Care Bill [Lords]

Debate between John McDonnell and Meg Munn

Monday 16th December 2013 Commons Chamber

[John McDonnell]

I think Mr Kaye would like me to press that at some stage during the Bill’s progress. His view is that they should be regulated in the same way as others, and that there should be appropriate inspections as well. I understand the difficulties, particularly in terms of family relationships with regard to carers. I understand the subtleties of that, but there does seem to be a gap in the Bill as it stands. I might want to look at that in Committee, and certainly on Report.

The second point is that I believe that in the other place Baroness Greengross or Lady Greengross—I am never sure of the titles of the bourgeoisie—moved an amendment to cover the whole range of abuse. That was partly a response to the lobbying for abuse by carers to be properly covered by this Bill. I hope the Government’s attitude is that the amendment will remain in the Bill. I am happy to give way again to the Minister if he wants to respond; perhaps he will do so later.

The third point Jonathan wanted me to raise was about assessment and reassessment. I do not know what other Members find in their constituencies, but I find that the process of assessment can be extremely difficult—first, getting an appropriate person who can do the assessment, then getting that appropriately skilled person to do the assessment, and then the bizarre continual reassessment after reassessment that amounts almost to harassment. Some people with severe disabilities —with permanent conditions who, to get a cure, would need a trip to Lourdes, to be frank—get reassessed time and again. That becomes worrying for them, and some individuals can lose some element of their benefit through this process.

[Meg Munn]

I have a great deal of sympathy with what my hon. Friend is saying. In my experience there seems to be a tendency of wanting to assess people and then reassess them, rather than putting effort into providing services for them. If we quantified the time that goes into assessment as opposed to provision, I think we would see some way in which we could shift some of these very scarce resources into helping people properly.

[John McDonnell]

I was with a constituent last Friday and the issue under discussion was disabled facilities grant. Again, there seem to be more assessments and more spent on assessment than on getting the work done at times. There needs to be a clear understanding of the issue of permanent conditions and how we can make sure people do not have to go through the trauma of assessment

That brings me on to the issue that was raised by Age UK—I apologise if others have raised it before—which is about the individuals who will do the assessments and the level of their qualifications and of their specialisms. My whole community has been traumatised by what happened with the Atos assessments, and I would not want to see another process implemented in the same way under this Bill. Age UK wants us to ensure that appropriate assessments are carried out by appropriately skilled and qualified assessors.

That leads me to a further point, and I apologise if others have already raised it. Part of the issue for people who have to undertake the assessments is ensuring that they have the right advocacy support. In my area, we have DASH—the Disablement Association Hillingdon—which provides excellent support and advocacy, but it is struggling, as is every other voluntary organisation in the area, as a result of local government cuts and the demands and challenges that are placed on it. It is important that, as we introduce this legislation, we look at the role of advocacy and the importance of supporting it through appropriate funding from local government and elsewhere.

I want to talk briefly about the report from the personal social services research unit. It was mentioned by my hon. Friend the Member for South Shields (Mrs Lewell-Buck), whose superb speech set out, drawing on personal experience, exactly how many of us experience the services of carers. I am not sure whether other hon. Members have gone through this matter in depth in the debate today. If they have, please will they intervene to tell me, so that I do not need to go through it again?

The report has usefully confirmed all that we have experienced and understood anecdotally in our constituencies. Even I was shocked at some of the statistics that it contained. The report was produced by the personal social services research unit of the university of Kent and the London School of Economics, and it is an objective assessment of expenditure and of the numbers of people receiving services from local authorities between 2005-06 and 2012-13. Its findings confirm what most of us have experienced in our constituencies—namely, that there have been

“widespread reductions in the period 2005/06 to 2012/13 in both the observed and standardised estimates of number of adults receiving state-funded social care services”.

It also found:

“Across all user groups, approximately 320,000 fewer people received local authority brokered social care in 2012/13 than in 2005/06. This represents a 26% reduction in the number of recipients of care.”

If we look at the standardised assessment, we see a

“decrease of 453,000 (36%) individuals being served”.

That reflects what I am finding in my constituency. People who should be receiving a certain level of care and who would previously naturally have received it are no longer doing so. The report goes on to state:

“Reductions in the number of clients are particularly acute for older people; 260,000 or 31% fewer older people received services in 2012/13 than in 2005/06…The standardised estimate of reduction was greater: 333,000 or 39% fewer clients.”

That means nearly 40% fewer older people are receiving services now than five years ago. The report goes on:

“Approximately 37,000 or 24% fewer adults aged 18-64 with physical disabilities received social care support in 2012/13 than in 2005/06. The standard estimate showed a reduction of 50,000 or 33%. A reduction of 30,000 (21%) was observed in the number of service recipients aged 18-64 with mental health problems.”

I find that staggering but, at the same time, it reflects what is happening in our constituencies. Why is this happening? It is fairly straightforward, really. It is a result of the cuts that local government is experiencing.

Although the report covers the period between 2005-06 and 2012-13, it emphasises that the vast majority of the cuts have been made in the past two years. The coalition Government have brought forward this level of service withdrawal over a very limited period of time. According to the report,

“our analysis suggests a drop in need-standardised net social care expenditure between 2005/06 and 2012/13 of approximately £1.5 billion…Moreover, almost all reductions in expenditure are concentrated in 2010/11 and 2011/12.”

That is a cut of £1.5 billion overall. It goes on:

“The largest reduction in expenditure levels is concentrated on services for older people”.

That again reflects the anecdotal evidence that we can bring back from our constituencies. The report suggests that there has been a £1.6 billion cut in services to older people. This is not a party political point; this is independent, objective research, which we should all take on board in the debate as it goes forward.

The report continues:

“For adults 18-64 with learning disabilities”—

there has been—

“a significant increase in observed and standardised expenditure in 2012/13 relative to 2005/6 worth just above £1 billion”.

So there has been some increase in some areas but dramatic cuts in others. Worryingly, the cuts seem to be focused on older people and those with mental health problems. The interesting thing is the point made by my hon. Friend the Member for Edinburgh East (Sheila Gilmore) and others about how this is disproportionate; it is not being done right the way across the board, and the impact on areas is geographically uneven. It appears that the most deprived areas are being hit the hardest.

The report said:

“Approximately 95% of local authorities in England were observed to have reduced the number of older people receiving services in the period…Of these, the number of older people receiving services had fallen by 40% or more in approximately a third…of authorities.”

So this is focused on a limited number of local authorities, and again it appears that they are the most deprived. I find that extremely worrying.

Although we welcome the Bill as a first step, as others have said, Dilnot did make it clear to all of us that the social care crisis has to be addressed before we move on to other changes in legislation, or at least simultaneously. Introducing new legislation when the Government are introducing this scale of cuts will completely undermine the credibility of the new legislation. That is why I hope that as part of the debate as the Bill moves forward we can reach a consensus on not only the legislation—where I hope we can take on board some of the points made in the reasoned amendment—but on the level of investment required over the coming period if we are to support the most vulnerable in our society.

The study I mentioned is objective and it reflects what I am experiencing in my constituency surgery on a weekly basis—I believe it is the same for other Members of all political parties. The social care services in our areas are under intense stress and, as a result, people with even critical and substantial needs are not being addressed—those with moderate needs, which are still significant and should be within the system, are being ignored completely. We need to address this matter with some seriousness now and try to reach some all-party agreement on the way forward, not only on the Bill, but on the investment strategy for care needs.