children are fed. I do not think that is an appropriate situation for the UK Government to force families into.
I wrote to the previous UK Government about that issue in relation to an individual constituent who was divorced from her partner. She was not able to have any relationship with her family, who lived in an African country, because they were so angry about her divorce and had threatened significant violence against her. I had written to the Home Office, suggesting that there was a real problem and that the children needed to be fed and supported. The Home Office said to me, “If she has such a problem with the situation, she can go home.” That was the only response it could think of. We have a responsibility to that woman and those children to provide them with a level of protection, because they are living here and it was not safe for the woman to go back to the country that she had been born in.
I agree that the length of time it takes for decisions to be made is a real problem. We have just had a visa approved for somebody whose case we have been helping with since July 2024, and that is a short period of time compared with some of them. One chap who has just had his visa approved has three children who have been struggling with no recourse to public funds. Thankfully, the school has stepped in and given them free school meals to ensure they are fed—but again there is no consistency in the decision making on free school meals, partly because we do not know which children it is who have no recourse to public funds, whose parents are not currently able to bring in an income and are not getting state support either. If there was more understanding about which children were in those categories, schools would be better placed to provide support.
Patricia Ferguson
Does the hon. Member agree with me that it is also invidious that young people in Scotland who want to apply for the Young Scot card, which allows them free travel, have to produce a British birth certificate?
Kirsty Blackman
My understanding was that there was some flexibility and that the Young Scot website stated that, if somebody did not have a birth certificate, they could go in person to speak to the local authority. I still disagree that that should be the case; there should be more flexibility. There are issues with birth certificates, particularly for children born in other countries—for those born in Ukraine, for example, the birth certificate might have been left behind when they fled. That is a problem. All young people in Scotland should be able to get the Young Scot card and the free bus travel that it entitles them to. I have actually been in touch with my local authority about the issues with applying for those cards, so I agree that there needs to be more flexibility.
Lastly, there is the issue of legal aid and the geographical spread of legal support. Despite the increasing numbers of people applying for visas in Aberdeen, we do not have much in the way of immigration lawyers, and we are Scotland’s third city—we are not a small place by any means. A lot of the Home Office infrastructure, for example, is in Glasgow and Edinburgh. People need to go down there to get their biometrics done, which is an expensive three-hour journey on public transport. Much more could be done in terms of legal aid immigration lawyers and the Home Office’s own infrastructure so that people can better access the visa systems.
Today I would like a commitment from the Government that they will try to make the system better. It does not feel as though any Government that I have been faced with have tried to make the immigration system work for people who want to come here, live in our country, contribute and be part of these islands. Rather than the Home Office, under Governments of any colour, continuing to penalise people for having the audacity to want to live here, it should support people, welcome them, get rid of the hostile environment and say, “We welcome people to come and live here. We want you to be part of our communities.” People will never be able or willing to integrate if we keep saying, “We do not want you here”, and taking three years to decide on visa applications. Anything the Government can do to reduce child poverty would be incredibly helpful. I hope the child poverty strategy can include children whose parents have no recourse to public funds.