Grenfell Tower Fire Inquiry

Kate Green Excerpts

Wednesday 12th July 2017 Commons Chamber

[Damian Green]

That issue may well be addressed by Sir Martin in the public inquiry, which is clearly the appropriate forum for that sort of investigation.

[Kate Green (Stretford and Urmston) (Lab)]

Even as we speak, and before the inquiry has begun, new tower blocks continue to be constructed and developed in my constituency and around the country. What new advice has been issued to planning authorities, those who monitor construction standards and the building industry?

--- Later in debate ---

[Kate Green (Stretford and Urmston) (Lab)]

I am glad to be able to contribute to this debate, and I congratulate my hon. Friends who have made maiden speeches this afternoon. It has been a real pleasure to hear them, particularly that of my hon. Friend the Member for Leigh (Jo Platt), who is my neighbour in Greater Manchester.

Like other Members, I repeat my deep condolences to every victim of the Grenfell Tower tragedy, which is an unimaginable horror for those affected. When we first learned of it just after the general election, it seemed that everyone around the House, especially Ministers, were absolutely horrified by the scale of what had occurred. There was a real sense of determination right across the House and Government to act to ensure that nothing like this could happen ever again in our country. I do not question Ministers’ continuing deep sense of responsibility and desire to make things different, but the reality is that we seem to have already lost that sense of impetus. We seem to be down in the mire of uncertainty about who is responsible, what is to be done, and when we are going to have clarity about what will keep people safe in their homes. That is playing out every day among tenants, leaseholders and homeowners in my constituency.

Of the high-rise blocks in Stretford and Urmston, eight are owned by social landlords, seven by Trafford Housing Trust, and one by Irwell Valley. The remainder are owned by a range of private companies, the names of which are meaningless to me; I have no idea who these companies are, who owns them, or who governs them. There is a major housing development in my constituency, with more in train; new privately owned high-rise blocks are being constructed. I do not believe that there is no place in our housing mix for good-quality high-rise housing, but if those new buildings are not constructed to the very highest standards, as we should expect in the light of Grenfell, and if we are not yet sure what those highest standards look like, those developments need to be paused until we can be confident about it.

The other day, when I asked one of my social landlords how things felt now, he said, “Well, it’s continuing to get worse,” by which he meant that there is increasing uncertainty, because the actions that need to be taken are becoming increasingly unclear. I recognise that there is an inordinately complex mix of factors to be considered, but that is of no use to landlords and tenants who are trying to make decisions about how to act in response to safety concerns. I urge Ministers to do everything they can to give clarity and certainty, at the highest common denominator, as soon as possible.

A small number of blocks in Trafford are partially clad, and all that cladding, as across the country, has failed the flammability tests. The intention is to remove the cladding, but the work has not yet begun because the property owners cannot be sure that, in removing the cladding, they will not make the buildings even less safe.

My hon. Friend the Member for Ogmore (Chris Elmore) rightly alluded to concerns about insulation. Our landlords intend to have that insulation tested, but can Ministers say why the testing of insulation is not being mandated and put on the same footing, with the same resources, as the testing of cladding? I find that inexplicable. Are Ministers aware of how many buildings have had their insulation tested? What has been the result of that testing?

There is a clear view on both sides of the House that sprinklers should now be retrofitted. Do Ministers have a view on whether, in some cases, it may be appropriate to install sprinkler systems on the outside of buildings, as well as the inside? As to whether sprinklers are installed in homes or only in common areas, that will vary from building to building, but an indication of Ministers’ attitudes to those questions would be helpful.

Similarly, do Ministers have a view on whether planning legislation could accommodate the possibility that additional external fire escapes may now be needed on some buildings? Will advice be given on alarm systems and on the level of safety checks that landlords should carry out? Will there be new advice on whether people should stay put in their flat or flee in the event of a reported fire? What assessment has been made of whether any remedial activity may expose new dangers, such as those relating to asbestos? Have Ministers reminded those who own high-rise buildings of their particular obligation to work safely with asbestos?

I am not clear, and landlords in my constituency are not clear, about the precise responsibilities of the fire service and landlords. Is the fire service giving advice that landlords have to weigh up and interpret when deciding how to act, or is the advice mandatory? I hope that the Minister can give us clarity.

The assurances we have received from Ministers on who will meet the costs have been opaque. Saying that Ministers and the Government will work with landlords and councils that are not able the meet the costs tells us nothing. We cannot have tenants bearing the costs, and we cannot expect leaseholders to bear the costs, because they cannot afford them. Social landlords and councils will run out of money as they put the different rectification measures in place. Ministers need to say clearly that, at a minimum, they will underwrite the costs, and that rather than the Government working with landlords to fund the measures, the costs will be met by central Government.

I want to mention a few other risks that have been identified and the questions that landlords in particular are asking me. Cladding is beginning to be removed from properties across Greater Manchester and the rest of the country. That is happening during the summer months, when the warmth provided by the cladding, and its protective effects on the decency standards of those homes, is perhaps not a major issue. Come winter, however, if that cladding has not been replaced by new means of keeping those homes warm and dry, there will likely be a rise in cold and damp homes, respiratory illness and all the other associated problems that we always hear about in our constituency surgeries. It will also result in extra costs for householders, who will spend this winter turning up their heating. Many of them are on relatively low incomes. It would be helpful if Ministers could indicate that, where it has not been possible to make those homes warm and dry again in time for winter, there will be help for tenants in meeting heating bills. They need that assurance; otherwise the poorest and elderly tenants will simply turn off their heating, at great risk to their health and wellbeing.

That brings me to my final point: the position of vulnerable tenants in these buildings, particularly those in sheltered accommodation. In some parts of Greater Manchester—thankfully not in my constituency—there are high-rise blocks that provide sheltered housing. Moreover, even low-rise sheltered housing is, as one of my social landlords put it to me, basically a tower block turned on its side. There are many vulnerable tenants in large sheltered housing accommodation. We need the Government to work with landlords on strategies to protect vulnerable tenants in particular, whether or not they are in dedicated sheltered accommodation.

Will Ministers give particular consideration to the contentious issue of data sharing? In the immediate aftermath of the Grenfell Tower fire, as my social landlords began to try to take action to make premises safe and offer assurances to tenants, I was told that they did not necessarily know who was in every flat, or the particular vulnerabilities that those tenants might have. So far as is possible, information is being shared across social services, schools, NHS commissioners and others, but obviously there are real difficulties and sensitivities. The Government envisage introducing a data protection Bill this Parliament, so that is an opportunity to think carefully and constructively about achieving a balance that respects individual privacy and data, but allows for appropriate access when that is important for health, safety and the preservation of life. I hope that that will be fed into the proposed legislation as Ministers develop it.

There is potential for some good to come from this appalling atrocity, but only if Ministers retain the determination and resolve that we saw in the immediate aftermath of the tragedy. I tell them, for the sake of those who have died, those who have lost family members and those who live in tower blocks today and will do so in future: you must take on that responsibility.

Northern Ireland

Kate Green Excerpts

Monday 26th June 2017 Commons Chamber

[Damian Green]

I refer the hon. and learned Lady to what Ruth Davidson has said today. Ruth Davidson is completely in support of this agreement, and she makes the point that, just as Scotland benefits hugely from the strength of the economy that a Conservative Government have provided and that allows us to make all the investment in Scotland that I have already detailed—I am more than happy to detail it again, if the hon. and learned Lady wants—and just as we have treated Scotland fairly, we should treat Northern Ireland, Wales and other parts of England fairly, too. That is what this Government will continue to do. If she wants any new money, I refer her, as I have done repeatedly from this Dispatch Box today, to the UK prosperity fund that we will be introducing after Brexit, from which I hope many communities in Scotland, as well as in other parts of the UK, will benefit.

[Kate Green (Stretford and Urmston) (Lab)]

I recognise that abortion is a devolved matter, although I deplore the resulting legislative framework in Northern Ireland. Women are prosecuted and convicted in Northern Ireland for seeking to procure abortions, which forces them to come to England for terminations. This is the question we are trying to ask the First Secretary: will his Government fund those terminations, those procedures, in English hospitals because those Northern Ireland women—UK citizens—cannot get them in their own country?

[Damian Green]

If we accept the logic of devolution, as I have said in answer to previous questions along these lines, this is a matter to be resolved by politics in Northern Ireland.

Grenfell Tower

Kate Green Excerpts

Thursday 22nd June 2017 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

We are already talking to the devolved Administrations about the lessons and anything that is coming out so far, and we will continue to do so.

[Kate Green (Stretford and Urmston) (Lab)]

It has already become apparent that landlords do not always know who occupies their properties, and the vulnerabilities of certain tenants. Will the Prime Minister ensure that we investigate opportunities for data sharing between, for example, local authorities, social services departments, schools and registered social landlords?

[The Prime Minister]

The hon. Lady raises an interesting issue. At the heart of this is ensuring that the service given to people interacting with various Government Departments is focused on and identifies their particular needs. I will consider the issue of data sharing.

Article 50

Kate Green Excerpts

Wednesday 29th March 2017 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

I can confirm to my hon. Friend that we are very conscious of the needs of the fishing industry. The Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs has been talking to the fishing industry. The Secretary of State and others have been looking carefully at the arrangements that will need to be put in place in the interests of the fishing industry, and that will be an important part of our considerations in future.

[Kate Green (Stretford and Urmston) (Lab)]

Young people are very distressed and sad that we are leaving the European Union. Many of them did not vote for it and many did not even get a say in this decision, but they are the generation most greatly affected by it. What will the Prime Minister do to ensure that she listens to and engages with the next generation?

[The Prime Minister]

The hon. Lady makes an important point, because decisions we take now about how we leave the European Union, what our arrangements are in future and what we do here in the United Kingdom in things such as technical education and our industrial strategy are about the next generation. I want to ensure that we are ambitious for the whole of this country and ambitious to ensure a bright future for the next generation, and that is what this Government will be working for.

European Council

Kate Green Excerpts

Tuesday 14th March 2017 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

The position we have taken is that, when we leave the European Union the acquis will be brought into UK law through the great repeal Bill, so that at that point everybody will know where they stand in relation to the various rules and regulations we have abided by as members of the European Union. Thereafter, of course, it will be open to this Parliament to determine the standards we require and the regulations we wish to see across a whole raft of areas, including those my hon. Friend mentions.

[Kate Green (Stretford and Urmston) (Lab)]

The Prime Minister will know that under the Dublin rules the UK has returned more asylum seekers to other European Union countries than we have received from them. What are her intentions post-Brexit? Does she intend for us to continue to participate in that aspect of the Dublin agreement?

[The Prime Minister]

We will obviously look at the relationship we will have with the European Union on matters such as asylum seekers. I have broadened the discussion on this issue; it is about not only the UK’s relationship with the EU but how the whole international community deals with asylum seekers and economic migrants. I am clear that, as an international community, we should accept that individuals should claim asylum in the first safe country they reach.

Oral Answers to Questions

Kate Green Excerpts

Wednesday 2nd November 2016 Commons Chamber

[The Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster (Sir Patrick McLoughlin)]

As Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster, I oversee the administration of the estates and the rents of the Duchy of Lancaster. I contribute to the Government’s policy and decision-making process by attending Cabinet and attending and chairing Cabinet Committees. This role is not without precedence under both Labour and Conservative Governments.

[Kate Green (Stretford and Urmston) (Lab)]

I am pleased that the Government plan to audit racial disparities in public service outcomes, but may I ask Ministers that, in doing so, they ensure that every Department and agency uses the 2011 census classifications, which differentiate Gypsies and Travellers?

[Ben Gummer]

That is a very helpful contribution from the hon. Lady, and I will indeed ensure that.

G7

Kate Green Excerpts

Wednesday 10th June 2015 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

We did have discussions about that. There is obviously very good information sharing between Britain and America, and there is increasingly better sharing of information among European countries, with the progress on the passenger name record. Where we need even more co-operation is clearly between countries such as Britain and Turkey, which can sometimes act as a gateway for people joining ISIL. That is where we need to focus our efforts.

[Kate Green (Stretford and Urmston) (Lab)]

I welcome the Prime Minister’s announcement on investment to tackle pandemics, but does he agree that vaccines and drugs will be effective only if countries have domestic healthcare systems that can distribute them through their populations? Was that discussed at the G7, and what conclusions were drawn?

Youth Service Provision

Kate Green Excerpts

Wednesday 3rd December 2014 Westminster Hall

[Alex Cunningham (Stockton North) (Lab)]

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship yet again, Mr Davies. I say in opening that I am rather disappointed; when I look round the Chamber, I see that we have Opposition Members who are interested in youth services, but we have only the Minister to reply on behalf of the Government. It is very disappointing, but even so, I am grateful to be granted the opportunity to raise some of these issues today.

As hon. Members know, there is a crisis in youth services, which have suffered cuts of around £260 million since 2010. There was nothing today in the Chancellor’s autumn statement to cheer up our young people at all. Link that to the ditching of the education maintenance allowance and the access to learning fund, the virtual collapse of careers advice delegated to schools without the necessary resources, and the pittance that local authorities have to pay out from the student opportunity fund, and we can see that young people are getting a very poor deal from this Government.

We are all aware of the spending cuts that local authorities are being forced to make as a result of reduced funding from central Government. That is being felt acutely in areas such as the north-east of England, where 11 out of 12 councils will experience higher than average reductions in spending power for 2014-15, along with a 5% funding reduction compared with 2013-14. To be clear, in pounds per dwelling, that is 10 times higher than cuts in the south-east, and almost four times higher in percentage terms. Across the country, this is devastating service provision and the ability of councils to meet the needs of residents, whether in the form of road maintenance, care and support services for the elderly or the provision of sporting and recreational facilities for the young. Nowhere has been left untouched.

One area particularly hard hit by the attacks on spending is youth services. Despite those services being among the most important that local authorities provide, and ignoring the long-term nature of the impact, levels of provision for young people across the UK have suffered horrendously under the coalition. To be clear from the outset, the Government’s policies have seen young people, just like women, shoulder a disproportionate share of austerity and its worst effects.

Youth services have been hit by funding cuts of £60 million since 2012. Some 73% of local authorities have reported being forced to reduce youth service spending during that time because of central Government cuts, resulting in the loss of hundreds of youth centres and thousands of youth workers across the country. I know that view is recognised by the former children’s Minister, the hon. Member for East Worthing and Shoreham (Tim Loughton), who said:

“Because they don’t have to statutorily provide youth services they”—

the councils—

“have too often been at the top of the queue when cuts come along”.

However, that is just part of a trend that started when the coalition came to power.

Over that longer term, 93% of respondents to a Unison survey said that their local authority had cut youth service spending since 2010, with youth service spending down by £62 million in 2010-11 and £137 million in 2011-12. Overall, that adds up to cuts of £259 million since 2010, with some local authorities having to slash spending by over half to meet their costs.

[Kate Green (Stretford and Urmston) (Lab)]

I congratulate my hon. Friend on securing this afternoon’s debate, and I apologise for the fact that I will not be able to stay for the entire debate. He paints a rather rosier picture, perhaps because he is talking about two or three years ago, than is the case today. My local authority of Trafford is now proposing that we would have no spending on the youth service at all from next year.

[Alex Cunningham]

I am grateful to my hon. Friend for that intervention. That is frightful, and as I develop my speech this afternoon, I will refer to some of the consequences of losing youth services altogether.

The Government have established a maze of inefficient and underperforming nationally controlled programmes that duplicate services locally. There are around 40 national schemes and services delivered by 10 different Departments and agencies, leaving councils little, if any, influence to co-ordinate, target and scrutinise the shifting market of publicly funded provision and hindering their ability to plan where best to invest their own support.

Over the summer, I visited one of the schemes, the National Citizen Service, and met some lovely young people. I was impressed by the efforts and intentions, but the fact remains that these schemes have failed to fill the gap that cuts to youth services have created. To make matters worse, the NCS costs £1,200 per head for a six-week volunteering programme, whereas a similar scheme in Germany is able to fund a whole year’s work-based volunteering for the same cost.

--- Later in debate ---

[Kate Green (Stretford and Urmston) (Lab)]

I am grateful for the opportunity to contribute to this debate about a matter that is of huge concern to my constituency following the Trafford council budget proposals made a few weeks ago, which would result in the closure of all of our youth centres around the borough, leaving only the central Talkshop available for young people in Trafford. In a borough that has, as my hon. Friend the Member for Stockton North (Alex Cunningham) highlighted, some outlying geographical areas and quite high transport costs, it is unlikely that many young people in my constituency would be able to access the central Talkshop.

The concern extends well beyond my constituents, although many of them have written to me about it over the past few weeks. There is considerable pressure on MPs from all over the country to sign a recently tabled early-day motion, and at a recent meeting of the all-party group on poverty, young people challenged MPs from all political parties about the importance of the youth service. They received favourable responses from MPs from all political parties about how we value the youth service, and they told us that, frankly, we do not put our money where our mouth is. It deeply discredits us as politicians when we proclaim our belief in a service but we are unwilling to ensure that it is sustainably maintained and funded. Young people become disillusioned when they see that our promises of investment in them are only words.

In Trafford, we are not only concerned about the loss of youth centres, important though that is—some of them are extremely effective and popular in reaching out to the young people in their neighbourhood; as my hon. Friend said, we are also concerned about the loss of trained youth workers. There will also be a reduction in volunteering opportunities in those youth centres, and I am surprised that a Government who are so keen on volunteering should remove such opportunities, which are much valued in my constituency.

In Trafford, as in other communities, the voluntary sector has traditionally supplied a good proportion of youth provision. I believe that our local authority hopes that that sector will now do much more. Like my hon. Friend, I greatly value the youth work that is done by a range of non-governmental, non-statutory organisations in my borough. The problem is that if we leave such work entirely to voluntary and self-organising youth provision, the offer across the borough will not be strategic. Some areas may be quite well served, but other areas where need is higher may be rather poorly served. There may be some activities that offer lots of opportunities for young people, but other activities that young people want to take part in may not be available in our borough.

My hon. Friend made an important point about sustainability. Voluntary organisations are keen to do what they can to fill the gap in Trafford, but it is a big challenge for them to raise sustainable funding to enable them to make commitments beyond one or two years. For example, Redeeming Our Communities, which has recently begun operating in Partington in my constituency, is keen to look at what more it can do as the youth service in Trafford is degraded, but it has already made the point to me that it can do only as much as it can raise funding for. We must be mindful of the fact that a voluntary sector solution is not sustainable unless there is sustainable funding to allow such organisations to operate.

[Alex Cunningham]

One of the questions that perhaps I should have asked the Minister is whether he will do something to ring-fence and protect youth budgets. Even if Trafford had only a small amount, at least it could work with the voluntary sector to improve its chances of delivering provision in some of the more difficult areas.

[Kate Green]

Certainty would be valuable to those who want to provide youth services. I also make the point to the Minister that the availability of statutory funding has drawn in additional voluntary funding on top of the statutory funding that has hitherto underpinned our service. Lostock youth centre, for example, has been able to raise hundreds of thousands of pounds of voluntary money to top up the statutory support that it receives. Although some of that voluntary money may continue to reach our youth centres, we will lose the basic infrastructure that enables a trained team of youth workers to go out and seek such additional voluntary funding support. Even if voluntary funding were widely available, provision cannot exist in a vacuum, without an underpinning of statutory financial support.

I am concerned that there is a real mismatch between the degrading of our youth services and the other strategic ambitions of local authorities and the Government for our young people: priorities such as reducing crime and antisocial behaviour, making young people feel safe, ensuring their emotional well-being and ensuring that they achieve, attain and have aspirations. In the context of considerable attention being given to the risk of sexual exploitation and abuse, there must be the highest provision in relation to safeguarding, and the youth service hitherto has been an important element of providing such protection to potentially vulnerable young people. As I am sure the Minister will understand, we are deeply concerned about that in the Greater Manchester area. The youth service in Trafford has been actively engaged in that area, and it is well informed about the young people who are at risk. I am concerned that such knowledge and intelligence may be lost.

Everyone recognises the financial pressures that our local authorities are under, but it is very short-sighted simply to slash youth provision. It is poor value for money because it will generate additional costs and pressures in other parts of the system in the years to come. I appreciate that the Minister will say that local authorities must exercise discretion locally and make their own decisions, but he has the opportunity today to offer certainty and stability so that we at least have the capacity for forward planning. I hope he will give us those assurances this afternoon.

Oral Answers to Questions

Kate Green Excerpts

Tuesday 14th October 2014 Commons Chamber

[The Deputy Prime Minister]

I think the problem is when one party feels bitter from the first day they are caught in a relationship they feel they should not have entered into in the first place. I know the hon. Gentleman wants to call time on this political relationship and instead enter into a sort of lock-in with Nigel Farage, but I am not sure that that relationship will make him any happier.

[Kate Green (Stretford and Urmston) (Lab)]

Does the Deputy Prime Minister agree that the threatened closure of every youth centre in Trafford as a result of public spending cuts can only put social mobility in the borough at risk?

[The Deputy Prime Minister]

I do not know why the council took those decisions. Other councils have not had to take such dramatic decisions and have managed their finances more effectively. As I said in my previous answer, this Government have been responsible for a significant reallocation of money to help children in the crucial early years. Through the Youth Contract and other initiatives we now see youth unemployment lower today than it was when this Government first came into office.

EU Council, Security and Middle East

Kate Green Excerpts

Monday 1st September 2014 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

Let me take, for instance, the case of the Yazidi people, where there was military action by the Kurds, supported by us, and, indeed, some military action contemplated by the Americans that would have been supported, and potentially facilitated, by us. Of course, the role we were prepared to play was to take part in a humanitarian evacuation. That would have involved British transport planes and helicopters and, indeed, British troops in the Kurdish areas of Iraq to support, maintain and look after those helicopters. So I do not accept that we will not intervene where there is a potential humanitarian crisis; we would, we will, we have in the past, but we should, as I say, ask ourselves the question, “What is in our national interest, what is the best way to proceed?”

[Kate Green (Stretford and Urmston) (Lab)]

The suffering of the Palestinians in Gaza, not just in this most recent conflict but over many years, continues to be a source of great distress and concern in my constituency, and this latest land grab will of course have further infected the situation. What recent—very recent—discussions has the Prime Minister had with the Americans in relation to this matter, since it is widely perceived that any lasting solution will depend on their influence with Israel and there is real concern that, with so many other international conflicts, their eye, and our eye, may be taken off the ball in Gaza as we deal with other threats?

[The Prime Minister]

I did discuss this issue with President Obama when we spoke during August, and to be fair to him he has taken a tough line over the need for a ceasefire and was very clear with the Israeli Prime Minister, as was I, about the need for a ceasefire and about the frankly unacceptable level of civilian casualties. Now we have the ceasefire, it should be about trying to get Gaza up and running again. That means the Palestinian Authority taking control, the rockets being taken out and the important restrictions being lifted so that that place can function properly.